captain one the black leaders of san francisco before that was called san francisco he was the first treasurer of the city and commercial street a cross street the hifblg original shoreline of san francisco was just a few feet behind where we're 12357b8z around opportunity to bring people to locations we have an opportunity to tell stories and for local businesses. >> holidays. good afternoon, and welcome to the sheriff's department oversight board for today, december 6th, 2024. in the united states of america, in san francisco, we are now in

session. and the meeting is called to order at 206 according to that clock. but more like 209 according to my watch. dan, please call the roll member who will be joining us shortly. vice president brueckner. president brueckner is present. member. carrion. president. carrion is present. member. nguyen. president nguyen is present. member. palmer. president palmer is present. president. sue. present. sue is present. jason rector has resigned from the sheriff's department oversight board and has been permanently removed from the roster. seat number two is vacant pending reappointment by the board of supervisors. the basic requirements for approval of an action remains a majority of the entire membership that the board or four affirmative votes. madam president, we have a quorum. thank you. dan, please read the land acknowledgment. the sheriff's department oversight board recognizes that we are situated on the unceded ancestral territory of the

ramaytush ohlone. the original inhabitants of the san francisco peninsula. as the indigenous guardians of this land, the ramaytush ohlone have maintained their connection to it. never relinquishing their responsibilities as caretakers for both the land and all who inhabit their traditional territory. in our role as guests, we acknowledge the advantages we gained from residing and working on their ancestral homeland. we express our our. we express our respect by honoring the ancestors, elders, and relatives of the ramaytush ohlone community and by affirming their sovereign rights as the first peoples. thank you. now let's please stand to recite the pledge of allegiance. pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands. one nation under god, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

thank you. and do we have any announcements? yes. on behalf of the sheriff's department oversight board, we would like to thank the staff at sfgovtv for providing technical assistance to broadcast and record this afternoon's meeting. you may view this afternoon's broadcast online at sfgovtv or on cable channel 26. this is the standard monthly public meeting held in person by the sheriff's department oversight board. members of the oversight board will be present at this meeting, and members of the public are encouraged to attend and observe. however, only those members of the public who are present in person will have the opportunity to provide public comment. with the exception of individuals with disabilities who require reasonable accommodations. public comment can be submitted in person, via email, or through postal mail. to send public comments by email, please contact zdob si zdub.org. for postal submissions, please just address them to the office of the

sheriff's inspector general, one south venice avenue, eighth floor, san francisco, california 94103. individuals wishing to make public comment in person may do so when their respective line item is called, with a time limit of two minutes for each comment. additionally, there will be a general comment period at the conclusion of the meeting for topics not listed on the agenda, but relevant to the jurisdiction of the sheriff's department oversight board. members of the public present in person may approach the podium to speak during public comment period. when it is available, each speaker will have two minutes to express their comments. first tone will indicate there are 30s remaining and the second tone will signal the end of the two minute period. madam president, this concludes the announcements. thank you. dan. the first agenda item please. calling line item one. approval of minutes. action item review and approval of the minutes from the board meeting held on november first, 2024.

motion to approve. and do i have a second? second. any public comments at this time? members of the public wishing to provide public comment on line. item one approval of minutes. you're invited to approach the podium when it becomes available. just lloyd austin. this is just for this line item. there appears to be no public comment calling the roll on the approval of minutes, vice president brueckner i is a member. carry on. abstain. are you actually supposed to be? just about no one here. vote no

because we can't abstain unless the board excuses you by vote. so carry on. is no member nguyen. yes. when is yes member palmer? yes. palmer. is. yes. president su i xu is i. there are four eyes and one nay. the minutes from the november first, 2024 meeting are approved. thank you. next item please. following line. item two. general public comment. at this moment, members of the public are invited to speak to the board for a duration of up to two minutes regarding matters that are not included in this afternoon's agenda, but fall within the jurisdiction of the sheriff's department oversight board. during this public comment period, neither sheriff personnel, the inspector general nor board members are obligated to answer questions posed by the public, although they may offer a brief response if they choose to do so. there will be further public comment at the conclusion of the meeting. if you wish to provide public comment, please approach the podium when it becomes available. please remember that you have a maximum

of two minutes to express your concerns. so it requires a self-control. two minutes. it's funny when you made the roll call, it sounded like prison. prison? yes, because everybody is in prison. everybody has been put under arrest. obviously, the sheriff as well, he's. but he's there. so how do we get out of prison? we have to do something. you know, consequence. we need to understand with self-control, which is absolutely key to get out of the mess we are in altogether. as human beings. we need to, i think, understand the fight against the food poisoning, which is more and more clear for all of us here. it's. how are you going to deal with that? we need to address it. air poisoning. i mean, all

things water. so, you guys, i don't know the sheriff. sheriff. that's not good for you. you see, because you can't bail yourself out at some point, it's over. the game is over, and your descendants and children pay for you because you pay for what you do. we all pay for what we do or not. there is no escape. including for me, of course. you know i'm happy because i know i'm doing something. aiming for beauty. it's not even right or wrong. it's beauty or ugliness. that's it. so understand for you, your own sake, life, happiness. that is your reason for being is to be happy. if you don't have a move on avoiding cowardice, hypocrisy, what disrupts self-control? monet. first of the game is going to be

