>> test, test. perfect. there we go. [laughter] all right. happy monday, everybody. i would like to welcome everybody to tonight's regularly scheduled sheriff's department oversight board meeting. today is monday, september 26th and we're getting started at 5:32. on behalf of the sheriff's department over side board we like to thank the staff at sfgov tv for providing broadcast and method vating tonight's meeting -- moderating tonight's meeting and colleagues, please stand and we'll recite the pledge after allegiance. ["pledge of allegiance"]

>> thank you for that. dan, let's call the first agenda item. actually, if we would like to make an amendment, colleagues, if you don't mind, to the agenda, i would like to move item 7 to item no. 2 now that we have a full amount of folks tonight, i think it would behoove us to nominations of officers early on if folks are okay with that? >> yes. >> do i need to make a motion on that? >> no. >> okay. we'll move it. okay. so, with that, dan, let's call item no. one, please. >> thank you, president. calling item no. one, roll call and informational item. member afuhaamango? >> present. >> member afuhaamango is

present. president brookter? >> present. >> president brookter is present. member carrion? >> present. >> member carrion is present. member palmer? >> present. >> member palmer is present. member nguyen? >> present. >> member nguyen is present. >> member soo? >> present. >> member soo is present. >> member wetchter? >> present. >> we have a quorum. >> given that member carrion and member palmer, this is your first meeting with us here live, would either of you like to give introductions on yourselves? i know when you got an opportunity to call in, you did but now we get to see your beautiful bright smiling faces and now if you would like to do introductions, you can. i'll give it over to member carrion. >> it's an honor to be here and serve and be present and really talk about the things that we can do to improve our sheriff's department and really facilitate transparency and accountability.

i'm very excited to be able to lend my expertise as well as to provide you know, clear woman of color representation on this board and be active in those communities and thank you all so much and i'm looking forward to working with each of you to do important work. >> likewise, thank you so much for being here, member carrion. member palmer. >> hello, my name is william palmer. it's good to be here and this is a surreal moment. not too long ago i was sitting on a bunk. [laughter] and i could never imagine this in a million years but i would love to give my expertise as knowing the system from the inside out, working closely with the sheriff's department on the inside and the outside. and make sure that we have an oversight board that makes our city safe and secure and all representatives are represented fairly.

>> i appreciate that, member palmer and looking forward to leaning in with you on that area of expertise. so, with that, my fellow colleagues, you got the opportunity to speak last month so we'll open things up for public comment before we move on to the next line item. >> for members of the public, you may view this meeting on web x on cable channel 26. at this time, the public is welcome to address the board for up to two minutes online item one. comments are opportunities to speak during the public comment period are available for members of the public who are present by lining up at the podium or those not present by calling by phone, calling 4156550001 tell and access code, 24946776879 and press pound and pound again to join as a participant and you'll hear a beep when you have entered the public meeting.

press star three and this will advise the moderator you wish to speak and add you to the queue. when you hear the moderator say, good evening, caller, you have two minutes. this is your opportunity to make public comment. you will have two minutes to provide your comments. once your two minutes ended, you'll move out of the queue and listening as a participant in the meeting unless you decide to disconnect. members of the public may stay on the meeting and listen for when another line item comes up and press star three to be added back into the queue to speak on another line item. it -- it looks like we have no public comment. >> thank you, dan. welcome again member carrion and member palmer. let's go to the next line item, please. >> president, did you say you wanted to move line 7 up?

>> correct. >> calling line item no. two, nomination and election of officers (discussion and possible action item) further discussion and possible election of officers to preside over the board. >> and thank you for voting me as a pro tem and it was a conversation we had last month and we want to wait until we have all members here in order to officially do things the right way so are there nominations for the presidency? >> before we move to the nominations, is it possible to kind of get a roll call of who is running for each office, um, position and why? i know we did it over e-mail but it's helpful to refresh. >> is that something we can do, noeks that want to -- folks that

want to -- there's nominations made and those can give -- >> yes, the way it works when you don't have anything set out in your rules, typically what bodies do is they first take public comment on the agenda item. >> okay. >> this is not how you have to do it but how it's often done. then the presiding officer request nomination from the office from the members and you don't need a second. when no additional nominations are offered, the presiding officer closes the nomination and then the commission votes on the nominations in the order in which they were received and the first candidate to receive a majority of the votes is elected to the office but there's nothing that prevents you from taking a couple of minutes and expressing your interest. i think that's what i'm hearing, people can say whether they are interested and i don't see why you can't do that. >> absolutely. so, we'll take comments from any members who are interested in the presidency. the floor is open. member wetchter

>> yes, thank you. i had, i had a short blurb five weeks ago as my interest, as many of you know, i have worked in the field for oversight for a long time and a campaign for the creation of san francisco's office of citizen's comment and now the police accountability and i worked there from 1983 to 1984 and returned and worked there for almost 19 years and i worked for an investigator for 43 years in the criminal legal department for most of that time. oversight is the great passion of my professional life. it's what i dedicated a tremendous amount of my time and energy to, not just in my paid work but through volunteer work for the national association for civilian oversight of law enforcement. i served on their board of directors for 7 years. been involved with the organization for 20 years and at their meeting two weeks ago, was

elected again to their board, so i'm continuing to make contributions to that. i'm seeking presidency for the same reason. i worked on a small crafted language of the charter amend; campaigned for its passage and then applied for a board of supervisors appointment because this is incredibly important work to me much it's the main focus of my life and i think given my experiences and knowledge in this particular area, i can be most useful to this board in the position of president particularly during its formative first year when it will make some critical decisions appointing an inspector general and establishing oversight for the sheriff's department. i'm someone who values collaboration more than hierarchy and that's

why the draft rules of order, i sent dan, which i think you have, the responsibility of setting the agenda should be collaborative between the president and vice-president and you want to bring in many voices as possible. i think the strength of any organization, any team and i think we can look at this as a team, i hope, is the diversity of the experiences and perspectives of its members and we have tremendous diversity in that area and i'm very, very proud of that. so i want to bring that out as much as possible, be as inclusive as possible, share as much as possible and that's reflected in the fact that, i asked dan to send you information about oversight about the opportunity to apply for the scholarship to the (indiscernible) conference which julie did apply for and i was happy to see her at the

conference and variance your events and oversight so i want to bring that -- bring in sharing that collaboration in that position. so that's why i'm seeking that. >> thank you for that member wetchter. my other colleagues, the floor is open. >> thank you, commissioner brookter. i too, have put my name in as president. i most recently served for 12 years as a commissioner for the san francisco commission on the status of women. i'm a fourth generation san franciscan and because of that, i'm very immersed in the community and i believe in community collaborations, community hearings. on the commission, on the status of women, we did work with the criminal justice system and also very closely with the sheriff's department, adult probation and i'm particularly proud of the rally family visitation services that was promoted through the san francis memorial hospital and i was on the bore of saint francis for nine years but that encourages

relationships with fathers who may have been incarcerated because of domestic violence and encourage relationships with their children. and we put together a lot of reports, so dashboards and data, my academic training is at the mathematician under graduate from uc berkeley and pure math statistics that will masters and apply mathematics of -- so i bring a lot of diverse experiences, academic ly and i'm familiar with the "brown act" and sunshine ordinance so i believe in collaboration but i want to make sure that we remember that we act as an entire body and that means that no individual commissioner goes out to do things that might mistakenly be

representative of the entire commission without acknowledging the commission. i think it's important when we are establishing the inspector general position that we do have some input from the community but also it's an unbiased means of doing so. i was glad to go to the conference and i was glad to see director henderson and am i didn't expect to see there. i served for almost that years on the california democratic party executive board. i'm still a lead cochair of the pot from committee. i'm proud of the work we have did especially with our criminal justice plank and doug case who served with nackle for a while, and he's on the san diego police commission and he's my designee for the criminal justice plank chair so we've worked very collaboratively, the

most important thing we tried to eliminate choke holds and i think we've always been (indiscernible) when the pot from committee because when we put something in the pot form, that means it actually becomes law or it goes to the ballot box. i also am active with the asian national pacific bar and i have been on the civil rights bar and the asian commission bar so i think it brings a lot of areas of expertise as well as collaboration within the community, so thank you very much for your consideration. >> no, thank you. any other colleagues? seeing none, i want to thank both for your commitment to the city and county of san francisco, to this oversight board and i think you both bring a wealth of knowledge so i think with dan, we can go ahead and open it up to public comment for the two individuals that have put their name in a hat for presidency. >> thank you, president

brookter. for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item no. two, if you're present, please line up at the podium. otherwise, please call 415-655-0001 and enter access code, 24946776879. press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. we have no public comment. >> all right, thank you for that dan. seeing that, we have two names of the individuals who put their name in the hat. gena, how do we need to -- >> someone needs to make a

motion. >> okay. >> and another motion. [mic is off] >> make a motion, okay. so colleagues, do we have a motion for either member wetchter or member soo? >> i move to nominate jason wetchter. >> i second. >> so then we go to your vote. is there other nominations that need to be made -- >> you would vote in the order in which the nominations are received and the first person that gets four votes (indiscernible). >> okay. any other nominations? >> i like to nominate julie soo for nomination? >> are we doing vice-president and president? oh, we were doing president first and then vice-president. my apologies, colleagues on that. there's two

nominations. two motions. one for member wetchter and one for member soo. i'm going to the vote on member wetchter. >> i believe there's a point of clarification. i believe the second motion was for vice-president for soo. >> is that what it was michael? >> i was nominating board member soo for vice-president. >> for vice-president, okay. i didn't hear that. >> oh. >> we're doing president first. >> so right now there's a motion on the floor for member wetchter. are there any other motions? >> yes. i move to nominate julie soo for president. >> so there's been two motions put on the floor and the first one for member wetchter. so, dan -- i'm going to vote for wetchter as well. nominations, it's closed.

>> then you vote. >> member wetchter, correct. >> [mic is off] >> and the first one who gets four votes -- >> correct. can we go with member wetchter and we'll do roll call. >> yes, president brookter. member afuhaamango, how do you vote? >> i'm voting for wetchter. >> president brookter? >> no. >> his nomination -- [mic is off] >> member carrion? >> no. >> member palmer? >> yes. >> member nguyen? >> yes. >> member soo is this >> no. >> member wetchter? >> yes.

