while i can submit that i'm not read the data, i can tell you that several years ago the probation department had a grant to have one probation officer assigned to a middle school here in san francisco. one the middle school, one of the larger contributors to referrals for young people in those schools are our juvenile justice system. the partnership we were able to create the groups that probation officers able to facilitate on the site and the work that we were able to do with the counselors in that environment, we were able to reduce the number of young people that were coming in our juvenile justice system. as we reduce the number of youth in the juvenile justice system, this is our opportunity to pivot to prevention. this is our opportunity to leverage the things that have worked, to maximize and expand

upon those strategies in order to continue to drive down those numbers and to achieve additional benefit with respect to young people and families in the city. i would propose that we be allowed to continue in that regard, ultimately it is my belief whatever recommendation come from the blue ribbon panel panel the city and department will need to reframe its priorities to meet those needs. >> what does school based probation officer in a mill school do? >> several things officer can do is facilitate groups.

our capacity to be on site to work with the staff in the school to help problem solve to help young people and practitioners to understand the role of the juvenile justice system and what the alternative options are. that is an incredibly valuable resource. we are not seeking to implement an informal probation or supervision program with young people in the schools. it's clear part mandate for the state is not only to respond

young people who are arrested and refer to the juvenile justice system to keep young people from coming to the system. partnership with the school personnel, problem solving with young people who are in crises, direct engagement are also some of the things that we have seen can be beneficial to youth when there's a school-based probation officer. >> it does sound liking for you're 12-year-old meetin meetih a probation officer it seems stigmatizing. is there -- i don't know. i'm not doing that work. are they identify as probation

officer? >> it varies by setting. when we had this in place the probation officer became and almost seemless addition to the staff in that environment. they brought with them their expertise of the juvenile justice system problem solving with young people in crises and offering referrals. >> supervisor mandelman: do you have data on outcomes, success of that particular intervention? >> it was a very short-term program. i can look and see if we had any evaluation that was conducted. i can share that information with you. i'm also aware there are other school-based probation officers in other jurisdictions.

>> supervisor mandelman: that would be interesting. what does a probation officer facilitating cognitive intervention group mean? >> thank you for that question. this is rethinking probation. i wish i can say this is relatively new concept. it is not. it's a concept that's existed for the better part of last two decades. essentially these are probation officers that are meeting with groups of young people in are on probation. having conversations about their choices that they make. [please stand by]

>> and so our anticipation was at some point, we may need to have the capacity to fill that gap and utilize those resources. since we did not immediately return those young people back to log cabin ranch, i would agree at this point maintaining the positions in the budget is

certainly not necessary. however, in light of the conversations that we've been having and about the blue ribbon panels to juvenile having, reinstating those positions at some later date may be of value. >> supervisor mandelman: and how hard would that be? is it hard to create a position? nope? >> creating a new position just requires the approval of the mayor and the board, which i don't want to emphasize that is not always an easy task. we had instructions from the mayor this year to not add new positions to departments. >> supervisor mandelman: and in a future budget, the positions already exist. >> but it's certainly available to the mayor and the board. >> supervisor mandelman: and how are you thinking about -- you've got a lot going on now,

but how are you thinking about log cabin ranch? how are you going to come to conclusions about log cabin ranch? do you think it's going to go to a panel or what are you thinking around the use of log cabin ranch? >> i think log cabin ranch is a unique conversation in and of itself. >> supervisor mandelman: and we had a whole hearing on it, right? >> i think that beyond its most recent utilization post dispositional residential facility for youth in the yufl justice system, that there is an opportunity to think more broadly as to what purpose log cabin ranch could serve to the

city. i think spending $9 million a year to service 8 or 9 young people in that facility was not sustainable. so i would love to see log cabin ranch be maximized for its utilization for whatever purpose it might serve in the city. and if there is a role for young people in the juvenile justice system -- and there are a sufficient number of young people who would benefit from that environment, i would love to see that, as well. but at this point, our position is we want to see what the recommendations are that come out of the blue ribbon panel. and to the extent that there is some value with respect to log cabin ranch in those recommendations, we would certainly be interested in pursuing them. >> supervisor mandelman: okay. thank you. >> you're welcome. >> chair fewer: yes. >> president yee: thanks, chief nance, for waiting. >> certainly. >> president yee: in regards to

