>> to create more housing? >> yeah. >> to facilitate the development of more housing. >> and to provide guidance to the city agencies and the direction of the city agencies to develop procedures and mechanisms for expediting -- >> okay, okay, i just wanted to clarify that. so my question is when you say that it's due in 30 days after the submittal of the application, what do you mean by "agency"? >> again, public utilities commission, sfmta, public works, the planning department, the fire department. those agencies that are involved in the review and potentially the acceptance of the infrastructure being described in the subphase application. >> so within 30 days of all of those agencies are to comment? >> yes. >> and then the approval -- so then once -- so once you have the approval target of april 11th which i guess is 90

days, then the permits -- so does it come to us before we go to the permit phase? >> well, again, we'll provide you updates along the way per the design review and design approval procedures. the major phase application is a board action and the subphase application is a direct action. but we'll be briefing you along the way. and then after the subphase application which, again, the subphase application is the 11-by-17 glossy book of what is proposed for this sub-phase with a lot of narrative, then -- then they will submit their first set of construction drawings for permit. and by comparison for the prior subphases those infrastructure plans are about this high in terms of the number of

construction drawings. and so that process will begin, you know, later in april or may and the target there is from the first submission of those construction drawings that, again, working with the city agencies that we take no more than nine months to get to final permits and final maps. >> right. i guess that my point is not to get into the details -- the details of the permits and, you know, whether it's, you know, it's structural or otherwise, because we are not equipped -- i'm not equipped on this board to give feedback on those kind of details. but i guess do you expect changes to be made to the actual housing mix or any kind of -- between now and that time period? >> yeah, no -- i think that with the housing mix that i think that we're -- that framework, other than the things that i have just discussed, that

framework won't change even through the major permit process. once the major permit -- the street improvement permit for infrastructure is issued by public works, then ticd will either themselves or by selling parcels to third parties, individual parcels will move forward. and they may -- the subphase application does describe -- it has a list of all of the parcels within the subphase and the proposed number of units to be constructed within each individual parcel, but then as individual projects move forward, then there might be some adjustment, you know, upwards or downwards, based on the design for that site or for the exercising of the flex zoning. >> okay. what i want to do is to reiterate that we maximize the

development opportunities here. i was at a function last night when they were discussing sp-50 which i guess is going to pass this year in california and signed into law hopefully by our new governor which is going to increase densities state-wide. here's our opportunity. we are creating a new development area and a new subdivision and a newer neighborhoods. and so this is the best time to actually to plan to create the best. so thank you. >> president tsen: okay, thank you, mr. samaha. mr. beck, in talking about the zoning and the highlight limits, -- height limits, i'm glad that you will come back to the board on this, but something that i would like to point out is that this massive plan was passed about eight years ago. there have been changes to both

building code and building technologies. 65 feet actually was predicated on sort of the most efficient type of construction, especially for affordable housing, which was five stories of wood frame over a garage. and that's how people got to the 65 feet. but now you've got changes in the building code which can allow six stories of wood frame over, and also changes to technologies, for instance, modular which actually requires a little bit more height between the floors. because you're stacking various modules together. and so i would like to actually look at this 65 feet. i think that it may be at this point in time that maybe too restrictive. and i don't know where this falls into, whether it's the subphase, you know, application, or whether it's a different

point in time. but although it seems like we have a lot of land on treasure island, actually every site has to be intensified so that we can get more housing units if possible. and it's rather arbitrary whether it's 65 feet, whether it's 70 feet or 75. i think that we need to relook at this issue to make sure that we can actually maximize and make it more efficient, particularly for the affordable housing developers on what they can do with this site. where does that discussion fall -- is it within the subphase application or is it a different content? >> that would -- that would probably be a separate process. you know, because what you're talking about there is a modification of the design for

