. >> it is monday, april 27, 2015 and it is 207 public comment this is the small business commission meeting and before i officially start the meeting i want to note i don't have any speaker cards when it's time to speak please line up and say your name and sign in that is greatly appreciated so mr. president, line item one is call to order. >> commissioner white commissioner white commissioner adams

commissioner dooley commissioner ortiz-cartagena will be a bit late commissioner l. riley and commissioner tour-sarkissian mr. president, we have quorum all right. so as we start off every meeting with general public comment this is for general public comment regarding any issues that are not on today's agenda if anyone in the audience has an issue to the think the agenda would like to speak on public comment do so now. >> seeing none, item 3. >> item 3 is the discussion and possible action to make recommendations to the board of supervisors on file the planning code massage establishments this is an ordinance amending the prado to order the massage as defined contain a conditional

use for the findings for public convenience and welfare so and today, we have deanna in commissioner chan's office. >> welcome and thank you for hearing this item and visiting us back to speak on the legislation to start the presentation i'm going to go over the amputee program there's changes and provided to you but if sfgovtv if we can show the projector? >> sorry. >> there you go. >> so for the a.m. necessary program we want to speak about the intent of the program there's confusion between grandfathering and amputee and the grandfathered those going through the permit progression

will do an c m t exemption and able to permitting operates the ones that didn't go through the process either what will happen to them with the amy to establish a limited program for the all existing massage establishment in san francisco, california operate without the permits their supposed to obtain in this characterization of the amputee program it shall be credited legal as far as those requirements those are similar to present before one it was operating or functioning in the location prior to january 14th that's the date the interim controls went into practices and obtain a business alone and all

employees obtain valid identification or permits from dpw prior to the date in the original order the owner needed a permit in actually it's the employees needs the permit there are no open police department or planning department against the massage 12r5ish9 and the massage establishment applies to for a permit between 2005 days that's in parallel of our health code to give them 90 days to apply with notice this is new we'll have our effective date for planning and the did you want will post on the description of the program on hair website subsistence owners and operators

to take advantage of the project and it will explain the zoning district that permit massage establishment that have a relevant without the conditional use authorization we shouldn't permit them at all that is the thing we've been working only dlunl with the planning department there are so many sdpoenz that the massage are not need a cu we want to create a program that encompass all the broad establishment and recognizes the location this will this delineated on the website so people know this is the site the demonstration will come why the planning department after they've gotten the deceptively permit and it goes to the planning department

that's when they gage the permit there are ways to show evidence so thankful included negligence or things like lease agreements or utility records etc. the planning department will determine the compliance of the establishment regarding those requirement in the thank you program and they'll have a follow the underlying program so if they want to invent if i they'll have to follow this is the the amnesty program to substitute the legislation to go great the land use commission >> thank you very much. >> and we have representatives here from deceptively and the planning department if you have

more to answer questions regarding the program. >> okay commissioners, any questions. >> i'm sorry. i'm on the wrong screen. >> thank you for your presentation if the past the amnesty 0 would they need a cu. >> that's amnesty we want to make sure it encomes the planning department has been great to make sure we encompasses all that didn't go through the permits they'll be able to operate without requiring a cu. >> after zoning they'll comply with the health department and continue operating correct. >> correct.

>> right now we were seeing certain areas no massage permits there was established there we want don't want to penalize them when we were opening. >> okay. great. >> i i cannot imagine there being i imagine there are quite a few questions from the establishment businesses i'm wondering if this is a possibility for you all to schedule workshops for people that want to come in and discuss their particular place or more importantly people come in with their questions this was done in prior legislation when we had that was the. >> mobile food. >> mobile food allows them to come in, in fact it fettered out issues not included in the legislation so maybe not

contemplating but this is useful to have a face to face workshop people can ask questions and you can answer issues we he may not have gotten the daily. >> okay. any other questions? >> commissioners, if i may it maybe helpful for those who don't have to go 0 through the i didn't if you can you walk me through it the common scenarios moving forward we understand the nuances of how the dpw permit applies to planning and the overlay of would be greatly appreciated. >> sfgovtv show the projector. >> those slides have not changed but to go over it for

the sole partitioned if they're providing massages at a fixed location or not a house that is shared up to 4 partitioned they'll be exempt from the conditional use progress and each practitioner gets a permit that's going forward for establishment practitioner establishment. >> for a massage establishment with more than one employee - now again this is for new establishments but for the already operating establishment they'll not have to get the cu approval if they're already having a permit or they're qualified under the amnesty program but they'll need a general establishment permit.