>> it's four yeses. >> so we have four yeses. congratulations, president wetchter. >> thank you very much and thank you to my colleagues. obviously, i have a lot to learn but i know i have a lot of great resources in the six of you and i'll do my best to live up to the expectation of this office both from the city and from you, my colleagues. >> for sure. >> roll call -- vice-president. >> oh, yes. >> it's okay. >> we call nominations for vice-president. >> i guess we'll hear from anybody that wants to be a vice-president first, right? so, board member palmer and i would like to be nominated for

vice-president. as 17 i was incarcerated in riverside and they decided to say i was amenable and i was ay literate dry belt and i knew education was my key to not only freedom but rough return to the character to which my family raised me to be so at age 45 i saw myself going to die in f- i didn't get out of prison and i studied law from the great men who fought for other people's freedom. i was successful in gaining my freedom and changed the sb260 laws for youth offenders and i released myself and hundreds of others who followed behind me before the board parole hearing decided to create another regulations to end that. i came out of san francisco to go to the california supreme court to rule that my constitution punishment, 22 of my 31 said that i said that i shouldn't be on parole.

they decided that's not the answer but they could never send me back to prison on that number. i thought that was successful. so i joined san francisco jail justice coalition, worked closely with sheriff moto and closing down jails and giving out phone calls so people can keep in touch with their family and giving their care packages when they came in so they can have dignity and that's when i got into really loving my city and the type of progress we can make when we come together. i also was appointed to the san francisco reentry council at the cindy commission because i wanted to make sure no more william palmers or they called me little billy would be sent to prison for life or adult sent to prison and that's a work in progress. i started life after next nonprofit because of my reentry

because of the patrol department was rougher than my prison stand and my officer put me in jail three tiles to ruin my supreme court hearing and i told him i loved him and he was doing what he was supposed to do and he disappeared a couple of months later no longer being a patrol agent. i have been both sides and they are both ugly and i have seen the bars and i have seen men and women dedicated to making changes and i support that. i support the heating of the disease policies that have been in place to put black and brown people behind bars and that work is still steadily needed to be looked at and addressed but i've also been a part of the process to remove bad apples and to make sure that they no longer dishonor the president of star which comes from the arabic word in my

religious beliefs islam meaning honorable. so as long as you're honoring that badge, i'm on your side. but when you dishonor that badge, then you have to come see me. >> and is there anyone else interested in the position of vice-president? >> yes. thank you so much, everyone. my name is xiochitl carrion and you may have known my work as a prosecutor and i'm here because i have been a victim of crime. i'm here because as a three-year-old child, my mother was murdered by my father and that pain and that suffering really showed me very early on the injustice in the world. i lived through these

experiences of not only having to work through criminal justice systems of having to navigate adult, basically, in all of my life of coming from a place as a we're latina, coming from a place of the extreme poverty, coming from a place of abuse and learning that justice is around the corner. and it's around the corner if people are able to come together and work together in a meaningful way. my life experience is something of a horror story and i come before you a completely different person, not based solely on my actions but on the actions of community and on the actions of social justice leaders of women, of queers and people who don't

get to sit at this table. as much i have accolades and i have gotten those now, i'm currently on the california law commission where i assist the california legislature in changing our laws. this is my second nomination from a different governor. i've been in over 30 plus leadership positions but it comes from this place, it comes from this place of recognizing that victims need to be considered because the rlt after as a past prosecutor, i very early learned on that victims without justice become defends and we need to address how victims are -- defendants and we need to address how victims are treated and sometimes the victims are those in our criminal justice system as well. as a pro cute cuter, i was in the independent investigation bureau and i delve into thorough

detail of the policies and regulations of what the sheriff here does here in san francisco. i've had the opportunity to look at misconduct and see how there were people who should not have held that bench, that acts where the misconduct that shouldn't have been representative of the people that are meant to keep us safe. i'm here as a past litigator. i've been in tries. i've been in transactional work as both a civil attorney now and now a corporate attorney where i assist in building community between so many folks that have pain and there is so much pain due to the lack of transparency and the lack of people being able to set aside maybe their

egos and say, we are going to work together to make this the best possible institution that we have. so, i'm here to you as a vice-president because i care about san francisco. i live in the community. my family is here. my wife is here, my kids, so we live in selma. and we're in it. you're not going to see somebody who is going to be coming out and just completely detached from community because i want to show that it's not only all of my work in nonprofits because i have done it all from taking out trashes to leading organizations to whatever needs to get done but that's what it takes, it takes someone who is able to work with every single person and i use my personal experience and my fuel

and i buffered that with my education with my law degree, with study chica studies, lgbt studies and labor in the workplace. by being there and representing domestic violence victims when i was a prosecutor and also by making sure that when i was a prosecutor and there was foul play i dismissed appropriate cases and you look at the cases and you looked at the facts and you saw, was there probable cause, was there an error and you held the line for justice. and that's something i'm very proud of. i'm eager to serve in this capacity to share my skill sets that come from personal experience of coming from where i come from and you know, making from the bottom now we're here and i'm very excited to be able to share that with

you and hopefully bring a different perspective, a perspective that many times is not heard, so i thank you all for your time and i hope that i'm able to use this expertise in a meaningful and thoughtful and pragmatic way, thank you. >> anyone else interested in declaring? and i'm sorry, do we take public comment now or after we have nominations? >> [mic is off] >> technically you already had public comment on this item so you're not required to do it but it would be nice maybe to offer it. >> certainly. we'll open this to public comment. if any member of the public wishes to comment upon this agenda item. >> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item no. office

of the vice-president, if you're present line um podium, otherwise, please call 415-655-0001 and access code, 24946776879 and press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. there's no public comment. >> thank you. we'll open the floor for nominations for the position of vice-president. >> i'd like to nominate commissioner carrion. >> i second that nomination. >> commissioner carrion has been nominated. any other

nominations? do i close nominations? if there are no other nominations and do we proceed with a vote even though -- okay. >> on the vote for vice-president, officer afuhaamango? >> yes. >> member carrion? >> yes. >> president brookter? >> yes. >> member carrion? >> yes. >> member palmer? >> yes. >> we have a majority vote. congratulations vice-president carrion. >> thank you. >> and i just like to say i really look forward to working with you. i want to say

something personal, i have read your biography and know about your experience in community involvement and i'm touched by your personal story and members on this board have similar compelling stories of overcoming obstacles and tragedies and i'm proud to be serving alongside with people who have surmounted those obstacles and brought a sense of compassion and caring for their communities, a sense of public service, i think going through those sorts of -- being wounded by life gives you a different perspective that i think is very valuable and so again i thank you for the candor for speaking about that and i salute your life surrender mounting what is a horrible start of life.

>> should we go through roll call just so it's on the record. >> yes. >> all right. >> member nguyen? >> for vice-president carrion? >> aye. >> member soo? >> yes. >> member wetchter? >> yes. >> thank you. >> i think the next item on the agenda is what was originally number two and number now three. >> members of the public who want to make comment online item

no. three, line up or call 45-655-0001 and enter access code 24946776879 and press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. >> there's no public comment. >> okay. is there -- do we have to take a vote to adopt the resolution? >> yes. >> do we need a motion for that first? okay. would anyone like to make a motion regarding -- >> i move that we adopt resolution under california government code section 5493e and that was discussed at the last meeting. >> second. >> online item three, member

afuhaamango? >> to adopt the resolution? >> aye. >> member afuhaamango is aye. member brookter? >> aye. >> member brookter is aye. member carrion? >> aye. >> member carrion is aye? >> member palmer? >> aye. >> member palmer is aye. >> member one? >> aye. >> member nguyen is aye. member soo? >> aye. >> member soo is aye. president wetchter? >> aye. >> president wetchter is aye. >> now we'll go to item three on the original agenda, adopt of minutes and this is an action item. review and approve the minutes from the sheriff's department oversight board inaugural meeting held on

august 22, 2022. >> so moved. >> second it. >> and we had two versions of these minutes, a version two where you made additions, some additional detail at my request. so you need to specify which version we are moving to approve. >> yes. >> so is that one we have before us? >> there's two before you, there should be -- >> so the motion is to approve draft number two with the additions. >> yes. >> second. >> is there a second? >> second. >> thank you. >> for members of the public who

would like to make public comment online item no. four, line up at the podium or please call 415-655-0001 and enter access code . there appears to be no public comment. >> can we ask is there a unanimous vote to adopt the minutes? >> is there a unanimous vote to adopt the minutes? okay. thank you. >> [mic is off] >> member afuhaamango? >> aye. >> member afuhaamango is aye. member brookter? >> aye. >> member brookter is aye. member carrion? >> aye. >> member carrion is aye. member palmer?

>> aye. >> member palmer is aye. >> member nguyen? >> aye. >> member nguyen is aye. member soo? >> aye. >> member soo is aye. and president wetchter? >> aye. >> president wetchter is aye. >> the minutes are adopted. >> i believe the next item on the agenda, number four, the original agenda is [reading item 4]

>> good afternoon, good evening, president wetchter, members of the member. kate howard, i'm the director of the department of human resources. i'm here to to talk with you about the important task you have in front of you to recruit and select the first inspector general for this department. and to offer d hr's support and assistance along the way. i'm going to review some of the resources that are available to you that we can offer and then ask for your direction about how you would like to proceed. i have a brief presentation that i would like to go through now. so if you know, your role is to conduct a recruitment process which will identify candidates who could serve in this important role to

conduct interviews and evaluate the qualifications of those candidates and then to make a determination together about who you have identified as the best candidate for the role and select a new inspector general. d hr can support you in two ways in this recruitment. as the city central human resources department, we can conduct the recruitment on your behalf, so we can provide an analyst who will work with the commission to develop a job profile and announcement and then conduct the recruitment or we can bring one of our pre qualified executive recruitment firms to work with you. most commissions do choose to work with an executive recruiter. i think that's largely because of their

wide public sector networks, because of their their focus on working directly with the commission. they are not distracted by supporting another department and they are really expert in maintaining confidentiality for the candidates in the process whether it's just at the kind of initial interest phase or whether it's later on down the process so i think that's a reason folks choose to work with a recruiter. typically, working with a recruiter once a commission has selected the firm that they wish to work with, it takes about 16 weeks is the timeline they typically propose. we do have five recruitment firms in our pre qualified pool so it's relatively quick to get one of those firms engaged to work with you. so if you choose to do that. most, whether you

work with dhr or one of our firms, the process that you'll go through as the commission is going to be similar to what is here in front of you, so you'll determine whether you wish to work with a recruiter with us. if you wish to work with a recruiter, you'll request proposals from that group of firms and they have gone through the rfp and are pre qualified and we'll go to them and say dear pool of recruiters and we have a great opportunity for the recruiting of inspector general and are you interested in working with the commission in supporting them in that recruitment and they will provide a written proposal that details timeline and their approach and their approach to including candidates from diverse backgrounds and a timeline cost. you would then have an opportunity to review those proposals and make a

selection about which of them i wish to move forward. once we get to this next stage, that's where you'll be working more closely directly with your recruiter. the first step is really to prepare the job description. and i have that here listed as candidate profile for recruitment but that's really about you all making clear what are the qualities that you're looking for in a new inspector general? they will also, a recruiter can also work with you to solicit input from stakeholders about some of the qualities or characteristics that the community or other stakeholders might be interested in should you want them to do that. once the job description is finalized and they will bring that in front of you and that's the final profile you would like to move forward with and they'll do recruitment and outreach to identify candidates for the

role. typically, after about, typically after three to four weeks, recruitment firm will come back to the commission or to the president and let that -- let folks know how the recruitment is going? should we continue to advertise it or ready to close it and bring the commission a list of candidates. they would present those candidates to you in a closed session, so you all would have the opportunity to review the full set of applicants as well as additional materials that they would have provided to the recruiter and then together you would make a decision about whom you wished to interview. the recruiter would support you in building out the questions for interview and managing the (indiscernible) ter view pro --