over for you as well. it's a warning. i can't do it all the time. but again, here tonight, today, this afternoon. thank yo. do i have let's see. we just finished public comment. so the next item on the agenda please. calling item number three presentation from ben ritchie. informational item ben ritchie from the department of human resources will brief the board on conducting performance evaluations. mr. ritchie. hello. good afternoon. thank you for being here. sure. my name is benjamin ritchie. i'm a senior human resources consultant with the department of human resources. i'll be providing information for the board on the process for board performance evaluations, for department heads to begin. oversight boards have broad discretion in how they exercise their oversight powers. the charter gives the sheriff's department oversight board the authority to evaluate the work of the office of inspector general and review the

inspector general's individual work performance. the board has the discretion to determine how it carries out this responsibility. the department of human resources does not have a defined process for boards and commissions on performance evaluations. the city does have general performance management system, but it's intended for use by managers supervising regular civil service employees. the city does have performance management processes for department heads. they include a self-assessment process where the department head outlines key accomplishments for the year and key goals for the following yea. this process is separate, though, from the process for boards and commissions to exercise their independent oversight authority and boards are not required to follow this process when carrying out their oversight duties. one other information regarding any meetings to discuss performance evaluations, we would recommend consulting with your advising city attorney to advise what parts of your discussion of the performance evaluation would fall under the government code for closed session exceptions of

public meetings for employee performance evaluations. thank you. and i just want to ask the members if they have any questions of mr. ritchie to please put yourself on the roster here. and i just as a point of comment, i just want to say that any kind of evaluation should be also a reflection of what we've done as the board, what goals we've set, have they been realistic? have we met particular benchmarks? were we clear on our purpose, our goals? so i think that going forward, it's always instructive for us to take that in mind as we do evaluations. it's takes a little introspection as well. so any questions? comments? nope. thank you for being here. none. thank you. i know forward. yes. and hopefully you'll beat traffic when you go home. thank you. thank you very much. any public

comment on this item at this time, members of the public wishing to provide public comment on line item three presentation from ben ritchie, are invited to approach the podium when it becomes availabl. yes. okay. sorry. so the main human resource today is self-control. you see? that's it. no more exploitation of humans because the name human resources is always kind of human resources. what is it a job? okay. right. okay. it's self control. everybody needs self control. you understand the concept of self control. you own yourself. nobody owns you. once you have self control you can't be controlled. so forget the unintelligence on the top of the pyramid. here. it's over for them. the game is over. you don't want it to be over for you, do you and your children

self control? especially when there are weapons involved? you see technology, all this crap which by definition has no self control, technology has no self control because it is a machine. okay? human resources, self control. thank you. yeah i so i was going to have dan call the next agenda item. and i think i need to contact assembly member joan sawyer again. so we could take a two minute recess. or we could maybe move that item towards the end. i would make a motion to continue with the line item five until the assembly member joins. okay, i second that. okay. and seeing no

objections, let's do that. let's move on to the next agenda item calling line item five. inspector general report informational item inspector general terry riley will give a report detailing the monthly activities of the office of the inspector general. this report will encompass the recent conference of the association of inspectors general, a visit to county jail three alongside board members and the collaborative efforts with the san francisco jail justice coalition inspector general. wiley. all right. thank you, da. good afternoon everyone. as dan stated, we some of the highlights of this month's activity. one was my attending the association of inspector generals annual conference, the conference was fantastic. it was we had access to about 65

different professionals specializing in different aspects of oversight. and so they they really focused on, you know, really the agility, the diversity and just the overall impact that proper oversight of, of law enforcement in this particular case can really have a positive impact on the community. now, the association of inspector generals encompasses federal, state, county and city and even some community based organizations that are all part of that community. so it's the subject matter covered, you know, the full scope of oversight. but overall, it was a very, very

comprehensive and, and, and just i thought excellent presentation of current the current state of oversight locally on on november 13th or excuse me, on november 19th. we my team along with board members sue and board member palmer, joined us in inspecting county jail. three. and it was a pretty lively inspection from the standpoint that the areas we covered is we of course, had some intense interaction with the inmates, but we also inspected the kitchen and that inspection was pretty comprehensive in that the person that supervises the kitchen, i thought did a very

good job giving us an overall presentation of how the kitchen operates in wk three, the inmates that are working in the kitchen, you can really see how there's some real skill development that takes place, given all the duties that they are having to carry out, which i saw as a real positive. and we also looked at their the maintaining of the laundry. and i know that that sounds, you know, okay, maintaining laundry, but, you know, when you're doing laundry for numerous individuals, it really takes an organized system. and so we got to look at some of the industrial washing machines and the industrial dryers and how they distribute and redistribute bedding and inmate clothing. and

again, you know, i think, you know, a lot of the inmates are actually doing the work. and so you can really see that there's also an opportunity while they're there at some skill development. now, getting to the conversations with the inmates themselves, you know, there had been discussion in our last meeting about having the inmates have access to one on one interviews. so one of the first things we did with this visit is we announced that we had our investigator, brett brant, begin there, and that he was available to any of the inmates who wanted to have a one on one conversation about the current conditions at the jail. there were a few who took him up on an opportunity to speak with them about whatever concerns that they had, but overall, there

were about 50 inmates, and we had a just a general overall discussion with them. and i think anyone who was present, you could see that there was no hesitation on their part in terms of being in kind of this forum of expressing whatever concerns that they had about the current jail system. and so let me go over a few of their complaints. one, and this is a complaint we've heard on both the men's side and the women's side, and it is the lack of programing since pre-covid days. so the programing that's going on with the men and the women in the jail has not come back to the level that it was prior to covid. so there was definitely some complaints about wanting more programing to be available