>> that's the - this is where the massage establishment is not a principle use and employees a practitioner to share a says that the cu approval actually can you clarify that if they'll need a use. >> diego if so it the exempt they'll go forward with the conditional use permit. >> even in the prohibit massage? >> if i meet the definition or a large hotel this is considered an accessory use that's not required. >> okay.

>> for the dpw permit if the business establishment itself. >> 0 sorry. >> if the business establishment it employing the massage practitioners they'll have to get the permit but if they're sharing space with the full practitioner the on news b will be on that establishment to get the permit for out call massage services their exempt if the process they - it requires a dpw service permit and as classified by one the advocates it requires a dpw massage permit or c mc provider or certificate

and then for home based massage you'll have to go through the cu with you not required to get the dpw permit but have their practitioner get the certificate certificate. >> open to any questions? >> okay. >> are you - >> i just have a one question about the one type of massage establishment requires a cu. >> uh-huh. >> that particular one is would noted the cu rather than all the other types. >> so are you talking about the massage establishment. >> that is the regulatory screen that is for dpw certified establishment required to go

through a cu process now we're requiring to all massage establishment whether employing the dpw or other services they have to go through the cu process. >> what's the difference why it is this way rather than the other types of practitioner i'm trying to understand why that type focuses on conditional use. >> in terms of the use of conditional use process in general we used that for the neighbors to have an opportunity to be warg of the establishments openings the larger ones rather than the sole provider we see that in terms of proliferation and possible liability massage

activity we didn't want to penalize the sole practitioner we've heard that loud and clear but it is for the larger massage establishment their hiring multiple employees and having a footprint on the community. >> okay any other comments commissioners or questions. >> mr. president this is a little bit unorchestrate if i may be permitted to ask a question. >> go ahead. >> under dpw conflicted health care providers under division two, that as moomgz as a accessory use are not required to get a permit, however they're not listed as an exempted entity under 9 planning

code would they have to go through the conditional use like chiropractors or practitioners go through the process based on the definition of the box you've shown at the massages and accessory uses. >> just a clarification do you mean currently operating establishment or ones going forward. >> well prominently moving forward. >> for moving forward and supervisor tang mentioned this in the previous legislation that was mentioned in 2009 under chiu they required a massage as a conditional use to go through certain listed ones you've said not listed in the health care so, yes they'll have to go through a conditional use.

>> so i'm sorry what is this special case. >> so if you're a claustrophobic office and opening an office as a new office and you have massage accessory use then while you are not required to get a massage established permit but under the planning code your considered a massage establishment even though you're a chiropractic but under the planning code you're required to go through a conditional use. >> it is just i think that is one of the few ones that as an accessory use it is not under the planning code not listed out. >> exempted. >> okay

so under the planning code you'll not be considered. >> there's a little bit of confusion. >> the planning code and the planning code has an exemption for medical services not defined within the planning code. >> maybe it provides an option. >> right. >> it is in the planning code i don't - >> okay. >> it is used in the planning code what to what. >> it the planning code and the did you want code on this issue? it is >> so a conditional use permit is required in the event of a new chiropractic office or something of that nature wants 0 go into business and has massage you need a conditional use permit for a massage.

>> i think what the confusion might be with the exemption for the dpw permit so there are two exemptions one a hospital host or other health care provider providing the services. >> it also states qualified health care provider under distinction two as defined. >> i think that language might be taken out with a new version it says of barer or cosmetologist for instance a massage of our face not considered a massage for a dpw permit for . >> so i guess when the commission heard the legislation the last meeting i think it was under the understanding that on

page 19 line 191 states the permit shall be required under the services provide by a health care provider that is defined under the definitions of on page 7 line one as under the regulations of division two of the california business code so i just - so is it how i read this is it those liquor an acupuncture it is an accessory use not required by the depending upon to get a establishment permit but not listed in the planning code as one the exempted entities they'll be required to go through the conditional use even though they'll be seen from the planning code as a massage establishment. >> correct. >> okay.