managing the interview process and at the end of the process, the commission would let the recruiter and dhr know which candidate you wanted to move forward with and we would work together to make an offer to the candidate and d hr makes all salary offers to all department heads. and that's pretty much the process. as i've mentioned, we have a list of five pre qualified recruitment firms that's available to you. and we can work in partnership, should you choose to work with a recruitment firm, we'll work in partnership with them and the commission president to prepare items to bring in front of the commission on whatever timeline you would want to bring those. i'm happy, so the next steps, if you wanted to move forward with a firm, would request the

proposals and we would bring back -- bring those back to you for review and decisions. and that is basically my presentation. i'm happy to answer any questions you may have regarding the process, dhr's role to support you or any other matters that i can try and answer. >> thank you. do any board members have questions? >> yes. i have a couple of questions, so i'll ask the first one. is the timeline different between -- is there a significant timeline difference between using dhr and working with one of these executive firms? >> it probably be quicker to work with an executive recruiter. mostly because we have not set aside time in our own work plan to dedicate to

this recruitment. of course, if you should want us to do it, we will make time. >> thank you. >> i saw that it takes 16 weeks total, is that from start of when executive or maybe dhr starts the process so when we hire the candidate? >> typically, recruitment firms will propose between a 14 and 16-week timeline for the recruitment process from the date that they have their first meeting with the commission until the commission is ready to make an offer. of course, that always depends on the commissions' availability to review and evaluate candidates and schedule interviews and any other scheduling issues like holidays, for example, can sometimes have an affect on candidate availability as well

as commissioner availability, but in general, four to six months for recruitment is typical. >> thank you. >> commission, board member soo? >> thank you. thanks, kate. the last time we worked together was on the executive director for the department on the status of women. i just wanted to know current cost for using a recruiter? >> each recruiter will propose their own pricing based on, you know, their, whatever factors they want to consider. what i have been seeing is between 30 and $50,000 for a recruitment. >> and as a follow up to it, i believe the salary has already been set through the civil service commission if i'm not mistaken, right this >> the salaries for department heads are set typically through

a process where dhr and we allocate department heads to different classifications. this department head has been levelled at the department head one level and the salaries do have standard ranges associated with them. there's a base compensation rate and there are extended ranges of available for recruitment or retention needs. >> okay. and then if we were to go beyond the base, what would be the process? >> so, typically, in those kinds of salary negotiations, we -- dhr and i suspect you as the commission would want to nope the candidates understand the salary range prior to applying and so the recruiter would provide that information to the candidate, if the commission or if the selected candidate, like, say they would not accept an offer unless the salary were

higher, then dhr would work with the candidate to determine whether we can meet their salary expectations. you know, the range for example for department -- the o961, department head one, the base level goes up to $193,000 but the extended ranges go first, in the first extended range to $224,000 and the second extended range is used rarely but available for unusual circumstances up to $235,000. >> and then one final question and i don't know maybe city attorney clarke, you might answer this. if we are presented with candidates who we know personally, is there a process where we would need to recuse

ourselves? >> i'm not sure. i haven't been asked that question before but i can look into it and let you know. >> okay, thank you. >> yes, member nguyen? >> regarding the rsf, what's the recruitment firm vex? >> typically and i would welcome your input about how you would like to evaluate those firms. typically, we ask them to tell us their timeline, tell us their pricing, to tell us similar recruitments that they may have done in the past, so do they have, in this case, other experience recruiting for oversight bodies, would be a good comparable? and then finally, what other recruitments have they done for the city and county? we always ask them to

provide their approach to recruiting a diverse talent pool, so that the commission has the widest range of candidates to pull from and we ask them to provide some specific examples and not just say we recruit from diverse job boards but we want to know, okay, who are you going to outreach to? how are you going to conduct that outreach to bring forth the most diverse and most well qualified talent? >> thank you. >> other questions? >> yes, follow up. for dhr, if we used dhr, is there a cost needed to come out of the budget? >> we would charge you for it. i would have to just do an estimate based on the total number of hours that an analyst would be assigned to the work. >> do you have an idea and i understand that the estimate, is it 30 to 50k because i know we're going to be talking about the budget, so it would be interesting to find out what

that would look like in comparison? >> i don't know off the top of my head. we have not conducted a recruitment in-house for department head in a number of years and so i would have to go back and look at an example from several years ago to use as a comp. >> thank you. >> i have a couple of questions. so, i've looked at the job description for 961 department head one, i see this position as being somewhat unique, maybe not falling into the preestablished categories. if we wanted a unique position description established for inspector general recognizing that it differs from all the other department heads and this doesn't doesn't exist, whoever fills -- this department doesn't

exist and whoever is in this department is creating it from the ground up and wanted the salary to match salaries of comparable positions in the bay area and i don't know if mr. long gave you the table i put together. what would be involved in that process? >> thank you for the question, president wetchter. so, we have very few department heads that are not classified using the department head classification, so i just would want to say that at the outset. the majority of those who are not elected department heads, so it would be unusual. the process would involve a discussion between the commission and dhr's

compensation and classification team, which of course i can -- and support you in that discussion. we would need to evaluate really why do you believe this is unique, how would it help you in terms of recruiting or what's the rationale for creating a standalone job classification? our goal with having department heads grouped together is to provide some sort of a framework that allows both in terms of compensation, in terms of scope of responsibilities, some consistent approaches across the city and so that's the -- that's why we have the approach we have here. in terms of salary, i did see the materials that you provided to me and when i -- so,

typically -- a commission or a department head or an hr team can request a salary study or a salary survey from dhr to evaluate, is the compensation appropriate for the role so if that's something you would like for us to look at, we're happy to do so. i would note the majority of the comparable roles that you have provided would be able to be accommodated at the department head one level based on the materials that i saw. >> that brings us up a follow up question. you talked about extending the range, the first level to 224 and the second level to 235. could it be advised salary because i'm thinking about drawing applicants who might be interested in the position and taking into account what comp

positions pay and the cost of san francisco which is unique? >> we can work with you and a recruiter if you choose to do that on kind of how we would advertise the salary. typically, what a department head would say, it would provide the base range and it would say extended range, extended ranges are available based on experience or for recruitment purposes and sometimes that's made public. other times the recrueltier has it and he or she is able to communicate it directly with candidates but we can certainly talk about that. >> i know because i see job postings on the nakel website for positions in this field, similar positions and when you click on the link, it will usually show you the salary of someone who might be considering leaving their job in one city and moving to another comp decision in another city and

they can make a quick judgment and whether it's a viable position. >> certainly. this is all public information. it's not intended to be hiding anything from an applicant. it is also true that the extended ranges are there for very specific purposes. they are there to address recruitment and retention recruitment that's particular to an issue. they may not be available to any candidate but they might be available to a specific candidate that you wanted to pursue. >> and how long, and what would be involved in dhr doing a salary survey? >> hmm.... i don't know the answer to that off the top of my head. i can provide that information to the commission's secretary and to you. >> president wetchter, i had a

follow up question, if you don't mind. >> yes. >> so this was from attending the nakel conference and because this is a unique situation and we want to get onboard as soon as possible, is there a way perhaps that we work with an inspector general candidate on a contract basis and so that person would be on boarded sooner with the consideration of possibly a permanent position? >> hmm.... >> let me finish this off. this is someone who had been an inspector general before in another jurisdiction. >> we do have a way to offer a contract for this role. the department does have the ability to select a candidate on a

temporary basis for example. you could -- you could identify an interim appointment where you would basically say to a candidate, we would like you to come and take this role on on a temporary basis for the next six months and we'll see where we are. so, that's a possibility. i don't think there's a straightforward way to enter into a contract for the role, though, so i don't think there's a straightforward way to do that. >> okay. i was thinking if someone were retired who might want to engage in that role and given that right now i don't think our it system for the sheriff's department is up to par, so we would have to have someone who maybe had experience considering it systems that would facilitate the work and

also consider personnel within the inspector general's office, so that's why i was considering possible alternatives. >> i'm happy to look into it a bit more. i do think the option you do have in front of you would be in the case of a retiree to really collectively ask that retiree to serve in this role for a limited duration. all department heads serve at the will of their appointing officer including an interim appointee for example. but i'm happy to take that question and if i can come back to you with a different answer, i'll let you know. >> thank you. >> >> from wetchter's statement -- thank you for coming out and presenting. you're our first presenter. >> thank you. >> so i just want to share i

heard member carrion, at least for me share information on how much analyst would cost and when we think about budget and i'm hear from my colleagues, just really being able to refine and look at that scope of work. within an rfp, i do it all the time and the scope of work will ensure we get -- really looking for that right inspector general and make sure we have the resources and tools to do so is what i'm hearing from my colleagues. i just wanted to reiterate that. >> there are two different firms that recently did recruitments in berkeley and sonoma. i don't know whether either of them are qualified for the city but i think the materials i provided had the announcement for berkeley, so firms have gone through this process recently and i assume are very familiar

with the process and with the field and presumably could move fairly quickly because they would not have that much of a learning curve. >> i can share with you the firms that are in our pool include bob murray and associates, cps hr, esl, hawkins, the hawkins firm and ralph anderson. >> what was the second one after bob -- >> cpshr. >> cpshr? >> that's right. >> we received from those five firms any of their, i guess, qualifications or resumes so when it comes to oversight boards and if they've had experience? >> yes. >> and then i think president wetchter, i wanted to note and this comes from the nakel

conference and i spoke with someone from the inspector's general office from wisconsin and it's expensive but there's a high cost-of-living and i was told they used a recruiting firm and after the large ex pen tour they came up with 20 candidates, however whshgs the madison hr department went through it, it was whittled down to five, so i don't know if we would do better than that with hr itself, so i just wanted to put that out there to my colleagues. >> was there any discussion on the issue or do we take public comment first, mr. young? >> it's up to you when you take public comment except that you have to take public comment before you take any action or

vote to take any action. >> okay. any additional discussion about the item, about opinions of the various alternatives? >> well, i think one of my, as i have noted, it would be interesting to do a little bit of number crunching and figure out from the five currently qualified firms if they are -- some of the ones you have suggested or not, what the experience is but we want to identify our deadlines with our inspector general. i'm concerned this commission has been delayed for a significant amount of time, that doesn't mean that we should rush the process of course because we want to get the pest qualified person, so i would like us to kind of really be thoughtful about some of the

it issues and the actual, like, practical part of getting somebody on the ground to start doing this work. >> um, question. with the approvals, could we ask them for a timeline for each stage of the process? >> yes. >> okay. >> maybe i can add something else that's helpful. you could ask me today, kate, will you please have dhr get proposals for these firms and we want to know timeline, we want to know about their experience of oversight boards, we want to know cost? and then while that's happening in the background, i think your question, commissioner carrion, regarding what would it cost for dhr to conduct recruitment and