to them. there were complaints about and these have been consistent complaints about the space and having access to sunlight. chief quantico shared plans that they're trying to create a opportunity to expand the inmate access to sunlight. and so we're anticipating that maybe by the end of january that they'll they'll be rolling out a new program for increasing the sunlight for the inmates. so i'm i feel real good about that, because that has been a consistent complaint by the inmates. deputy chief quantico, who was a captain and has since been promoted to deputy chief. he also revealed to our group

and the inmates of the intent to create an orientation video so that the orientation video would ensure that the inmates understand all the services that are available to them and how to access them. and i guess there's, you know, some concern that the inmates might not know everything that is available to them. so i think that that's a positive development to put together an orientation video. some of the other ideas that that we discussed was with with the board members that in some of these were our suggestions. for example, president icu suggested that the jail may want to consider a service dog program and that there is a number of different facilities that have service dog programs that are very, very that have a very positive impact on the

inmates, plus providing a service in providing service trained dogs. and so and chief quantico, deputy chief quantico at the time, said that they were also planning to bring in the program. but i guess covid hit and it kind of went by the wayside. so that is one of the programs that we definitely are going to keep our eyes on and trying to develop there at the jail. and as i said, we looked at the facilities. now i think we have to specifically specifically talk about the inmate engagement that that occurred. and i do have to say that, you know, generally what we do is, as the inspector general, i will start the discussion with the inmates and many times i'll just ask the basic question of how's everything going? and that just sets it off, you know, in terms

of the feedback that we get from the inmates. and in this particular case, probably, well, the first thing that they mentioned, that is a big problem is they still feel like whenever there's a lockdown, they feel like they're being punished for something they didn't do, something they didn't have anything to do with, and that some of these, some of the different incidents are still triggering lockdowns that are impacting everyone. in fact, you know, we've had discussions with deputy chief quantico about that. and we have definitely seen improvements in their intentionally keeping the operation up and running as much as they can. in fact, that day,

there had been an assault on a deputy in the jail. and again, we hope that the deputy is making a full recovery from that attack. but as a result, i think if we had gone back to january 2023 there, our visit may have had may have been canceled because there would have been a full jail lockdown because of an assault on a deputy. and because of the efforts that they're making to as much as they can keep the have whatever incident occurs impact as few people as possible. they made a decision to continue with our visit. and so i, i saw that as real progress in terms of how they're they're trying to avoid the lockdowns, having such a tremendous impact on everyone.

another complaint was of course, as i said earlier, programing there are it's kind of a two piece complaint. one, they're complaining that they're not receiving enough program programing, but secondly, when they are engaging in court ordered programing, the programs that they're participating in are really not doing a good job of getting them the information that they can provide to the court that they've either completed the programing or they're participating in the programing. and so the sheriff's department informed us that that's not really their responsibility. it's a court ordered program. their responsibility is to make sure that they have access to that program. but in terms of reporting and giving inmates the ability to show proof of their participation in the programs, it's not the responsibility of the sheriff and so as the ig, we

plan on reaching out to some of the programs and talk to them and discuss with them like, we need to get this figured out, you can't have these guys participating in the programs and then not providing them with any proof of the programing. so we are that's one of the things that we will be getting to the bottom of and getting that resolved for the inmates. and then the couple of other things that are i think are significant. one, the sheriff's department had a so a lot of the inmates have tablets. there was a problem with the tablets. i think somebody got into the tablets and they had to shut the tablets down. but as a result,

all of the grievances of the inmates had to be handled in using written paper and so this delayed the sheriff's investigating their grievances. and so the inmates were complaining that they their grievances were being lost in the shuffle. and no one was was getting back to them about their grievances. whereas when they were able to file the grievance digitally on the tablet, they were in the system and, and they were being addressed. so we addressed that with, with deputy chief quantico. and he, he explained to us even before we went in and spoke with the inmates that there they were backlogged with the paper grievances and that they were, you know, they felt in a couple of weeks they were going to be able to address everyone's grievances and so i think we got that resolved with the inmates and understanding that your grievances have not been lost, and they will be addressed. now,

the other thing is with the tablets, you know, in many jails across california, inmates with tablets were able to make phone calls from the tablets. and in san francisco, they can't make they can't make any phone calls with these tablets. so there were a lot of complaints about that. well, the company that san francisco now utilizes is nucleus. and the tablets are well, the contract is almost up, is almost up. and there is definitely going to they're definitely going to address that. whatever new contract they enter into that there be a opportunity for the inmates to make phone calls from their tablets. so i think that that is that's another thing that i anticipate will be resolved now. another big complaint was that

when inmates get put in the hall with the sheriff's department is doing is they go in and they confiscate their commissary, and the commissary can be edible items or, you know, in non-edible items and so what they do is when they get put in a hole, they they confiscate all their commissary and other items and they store them away. and when the inmate comes out of the finishes, the discipline, you know, all their commissary is gone. and so there were some pretty intense discussions about that. and so we discussed it. and i, you know, there are areas that, you know, we may not necessarily agree with, but, you know, in running the jail, the sheriff has the discretion to kind of set what the standards

are going to be, you know, so that if you go into the hole and they confiscate your, your commissary, you know, that might be one of the penalties for going in the hole. however, you know, we discussed that that aspect of it. and, and i think there's going to be some further discussions as to, you know, because most of the inmates are not coming from situations where they, you know, let's face it, can't afford to spend their money on commissary and then have it confiscated and then not being returned and so that, you know, we have to discuss there being a different alternative to that. so but but you know, that is in one of the areas that's within the sheriff's discretion. and there was also a complaint and these complaints go to really the fact that it's an old