the pilot project you talked about at the middle school, what year do you know that was approximately? was it a long time ago or something? >> it wasn't that long ago, and we were partnering with viz valley middle school at the time. and it was between -- i was to say between 2014 and 2016, i want to say, but don't hold me to that. i can certainly check and get the accurate dates for you. >> president yee: and do you remember the principal's name here? >> what. >> president yee: was that vincent chow? durkee. >> i think it was principal durkee, and that was part of a grant that we received from the state.

>> president yee: i guess would you describe what this individual who moit be going ingoing -- mighti be going into middl school be doing? what's the purpose of somebody else who's more knowledgeable in terms of skills and truth dynamic interaction? i don't know without understanding what's going on. >> what i've seen is when school-based probation officers are present is because they understand the nature of the kinds of situations and behaviors that land a young person in the juvenile justice system, and because of their knowledge and expertise of some of the programs, services, and resources that work

specifically with youth in the juvenile justice system, that they have been of tremendous value to not only the teachers, but the counselors and school investigators. and being able to sit around the table and consult on truancy behaviors or behaviors in the classroom or borderline conduct has been extremely valuable, especially when those problems can be solved at the lowest level without resulting in a young person being referred to the juvenile justice system. so that is where that value has been tremendous. and again, i think that when we look at the middle school ages young people that come through the juvenile justice system, in looking at the patterns where some of these young people are being referred from, that that

is absolutely something that we should do. and i might also add that we had folks from the community that have reached out to the probation department asking for a school-based probation officer being able to them in that capacity. obviously, it's not something we can do at every school, but if it's something we can do for certain young people that attend certain schools, it would seem that's consistent with our goals and perspectives with respect to prevention. >> president yee: yeah. you know, i don't know much -- i haven't seen much research -- i'm sure there's been some research in terms of that particular situation. we do so much of our work, social justice issues, and whether it's systems that we want people to be knowledgeable about, we do that work through

nonprofits, and they find staff that's probably knowledgeable in those areas -- and again, i don't know if it's more effective, less effective if a bona fide probation officer that shows up -- is this something that shows up in uniform. >> no. >> president yee: it doesn't matter for the kids to see an adult and know something. >> correct. and our work is not at that level. it is not limited to young people who are active on protection. and while there may be -- >> president yee: no, i'm -- >> and while there may be people on probation in that same school, and to the extent that they are, that person serves as a liaison between that school and the juvenile justice people that are

involved in the system. >> president yee: well, i'm going to go out on a limb because i don't understand the issue and it's presented by supervisor ronen that -- i'm not so sure that i'm going to come to any conclusion, but the question that i have is this -- this -- but the impact of having somebody describe some of the stuff that you're talking about is useful. i can see another pathway to that, which is to maybe use some of those resources is -- since you didn't hire anybody that, use some of the staff savings to actually contract out to some nonprofits, when

organizations that maybe -- some organizations that may have some expertise or not. maybe they could hire some probation officers so they're coming from the community. i don't know if that makes any difference. i'm just thinking out loud and not having any conclusion. so if that's the direction then that this group of people here sitting next to me would like to take it, is it possible in terms of restructuring the finances to do that? >> i can certainly have that conversation with our team. i'm not clear to the extent that we can take salaries and benefits and redirect them in that way when they were originally allocated. although i would imagine to the extent that the board is interesting in reallocating the

resources, that there could be a pathway to get there. i think most importantly what i've heard in the question is whether or not there's an opportunity to identify someone other than a probation officer to perform the tasks and serve the role that i described. and while i think that perhaps there are some of those roles and responsibilities that could be effectively served by a community based person, that there are others specifically as they relate to the juvenile justice system, the juvenile probation department and its work that would be better served by a probation officer. >> president yee: and i'll just leave it at that. i think i'm just trying to be open to the concept of -- >> yes.