development and the special use district regulations that were established for treasure island. we'd be changing the zoning or adopting new guidelines for exceptions to the adopted zoning. so that would really be kind of a separate dialogue to be initiated either by tida or ticd or the two of us together with the planning department. >> president tsen: um-hmm. well, i would like for you to look into this issue. i think that height limits by a lot of cities and jurisdictions looking at other ways to look at zoning and specific height limits may not be the most perfect way to do it. so if you would look into this issue to see what we can do to allow maybe more height and more density within the limits, that would be very helpful. >> well, and as you pointed out in the case of modular

construction you're perhaps talking more height without more density. >> president tsen: exactly. >> which is particularly relevant as we do have our overall limit for the island as well. but, yeah, definitely something that i can discuss with ticd and take a look when we come back. >> president tsen: great, thank you. yes, miss lai. >> thank you for bringing that up, and i think that bobby also touched on this but i support the suggestion to look at how else we could increase the efficiencies and density on the island. but on the outside we also have to look at whether or not it would exceed the deir that had already been done. that doesn't mean that we can't do it, but when you look at studying that, if you could also tell us what the related consequences are on the environmental study, that would be helpful. i mean, it's possible that maybe we just need to do a more

limited environmental study on adding the additional density. and then the other thing is that the state density bonus -- i believe that does not require seqa, so maybe that's one way to get additional height without actually changing the zoning. and without triggering additional environmental review. thanks. >> president tsen: thank you. so are there any comments from the public on this item? hearing none, next item. >> clerk: item nine, a tour of new york parks. >> so at the end of november, we were able to go tour some parks

thanks in large part to -- or almost exclusively to the connections to reach out to a number of facilities and programs in new york and schedule some people to give us some tours and some briefings. before talking about that, i just wanted to highlight a few things about the treasure island parks and open space program. we discussed it a little bit earlier that the parks are envisioned to be under tida's jurisdiction, not under the san francisco department of parks and recreation. and the open space plan anticipated tida might work with the conservancy and contract out operations. and then in terms of the ongoing funding for the parks, the parks in new york have a number of different models.

for treasure island the community facilities district that we've established for over treasure island is extended. it is scheduled to continue in perpetuity to provide the source of funding for the parks' maintenance and operations. overall we have a wide variety of parks and open spaces on treasure island and on yerba buena island. totaling 290-acres out of the 465-acres of land that we are receiving from the navy. so a significant portion of our -- of the land on the island will be open spaces in the future. and so in terms of the trip to new york on the 29th and 30th, as i said, representatives from tida, chris

meade, and their program director wiggins, as well as christy yard, principal at c.m.g. and the arts commission, toured several parks in brooklyn and manhattan. our interests were in learning about best practices for the development, governance and conservancy of open spaces. and the design and operational considerations and art programs and financial institutional models and the governance and operational rulemaking. this aerial map shows you the sites that we visited. brooklyn bridge park and the brooklyn naval yard and domino park in brooklyn. and governor's island and the highline and hudson yards and the shed in manhattan.

we started the first day with a conversation with charles mckinney and robert balder. charles mckinney was a former chief of design for new york city parks and is now the chair of the city as a living laboratory. and robert balder directs cornell's architectural program in new york city. and charles was able to give us a lot of insights from his career within the park system and now working with some of these types of parks that actually reside outside of the new york city park system. and we then visited the brook bn bridge park which was formally a both a cargo shipping facility on the brook lidg brooklyn wated just in terms of its model. and the portions of the site

were turned over to residential and some commercial development and revenues, tax revenues from those properties are what finance the ongoing maintenance and operations of the park. and the initial m.o.u. was signed for this program in 2002 and construction began in 2008 and as of last summer their construction is about 90% complete. in terms of acreage, they are about a quarter or a little more than a quarter of the acreage of what the parks programs would be on treasure island. and the upper righthand image kind of shows you the length of the system running along the waterfront. this was a cargo facility, so a lot of their -- the park is actually on piers over the water and as you can see looking down