jail. but they were there was a lot of complaints about the dust and dirt coming through the ventilation and inmates feeling like they're not really breathing clean air. and so on. in terms of the current hvac system that may be something that we need to address with the sheriff's department and the board of supervisors about going in and having the hvac system in the jail cleaned out, because it's probably been a number of years before since they've done any kind of cleaning of that system. and, you know, these inmates are in these confined circumstances. and you know, it's not healthy if they're not breathing clean air. and then finally, there was a major complaint about the visitation

system in that, you know, in a lot of these things are are being driven by the sheriff's department having personnel shortages. so what they complained about was that when they when their family members want to visit, all of the visitation spots are already taken. and so they're not receiving the kind of visitation from family that they crave for. and i do think that deputy chief quantico, i mean, you know, he really does respond. so what we saw was that we're seeing an expansion of their ability to increase the number of opportunities for inmates to receive visitations. it's still not where it was pre-covid, but it is getting better. but these

were you know, these were all areas of complaints that the inmates had. and so some of these are going to take follow up on our part. you know, particularly we want to confirm that, you know, they were behind on addressing the grievances. and so in our next month's visit, we want to make sure we'll have you caught up with the grievance process. we want to make sure that we're staying in tune with when the contract of nucleus is up. and there's a renegotiation of the tablets, let's make sure that we're aware of what the complaints are so that, you know, if there's any negotiation for new tablets that those issues be addressed. the confiscate the confiscation of the commissary food, we will have further discussions with that. and in terms of the unsanitary conditions and not

unsanitary, but the breathing of bad air, that's something where the ig can join with the sheriff in, in seeking funding for the hvac system to be cleaned out. i mean, it is a very old jail, and let's see, we also had a meeting with so that that comprised our visitation of cj three. i thought it was very productive and i and i you know, and i actually can't leave without mentioning commissioner palmer who was present. and you know, i think we have pretty good conversations back and forth with the inmates. and i think what happens when you have them in kind of this group setting i, you know, initially everybody is just kind of quiet and there will always be a couple of voices that that want to have their issues addressed. and then what we notice is that it just

starts a chain and more and more inmates and to the point where everybody wants to talk about what, what their problems are. so we had reached a point where, you know, we had addressed a lot of their issues. and then commissioner palmer stepped in and started trying to provide them with some solutions to some of their problems. and i think what was notable was everybody stopped talking and really, you could just see the connection between commissioner palmer and the inmates and, and the discussions and, and to the point where after we finished the presentation, there were more i think there were more folks coming up to you an extra 20 minutes just in the pod, because just in the pod, because all of the inmates wanted to talk to commissioner palmer

about seeking solutions to their problems. so, you know, i think that you found your calling. i actually wanted to clarify. so the tablet, there was actually a breach into the system. so that's very serious. and that's why the tablets had to be taken away because it just compromised the safety of everyone, including those incarcerated, from using the tablets. and then the commissary issue goes back to the nutrition that we talked about a lot of them, the incarcerated, are hungry, so they spend their money and they buy additional food items. so it's pretty devastating when it gets conference comp confiscated as they're putting in hold. and then there was also, as i recall, an talking about the number of days when they're on hold and credits on the system. so that's something that needs to be addressed. yeah. and again, like i said, you know, these are not individuals that come from circumstances where

they just have unlimited money to buy commissary, you know, and so to have it confiscated and not returned, it can be very devastating to folks. and so something needs to be worked out there with that, because that just didn't that just didn't sit right with a lot of people. and member palmer and i spent a considerable amount of time in the walk in refrigeration, which was pretty chilly, but it was pretty impressive of how they went through the inventory to make sure the food is fresh and how things get moved out. so i think those who don't work inside the kitchen and don't make time for the gym, they actually get a lot of heavy lifting and i was very impressed with the operations there. it was a great job training and i agree. i think that the kitchen operation is the one aspect of the jail that i think really

provides them with some skills that i see that are transferable outside, because they all seem really, really dedicated to the job. also, and it's actually pretty impressive to watch. so i thought overall it was a very productive meeting, you know, and there was a lot more interaction and i know that commissioner sue, president sue has gone to several visits, and i would say that that visit was probably the most interactive we've ever had with the inmates. i mean, people, and i'll say this, that when we left, we knew what their complaints were. there was no there was nothing left off the table. by the time we also made sure that they knew about prisoner legal services, because some had some unmet needs where it would have been, you know, prisoner legal services. yes, absolutely. so we

also, myself and marshal kane met with the jail justice coalition, and we have monthly meetings with this coalition of folks and this is where we kind of collaborate and try to come up with different solutions for the problems that we're aware of. and so some of the some of the things that we discussed at this past meeting was one we informed them that, you know, we are looking at the food contract with aramark and trying to find some alternatives in providing more fresh food. and they are very interested in participating in a working group that we're planning on putting together, because what we want to do is as

we approach the aramark, the end of that contract, we want to have already done the work in that we want to we want to really have a working knowledge on what are some of the fresh food alternatives that can either compete with aramark or that aramark can bring into the fold of the food that they provide to the inmates? and so we're we're we're actually looking very forward to that collaboration. and in fact, we also want commissioner palmer to participate on that on that committee and finding fresh food alternatives to what aramark is currently providing. we're also looking at some of the current jail programs to assist the sheriff's department with

identifying some additional programing. you know, because like i said, the both the men and the women are craving more programing. and so we want to put together a working group that can try to assist with finding more programing to be provided to the inmates. and then finally, we are, you know, because the subject came up of, you know, inmates not having an opportunity to, to have one on one conversations with the inspector general. so what we have, what we are going to be creating is a weekly hour where inmates will be able to meet, sign up if they want to have a

discussion with the inspector general's office. they can sign up to have a one on one conversation with the inspector general about whatever issues that they're having, and we'll be doing that once a week, and we'll be doing it under the circumstances that all of the conversations will be confidential. and it would be very similar to the inmate talking to their attorney. it would be a discussion under similar circumstances. but we feel that that will offer them an opportunity if they have something that's that of, of real concern and that they can have a confidential conversation with us and they don't have to wait for a whole month before they talk to us. and so we're looking forward to, to creating that opportunity. and then finally in 2019, there was a survey done of all the inmates.