>> president yee: one of the most difficult age to work with is students -- high school students. i've taught at every level, and i find that middle school students are sort of grownup to be adults, but they're not quite there. and sometimes, some of the kids that have the most challenges at middle school, they tend to also unfortunately drop out by the time they go to high school. so it's really, to me, a crucial age to reach these students. >> yes, i would completely agree. and to the earlier point with respect to the school-to-prison pipeline, we want to have a chance to engage those students in crisis before they end up in the juvenile justice system. unfortunately, for far too many of them, that is precisely what

happened. >> president yee: thank you. >> you're welcome. >> chair fewer: supervisor ronen? >> commissioner renn >> supervisor ronen: yes, colleagues, kind of continuing with supervisor yee's comments around the budget, we are the last line of protecting the taxpayer dollars. over the last few years, the amount of children that j.d.p. is responsible for has declined by 67%, and yet, the staffing has only declined by 7%. that's a 60% difference, and i feel like we have fallen asleep at the wheel here in terms of being fiscally prudent in overseeing this organization. i never want to cut where it leads to a layoff, so we're looking at where are the vacant positions in the budget where we can do something here? of course kids in middle school

need extra support. it's one of the worst times in a child's life. los angeles just pulled all of their probation officers out of the middle school precisely partially because of that -- the stigma that supervisor mandelman was talking about, but because that's not the best entity to provide that nurturing, that mental support at that really, really tender age. we decided as a board -- i know supervisor stefani wasn't in agreement, but we want to do a radical reform by closing down city hall. if we do it all at once, that's

a really irresponsible way -- juvenile haull. if we do it all at once, that's irresponsible. the person that we're contracting with to oversee our blue ribbon panel, david mohamed, a nationally recognized expert is saying probation officers should never be providing its cognitive therapy, it's crazy we're considering this new position in j.p.d.s budget before this blue ribbon panel has a chance to make its recommendations. so i would ask that you support this today.

we know -- perhaps the budget and lemgs lay tiff analyst can speak -- legislative analyst can speak to this. we know that juvenile hall is grocery overstaffed, and we know that we have a very big undertaking in front of us in 2.5 years that we should not do in one fell swoop but that we should prepare for over time. so i would again ask the budget committee to support this proposal. >> chair fewer: supervisor mandelman? >> supervisor mandelman: and i'm hearing more from the department about this proposal after you digest it more as to whether this is the best idea

and why. can you make address the observation that supervisor ronen has made about the disconnect between a declining -- is that right, the number of youth you're responsible for in juvenile hall has declined on a great magnitude, but the staffing of j.p.d. has not. what are your thoughts about how that would come into better alignment and how these positions relate to recognizing some kind of savings as the responsibility as the department seems to have shrunk. >> i think it's an excellent and legitimate question, supervisor mandelman. i think the best way to describe and the most

succinctly way to describe what appears to be a disconnect between the staffing and the numbers has a lot to do with now you is specific our work has become over the past decade. and if you were to look at what the standards were, even with respect to how services are delivered to people in custody, there has been tremendous expectations in the way that service is delivered. there have been substantial changes in the regulatory requirement associated with running a juvenile hall. so for example, a decade ago, young people probably spent far more time in their rooms than they do today, and as a result, the level of engagement required of the staff was far less significant.

whereas you fast forward to where we are today, where young people spend the vast majority of today out of their rooms, with the exceptions of two hours during the waking hours and ten hours overnight. so as a result of that, these officers are much more interactive, far less observational. we have multiple programs in agencies simultaneously. we've maintained that san francisco's juvenile hall is unique in a variety of circumstances, first and foremost, the level of

supervision in our schools and c.b.o.s, but the fact that we're not operating remotely with cameras, and the staff are carrying pepper spray to dispel conflicts and other problems that young people may have. so i would say that as the numbers have gone down, we've been far more selective in the way we've focused our attention and resources and quite honestly, the risk assessment. the low-risk people are not finding their way to juvenile hall, so what is left are young people that require a high degree of management, psychiatric care, and behavior management, and that simply cannot be done with fewer staff. so to conclude as the standards