the waterfront there. and they have a wide variety of programs and you can see the second pier in at the top where there's soccer fields and the third pier is harder to see but -- outside of the first pier with the blue oftenning and it's harder to see but it has basketball courts and a skatepark and other facilities. domino park is the second site that we visited in brooklyn. it's part of the redevelopment of the former domino sugar refinery property. and it's opened up a portion of the waterfront there in brooklyn that has been inaccessible, it's within the fence line of the sugar factory for many decades. the factory closed in 2004 and the property was purchased for development in 2012. and the developer here made a choice to build the park first

before or concurrent with their first new residential development. so the park opened up just this past year. it's comparatively small, about six acres, but, again, like our city site park and a lot of our facilities it's along the water's edge and linear, and interesting in those respects. and the brooklyn navy yard was our next stop. this is more of an economic re-use opportunity. the brooklyn navy yard was an active u.s. navy yard up through the 1960s and then it was transitioned to become an industrial park and functioned

in that capacity through to 2011 when the navy development corporation took on a new program to try to renew and to revitalize the industrial park. and they just this past year released an updated master plan. so, again, this is more of an economic re-use opportunity than a parks and open space, but it's interesting to some of what we may try and do in terms of reuse of historic facilities. and the image on the upper left is kind much an aerial of the navy yard in total. and the lower right is an interesting re-use of the historical structure as -- not re-worked but kind of an i.t.

incubator space. and hudson river park. hudson river park emerged from a failed highway project. so maybe akin to our marcadaro. and the plan was to replace the westside highway with an interstate highway. when that highway replacement program did not materialize they have reused the right-of-way that was dedicated to develop the hudson river parks. and a little earlier timeline here and the m.o.u. began in 1992 and construction in 1998. and this extends along 4.5 miles of the waterfront. so there are still portions of the project to be completed to connect the entire 4.5-mile length. but it's still a very sizeable park network along the hudson

river there. and you can see a couple of these photographs were not taken in december and it's kind of showing how the -- how the level of use that the space gets during the warmer months, rather than a cold november morning. and governor's island, governor's island is located just south of manhattan and, again, not unlike ours, more than half of their island is silt land. it is accessible only via ferry. and this is -- it does have an open space program but it's also a program driven development site. their vision statement is to be new york city's most sustainable campus for learning, research, art and culture with extraordinary open space. one of their anchor programs is

the harbor school which is a public high school, magnet school, located on the island which opened up in 2010. and when they first entered into the agreement to take over full control from the state of new york and then first phase of construction began in 2012. and you can see in the first two images a couple of the temporary art installations on the island, the one in the upper left is in the chapel there and in the archway of the building there. and here's an aerial of the island and so that kind of oval-shaped portion at the very top of the island, that's the historic original island. and that's where most of the historic structures on the island are located. and then the southern two-thirds of the island are the manmade

portions of the island. you can see the number of ferry piers around the island. and the kind of dirt portions on the two sides of the island are areas where they're going -- they plan to do economic investment opportunities to help to bring revenues and programs and the green belt that goes through the middle of the island there is kind of their plan -- their existing and planned open space network. and the highling is a former new york central whale way spur on the west side of manhattan that through grassroots preservation effort has been converted into an elevated parkway. and like the grassroots effort to bring the park to fruition, 90% of their operating budget is privately funded.

the railway was abandoned as a functional railway in 1980 and the repurposing or the reconstruction of the park began in 2006 with the first phase opening in 2009 and full build out of the high line by 2014. and, again, this is a mile and a quarter of elevated park running through the west side of manhattan. it really is kind of a sequence of rooms or experiences as you move through the length of the park. at the north end of the park you come to hudson yards which is the largest private real estate development in the united states by square footage. and a little over 12 million square feet of proposed development on this site.