what our timing would look like and i can bring the information back at the same time and you would have more complete information about how you wish to go forward, requesting information or requesting many proposals from our pre qualified pool doesn't commit the commission to working with one of them but it gives information about what your choices are and which firms are willing to work with you and what is a good fit. the other piece i would mention, some departments find that owe it happen recentry but it happened in the past, they don't wish to work with any dhr qualified firms and the challenge is you would have to run your own solicitation for an executive recruiter and that seems maybe a bit challenging for the department, given its staffing levels at the moment but of course, that's always an option. >> how much detail could we

expect from each of these firms about how we go about the recruitment? and how they would seek out applicants and how they would advertise it so we get their understanding of the field and how large of a net they are going to cast and how to fine that net is going to be? >> typically, the proposals ranges from eight to ten pages for each of them. they include a detailed description of their approach to the work. they typically talk about their networks and recruitment strategies within a particular field. they will talk about timeline. they will talk about pricing and talk to you about the team that they would have assigned to the project. when we request responses on your behalf, we can ask them to be sure to provide additional detail about strategies that

they would use or that they have used for recruiting, for oversight bodies, if that's helpful. >> would they be looking to us to provide details about the knowledge, skills and abilities that would go into the job description or would they make suggestion on their prior experience in the field? >> it will probably be a combination of both. they would want to speak with you about what you think the key, knowledge and skills are and what the priorities of the commission are over the coming years, three years, so that a candidate has an idea of what the role is. they will typically review any materials regarding the responsibilities as a department and incorporate that into a draft for you all to review and then they would bring that to you and you all would flush it out or adjust it as appropriate. but that's really

the role -- that's why you would be hiring them to do some of that work up front and to give you a draft to respond to. >> any other comments or questions? we can move to public comment and perhaps entertain motions. or do you want to entertain motions first? >> [mic is off] >> why don't we go to public comment. >> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item no. five, line up at the podium or call 415-655-0001 and enter access code 24946776879. press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. there's no public

comment. >> speaking as a board member and not president, my thought would be we ask -- ask dhr to seek proposals and come back with the timeline and other variables and in the meantime we form a subcommittee to craft the knowledge and skills and abilities we want in the candidate for the recruitment or whoever will do the recruiting to look for. any comments or thoughts about that >> yes, i definitely would like

to see some information that you've mentioned, thank you so much for providing some more structure and guidance for us as we create that. that's very helpful. and if we could get that, what would be the timeline for receiving that? would it be possible to turn it around for our next meeting or is that unrealistic? >> we had monthly meetings so i -- >> a month depending on the timing of your posting of materials might be possible. i can work with mr. leon to make an effort to have something back for your october meeting. we do like to post these opportunities with our recruiters for at least two weeks so they have a significant of enough time to provide a thorough response and

then we'll need to review them, make sure they provided a complete package and then prepare them to bring to the commission. so, we can work to have something for the october meeting. but it is a short turnaround. >> when do -- you need a week for posting? >> yeah. >> okay. >> three days. >> okay. that should be fine. >> thank you. and for your teams work on this. >> does anyone want to make a motion regarding this matter? >> regarding the subcommittee, i would like to -- >> no, i think -- request with requesting dhr. >> i move for the requested proposals of both from the five

pre qualified materials as we have discussed here in the -- terms as we discussed in the session and the dhr turnaround in october. >> that includes the budgeting, right is this >> yes, that's inclusive of the budgeting and past experiences and recruiting for oversight boards. >> i guess could we put a caveat in there in the consideration of say a retiree if we wanted to have someone in the interim? does that complicate -- i know that adds another wrinkle. >> i'm happy to bring that back as part of my report at the next meeting if there's another option i have identified. >> thank you. >> i'll second that motion as amended, if that's considered an amendment. >> sure. i accept the friendly amendment. [chuckle] >> do we need a roll call vote. >> member afuhaamango? >> aye.

>> member brookter? >> aye. >> member carrion? >> aye. >> member palmer? >> aye. >> member nguyen? >> aye. >> member soo? >> aye. >> president wetchter? >> aye. >> regarding establishing a subcommittee, do we need a separate motion for that? >> i didn't understand it to be a part of the motion. >> pardon me. does anyone want to make a motion regarding that. >> i think we want to think twice about a subcommittee. i think there's a lot of opportunities to create different subcommittees. i think based on, i think it would be helpful to receive the information first, to see if all of the -- all of the board commissioners want to be part of that. i don't think because we are such a small commission, it might be beneficial for -- and

this is such a critical role, it may be important for us to all put our input in, so that that's more my idea rather than narrowing it down -- whether it be preparing drafts of volunteering to prepare a draft, that's another thing but creating another layer, we might not need to do that at this time. >> what is the typical size of subcommittees, attorney clarke? >> it can be anywhere from -- if you have four and your meeting is five, so two to three, i guess. >> okay. >> i was going to say i agree with commissioner carrion. in the interest of transparency for this first inaugural important hiring decision that we act as an entire body and i don't know if having a subcommittee is

necessary. i was also thinking that in parallel, as we're doing a search that we might actually have some community hearings as to what the community would like to see in an inspector general, so that's my other input that we could do things in parallel. >> so, commissioners can make choices about whether they have subcommittees or not, some do and some do not. typically, they want to retain all the decisions regarding reviewing candidates and interviewing together as a whole. in terms of public input, i think what you're describing, commissioner soo is very common, that a commission would calendar items requesting public input on the qualities that the commission should be seeking in a director or the experience or

other kinds of thinks the commission some take into account when evaluating candidates and typically the selected recruitment firm can help you with that, depending whether you want to have it kind of here at a typical commission meeting or whether you want to have it out in the community, you have options for both of those. >> thank you. >> i think we would need maybe some language access so it might be instructed to have something in the community with particular interpreters or work with the community groups. >> i don't want to get too premature but there was a motion on the floor. >> for discussion, if we were to meet in the community as a full body, we're talking about our october meeting or november meeting and i believe sfgov tv is not able to broadcast from

remote locations, so i'm -- i have always strongly supported community meetings and i went to the police commission that was held. can we hold a community meeting between now and our next board meeting to solicit input from our community and report back. >> i would suggest the entire commission. we're new and it's important for all communities to know about us, so and i don't nope that we need to have a whole month in between. i mean, i'll willing and i know everyone's very busy but i'm willing to have additional meetings and i don't envision more than two different sessions on input and we could determine a location. i know it's harder for our commission secretary to try to deal with the logistics

but to identify two different locations and have two different hearings. >> so, we do have member carrion's motion still on the floor. >> yes, so my motion, i believe was already -- it was first and seconded and we did the roll call. >> correct. >> and -- >> there was a call for another motion in the subcommittee. >> there was another call and my position is to oppose such a motion. >> i did make a motion about that. it was a suggestion, so i think the discussion really shows the board -- where i think (indiscernible). so no need for a motion there. >> should we call the question then? >> yes. >> i don't think we need to. well, no. there was no motion and no second. so we can go to the next line item. >> yes. >> did you make a motion about asking dhr to -- >> yes. that got approved.

>> so we don't have any other motions? >> correct. >> okay. okay. very good. thank you for your presentation. so we can move on to the next item which on the original agenda was number five, budget report. informational item. presentation by the mayor's budget office. >> that's going to be remote, correct? >> oh, yeah.

>> thank you.

>> i'm sorry, could you hear me? >> no, we couldn't. >> apologies for that. can you see my screen? >> not yet. >> dan? or jaime? >> no, we can't.

>> it says it's being shared. >> can you see it on my end? >> i'm going to share it on my end. >> al -- apologies i'm not here just got back from travels and i didn't want to get you sick so you're with me from my home and in the future i hope to be there in the future. my name is camilla and i'm one of the staff of the mayor's budget office and here to talk about your budget, so you have some understanding going inform the next year what that is. this in addition to that, to give you a brief -- go on to the next slide, a brief background as to what the budget

cycle is, so you -- for those who haven't work with the city and familiar with it, we're now in september which is the beginning of what we call department phase. there are two things happening and one is city departments, sheriff's department and accountability included are beginning to think about what their budget ask are for the next fiscal year so we're in fiscal year '23 but i'll think about what you want for fy24 for the next few months and what our office is doing is understanding the issues and getting a sense of where we might be going and in addition, trying to understand what the city's potential deficit are and surpluses. nine times out of ten, that's going to be a deficit. this last year we were

fortunate and had a surplus to start the budget season. that deficit leads to staffing departments reducing budgets year over year mainly because personnel cost are so high and they grow year over year without even touching them. and you can understand that makes sense due to labor negotiations, cost of benefits going up, things like that. so, during this time from september to january, departments are developing proposals of what they think they may want in a budget and the mayor's budget office along with the controller an office are getting a sense of how much money we might have to spend the upcoming fiscal year. the mayor's budget office will present what we call budget instructions in december and those budget instructions are from the mayor's office to the departments, letting you know

how much money we have to spend and in addition to that, what the mayor's priorities are and any other recommendations or request we have for department proposals. those proposals then are turned around quite quickly and sent back to us and the controller's office in february and at that point we turn to mayor's phase of the budget and the mayor's department is running closely with the department team, primarily their finance time, budget team determine what the needs are of that department and how we can make sure all of the needs are met and that also all of the mayor's priorities for making sure the city as a whole and not just department level but as a whole is running smoothly and that leaves us through the mayor's phase when we present our budgets to the board on

june 1st and then the board of supervisors reviews those budgets and they make decisions and changes as they did in your budget last year to either make reductions or to add back additional initiatives ever funding so this is the overall budget cycle. there's no need for you to memorize this but it gives you a sense of where we are and when departments are expected to provide their input and how things will move from there. you can go to the next slide. thank you. so, this is a very high level overview of your budget. so it's broken into a way that the budget is divided (indiscernible) division, so the

sheriff's department of accountability is a department. within that, there are two divisions and there's the office of inspector general and there's the oversight board. there's definitely the opportunity for funds to move around within these two areas. it is not -- please do not feel that what is in the (indiscernible) budget can't be shared with the oversight board. there are changes in there that can happen. but primarily the -- how we have budget setup with any oversight boards or commissions is their budgets are kept separately and are often much smaller because it only benefits staff who work with the commission directly and also the (indiscernible) for the commissioners and board members and i apologize, there's a typo

in here. it's .06, not .05 million so $60,050,000 -- so 60 and 50 million. it could be the recruitment firm you would be hiring to bring on to support the recruitment of the inspector general. they might be training organizations, if you need to have training done through any sort of new state or federal legislation that has been put into place and a variety of cost can go to professional services and contract budget. the oversight is smaller but within the oyg salary, we have a chunk of benefits and salary to pay

for staffing and the predominate amount of staffing and hiring contracts. the reason that's relatively high is because we think there might be it could have the department might need, whether that is software to work with the sheriff's department or, you know, if there's a new system of keeping inspector -- investigators notes confidential, whatever that might be, there's room in there every year, $300,000 for the office of the inspector general to purchase professional services and contracts and the (indiscernible) budget is small but this is very average for departments and it's about $500,000 a year and the work order for other city departments are larger in the first year because of the recruitment for

the inspector general. we added funds in there for dhr support but that could be used in the professional services and contracts area. and lastly, in the work offices to other city departments is the training that you all received through the sheriff's department. we can go on to the next slide, thank you. so, here you'll see staffing. this is what was written up in the charter. apologies. the inspector general is in there and 7 investigators which is the amount that's required as of now. two senior investigators and one attorney position which is a policy attorney position. it is not a legal recommendations position to make that distinction. and then the board members, there's seven of

you and it's stipends and manager assistant and senior administration analyst. that's all for my presentation. i'm happy to answer any questions. >> any questions from board members? >> yeah. just one. just one, thank you for that presentation. just to get clarification, back on slide number three and i wanted to make sure my math is correct and i'm not a mathematician like councilmember soo. >> (indiscernible). >> absolutely. but on slide three, if we can pull it up, dan, really quick. i just want to make sure the reference was, this was dollars in the millions, correct? >> yes. >> and so, i just want to make sure i heard you correctly because i heard and if we can pull that up real quick, dan, there was the one section, like looking at professional services and contracts and i got an 0.06.