have changed, as the regulatory commitment has changed, as our services have changed, so has the left of engagement and staff required in order to deliver that high level of care. >> supervisor mandelman: but you can understand tof skepticism, and you would probably expect, i would think, reduced costs, quite frankly. >> yes. >> supervisor mandelman: of those four positions, it looks like at least two in the halls. the two probation officers -- >> none of the positions are in the hall. >> supervisor mandelman: are in

the haul. >> and it represents a separate division. >> supervisor mandelman: and what is the balance of budget and employees in the hall, out of the hall -- and you don't have to answer this for me right now, but i'd be curious. >> so in our budget presentation, and i'd have to look back at the slide. i'm going to consult with my staff. do you have the breakdown by division, the percentage of our budget? [inaudible] >> supervisor mandelman: you can get this to me. >> we can get this to you. >> supervisor mandelman: thank you. >> but there are currently 35 probation officers whose

responsibility it is to work with young people who are not in custody but to work with the youth -- and to work with the youth as they are detained. i know there's been a lot of discussion about the cost of operating juvenile hall, but at the end of the day, that cost equates to about $42 an hour per hour per juvenile. that's what we're spending to service san francisco's youth in juvenile hall. >> chair fewer: oh, i'm so sorry. paying attention. i was listening -- and i wanted to just mention, chief -- so chief, i want to say having been on the school board for 8 years, and then also having been an advocate for the schools in the southeast part of san francisco, you know, i'm sorry, but i don't agree. i just don't think probation

officers should be in middle schools. students start middle schools sometimes at 10 years of age. this is why we're looking at putting our peer counseling into -- also, i don't believe that police officers should be in our schools. we used to have police officers in all of our schools. but it is because police officers and probation officers are really associated with the juvenile justice system, with a justice system, and i think that what we're looking at is at the school district, we've invested a lot in counselors, we've invested a lot in wellness centers, we've invested a lot in i think a lot of these types of support around especially for our lgbtq use also which we find through

our studies also are three times, four times more likely to have depression and be suicidal. these issues that come out around that middle school age, it is a very odd age. they come in 4'2", they leave 5'2". if any of you have had middle schoolers, you know the transformation is tremendous. and so i don't believe that probation officers should be in middle schools. i think it might have worked at one time or maybe in a different area, but i think in san francisco what we're looking at is more of a holistic way of looking at it. with san francisco kids, the problems and challenges that they have, it's sometimes not one simple issue, it's many complex issues that even we don't have control of.

it's about generational also poverty or things that i think society actually intensefies. i just think with social media, there is no forgiveness. you know, i think we all mess up. and with social media, it is not just out there to your school, but to thousands and thousands of people, and it's forever. i think the idea of a probation officer really understandtion or being skilled to do -- understanding or being skilled to do -- or meet those needs, i just kind of don't think it should be there. so i just wanted to say that. having been in these schools, and i think supervisor yee was sort of probably thinking about all the supports that we've put in for counselors, and we do that actually funded through the city money that the city so

generously gave us through a charter amendment, that most of that money goes to counselors, it goes to peer counselors, but it goes to our wellness centers where the staff have degrees in family counseling. and i've seen this group. they choose this group that with really communicate with youth and communicate with them. these people, i've seen them in the schools, and there's a level of comfort and trust, and i think that is super important. so i just want to say even in the positions to facilitate wellness groups, they do that at the intervention centers and beacon centers. i think that i have to say that i strongly say that it is not the place for them, and --

yeah, and i'm sorry that we disagree. >> no, thank you for that feedback. i appreciate it. >> chair fewer: and i appreciate you actually trying to make a difference here. so thank you. i just wanted to tell my colleagues how i was feeling about that. thank you. >> thank you. >> supervisor ronen: yeah. i just wanted to mention if you -- why haven't you considered repurposing or why doesn't this committee consider repurposing some of the staff at juvenile hall that they can then use for this purpose if it -- i mean, i still think it doesn't make any sense to start these new programs, and it's contrary to the evidence and what experts in the field say is the best practice, but they have -- i mean, 19 of the staff

from log cabin were sent to staff juvenile hall above and beyond the staff that was there when the population declines 60%. so this makes no sense whatsoever why we would be adding new positions is just beyond me. that's all. >> if i may respond to supervisor ronen's comments, i think it's important that we move these log cabin ranch counselors in juvenile hall into vacant juvenile hall positions, which is why there's an opportunity to talk about cutting positions from log cabin ranch. at the same time, as a result of doing that, we have reduced our reliance on as-needed employees, cutting that cost by close to 50%.