and so we are putting together a survey that can be administered through the tablets. and we're going to do a survey of all aspects of the jail conditions. and we're coming up with questions. and in the jail coalition is going to be participating in that jail survey with us. and so we're hoping that by the time they have the new tablets, we can and the sheriff's department has agreed to implement a, a digital survey on the tablets that, that so that everyone can participate. and we'll look at the feedback that we get from the jail wide survey. i just also wanted to just mention that most of those incarcerated do have access to confidential. i guess, a complaint system at

every visit. marshall kane's been there along with brant bazan, and they've both taken copious notes. so we get to engage more. so i want to thank the both of them for doing that. but some have gone directly to brant, and he's taken their information, so they've also followed up privately. so i don't want people to think that everything is out in the open. they feel like they might be subject to retaliation. the other thing that chief quantico brought up is that they're trying to reestablish the farming program that they have. and i know here in the city, in the bayview with the florence fang gardens or their farming program, it's been extended. it's been very successful for especially for people in food deserts. so they've been able to be, i guess, recipients of some kind of federal funding. and so that's maybe another area that we need to explore to supplement the food issue. absolutely. and i will say that in the year that

i've been the inspector general, and this is with inmates having aspect, having access to brant, our investigator, marshall, we have not received one complaint of retaliation as a result of our visiting the jail and they're speaking out about the conditions we've not had one person call us and feel like they were retaliated against for what they said about the conditions of the jail, and i think that's important to there's new leadership in the in custody division. so and but they are very seasoned deputies who have been there for decades and recognized by those who have been incarcerated as as people they can actually go to. so they i found that they actually had a generally cordial relationship. yeah. and in fact, we met captain shannon is going to be the new captain in charge of cpx three because deputy chief quantico got promoted and is moving. and so we had a real good interaction with captain

shannon. and he's been there 30 years, very experienced. and so we think it's going to be a very smooth transition from captain. now, deputy chief quantico to captain shannon. and then finally, i wanted to let the board know that in next month's meeting, we'll be presenting a one year summary of the oig will be presenting a summary report of the last year of the office of inspector general. in terms of what we've accomplished. and we hope to have discussions with the board in terms of what are your goals and what are some of the challenges that you see that need to be met by the oig and, you know, find out what your priorities are going to be for

the next year so that we can, you know, make those very much the center of moving forward with the oig. and then as the board is aware, you know, i did submit my resignation yesterday as the san francisco inspector general, and i think i, i was pretty clear about why i did it and what motivated it. but, you know, if there are any questions anyone has or wants to discuss, then i'm a very much an open book. i you know, as i stated in my resignation, i will be on board until january 10th. and so i am very committed to this wor. and so whatever i can do to make for a smooth transition, i'm here to do that. thank you for your commitment and i also want

to point out that without the help of marshal keane, we wouldn't have the interactive, real time dashboard. as many of you may have noted, our san francisco superior court recently implemented the real time dashboard for their cases, and that took a deep commitment of presiding judge marzullo two years. so this has been less than a year. and it's up and running. so that's one major accomplishment. but i just want to take some comments and questions from our fellow members. and beginning with member carreon, great. thank you so much. it's very unfortunate that you will be leaving us, but i understand and respect your decisions that you laid out for us. and, you know, we have been very privileged to have you with us for this first year, and we are i have to say, i'm very proud of the work that the office has done, even though that the challenges that were

thrown against it were, you kno, extraordinary. but the work that has been completed is very important and meaningful. and i think that's obvious. to the jail inmates that we go and we get to introduce to them, this is the work that has been done and this is what we're planning. so thank you for all of your work. i, i it's a shame that we're losing you. it is an absolute shame. but i look forward to you continuing to help the community in a different capacity, whatever that is in your future. i had a question. what caused the breach in for the tablets? i think it was an outside breach. oh, okay i see. yeah. outside software hack. okay. thank you. and president sue, thanks. because i, i couldn't come up with the word that it was a breach. yeah, but it was an outside breach. and so that had they shut down all of the tablets and had to go to the paper system for filing

grievances, and we actually saw the grievances. they showed us the stack. they were very transparent that there was a big backlog. yes. so there, there. so that's why at next month's meeting, we want to make sure that that stack is dramatically smaller. great. i know when i did the with you and other folks, the women's jail visit, one of the things that we had told the inmates was that, you know, we have an investigator here, and if you want privacy and you want to have a conversation not in the presence of deputies or around any, you know, folks, that that would be accommodating and there would be space for that. did that also occur in the last visit with the with the women? no. in the in the november visit. oh, yes. that's the first thing we announced. okay, good. i just wanted to make sure that so because i think that there's been critiques that, you know,