it's $400,000 in terms of salaries and benefits. >> $6,000,000. >> so that's correct? >> i'm sorry. it's in the second year. it should have been 0.05. >> got you. salaries and benefits is correct, that's $400,000 >> yes, that's for the seven stipends. >> okay. >> and then the two full-time salary and benefits. >> okay. perfect. i wanted to make sure i was reading that correctly and doing the math correctly and making sure it was in the millions. >> who are the two full time employee for the oversight board listed on that line? >> i can get the names for you but it's a management assistant and manager analyst. is len

occupying that. there's a senior administrative analyst separate from the general inspector's office. >> the way this was structured, we assigned the management assistant and senior analyst would work across both because the board meets once a month and there might be e-mail work involved in that as well but yes, it is up to your discretion how you and the inspector general together decide to make that work. >> other questions? >> will we be receiving and how will we receive updates as to where we are to the budget and cost and expenses? >> so, i had that happen but we'll comment -- that will come into life when the inspector general is -- >> you're muffled, can you repeat that? >> of course. that will be up to the inspector general and yourselves as you desire how you

want to manage the department. at this point in time, dan is the only very lucky employee of the sda and he will be working with us to manage anything and everything within the department including the finances at the time. and the budget proposal. my hope is that he gets some support sooner than later because it's a great deal of work but that is the way it had be set up moving forward, if that answers your question. >> yes. to follow up with that, we discussed it's going to take several months to find our amazing inspector general that we will find and hire. in the meantime, can we receive information as to what the budget is maybe in the next two months of what the expenditures

have been? i know we've already spent some of those funds for staffing, obviously, as well as for training so just to kind of keep an eye on that since we won't have an inspector general for a couple of more months. >> certainly, one of my colleagues will be happy to provide that information to you and we certainly will work with dan who is the next one working with our team to get that information for you as well. at your request, happy to do that. >> other questions? i have two questions. can we get a breakdown of current expenditures from both budgets, the oversight boards budget and inspector generals budget so far for this fiscal year, 22-23 fiscal year? >> you're requesting expenses that have already been made?

>> yeah. and continuing expenses so we can see where we are, how much has been spent, how much is going to be spent per month at the current rate. >> yes. i'm happy to work with dan on this if you all would like to make that request to dan, he and i can work together to get those numbers to you, certainly. >> okay, thank you. and i had, i'm looking at the mayor's budget is 329 where it says total -- that's 7.7 positions for fiscal year 21-22 and 13 for fiscal year 22-23 with a total personnel budget of $2,920,000. so, that seems to be higher than what you just showed us, so -- >> the mayor's budget does not include changes that were made

by the board of supervisors and they did make a reduction to your budget by $500,000 from the mayor's proposal in salaries and benefits and that was not positioned but it was attrition which counts as a position so you'll see a reduction there. but you have every opportunity to propose new and growing staff here on out if your budget proposals. >> and what responsibilities does this board have regarding the crafting of the fiscal year 23-24 budget because the circular chart you showed us shows we're partially through that process and planning for that? >> yeah. attorney clarke, please free to jump in. to my understanding, there's no requirements of you. it will be up to yourselves and the inspector general when they join the team and decide how you

would like to operate. it is generally not the commissions or the boards who are responsible for putting together the budget, putting together proposals. it's a relationship between department heads and boards or commissions, whether it's discussion back and forth and what the commission and commissioners would like to see in the budget and then some commissions which are -- they have extensive charter language require budget approval before the budget is presented to the mayor's office on the due date. >> okay. just wanted to make sure there's nothing we have upcoming deadlines on. >> all good. >> thank you. >> yes. >> anything further? thank you for the presentation. we'll get a copy of the powerpoint for our

reference? >> i can send it to you. >> thank you. >> thank you all very much. have a great evening. >> i feel better. >> we need to take public comment. >> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item 6, if you're present please line up at the podium. otherwise, please call 415-655-0001 and enter access code 24966776879, and press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. there's no public comment. >> i think we can move on to item no. five which is the sheriff's chief report. chief, i do apologize for you having to wait for so long. thank you for your patience. >> that's okay. i'm used to it. [laughter]

just for information, i'm chief richard, chief of staff in the sheriff's office. we met last from the last meeting here, you requested an update on our staffing. we (indiscernible) for five years so we started from 2017 to now. so, powerpoint presentation we have here is going to cover the total positions our department budgeted for and the actual staffing that we have now. in addition to the difference between authorizing actual staffing, so.... i'm not a tech

guy. can you help me. [laughter] okay. we're going to start with the 2017, what we have here. in 2017, we're authorized for 1158 or back then it was 992.5, so the change from that staffing

overall was 165.5. if you look at the sworn, we're at 85% capacity. professional authorize here, we're at 123 and we want to get 98, i guess it's more for professional staff, it's hard to recruit on that note. in 2017, we had authorized 99 and we had 95.5 cadets employed with us and as we move on to the following years, you'll see in 2018, our numbers are a little lower. we changed 156 and our authorized then was 940. so, actual was 824. operated at 88%. so, same thing with the professional who stays at 76% and cadets are at 90. in 2019, where we authorized

for 1174, we had 995 total employees. if you look at the sworn, we operated at 87%. again, the professional staff remains at 72%. and the cadets operate, we have at 84% higher. as we go into 2020, we're authorized by 1175. our actual was 987 total. we had minus 188 employees total. we operated at sworn at 88 -- 85% and professional at 77% and then cadets was at 83%. here's a difference. this is when covid kicked in. authorized for 1191. total staff was 927. total change from that from the previous years, 264. if you look

at our staff and sworn, it's thorded for 793 and down to 744. same thing with the professional staff, it has gone lower at 67% and again with cadets at 75%. that's at 2020, the start of the pandemic and everything going on. also with the environment that was happening back then. our final -- it's much worse. everything is in red. we're authorized at 1191. we have totaling 155. we're at 336 short total. if you look at sworn, we have authorized 933. we're down to 675. again, with the professionals, 142 authorized. we had more working at 97. with our cadets, if you see it's almost half. it's 116 down to 83. we have a graph here

if you need a better look at it from there. the red -- sworn on top, if you look at it, it goes from top from the year 2017 down to 2022. same thing representing with the to -- professional staff and overall staff and we have sworn from that point on. that is what we have up-to-date for now. so, our challenge is right now that we're going through with the training portion of it, in addition to covid, that affects us and because of the shortest of staffing and we have to go through mandatory staffing to cover the courts and jails and everything else. so you can see they are working extra hours to try and keep the sheriff's

office in operation. what we're trying to do now is for recruit, we're trying to do aggressive recruitment drive. we're on billboards now. we're doing digital advertising. we're on the buses, as you can see, if you drive by and i know it was a billboard and oakland, it says we're hiring, so we're really trying to recruit very massively and this is, you know, we're a part of the makeup of law enforcement. everyone is having a hard time and other agencies along with ourselves but we did partner up to increase the recruitment drive. we partnered us with the army, it's called the pays program and that encompasses, when a military personnel is ready to get discharged they can go through the testing process in the last six months in the military so by the time hopefully when they are

discharged, that we are able to hire them, provided they pass all the qualifications. and again, we've been attending job fairs all over the city including the peninsula, bay area and we've been trying to recruit massively so that's where we're at as far as the recruitment and staffing. any questions? >> have you seen applications as a bases of the recruitment efforts? >> we have been lucky because the sheriff's office has a (indiscernible) job scope so we're doing better than the police department as i would like to say. we average between ten to 20 applicants so we've gone all over trying to push and push and we continue to push. we're trying to encourage to do a collaboration where we're trying to encourage our employees to be a part of our recruiting program, to promote

the department and promote the office about what the job is so people can hear about it from line staff and everybody else. >> chief, it wasn't in the slide but i'm concerned see especially when it comes to our law enforcement agencies, like, how many folks in the sheriff's department live here in the city verses outside of the city? >> we're, i think we're pretty tough because san francisco is a high cost-of-living. >> of course. >> i think the majority, it's probably safe to say 70% do not live in the city compared to the police department, the same thing. there were 70 to 85%, people do not live in the city because of the cost of living. >> it looks like you suffered significant drop in the deputies, personnel involving custody. how does that compare with the number of individuals and custody over that same five-year period? >> we try to keep our numbers

low in custody low. we try to get it at 800 at most if we can. of course, we're trying to alleviate some of the -- the lock up too by putting on electronic monitoring. so we're trying to maintain that as much as possible especially too with the current situation with covid. it's still active so we're requiring that people still wear their mask and get tested and everything and not to mention m-pox so there's a lot of things happening. in relationship with that, it made prisoners -- staffing is low so people are -- our staff is getting burned out because they have to work sometimes double shifts just to cover it to make the jails safe and the rest of our programs too. >> i guess what i'm interested

in is the -- the average daily population, would that be correct term? >> yes. >> the period 2017 to 2022 and how that corresponds to the staffing because what i have heard from you and the press is the amount of mandatory overtime increased dramatically. >> yes, it has. like we said, because of the covid situation and everything, we're trying to keep the numbers down but the staffing still has to be able to cover all the shifts and everything, so but again, we go back to covid. we go back to burnout and we go back to people may want to seek other careers in another department, we lose a lot from attrition too. so we're trying to recruit more to accommodate that. unfortunately, it looks like the recruitment doesn't keep up with the attrition. >> would it be possible for you to get us to the figures on the average daily population during

that same time period so we can compare it with the number of deputies assigned to the custody division? >> the numbers right now, as you look at it, we're at 673, so we're trying to keep up. >> right. >> you go and see the population is bigger than the amount of employees we have. they are in custody. that's why it's mandated in overtime to keep up with this. >> right. that's the population now but i would like to see what the population was in 2017, 2018, 2019 and how that compares to the number -- >> i have those figures right now. [multiple voices] >> for the future -- >> i was looking at the staffing you were talking about and not relation to what's happen nothing the population. >> is it possible -- >> we can come back with that number again at the next session but right now, i do not have it. >> compared to the prior years at san bruno, do you have the same number of pods occupied,