when it struck me that in san francisco we have, under prop m we have a million square feet of office space per year so this represents a decade's worth of new development in san francis francisco. and the construction began in 2012 and full buildout is expected by 2024. and, again, this is being developed above the rail yards. so above the area where long island railroad has its storage on the west side of the island and all of this is developing -- is happening above that. the image on the upper right is a rendering of what the anticipated buildout, when all of the development is complete within the hudson yards area. and some images on the lower portion of the physical models of the planned development, with

the kind of golden basket weave object in the middle of those two diagrams is a component of the art program there. and just to the south of that art work is the shed at hudson yards which is another site that we have visited. and the shed is a performance and gallery and creative space meant to present a commission and present a wide range of performance, visual arts programs. it's philanthropically endowed and to be philanthropically sustained and they'll open this year. they have an endowment for the first three years of operating costs in place, and they're

looking to build and to sustain this program. the image on the lefthand side kind of shows you the model of the building and the righthand portion of that is actually retractible so that can move back against the high rise building on the left and opening up a plaza there or can be rolled out to enclose the plaza to create a larger performance space inside of the structure. and this kind of -- at the i think of hud -- at the edge of hudson yards shows you kind of how -- you see what looks like a green belt or a sidewalk there, and that's actually the elevated level so that the rail yards and the other things are below that throughout the site. and so kind of some of the take

aways from our visit -- open spaces in these areas are operator management and in partnership with conservancy organizations and not through the new york city park system. and the central parks conservancy in the 1980s was what really initiated this movement towards this model in new york. and so one of our areas of exploration going forward is, you know, should we develop a conservancy relationship and what role would that conservancy fill? what is the -- what are the opportunities for philanthropic support for our arts or our open space program and how would we simulate that. and from both the designers and the operators, you know, it's kind of a consistent feedback of planning to design for

activation and that's not just the spaces that you design, but making sure that you have the services and the facilities and the amenities that people are going to want to have when they're within the parks so that the park is not just the space but it's the opportunity and the things that you can do while you're there. and really a focus on family-friendly spaces that families tend to use parks in different ways. they come to parks for longer visits and the larger flexible programming spaces where they can spread out or playgrounds. so those types of design considerations. and on the operations and the maintenance side of things, emphasis of developing standards is a basis for ground-up operating projections. integrating the operation facilities in the design of a parks and open space.

we had some conversations around rules and regulations for open spaces and also planning design for adaptation to climate change and sea level rise. i think that this is an area that has been a focus for our program from the beginning, but hudson river park had some real hard lessons that they learned in the super storm sandy about the impacts that that had on their facilities. and then always planning and design for flexibility and being able to respond to the use that comes to the park even when it may not be being used exactly the way that you originally envisioned that it would be used. some highly successful places, for instance, in brooklyn bridge park are being used as wedding photo backdrops and other things that the designers didn't necessarily think of when they were designing these spaces but

that's how people have responded to them. and also experimenting in programming and in events to see what resonates with the community and what draws interest. and where groups of advocates for programs or flexibility come forward and make them invested in the -- in the ongoing operation and programming of the space, give them a management function. so i had an analogy for this but it's escaped me. but then also the role -- even if these parks don't fall under the san francisco park system, to -- to have discussion about what is the role of the city either in programming, how does, for instance, our sports fields interact with the programming of rec and park sports fields and also indemnity and security for

operations of the parks. so some plan next steps for us is to look more locally here for engagement with the city or trust or others on lessons that we can learn and models that we can seek to replicate, to explore conservancy and stewardship structures and planning for the contracting of park maintenance services, and ensuring that we have adequate maintenance and support spaces in our design. and any rules that we need to adopt and then moving on from there. >> president tsen: great, thank you. if you don't mind, miss richardson has asked to ask a question. >> thank you very much, bob beck, for that detailed