you are having meetings in front of deputies, which then people doesn't create an environment. but so starting off the meeting that was our first announcement that we have an investigator here. if there is anything that you'd like to discuss in private, let us know. and he is available to have a discussion with you. and i think there were a few people who took him up on it. oh, great. yes. i know in our visit it was only, i think, one person that did. yeah. yeah, i think that complaint was actually pretty much unfounded. i think as we've done all of our visits with the inspector general, we've always offered that. and brant has always been really good at following up wit. and i think there was also kind of the implication that the inmates were not being as forthcoming in kind of a more open setting. and i and i don't know if commissioner palmer wants to speak to it, but trust me, that was not a problem. they

told you. they told us everything that was happening. so, yeah, i think and then like i said, we took it as a constructive criticism and we moved on. it. and so we now start off every visit with we have somebody available to talk to you on a one on one. great. thank you. so much. thank you. member palmer. thank you. i yes, i want to say we're going to miss you. i hate to see you go, but you know, you got to do what you got to do, right? and second. yeah, the visit that we had and the way you conducted it, the way you conducted yourself, the way that marshal and the investigator was there again, i would say that i was looking to see if there was people not wanting to speak in

front of brass. i mean, there were high level staff there, and so i think that also probably made them even more bold. and because it was like you can't get away with this guy standing here. so i can tell on this lower level deputy that to this big guy like, so you had you in the room, you had, you know, higher officials in the room and then you had, you know, us in the room because they was looking at julie like she was going to do something like, you ain't going to mess with me where she's standing right here. so i was like, wow, okay. so i immediately said, you know who this is? this is the president of the board and just wanted to make sure that they knew that the grievances that they were given to us, they can actually tell their family members to come sit in these chairs right here and to say even more and to be even more candid and be more open and get some, you know, some some, some real time feedback and unfortunately, we

don't see them here. and that's part of our mission, hopefully in the new year. how do we advertise and market what we are doing right down our general emails. so we said if you can't be in person or your family member can't, you can always email. they did. and so with that said, the assault that took place, not only was it wrong and unacceptable, but i wanted to make sure that the community knows that it was by someone who was mentally ill. it wasn't gang related. it didn't spill over into the rest of the jail. so it was isolated. and so we were able to come and continue on. and that's going to happen. that's just the nature of dealing with that population in the jail. and so i want to also give props to the jail for handling it in the way that they did the program. when we talked about the program certificates and paperwork and documents, it

should be the responsibility of those who are running the program to make sure that the paperwork is distributed to all necessary invested parties. it shouldn't be the guy who's locked in a jail cell on a bunk with no computer, no printer, no email, no nothing like that. should should be, you know, the policy. and so hopefully that we'll be able to convey that to and not to the office. we're going to get to the bottom of that. yeah. and as far as the tablet i think we talked about that. i've used the tablet. it had to have been an outside breach. so i'm glad we talked about that. and hopefully we do we do change the vendor and get phone calls and texting available. like i said communication when you're inside in order to present a formidable defense for yourself, especially

if you're innocent, you need access to the outside world and all the resources that the outside world has, because there's nothing inside for you to help you defend yourself. yes, there's a law library. yes, there could be some interaction with your attorney, but there's nothing like accessing people who are going to, as we say, run for you. you know, and champion your cause. when you purchase something with your own money, that's your property. and i don't know any other part of the jail where personal property is just thrown away without documentation. yeah, i don't think that exists anywhere in the world. it shouldn't be. otherwise. it's called theft or misappropriation or something, right? embezzlement, something. there's a there's a legal term for taking somebody's property. right. so i think that should be a concern. and it should be a priority to separate food items that the jail gives you from the

food items that you just purchased from canteen. once you go into an isolated situation, it's not going to take you long to consume canteen items. first of all, you don't get to buy that much, and when you're in an isolated situation like that, you tend to consume more, to console yourself to, to you know, pass that time away. so hopefully, as you said, they will take a look into that. and the thing about visit and scheduling a visit is, which is so important that that, that, that is fixed is because it's difficult to schedule a visit, which is i mean, i don't know how many people are going to stay up till 1201 in the morning to jump online to try to get a visit slot. that in itself shows love and dedication from someone out there trying to see their loved one. but what is sad is when it comes to the visiting

days, all the slots are not filled up, the jail isn't busy with visitors coming in, seeing their loved ones, so that scheduling and then the end result of it being so busy that they have to say, oh, there's not enough room. that's what we want to hear. oh, we just don't have enough space or you know, you got to come back again. like, that should be the priority of the jail as well. one of the things that the ig spoke on was my interaction wit. the residents and what i, what we talked about afterwards when we debriefed was that there and the deputies were are the sheriffs were also very interested in was creating incarcerated coaches. yes. an incarcerated coach is someone who has been through what you've been through and can help you

manage your time, whether it's a week or two, a month, a year, whatever your time is, it is good to have somebody to sit down with you and not only talk to you just as a human being, to human beings, so you can get some things off your chest. but to give you a type of time plan, you know how to do your time and not let your time do you. and so they were very interested in that. and i would love to shop that around to some nonprofits that engage in jail services and maybe some new ones, you know, someone, some some organizations with some fresh ideas, united players come up to mind, some other ones come up to mind. that might be a conflict of interest. so we'll talk about that offline. but having that type of resource inside the jail and it and it may not come at any cost to the jail whatsoever. you know. but there is from some of the foundations that they receive money from, there is money to, to help in that situation. an incarcerated coach