>> but we in terms of the that health care provider piece i believe this is likely going to be struck but u out in the new legislation it will be more clear who will go through the process. >> okay. so then that maybe something commissioners, if this changes is happening if there's any particular you heard the last legislation that was under the legislation. >> commissioner tour-sarkissian. >> yeah. about the amnesty program under the amnesty program they talk about the massages in my you might include an accessory eye for the amnesty program. >> i believe see

just to confirm that the accessory use is included. >> that's my understanding yes. >> dpw and planning correct. >> correct. >> for the cu the amnesty is for dpw correct. >> commissioner l. riley you have a question. >> i was wondering the accessory use is a cu process according the planning. >> correct. >> in terms of dpw for the permitting there's two exemptions they list in the health care concurrently so fits it is a state facility a hospital or medical facility or a barber or 'coz motive that defenses it in the process of

their services they don't need a permit it says health provider but that will be struck out. >> so they'll need a cu. >> they will i'm sorry a dpw but in terms of the cu accessory use is required. >> so it is required. >> yep. >> thank you confusing. >> so just fire - can i ask diego for a chiropractic office medical services is permitted and massage establishment are not permitted but having massages they'll have to go through the conditional use is they're going 0 through a conditional use for the chiropractic office in that particular area i'm just - and we have to talk to 0 people on

navigating that. >> i understand going forward there are 4 accessoryy uses this didn't require is it they're using the massage out of your dwelling our residence or a tourist hotel you're a large institution or a hospital, medical center you're doing chair massage if you can't fit usual massage practice those practice into one of those going forward you'll need a conditional use authorization to do that as proposed the case you're talking about is not stipulated as an accessory 0 eye. >> for a chiropractic office let's say that wants to open up in a new zoning area where medical uses are allowed by massages are not if they have

accessory used will they be able to open. >> sound like- massage can only be accessory under those 4 or 5 circumstances that i listed if you're doing it as a dwelling or at a tourist hotel or medical center or chair massage you'll not been able to do that as the owners is accommodated what's the practice as before the ordinance. >> okay. so basically a chiropractic office where a massage is not permitted will not be able to allow massage as an accessory to simplify is. >> yes. >> okay. >> or if a new business offering chiropractic services

contemplated having massage tail be better 0 open up massage first, because the conditional use is going to hold up the entire as opposed to rather than waiting to go into business your permitted services you'll hold back and apply at a later date. >> as long as it is permitted in a cu use or the chiropractics office will not be able to have it. >> and any area. >> yeah. and this legislation is offered to be changed or the same plays for the accessory use for anyone else's. >> as the ordinance is proposed massage can only be an accessoryy under the four or five things the hotel or the

chair massage. >> can you state the logic and not include the prolific e whoifk e chiropractic services. >> do you have a rational besides excluding the chiropractic office. >> this is legislation before our ethics commission i believe their seeing problems various types of businesses including the choifks offices their cloishth and doing massage on the side but their main business is massage so they could go over the counter for permitting also known as going through the cu process as a loophole that's why they created the cu requirement for accessory use with only those exemptions. >> so maintaining the

conditional use then why - then is there any reasonable reason to say for let's say the m u if the medical services are allowed i mean not to say you're going to add massage you're going to go through conditional use. >> can you repeat that question. >> as i understand what diego said in the mou district medical services are allowed and massage established are not and your newly opening choifks offices massage is not allowed so you can't go through conditional use so but if the reasoning for having the conditional use is to have another layer of review and

insuring that the choifks office is a chiropractic office if medical services are permitted why i'd like to take this opportunity just make that - if you make is a conditional use why not allow it the areas y where massage is currently not permitted. >> that's up to the supervisor e.r. whoever put the conditions on the neighborhood we cannot button put a blanket and say if you're a medical service that's the call of who made the restrictions who put that in place that was what something that would have been difficult we'll have to vote every supervisor to change your district by that supervisor so we are allowing for it through cu process depending on the

district it's up to that specific area. >> i think where massage has been implicit restricted you'll have to go through a process to address that on a location by location district or district by district, however geography by domino basis unless you want to take that on citywide but in the specific geography when the case arrives i think that would overly complicate your efforts to address that as that point. >> commissioner white. >> yeah. i have a quick question so if i'm a nail salon and offer chair massage is that part of this amnesty program. >> li