presentation. what i wanted to have an extension and to give my editorial comment because i was one of the two commissioners that had this rare and golden opportunity. and i want to start by -- every now and then people ask me, what is the composition of the treasure island board of directors. and i get asked that question often. and i have to pause. every now and then i am letting the public know that on this commission that we have people with extensive -- study from development experience, real estate, facility policy, land-use planning, that's why we're here. for me there is also someone on this commission that epitomizes all the aforementioned and that is commissioner tsen, our

president, harvard education and very extensive. for me the takeaway from this rare and wonderful tour -- and we need to really underscore that -- individually it would never have happened. we were never, never have been able to put together the calibre of the people that we saw in new york. it was mind blowing, i need to really state that. why is that? because a lot of things that we saw -- san francisco even a world-class city, we do not have that. there are certain things, many things going on in new york and new york is a bigger place and it's a place that fully developed and we're talking about high density and everything and san francisco for decades is having our own unique

set of development. we have obligations on this commission as we are developing a world-class treasure island and yerba buena island, a place that would have other people coming from all over the world to see what we have here. so we cannot sit here and do just the mediocre. we have to really look at this, and we have to assemble world class. that's what the commissioner tsen did, spent months, months in putting this together. we have world-class architects and landscape architects and we also have our team here and is to go there and see what the models and the best practices in design. in san francisco we do not have open space like in new york. here we have everything is done within a city agency, but that is fine and what we're hearing

all over the world is that, no, to sustain the maintenance of those, you're going have to to explore some other areas there because the city model and all of the -- for the longevity and you'll spend hundreds of millions to design landscape and open space, it will not work. if you have a plan to have the financial implications and how they'll be and the materials and everything and it's not going to get there. so you'll end up in creating all of this -- san francisco is actually grappling with that statement now. when the redevelopment agency was abruptly disbanded we had all open space now that we do not know what it will look like in 10 years' time. so going to new york and looking at all of this is that basically we have professors from cornell university and they were

gracious and they gave out a red carpet of a lifetime. i think that we also learned that for us reciprocity, we all in san francisco, all of us, better be able to match what kind of treatment that we have in the kind of professionalism and everything that we learned there. it was more than educational. even there i was thinking about my fellow commissioners because of the quorum, and if there's any other way, i don't know that you can duplicate this tour that everybody really needs to see what we need to see. i think that the commissioners and the mayors have said before that, yes, you're experts in real estate and in structural and anything you don't have the expertise, okay? so even though we have expertise in certain areas here but there's collectively certain areas that you cannot make that decision here unless you see what the other people are doing. that's what this trip -- now in terms of art -- we invited jill

mantle from the arts commission and i had the privilege of going with us here. when built it will be opened in 2019, there is no other place in the world that would be like the shed. and we need to put that on the record here. the architecture of the place, the opportunity for art, for visual, all forms of art, are gug to be there. so san francisco needs to really think and, again, art is part of our development here and it's part of the financial implications. and people are going to go to the shed before they come to san francisco when it fully opens. again, when you look at the design and the structure, and some of the things that we could do on treasure island and the landscape architects and they're the finest in the world. they are already involved with the broo brook brooklyn bridge e

companies will build in san francisco and new york and san diego and in all of over the world. so the takeaway for me is that you had outlined some of the things that we really need to look at. and i think that there are serious, serious issues that we need to really look at. how will we be financially, again, manage all of these parks and open space. treasure island will have more open space than the golden gate park. and so the discussion must begin right here for all of you commissioners now. and it's not that we want to kick the can down the road. so we know the expectations and i would think that going to new york now is important to have this parallel discussion that we'll put in place when we are going to be approving all of these plans. that obligation rests on this commission to really look at

putting something in place that we can begin to engage all of the stakeholders as to how we're going to get on treasure island and that's part of the things that we looked at. so commissioner, you are more modest and gratitude for you for these efforts and we owe you a great deal. and it shows your influence and your class because your harvard education and your colleagues and we are very grateful. where do we go from here? i think that there are other places that we need to look at as commissioner samaha. most of us here, even all, would travel all over the world extensively. there is no place that i go to that i do not go to the parks and look at the sculptures and the museums. when i'm in europe i do that and in africa we had national parks and tropical plants and whatever. we really, really need to look at that.