would keep people calm, would keep most of the problems down. and the jail would run a lot more smoother. so it's a win win for the residents as well as the staff that supervises the jail. and i like the idea of the survey. i hope that is in conjunction with an app that allows them to directly set an appointment with the ig office, you know, so they can say what they have to say and say. and i would also like to see you and, and that's, that's that's about it, i think i think overall everything was good. i think my comments here today was just to emphasize what we should be asking the sheriff's office to, to move forward on the last but not least for the sheriff's department oversight board moving forward, along with the ig office, is to have the mayor and our designee come and speak to us because we're in the same

people's house as she is, right, or she's not going to be here. but he, the new elect mayor lori is going to be here. and why not come and talk to us? because this is a group effort. this is a this is a us thing, and there are a lot of first of all, we need a budget. and second, we need a parking permit for us at all times in the city. no, i'm just kidding. but that would help. so i mean, since we do volunteer, i almost got a ticket the other day going to the police station headquarters on third street, but we won't go there. but yeah, just talking to the mayor and getting on board with him and seeing what his program is, not only for the jails and the sheriff's office, but the oversight committee. i heard that he has concerns with the numerous oversight committe, but i really feel that this one is important. i've already seen the changes because of us. i've seen the level of the deputies taking this serious. and we all

know that if you are doing something and you know that you're being watched and an oversight overseeing, you're going to behave differently than if you have carte blanche behind closed doors and no cameras and no audio, just human nature. we already know we've seen studies you give normal people a badge, and then, on the other hand, you give normal people some stripes and say you're incarcerated and you're they immediately create the relationship of i'm better. i have the authority to do what i want over you, and you have to be submissive. so we want to just make sure that our sheriff's department, our sheriff's office and our deputies, which i think is doing a great job. i haven't heard too much complaint as i have in previous years, about their behavior and whatnot. so i think what we're doing is good here. i think it should be continued and hopefully that the mayor will come and hear why we should continue. thank you. member

palmer. next we have member mango. okay. hopefully i can make this quick, but i just wanted to reiterate the earlier sentiments of, you know, just thank you for your work. and i know that in day one, you made it very clear that you needed budget to be able to do the work. and so i appreciate it. okay. this my two questions for clarity. two questions for clarity. the assault is that when did that happen. that same day. that same day. so on november 19th okay. and then the second question i wanted to ask o programing, are they talking about external programing or are they talking about internal internal. so you have five keys. yeah that so they now do five keys. when we first started they were only doing five keys in one pod. they now do five keys in two pods. but there's not enough programing. yeah that seems like

an in-house problem. they need more programing. and so that's why we discussed with the jail coalition that we might have to lend a hand with finding some outside programing that can come in and come in-house and, and help. okay. i guess i don't understand how outside. i mean i'm i'm down for suggestions of external programing. i'll just give you one example. so the latino task force suggested that they add a hair braiding program to the women. that thing is taken off. i saw that in the news. yeah. and so there are different, you know, outside programs that we can, you know, find out what's happening. and that could be very, very uplifting to the inmates because. right now i get the

sense that they're bored and they want to they want a program, but there's not enough programs. yeah. okay. that's helpful to know. i guess my overarching critique and maybe something food for thought for just the board. the rest of the board and for future is i mean, the three big issues that i understand is shutdowns, which i still don't have clarity on how often that happens. number two, the lack of programing, which sounds like it, i just don't understand because it's like five keys is like they get funding for that. that's their problem to solve for. and then number three, obviously unsanitary conditions. and i just i think my overall feedback is like i, i know you mentioned that they are like, oh, it's because of covid, but every neighboring jurisdiction has been able to bounce back. so that's just not a valid excuse. all right. in my in my mind, i 100% agree with you from this

perspective, five keys is going strong in some of the surrounding counties. and i remember being in a meeting going, well, wait a minute, didn't san francisco start five keys? yeah, it's a it's a san francisco program and department program. it's so there really needs to be some focus on that. yeah. okay. and then maybe just for the board to consider because i know you're on your way out, but just something that i am thinking about is just like, how do we have, like, like i understand when we use vague terms like improvement, i need to understand. i think it's helpful to have benchmarks because then you can understand measured progress and the speed in which we're progressing. and that's why i want it, because i want to hold their feet to the fire. like, okay, fine, they want to do lockdowns whenever they want. okay. i need how often do you do it? yeah, i think the two biggest

suggestions i would make is we need to set up a apparatus for reporting out on when there's a shutdown, because right now we really don't have any idea how often the shutdowns are occurring. but we do know that when we go to the inmates, the very first thing out of their mouth was the shutdowns and how they feel like they're being penalized are punished for something they didn't do. so then it raises the question, well, how often does this happe? and we really don't currently have a system set up for letting us know when there's a shutdown. yeah. and i also think just, you know, like i understand their issue of being understaffed, but it doesn't help them, you know, with the lockdowns and having consequences, unintended consequences. like, you know, we also should know how often is

this happening. yeah. because you really can't resolve the problem if you don't know the extent of the problem. so i would say that that definitely is one of the things. and then i again, i think that we need to find out why. what are the roadblocks to improving the programing if you're getting funding for it. so i was going to say this also goes back to their it system. if we could have an interactive dashboard. so we know there's a shutdown. and i know that i signed up on that visitation program just to see how it works. and it really was like playing the lottery. but after the complaints about lack of notification or early notification on shutdowns, i know that they had improved because i started getting more notification on the shutdowns ahead of time, but that doesn't help if a family lives three hours away and they're on the