we've reduced overtime costs in juvenile hall, as well, and so we'll probably fall close to $900,000 instead of the $1.2 million from last year. and that's only in the short period of time that we've been able to have those log cabin ranch counselors on-line. they had to be trained, they had to perform observations before they could perform as full-time employees. so i anticipate that over the course of the next fiscal year that we will realize even additional savings by having made that transition. and so it isn't as though

that -- >> chair fewer: would that be okay with you? okay. supervisor ronen, would that be fine? okay. that's great. chief, would that be okay? >> absolutely. >> chair fewer: would we require the chief to come back in attendance? >> i'm happy to be here. >> chair fewer: are you? okay, sir. you've been here all day?

>> if you can put me first? >> chair fewer: why are you making a face, mr. b.l.a.? >> i don't know that we'll have those at the beginning of the meeting, but i can talk to the chief -- >> i will defer to the controller. >> chair fewer: thank you so much for your patience, chief. sorry, mr. mandelman. >> supervisor mandelman: well, i was wondering, we want to get this done by tomorrow rather than giving them until monday or tuesday. >> chair fewer: yeah, tomorrow because then we know what we're dealing with because we really don't know. okay. so i would make a motion -- are there any other items before us? no, this is it. okay. than thank goodness. i wanted to make a motion to continue items 1 and 2 to the

budget and finance committee hearing tomorrow. do i have a second? thank you. supervisor mandelman. and there's no further business before us. this meeting's adjourned. thank you, everyone.

>> welcome to another episode of safety on today is episode we'll show you how 0 retroactive you're home let's go inside and

take a look. >> hi and patrick chief officer and director of earthquake for the city and county of san francisco welcome to another episode of stay safe in our model home with matt we'll talk about plywood. >> great thanks. >> where are we we if you notice bare studs those are prone to failure in an earthquake we need to stabilize those they don't lean over and plywood is effective as long as you nail along every edge of the plywood for the framing we'll nail along the sides and top and on the bottom 0 immediately you'll see a problem in a

typical san francisco construction because nothing to nail the bottom of the plywood we've got to wind block between the studs and we'll secure this to the mud sill with nails or surface screws something to nail the bottom of the plywood. >> i notice we have not bolted the foundation in the previous episode thorough goes through options with different products so, now we have the blocking we'll a xoich attach the plywood. >> the third thing we'll attach the floor framing of the house above so the top of the braced walls one to have a steel angle on top of this wall and types of to the top of the wall with nails into the top plate

and the nails in this direction driving a nail it difficult unless you have a specialized tool so this makes that easy this is good, good for about 5 hundred pounds of earthquake swinging before and after that mount to the face of wall it secures the top of wall and nailed into the top plate of the with triple wall and this gives us a secure to resist the forces. >> so you now see the space is totally available to dots blocking that he bottom and

bolted the foundation in corneas what the code in the next what the code in the next episode you'll see you apply - working for the city and county of san francisco will immerse you in a vibrant and dynamic city that's on the forefront of economic growth, the arts, and social change. our city has always been on the edge of progress and innovation. after all, we're at the meeting of land and sea. - our city is famous for its iconic scenery, historic designs, and world- class style. it's the birthplace of blue jeans, and where "the rock" holds court over the largest natural harbor on the west coast. - the city's information technology professionals work on revolutionary projects, like providing free wifi to residents and visitors, developing new programs to keep sfo humming, and ensuring patient safety at san francisco general.

our it professionals make government accessible through award-winning mobile apps, and support vital infrastructure projects like the hetch hetchy regional water system. - our employees enjoy competitive salaries, as well as generous benefits programs. but most importantly, working for the city and county of san francisco gives employees an opportunity to contribute their ideas, energy, and commitment to shape the city's future. - thank you for considering a career with the city and county of san francisco.