more pods occupied or fewer pods occupied? because i know each pod requires two deputies in that pod and there were two deputies in each pod? >> i have bring someone who is more familiar with the count in jails because i'm just here reporting the staff mode. i have to bring somebody that's there. you do understand that i've been with the sheriff's office for two years. >> and then regarding recruitment, i know a lot of law enforcement agencies are also recruiting. >> yeah. >> i know that many of the individuals, if they decide a career in law enforcement, they will apply to multiple agencies and often take the job that is first offered to them because they want to start in their career, so what are you doing to address the timeframe issue of people who apply and move the

process along? >> we're going with the same practice as the police department. they have to go through eight examines and that's a background check and medical and psychological and everything else so they have to go in steps before we can go on. we do try to expedite but we have to be very thorough since we are given these new employees a great responsibility, so we have to be very, very detailed as far as what we're doing on that. >> as you know, i have worked at dpa so i was aware that sfpd had lateral transfers from other departments. >> yes. >> the sheriff's department getting lateral ral transfers and how are those handled. >> some do apply and not as many as the pd. but we do get a handful and they go through a process. they don't have to go through the academy but they have to go through the full course and background and get an orientation from us to go

through that process but the recruitment drive for laterals isn't in abundance compared to someone who want a job freshly as a deputy. >> other questions? >> i had a couple of questions and in terms of electronic monitors and can you talk about the challenges and what personnel is needed as opposed to being in custody? that's a fixed location but if people have to go out and monitor the different people, i suspect that takes more personnel and more hours? >> we need more personnel. right now we're short staffed in that unit right now. we're very short staffed. so we have our deputies over there working sometimes double shift or because -- we have to shift them to another

unit to work that unit. >> so at the next meeting, could you talk about the staffing for that electronic monitoring and how many people are currently monitored, outreach, maybe? >> i don't have that number and i'll have to bring it back in terms of electronic monitoring >> i mean at the next meeting. >> yeah. >> the other part is in terms of recruitment, it's one thing to recruit. it's a whole another thing for someone to make it through the entire academy and what is the percentage of people who tangle out and don't make it through -- through the academy? >> on average, we don't have a big abundance but usually we see between six and ten, maybe 15 recruits at one time but the -- knock on wood, we've been having a success rate where mostly everyone has passed the --

passed academy and it could be because we give them a pre-academy and give them a good pep talk and they can stay the 20 weeks or 28 weeks and which academy they do attend. as far as percentage wise, if it was going to happen, it's not every class, maybe one or two may not make it or they resign because they find out the job is not for them. >> and then does the sheriff's department have something similar to the pal program with the police department in terms of working with kind of junior exposure? >> we have a junior deputy program. we have a lot of youth programs we go out there and try and do outreach out there. >> anything at stones town? i see them competing at alameda county poster. >> alameda is a big recruiter and sell a lot. >> anymore questions -- i didn't want to take too much of your time so i kind of -- we have the

(indiscernible) you were asking about. we cover custody and that covers the two months we had in the past two months so far and to give you the total that we received in july of 2022, if you look at the numbers there and the red it says july 2022, we had a total of five cases that overall, three of them -- for if you look at it, it was crimes against a person and then we had one property crime and then others were just one and so the total split up was five felonies actually and go misdemeanors. three of them were active, still open for investigation and two of them are currently closed right now. >> is these cases involving people in custody -- >> people in custody, yes.

>> okay. >> and in august, we had received 26 cases, if you look at it, we had -- over here if you look at the colors over here, 11 felonies and 18 were misdemeanors so again, breaking it down, 15 was crimes against a person. we had one property crime. we had three section crimes and the rest were seven others. and that may be related to vandalism and if you have not heard, we had one vandalism case a few days ago that were -- we had to report because that person vandalized the water sprinkler and damaged our county jail three -- county jail one with the extension amount of money that goes into six figures we have to do for repairs. >> do you have figures on

internal investigations of (indiscernible) against deputies? >> that's our ia. i would have to get numbers. we ask for criminal investigatings not related to ai. that's why we went with the custody but next round i can bring our lieutenant over here to talk about our ai cases. >> i would be interested in getting a sense of a number of complaints and disposition and findings and also some figures and i don't know if you can provide this or city attorney can provide these on lawsuits against the sheriff's department and settlements. >> okay. again, that would go with ai and also with our legal team. and we'll have to discuss that -- we'll lay that out for the next meeting. >> recognize, we know that a lawsuit does not mean something happened. the city sometimes happens to settle as a cost saving measure but i think it's useful to get a look at those

figures and have a sense -- >> we'll bring our ai team in here and explain that to you. >> sorry. when you say lawsuits against the city, do you mean in what time period? so if that's something -- because i had something -- you're talking about times a deputy or the department was sued in what period of time? >> the last five years would be a reasonable period? >> i think it would be better to start with the last year and i worked in the past with the departments and my guess -- i haven't looked to see what is involved but i would recommend a year. >> okay. i just have no idea what we're talking about. >> i don't either at this point. [laughter] >> chief, one thing i would be interested in, obviously, you have people on leave, i don't

know how much is for medical reasons, others -- but i would be interested in figures on the number of attacked on deputies. >> i'm seeing you track that -- >> you mean deputies on disabilities? >> actual assaults on deputies by -- by incarcerated people in the jails. >> we can do that. >> that's a factor in morale and staffing. we would hope it doesn't happen but unfortunately, i'm certain it does. >> we had recent cases that it did happen, so.... they are still being investigated right now. >> okay. just in figures and no details to violate anyone's --

confidentiality. is it increasing overtime and leading to more adults on deputies? >> we'll bring that up. >> okay, thank you. >> anymore questions related to this? okay. so i know you heard last about our access for incarcerated and who has access to education and as you all know, hopefully, we have a lot of programs related to -- that's in our jails and everything. one of them is our (indiscernible) program. i do have the policy related to that each one of you would like to look at it. i believe it's in your usb drive we gave to you in training so if you don't want one, i'm fine with that. would anyone like one before i move on? okay. they do have access. there's a policy related to it. the criteria is usually for sentence and non-sentenced inmates in the

general population. they are eligible to apply for five keys. again, if i can use a charter school -- they have to go through an assessment program to try figure out where they can place them when they go to academics on there. again, it doesn't matter about agenda in this city or anything like that. everybody is eligible and everyone has access to that part of it. again, there are rules that they have to follow, again, there's not a mandatory where they can get disqualified or dismissed but there's guidelines if they violate policy and they will get reviewed before anything happens on that. if they cannot finish their five keys education, there's a post release where they can go out and still (indiscernible) for

education after they post for release. we do offer other programs and there's 13 other programs in the county jail two and three and they have access to all those programs available to them. and that concludes my presentation unless -- unless you've got anymore questions? >> anymore questions, board members. >> there's job training as well. >> there's job training and we're connected to the city college and they help us out too so we try and expand it and our courses even more. >> (indiscernible) are we saying the educational programs are paused because of staffing issues and to what extend? >> there was a pause because of staffing but covid did play a role in that too, our director is in charge, alisa riker and

it's not a staffing program and usually it's the first to go so that's we're aggressively are trying to improve the staffing portion of it right away so we can get the programs and everything back up to par. >> are there educational programs currently taking place in the jail. >> >> currently right now, they are. they have access to it right now. >> could you describe how -- what that access is and what the programs are? >> let me pull it from my notes here. currently right now, besides the five keys program, they have access to a program called one family where staff

helps family members of the incarcerated to go and have video visits right now and they facilitate that. we also have the public library that deliver books to the jails on a regular basis over there. we have access to -- the city has access to college classes and there's a mentoring men's movement. that group -- they work from jails and they are available for that. there is a stanford lecture portion that we do have. substance abuse program, violence prevention program, also we have programs for veterans. those just a few i just named. >> are those virtual or any in

person? >> right now, some are in person and some of them are virtual and some have been postponed because of staffing. >> and the ones that have been postponed for staffing, do you have a sense of how many and which ones owes -- -- >> i don't have those numbers yet. >> okay. >> do you have a sense when those ones paused might be resumed? >> i can give you more detail in the next round and bring the person in charge of the program. >> okay, great. thank you. >> just a statement if i could, president wetchter. first and foremost, chief chiu, thank you for coming out today. it's an opportunity for us to work through the presentation and what we want to see from the sheriff's department and just really want to make sure that you know, as we look item no. nine and making sure we agendized some of the topics for

discussion in that section so that folks get the opportunity to bring motion before us, i think that would be good and i want to say thank you. >> i didn't know if you were going to leave. i did a tour of is not bruno before the pilot program, the crows net program was implemented and maybe my fellow board members would be interested to see how it works because i have been trying to visualize it and i have been having a difficult time and i know no more than three of us can be present at any one place but mr. long, we can see if we can schedule that at a convenient time. >> we can work that out. i need to talk to the chief deputy and the captain and give us dates and times and we can arrange it. >> thank you very much. i appreciate that. >> you're welcome. >> thank you all so much. also, i think it's really important to keep in mind that we have heard how very much understaffed our sheriff's are, so i think we want to be thoughtful about when

we think about the future agenda items and scheduling as to what the is the priorities and why we need certain things at certain times because we want to make sure our deputies are also healthy and working double time and doing all the things, they are members of community and we want them to be, you know, not on medical leave and what not so we do greatly appreciate your work and this is a new commission and we'll work with you to figure out the best way to facilitate the delivery of information in a way that is not overburdensome but reasonable in what our action items are and what we tend to do here. >> i appreciate that, thank you. >> thank you. >> i think -- i got one more question. what role does the sheriff's department play in making sure that the courtrooms are open and available for people to have their

constitutional hearing to a speedy trial? >> we work with them, with supervisor roden who tried to push it through. we've been working on opening the courts in civil courts but we're still working on that. again, it goes back to staffing. and it goes to public safety and officer safety issue and staff those areas and again, if you look at the numbers, we're down at 600 so that requires additional staffing to cover those areas. we are still in the works. we're still working and corporating with supervisor roden and that relationship. >> i was going to add, commissioner palmer, i have been to court watching the last couple of months so people have refused to show up and waive their right to a speedy trial, so we also have victims waiting to be able to confront the defendants -- and haven't been

able to and i have been to the preliminary hearing for several cases so that's the issue as well. >> that's it >> yes, thank you. >> thank you. >> i guess we'll go to public comment now. >> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item 7, if you're present, please line up at the podium. otherwise, please call 415-655-0001 and enter access code 24946776879. press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. >> thank you board and congratulations to the president and vice-president. my name is ken, i'm the dha president and i'm very glad that you are