and the takeaway for me, mr. beck, is that we need also -- and i mentioned it earlier -- we need to have a dialogue as to how we'll treat the work of other parks. they warned us that we must be extremely mindful of what we put -- when you are expecting millions of people to come to the parks, they accentuated your waterway will make-or-break you in what you do in that. that will eat up most of the cost of maintenance is the financial implications. so we're going to all have takeaways there and we'll be doing that and i am pleased, even on my own money, i want to go back to new york and to the shed when it's open. so thank you for that editorial statement and it's to convey to the city of san francisco that it was well spent and that this commission, all of you, should be thinking about us getting out

of here and to really look at the best practices in design. and that's what you can take away from this tour. >> president tsen: thank you. i'm leave my comments to later. but miss lai, yes. >> thank you, linda, for sharing your perspective on that. and, yeah, i would agree that it would be fun to go see it firsthand, but i also feel that we have a lot of experts who have been consulting and helping us. and they have seen a lot of this. so we're certainly relying on you. just a couple of questions. i have never been to governors island before but i think that i only saw the piers and there's no, like bridge or any kind of vehicular means to get on and off the island, right? >> ferry access only. >> okay. so how did the students get on and off the island? because there's no housing there, right? >> there's no housing on the island. they commute via the ferry every

day. >> how much is the ferry? >> i'm not certain. the operation -- the operating budget for governors island comes through the governor -- or the mayor's budget of the city of new york and i believe that about 50% of their annual operating budget goes to subsidize the ferry service to the island. >> oh, 50%. okay. >> of the governor's island operating budget is -- goes into the operation of the ferries or subsidizing the operation of the ferries. >> okay, and the other 50% is just -- >> well, the other is the rest of their operations. so 50% of the budget for governors island is going into subsidizing the operation for to and from the island.

>> that's a lot. so the ferry is not free? >> it's $3 round trip. $3 round trip and $1 for seniors and $1 for children 13 or younger. >> that's very affordable. how long is that ride? >> seven minutes. >> seven minutes? okay. so actually approximately the same as from -- >> (indiscernible). >> yeah, i'm just very curious about their model and, you know, their cost recovery or percentage, all of that. maybe if you have some additional information that we can roll into a ticd meeting. i'm just very curious how other people operate their ferries. >> we did ask a lot of questions about the ferry and i think that it's good to compare. but the fare will never pay for the services itself. >> not in america, but, yeah.

that was not supposed to be -- (indiscernible) just a fact in. other parts of the world it can happen. and then questions about the conservancy and i'm not familiar with how that works. are conservancies typically just essentially like a quasi government agency or is it really a non-profit? >> yeah, it varies in the model. some are kind of purely non-profit if you think of like the friends and rec park here in san francisco. and to full -- more like a business improvement district and i think that for brian park, you know, that -- brian park is managed by the bid for the neighborhood around brian park. but, yeah, for central park, you

know, it started as a means of trying to put additional money into the main park because in the 1980s, you know, the city of new york will declare bankruptcy and so forth and central park had become not a very hospitable place. so there was really a philanthropic effort to to raise the level. so it started this way and then moved to operations. and now for central park, two-thirds of the park operations are by the conservancy. and the city parks system still has some operations, but two-thirds ever the operation of central park are under the conservancy. so in that case it's a quasi governmental function. >> president tsen: let me just add to that. i mean, one of the reasons that

we had this tour was to look at different models tha models tha. and new york being a city that is in some ways older in their management of various parks, they've had different models. and i think that what we will do, bob, with your help and with your staff's help, is to next year one of the things that we should look at very carefully is what some of those models are because we have to manage in the end 290-acres of open space, hw we are going to do that. we haven't had a plan brought to us at the board to look carefully and very detailed budget of what it's going to take to operate and manage these various neighborhood parks and those city side parks and the various open spaces that we have. capital improvements and building the parks is one thing, but we've got to ensure that