>> my name is alan schumer. i am a fourth generation san

franciscan. in december, this building will be 103 years of age. it is an incredibly rich, rich history. [♪] >> my core responsibility as city hall historian is to keep the history of this building alive. i am also the tour program manager, and i chair the city advisory commission. i have two ways of looking at my life. i want it to be -- i wanted to be a fashion designer for the movies, and the other one, a political figure because i had

some force from family members, so it was a constant battle between both. i ended up, for many years, doing the fashion, not for the movies, but for for san franciscan his and then in turn, big changes, and now i am here. the work that i do at city hall makes my life a broader, a richer, more fulfilling than if i was doing something in the garment industry. i had the opportunity to develop relationships with my docents. it is almost like an extended family. i have formed incredible relationships with them, and also some of the people that come to take a tour.

she was a dressmaker of the first order. i would go visit her, and it was a special treat. i was a tiny little girl. i would go with my wool coat on and my special little dress because at that period in time, girls did not wear pants. the garment industry had the -- at the time that i was in it and i was a retailer, as well as the designer, was not particularly favourable to women. you will see the predominant designers, owners of huge complexes are huge stores were all male. women were sort of relegated to a lesser position, so that, you reached a point where it was a difficult to survive and survive financially. there was a woman by the name of

diana. she was editor of the bazaar, and evoke, and went on and she was a miraculous individual, but she had something that was a very unique. she classified it as a third i. will lewis brown junior, who was mayor of san francisco, and was the champion of reopening this building on january 5th of 1999. i believe he has not a third eye , but some kind of antenna attached to his head because he had the ability to go through this building almost on a daily basis during the restoration and corrects everything so that it would appear as it was when it opened in december of 1915.

>> the board of supervisors approved that, i signed it into law. jeffrey heller, the city and county of san francisco oh, and and your band of architects a great thing, just a great thing. >> to impart to the history of this building is remarkable. to see a person who comes in with a gloomy look on their face , and all of a sudden you start talking about this building, the gloomy look disappears and a smile registers across their face. with children, and i do mainly all of the children's tours, that is a totally different feeling because you are imparting knowledge that they have no idea where it came from, how it was developed, and you can start talking about how

things were before we had computer screens, cell phones, lake in 1915, the mayor of san francisco used to answer the telephone and he would say, good morning, this is the mayor. >> at times, my clothes make me feel powerful. powerful in a different sense. i am not the biggest person in the world, so therefore, i have to have something that would draw your eye to me. usually i do that through color, or just the simplicity of the look, or sometimes the complication of the look. i have had people say, do those shoes really match that outfit?

retirement to me is a very strange words. i don't really ever want to retire because i would like to be able to impart the knowledge that i have, the knowledge that i have learned and the ongoing honor of working in the people's palace. you want a long-term career, and you truly want to give something to do whatever you do, so long as you know that you are giving to someone or something you're then yourself. follow your passion and learn how to enrich the feelings along the way. >> i came to san francisco in

1969. i fell in love with this city and and this is where i raised my family at. my name is bobbie cochran. i've been a holly court resident for 32 years. i wouldn't give up this neighborhood for nothing. i moved into this apartment one year ago. my favorite thing is my kitchen. i love these clean walls. before the remodeling came along, the condition of these apartments had gotten pretty bad, you know, with all the mildew, the repairs. i mean you haven't seen the apartment for the program come

along. you wouldn't have believed it. so i appreciate everything they did. i was here at one point. i was. because i didn't know what the outcome of holly court was going to be. you know, it really got -- was it going to get to the point where we have to be displaced because they would have to demolish this place? if they had, we wouldn't have been brought back. we wouldn't have been able to live in burn. by the program coming along, i welcome it. they had to hire a company and they came in and cleaned up all the walls. they didn't paint the whole apartment, they just cleaned up the mildew part, cleaned up and straighted it and primed it. that is impressive. i was a house painter. i used to go and paint other people's apartments and then come back home to mine and i would say why couldn't i live in a place like that.

and now i do. >> president yee: good morning. we have a special treat for you guys today. this -- i'm going to welcome you not to the budget committee, but the budget committee will just follow this special meeting very shortly, so i want to say that welcome to the june 20, 2019 special meeting of the san francisco