speaking about staffing. i think this board should make staffing a priority. as the president of the dha and board we researched the staffing for many years and if you look into it and dive deep into it, we're not the only ones that looked into it, the civil grand jury has, and they have written multiple reports and the controller's office have, they have written multiple reports. this is a continuous problem and so much of a problem, i have listened to every reason and every excuse from the sheriff's department and i have researched it and the most and recent and last excuse led me to the controller's office where i met with the controller and i do agree with the sheriff's office that the sheriff's budget is a problem. and so does the controller, budget needs to be higher and appropriate. that's partial

effect but that's not the only effect of our staffing crisis. here we are today, we're talking about staffing and that's a priority that should be the priority because really if you think about it, what does it affect? >> it affects safety inside the jail and affects peace and affects going to programs, it affects walk time. it affects gym time and it affects medical appointments and court trials like you brought up, it's the cog in the wheel that slows everything done, it's the cog in the wheel where our deputies are getting attacked because the lack of staffing. it's the cog in the wheel because other incarcerated people are being attacked and employees are being -- attacked and this needs to be your priority. i would like to say although the sheriff's office presents they are

aggressively hiring and they are trying to recruit, you know, the contrary based on our research, there's trying and there's doing and the trying, there needs to be more fire under the trying. there needs to be more urgency under the trying. the marketing and recruiting right now pretty much that started in june prior to that, there was little to no marketing and the recruiting was week and the department re-- relied on other employees to network on getting new applicants and it worked well until the last two years where morale decreased the lowest levels to where our contract has been violated multiple times to the point of our members losing time off because of contract violations, to the point of applicants coming in with

experience, with academy certificates, laterals, getting underpaid and paid at a training wage when that never happened prior to 2020, so there's problems within the department that i urge you to look at. now, if we fix all those inter department problems where they have impacted (indiscernible) and promoted deputies to sergeants and i mean a lot of sergeants during the staffing crisis, where they skipped and not offered testing for senior deputy which could have balanced some of the issues with the impact of staffing instead of going from deputy -- >> i think we've hit the time limit for your public comment, my apologies but we need to add here to that. >> thank you. but please research it and look into it. [timer]

>> to the parents for the public comment, there was missing -- the password to get into the meeting, so the meeting id is 24946776879. and the password is 63879899. public comment is now open. we'll give you a few seconds. >> could you repeat that because usually when people hear it specifically -- >> and slower because if it was me, i wouldn't have caught any of those numbers. >> it appears public comment was missing the password, so the meeting id, let me start with the phone number, 415-655-0001. meeting id is 24946776879. and

the password is 63879899. there's no public comment. >> the next item on the agenda is item 8, rules of order/by-laws, this is a discussion item.

board members about -- discussion by board members about any of the proposed rules of order that mr. long has sent us based over the past five weeks? >> city attorney clerk, are you going to finalize it if we send comments or -- would you prefer that maybe one commission member accumulate the comments and revise the draft as necessary? >> yeah, i mean, it can go either way. i made comments so the ones from existing bodies, someone, ten tee city attorney reviewed those so the main thing

we are looking for is they are consistent with the "brown act" and the sunshine ordinance, so for those that were for existing bodies, that's already -- our office reviewed those. the one that, the draft that president wetchter sent to me, i went through and made edits and to make sure and it looked at it with the eye towards, is it it consistent with the "brown act" and the sunshine ordinance and i haven't looked at this current draft since then, so if it's not changed, since i looked at it last, then i'm sure it's fine but what rules you adopt are entirely up to you with the caveat, like i said, they are consistent with the "brown act" and sunshine ordinance. it can go either way. if you want me to make comments on other drafts, i could do that or if you want -- if this body decides that the

draft that president wetchter sent which i think is built off the police commission rules of order, if this body decides that's the draft they want to work on, i can go back and finalize it and send it to the group and at the next meeting, if you elect to adopt that, you'd have to put it on the agenda as an action item because you're adopting rules and you have to give 15-days' notice for that meeting so if you want to do that, i can do that. so today, you couldn't adopt them. it's only an informational item, so those are some of the possibilities so -- >> i asked that only because not just substantively but also the format was off. i didn't know how in shape you wanted the things because obviously if we're going to adopt something, the formatting is important as well. >> yeah. i'm happy to -- i'm

happy to make a comment on the -- comment on formatting also. i didn't notice anything in particular. the draft i'm looking at now -- >> i mean i see spaces in the underlining isn't consistent so i'm -- as an attorney, i'm anal about some of these things having worked on regulations as well. >> i wasn't looking at it for that purpose because it was one of three four drafts floating around. >> i was wondering if we were submitting drafts or comments to you, like how perfect of a form? >> it's entirely up to you. >> okay. because i mean, if this came to me as a final draft and even with the 15-day notice, i couldn't vote for it because i'm looking not only substantively but also in terms of presentation and format as well.

>> yep. so, the way i approached this is when people sent me drafts, i have been look at it an item consistent with the sunshine ordinance and the "brown act" and i haven't been looking at it for formatting purposes. it's not -- but i can do that if that's something you want but i'm happy to take whatever comments or edits you had that go to formatting or wording or anything like that on a draft -- on one or two of the drafts and get back to you and send back to you a for final form. >> okay. thank you. i mean, main thing is they are your rules. they can look however you want them to look. meaning the body's rules. >> yeah, i had one concern about actually on agenda items and including the inspector general because the inspector general works for this body so i think

it's better to keep it within the board to come up with agenda items. i mean, it can be in consolidation with the inspector general but i think just to keep it consistent and maybe a media policy as well. that really, things shouldn't be in the media that hasn't been a consensus of our entire commission and anything that touches a legal arena, it would be best directed to you or if -- if it's germane to the sheriff's department/sheriff's council. >> what i think might work best is if, so everyone has a draft, right, and i think there were copies so if -- i can make a note of those edits you suggested and if the body wants me to make the edits to the document and bring that back, i can do that but you could also, at the next meeting when you're adopting the rules, anyone is free at that point to make

suggestions to the draft that's out there, like, they can be oral suggestions and then you can vote on whatever those suggestions are and i can commit what you have voted on to writing or edit it as everyone directs me to at the meeting so it can go either way. >> okay. i'll try and make it easier for you and do a clean copy myself and then i'll probably just highlight changes in language rather than -- and i always find underlining and then (indiscernible) too confusing so i highlight in a particular color whether it's yellow or green. >> that works fine. maybe what i'll do when we come back, i'll shift that draft around through the secretary and try and make clear what our -- your suggestions and what were my suggestions, so then when you come back to vote on the rules, if you decide to do that at the next meeting, you'll know when

you're voting on basically. at that meeting and if there's a draft and close to final form, this body is free at that meeting as long as it has been agendized to make suggestions and they can be a part of the final draft too, so that's -- what is brought to the next meeting doesn't have to be exactly what you end up voting on, if that makes sense. >> i have a question. i don't require sending a media policy in the other commissioner rules of order that you sent to us, is there one we can copy or adopt? >> there isn't a media policy for the other commission i advise and i don't remember seeing it in the ones i have shared. so i can ask around my office to see if other commission -- where the rules aren't before you and not one that is advised they have a media policy and i can bring

that to you too. >> i'm sure there's something that stood up and ensuring there's not a first amendment right of board or commission members. >> the other commission i advise, i think the rules of order say that the president -- can speak for the body. but even now i think it's problematic. it's one thing to be able to speak to the media about something that the board, a decision that the board collectively made but it might get confusing in terms of what you are saying as an individual verses what you're saying as a member, so but i have seen that in the other commission i advise in the juvenile commission. it's in their rules but it's up to you and i can look at it with an eye to the first amendment issues. >> i was looking at the police commission rules of order

because they closely -- their work most closely resembles ours. any questions or comments? okay. is there any public comment? >> sorry. >> i was going to make a motion that we all submit -- i was going inform say we submit things -- i was going to say we submit information because we need 15 days' notice and i don't want if you want the board members so it can be finalized or we have a month and carry it and do it -- >> i was thinking latter of november and agendized it for november. >> but realize there's going to be thanksgiving in there too. >> yes, there is.

>> and ms. clarke, i -- say this is a pdf so all comments you made which were attorney/client privilege would be excluded and i can send you this in word version and if you can take it out so it's easier and you can send it to dan, if you can send it to people so it's easier to make changes using track changes so we can see which changes each individual is proposing, if that's easier. >> i tend not to use track changes so i use highlighting. usually, i think my role has been master scripter in the past so usually it's easier and i would say that because city attorney is finalizing it. city attorney is the master scripter so there's not too many people playing with the draft and then one goes out in error as a final. >> so if i'm hearing you

correctly, do you want to volunteer to receive those of us -- the corrections or additions to it and then you can share -- >> it can be either or or i was going to say it would be city attorney working on it because -- >> it's better you send it to dan and they forward it to me individually. i want to avoid us accidentally share things among -- >> i agree. >> and thank you for doing all this work, it's very tedious. >> that's why we went to law school. >> i'm having flashbacks. >> i presume we have to do it once. okay. are we ready for public comment? >> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item 8, if you're present, please line up at the podium. otherwise, please call

415-655-0001. and enter access code 2496776879. with the password 63879899. press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. and given the technical difficulties of this, i believe we can take public comment on any lines one three eight. there is one public caller. good evening, caller, you have two minutes. >> commissioners, can you hear

me? >> yes. >> okay. i had to call the sheriff's department because sf tv -- so we can verify and get a password to participate in this meeting. i think all this should be done before you start your meeting and start the middle in the meeting or the end. we, the public are watching y'all like a hawk. and i did listen to the entire meeting, the first meeting and i want to say even though this wasn't an action item and you're discussing about the rules of order but i want to

say that our city in recent months have many new commissions. we have a commission on public housing, street and sanitation, the sheriff's now have a commission and each of these meetings have to have some standard. and one of the most important points is that the public has to participate. >> caller, you have 30 seconds. >> thank you for the 30 seconds. we, the people, need to be respected and we were not respected today. and i'm going to participate in the future agenda items. i'm on standby.