it's going to be maintained and it's going to be open and it's going to be able to be -- again, you know, to operate and maintained in a clean safe way for all of the people involved. so looking at the various models was one of the things that we were hoping to do. and let me just say that because of core missions, we couldn't bring the whole commission on this trip but it is certainly my intention that all of you will have a chance at some point in time to participate and we'll bring the people over to participate with us and there will be other trips in the future. >> so a question about our existing park systems in san francisco. and we have one of the largest parks here too. golden gate park.

is there a conservancy that already works with that park. >> i think it's a 51-c but not a conservancy. >> okay. >> president tsen: mr. samaha. >> a few comments and a couple questions. one, i have been on this commission long enough, i think 12 years now, to remember that we did have a discussion about conservancy for our parks. i don't know how many years ago this was that we had this discussion, but so much comes before us and we had so many reiterations of a lot of our plans. but did we not have a position on establishing a conservancy for the management of the parks? for treasure island? >> i haven't gone back to some of the board conversations and

actions. the open space plan and they left it as an open question but that doesn't necessarily, you know, kind of catch the nuances of conversation that was happening at the board when the open phase plan was discussed here. >> it's just one of the options discussed but i remember having a very thorough discussion, it was before your time i believe, bob. and we have flushed that out and we thought that it was a great idea not to have rec and park manage the park and to have our own sort of way to manage and fund and all of that. so this is just one thing that i wanted to mention. and the other thing is that i was sorry that i could not go to new york city and i know that because of the brown act and other limitations for the way that we hold public meetings and

we could not all be there but i'm happy that a member of our board and staff were there to bring back the knowledge. and when i look at the number of locations where you guys went, i'm awed by new york and it really makes us feel so small. and it reminds me of a trip that i took years ago which is before and we went to the champagne region in france. i'm from the bay area and feeling all big that we have a big wine region and we said we have the mumm winery here in napa and we went to mumm and they had 25-kilometers of tunnel

under the city just for them. and it reminded me of how much bigger other areas are and how huge new york is and how much we can learn and i'd like to suggest bringing people here as well and not having to go there. and also i like this enough -- and thank you for doing that, bob -- and the synopsis and the next steps and we should look at the next steps here and develop, you know, to have more hearings and to have more study on many of these. because these need to be flushed out. one of the things that, you know, the fact of open space and the design is a really big one and i think that sometimes we get so caught up in the moment where we think that it's going to be the need that we have and it reminds me of clients of mine buying a house and you go in

there and they say we want to remodel everything and do all of this. and i say, wait, live in it for two or three years and see what you really need from the space. i think that we should carry that model here somewhat in terms of moving forward with our spaces on the island and how do we, you know, build in flexibility, among all of the next steps that you have mentioned here. so i look forward to us going through this as a way for us to move forward, to grow and learn, and, yeah, we also have a lot of other regional areas here, models, al ameadea, and there's a lot in the bay area that we can learn from that we don't have to go all the way to new york. but thank for doing that, commissioner tsen, for setting that up and let's use it to grow and move forward here. >> president tsen: mr. dunlop. >> thank you very much, and thank you for your work on this,

and the two of you just must have -- boy, that's a lot of work in a very short amount of time -- two days or something? amazing. and i, yeah, so i'm very grateful for your work. and it's going to take a lot of conversation to get it all -- pull it all out of you. but i think that it seems to me that the most important thing is the funding question. and the funding question to permanently fund it and that means that 50 years from now that it's not going to be falling apart because there's no money. we really have to look at that and make sure that what we put up is also what we can actually afford. and we're not leaving some huge

debt for future generations, that we're leaving an ed fis that we can all be proud of that will always be there. and i know that will be a major part of our conversation. and it probably should be a part that just goes parallel as we talk about what we're doing, like, you know, again, beautiful dog park. i love it. but is that going to be affordable in 20 years? and is there some way that we -- like, say the city as it occasionally does, goes into the red, will we be able to keep our part up? and to be able to maintain it to the standards that we have and which are very high standards. so just my two cents. thank you, again, for your efforts. >> president tsen: thank you, mr. dunlop.