>> thank you, caller. no other callers. >> no more callers. >> okay. then item 9, future agenda items and scheduling regular meeting. discussion and possible action item. and you gave us the list of potential accessible meeting room times. >> as a reminder going forward, sfgo tv will not be broadcast this live and it will be

recorded to be heard next day. >> will people be able to listen online? >> they can sign in into webex. but it won't be broadcast on cable tv. >> webex, will they have visuals or audio? >> i believe it's audio only. >> audio only, okay. >> i understood this list to mean if we were to choose one of these dates, we can have live broadcast, right? >> correct >> it's only -- so, i'm looking at this and to maximize public participation, i think fridays are not necessarily a good day. i would make myself available but fridays aren't the best and i think the second best would be the fourth wednesday where we're able to have that window of opportunity from 9:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. but again, i think during work hours minimizes the ability for the public to

participate and to me, that's the most crucial aspect of this commission. but i guess if i needed to prioritize a preference, it would be the fourth wednesday from 9:00 to 4:00. >> i would also prioritize that date. i would -- i think i'm concerned also about the fact that people need to work and they might not be able to give their input during these hours but given the circumstances, this is what we have available to us, i would also prioritize the wednesday, the fourth. >> yes, i concur. i echo the same sentiments my colleagues have in terms as we just heard, able to ensure we can have public comment and folks can call in, so if we were to choose a different date for

availability for sfgovt tv, it's that wednesday but i'm not opposed to, since we had a steady rotation of the last two months of keeping the months although they are not live broadcast, it allows folks an opportunity to call in because if it's not an sfgov tv, it's still a live link, correct? it will be a webex but shown the next day so -- >> we won't -- >> we won't have the video. >> we wouldn't have access unless somebody was actually here live in our -- owe >> the room is open >> in the room with us and i'm trying to layout the options. that's my thought process. >> on the commission -- on the status of women, we were audio tape and that presented an issue and this isn't during covid, so i'm thinking, second best is the longer hours but as i look at

this monday, window is only three years and if we had longer meetings and this is work time 9 to noon. if anything happened noon or later, we could have more latitude and people could have lunch hours between noon and 2:00. i'm concerned about that. >> i'm not having visuals means members of the public would not see the powerpoint presentations that are made to us which are often valuable information. >> and also not recognizing who is speaking unless we identify their selves each time we spoke although i know secretary taylor and you're good at calling on people so, but i think it makes it so much better to have visuals. >> i work during the day, weekdays, so definitely monday through thursdays are not an option for me and i would prefer fridays just because it has a

longer timeframe but yeah. and i'm more flexible on a friday too, so.... that's my point of view. >> michael and william, what about your availability? >> i would prefer friday evenings rather than something in the morning monday through friday because yeah. that's busy hours for myself. do we have a time limit, like, can we just be here for two years or do we have to be here until every item is covered? >> i think we will allow ourselves the flexibility in case it's longer and public comment may one over. >> we can carry the meeting over to the next meeting. i have been in somewhere the agenda is long where we move it to the next

meeting. is there an end time? right now we don't have an end time? >> i second that. i think it would be helpful to have an end time or time keep so that we're kind of moving through the items quickly because i think some of the questions that, even the follow up questions we have for the discussion items can be e-mailed, you know, like, we can kind of save time that way. >> and i think we did more, i mean, like you said, there's going to be meeting where we need more time but then we can reschedule that for a different day if we think our agenda items need more time but for routine agenda, i say friday went 5:00 and 7:00 is good or 4:00 to 7:00. >> michael? >> actually, i agree with palmer due to work conflicts. i think

friday would be best. >> i'm so happy to spend my first friday of every month with you wonderful people. i'm okay with that. >> it's might be better than the fourth friday but the overall, you know, priority for me is public participation. >> absolutely! absolutely! >> so are we talking about the first friday or the fourth friday? >> first friday. >> okay. >> first fridays. >> i would imagine my personal feeling is we want as much public involvement as possible so we want to encourage people to watch the meetings and to call in or come in person and speak because as we have said, i think we want to hear from the community about their concerns and listen to that and hopefully our audience will grow. >> and then do we want to get a time for the first friday?

>> yeah, like 4:00 to 7:00. that's what i put down. >> i'm okay with 4:00 to 7. >> great. >> what do we do with holidays or vacation? you may -- >> we don't take vacations. >> okay. [laughter] >> just checking. we do. >> we can work around it but -- >> is 4:00 p.m. the earliest that people can start? or is there a possibility of starting earlier? >> i'm still thinking about public participation so i think 4:00 p.m. is the earliest we should start. >> agreed. >> so can i make a motion we meet on the first fridays in room 400 at 4:00 p.m. until 7:00 p.m.? >> i second that motion.

>> for members of the public who would like to make public comment online item the, if you're present, line up at the podium or call 415-655-0001 and enter access code 24946776879. password 43879899. we have one caller. good evening caller, you have two minutes. >> my name is francisco de costa and i would like to participate in some of the key virtual meetings that our city has and

there is no doubt that at this time, the san francisco police department and the commission and the sheriff's department and commission are playing an important role in advancing quality-of-life issues in our city. very, very serious quality-of-life issues in our city. that is why we have to have everything to allow the taxpayers, constituents who are (indiscernible) the constitution participate in these meetings. it's very important. now, at every meeting, we have a choice whether to state your name or

not state your name. [beeping] i don't mind stating my name. it's "brown act." so, some people don't like to state their name and that's fine. i like to state my name. [timer] >> >> caller, you have 30 seconds. >> there are no other public comment. >> do you want to take a vote? >> okay. we have a motion on the floor. and i do have a question. would that mean our next meeting would be friday, october 7th? >> i was going to ask that? or did you want to move it to

november? >> i was going to put a caveat on that motion to move it to november. >> i think a month to prepare those materials. >> for sure. >> yep! that gets us prepared as well. >> no procrastinating. >> november 4th from 4:00 to 7:00 is our next meeting. >> i'll be at a national bar association asian conference so i won't be here but materials still can be sent in. >> we'll take the vote. member afuhaamango? >> aye. >> member afuhaamango is aye. member brookter? >> aye. >> member brookter is aye. member carrion?

>> aye. >> member carrion is aye: member palmer? >> aye. >> member palmer is aye. member nguyen? >> aye. >> member nguyen is aye. member soo? >> aye. >> member soo is aye. president wetchter? >> aye. >> president wetchter is aye. >> item nine is future agenda items and scheduling regular meetings and we have addressed scheduling regular meetings of future agenda items. i didn't realize you were going to be here and that's why i made the request earlier. >> [mic is off] >> i was going to quickly review what has been sitting kind of on our back-burner so-to-speak now and i have made, i have redrafted the mission statement to clean it up a little bit and maybe we could send it to city

attorney clarke so we don't do (indiscernible) things if that's okay with you. >> i'm happy to look at it. so you want me to look at it for purposes of making sure it's consistent with your charter, duties and et cetera. >> yeah. i draft a mathematician and the elegant proof is the most -- i like to keep it direct and that's why i cleaned up the mission statement. my colleagues are going to work on the mission statement and that's why if we could add here to particularly deadlines and get this completed by november, so we can actually vote on a mission statement in november. >> so you're recommending this is an agenda item. >> uh-huh. and then also i think secretary (indiscernible), you took a poll on the logos and

that will go to business cards and then i think if we're going to set out some community hearings and i know we're going to get into the holidays but maybe that is a good way to have some kind of community involvement and i think commissioner afuhaamango, you really are looking forward to the community engagement as well, so i think maybe at the next meeting, if we can talk about some dates for some of the community engagement and maybe also even look at the sheriff's calendar, if they have some community events that they are doing over the holidays as well and make we can ducktail or at least make announcements at a sheriff's community event that we're going to have a hearing other a criteria of an inspector general, so.... but i think it's important to actually get the mission statement done and the logo and business cards so as members, those of us involved in the community, at least are

willing to give out contact information to solicit input, so those are the four items, thank you. >> chief, would it expedite things if you send it in advance of the meeting and if we had questions about them we send them to dan in advance of the meeting, is that permissible or would it expedite things? >> i don't know how far out in advance because staff has to put things out in advance but usually i call dan and let him know if i can put it on there. today, he said i can plug in my own usb but it does take time for our folks to work on that to the specific to what you're asking. >> i'm wondering if we had the materials a few days before the meeting, if we had questions we can e-mail them to dan and he can forward them to you and we

wouldn't have to ask them here and you'll be prepared to provide the information. >> i was going to share and for a point of clarity as we move forward, when we have presentations it should be mosted to the public at the same time we post the agenda so everybody is aware transparent wise of everything that's going on, so i think that might be a good practice to start with, if we can get it 72 hours in advance as we post the agenda so we can post it so member of the publics who have questions on what we're seeing, we can write our questions and reach out before hand if we want and have questions prepared as we're coming into it. >> excellent! >> is the link the same all the time for the public? >> no. >> oh! >> it changes. >> hopefully it's more consistent since we'll have a consistent meeting. >> i want to be mindful of what commissioner carrion said, that we do prioritize our request of staff because there's a lot going on right now.

>> for sure. for sure. >> was there -- the only thing i want to agendized as we just talked about it was the rules of order for november meeting. hopefully by that time everybody has a month to send out less views and edits and grammar and hopefully we can vote on that in november and also because we talked about it and we can discuss it when you talk through the agenda but have dhr come out to address the questions. those are my two things. >> maybe we could is a list few the timelines when dhr comes back and coordinate with community hearings and i don't anticipate, maybe two community hearings would be adequate but i want to make sure we have language access and spanish and mandarin and cantonese. >> would you look at having a

commission meeting in addition to our regular meeting? >> yes. >> okay. so then perhaps we could look for one some time in november before thanksgiving. >> i don't know if that's possible or maybe december because we want the report back from dhr and the report and timeline. >> they will bring back the report on november 4th so if we had a community meeting between november 4th and thanksgiving, we would have gotten the report from dhr? >> i think it's better for december. >> you know -- >> to a flounce it during our november -- to announce it during our november meeting we'll have a community meeting. >> there's too much going on during the holidays, so given that we're going to be getting

these five potentially proposals, information that we're going to get, an entire month to review that and it's an action item and i don't think we should have a community meeting during dez. it's busy for different reasons and we should plan on doing that in the beginning of the new year following the break. and we can use this time if we are able to maybe identify a date by next november, our next meeting, we can identify and then publicize that january meeting much more in advance and give people a month and a half notice. >> i think it's possible to have two community meetings in january. >> yeah, yeah. >> that's a great idea. >> where is the link to view this for the public located to

share with people? >> it's on the sheriff's website. where is it currently? >> the link for the meetings we have, are they -- >> we have -- on our website. >> yeah. someone texted me today saying the link wasn't working, i sent them a link on the agenda. >> it worked for me. i have one question, so i think you're still listed as a pol for police commission after your name and then under mine, i'm still sba consultant, i think, so at what point are we going to be sdod after our names, our e-mail? >> the e-mails are going to follow the budget and it's going to say fda. we need to get you all processed first, i'm waiting for -- and that one thing and

then hr doesn't work quickly but i'm trying to get them -- >> i know, you have worked diligently since we have been onboarded. >> i'm trying to get you guys processed. >> by that time it will be time to file another form 700. >> the new fiscal year. >> all right. do we need general public comment on that item? >> at this time the public is welcome to address the board for up to two minutes on items that did not appear on tonight's agenda but within the subject matter jurisdiction of the sheriff's department and oversight board during public comment and neither sheriff's personnel or board members are required to respond to questions by the public but may provide a brief response. general public comment is for, given the technical difficulties, it can

be for any agenda item. for those present, please line up at the podium. for those not present, call 415-655-0001. enter access code 24966776879. and the password is 63879899. press three to raise your hand to be added to the queue. and there is no public comment. >> a motion for adjournment. >> so moved to adjourn. >> second. >> roll call on that or can we -- >> you can take that unanimously. >> oh. >> okay. chief, any objections? >> no. >> all right. the meeting ending at 8:31 p.m. >> thank you.

>> thanks, dan.

>> i am rafael mandelman, i chair this board. vice chair is aaron peskin.