and let we just say that the trip to new york was meant to inspire us with some ideas that they have instituted and also to look at carbon problems and issues that come up with the management of large open spaces. that is something that we'll have to dedicate ourselves to. but it was not meant to say that we have to copy what new york does. in fact, it's really interesting to note that when they were asked, the new york designers were asked what inspired them, they would say san francisco and they are inspirations to us. so we know that we have our own set of -- how should i -- design aesthetic and the fact that we really have an incredible, spectacular setting which is quite unrivaled in the world.

we have world-class architects and landscape architects here who are designing for us. so it was not meant to say that we had to copy them, but just to say that there are issues and ideas that we can share. and what came out of this is that we really have to focus in on what it's going to take to manage and maintain these open spaces in these parks and we have to have as they have done with many of their parks, even before they were finished, very detailed budgets on, you know, so that we know what is the funding that is required to make sure that we incorporate that in all of our planning and financing. and i am sure that there will be

other types of trips to bring and one is about affordable housing. so we will do that in the future. but i wanted to thank -- i wanted to thank linda for coming and i thank the landscape architects and tida staff and all of our partners at treasure island development. i think that it was a great group to go and to look and listen and then to bring back to san francisco the best ideas. so thank you all. >> thank you. >> president tsen: okay, let's see, any comments from the public? if not -- yes, yes. >> i'll comment quickly. first of all, i'm so sorry that i didn't get to go on that, i was nursing a knee injury and i'm sure they would have slowed you guys down too much. but i'm really glad that you all went. >> president tsen: and your partner too. >> and my partner got to go and so that was great.

it was a short 20 years ago that i was touring the contingency around chrissy field when they were looking to start working on broobrooklyn bridge park, so ita small world. i wanted to remind you that commissioner samaha you were right that we had an all-day workshop on conservancies and the benefits of those, maybe more than 10 years ago in one of the great ybi, and we had them from the california state park foundation. i think that isabelle wade was there from the neighborhood parks council and we had spoken to isbilisabelle krouse and alle people on how it might work. they are takeaways that i would be happy to dig up with you and share with you as we start this conversation. and the big one is that it was too soon then. so i think that now it's not too soon. it's just the right time. and the other was that the

success to many of these parks has to do with very active programming to keep things going on and to attract more people out there that also help to attract different types of funding and that also increases the cost for maibs because you -- maintenance because you have more people out there running around. so programming and maintenance are really a key thing for us to all work on soon. and i'd be happy to help in any way that i can. >> president tsen: thank you. all right, next item please. >> clerk: item 10, the year ahead. >> president tsen: that's a good segue, bob. >> yeah, so i just wanted to, you know, it's kind of a traditional january meeting to take a look at some of what is coming up in the next year. and, you know, starting with the navy transfer map, again, everything in rows and purple and in peach have now transferred to tida.

this next year we expect to get site 24 which is shown in green and then towards the end of 2020 or more likely in 2021, so we may take 2020 off, but more likely in 2021, some of the northeastern corner of the island will come -- come and then the last part. so the end of 2021, early 2022, which is site 12. it's really the only site where there's active work going on at this time. and in terms of infrastructure planning design, we have touched on it many times. a bulk of our focus in this next year is going to be shepherding the subphase three mapping activities through the various city agencies and through the board of supervisors and the department of public works. and that will be -- it's a very important -- in terms of maintaining progress and

financing on behalf of the developer and just keeping a flow to the construction work on the island. (please stand by)