freeway trying to get here. and yeah, so did you have anything okay with that? well, let's turn to vice president richter. i think first and foremost, i mean, a lot has been said today. i think it's been a very fruitful conversation. and i definitely want to say, you know, thank you. ecg wiley. one thing that no one can take away is the fact that you were the first ecg here in san francisco. and i think it's safe to say amongst my colleagues that you were the best pick for the position. and so i think to what member amigo was, was sharing, i just really want to make sure that for me that as this board, we have the opportunity to continue the work regardless of who's in the position not to take away from from what you've done and what we've been able to start. but the conversation that i'm really enjoying the most is beginning to start to hear tangible results for some of the challenges that we are hearing. some are new that i think we can

really tackle. i think relatively quickly when we're talking about the hvac system, because not only do i think about the inmates, i think about our deputies as well, too. they're breathing the same air. and i think that's something that should be addressed, you know, as quickly as possible. i'm also really enjoying the conversation around the programing. as someone who works closely with five keys, you know, there are charter school really focused on folks getting their geds. but what i'm hearing is more programs from the outside and community based organizations that can develop a relationship with the sheriff's department to go in and provide services. i can share that in my work in the nonprofit sector. before i got to san francisco, i was working for an organization who had a great relationship with the parole department. and so when folks were being paroled, they had to come to a meeting at the parole office. and there was, you know, 50 to 60 individuals who were being paroled. and as a part of that, there was 25 community based organizations who had tables that they had to go. and you had

to talk to at least five in order to be released from that meeting. right? so there's some strategies and things i think that we can do to make sure that folks know that there are programs that are available especially for them to, you know, as i'm thinking about when they come out, giving them something, right. member palmer to look forward to for those those that are coming out. so i would love to be a part of that committee that's looking at the programing. so i think that's a great way to continue to keep things rolling. with the work that marshall and his team has done is to put together these committees to make sure that, again, whoever is in this role, they have that that access and kind of that, that backbone to come into. another real concern for me too, is around the access to sunlight, just as like a fundamental right as a human being. so something i know i definitely want to look into, and it's something that continues to come up. we've talked about the jail lockdowns, and i do think it would be great. i don't know if we have the ability or i don't know how

often or how quickly we find out. i'm just sharing. when i was on the police commission, you know, anytime there was an ois, an officer involved shooting or something that would go on. even us as commissioners would get like a text message or an email like, hey, this just happened. so then we're also not caught off guard going to community and they're sharing information about, you know, something that happened. so i don't know if it's i don't know if we call it a deputy involved situation or what we can do, but it'd be great to take a look at the technology around that. and then i think lastly, for me is also the conversation around the food security had an opportunity to go to an event just a couple of days ago. it was a phenomenal event and it was put on by the nba foundation, and they are receiving pitches from folks who are designing applications and have these technology companies to receive funding and there was a young lady who had created an app called produce cycle, and it's basically technology that connects small urban and rural farmers together in order to

provide great fresh produce and food to schools. and so i immediately thought about our work, and i was like, oh my gosh, like, how can we leverage technology even that? we have to be able to look at the services and be able to look at the food that we're providing inside of the jails to our folks, to make sure that it's wholesome and nutritious versus what we've been sharing as of lately. and then i think lastly, for me as well, too, is i was thinking about, you know, as we talk about the deputy chief, and i know it's been great working with, with with sheriff miyamoto and chief zhu, but also being able to look at being able to go in during shift changes. we used to do this at the police department when they were going through shift changes. as commissioners, we'd be able to go in and just be able to talk to the deputies to also see what the deputies are seeing and what they have going on, because i just look at it as one huge ecosystem and community, right?

they need what are some of the things that they need as well to, to, to ensure that programs are coming in and what are they seeing that also can help us as we are helping the folks that that are inside and we're addressing some of these complaints. so those are just some of my takeaways and some of the things that i was looking at, some of the things i know definitely would want to work on and be a part of. so just looking forward to continuing to move things forward. well, you know, i think what what will do is in our annual report next month, we will include a section on some targets that would be good for the board to consider that we think would have a direct impact on the sheriff's department and the management of the jail, that if we're able to meet these particular or improve these particular areas. and i mean, programing is like staring

you right in the face and i have my opinions that i don't know if they're appropriate to state in this venue, but that i think you do need to communicate to this board in my opinion, what would would i think would improve programing? and i'll do that. so i just have to say, i appreciate so much your dedication and commitment and also earning the trust of the community. i think that was first and foremost when we were interviewing for an inspector general, that there would be no credibility if we didn't earn the trust of the community. so thank you for your commitment and your work. and i expect, you know, we're going to cross paths again and collaborations and, you know, our reports. one thing i also noticed is we had a lot of loss of ngos and collaborative organizations that used to work with the san francisco jail. and i don't know if it's because the

people who work for these organizations don't live in the city anymore. so, for instance, when member palmer and i were in the kitchen, i remember yolanda robinson. she handles interfaith services. so when we're talking about specialized meals, especially when the holidays, she said, i used to be able to have a rabbi come and from the city, and it's like, well, we have a large jewish congregations here. we have. and so she had to go to the east bay to have someone come. and so that was astounding to me. and i want to know why there is a loss of the supportive services and organizations that we have, the ngos, the other thing that is really crucial is about the scheduling with those incarcerated, their meal time, their activities. and i know there's complaints about attorney visits, which are crucial, but sometimes because of the staffing shortage, the deputies would say, you have to wait because this is the meal service time and we have to

supervise that and we can't break away and have the attorney visits. and so that becomes a complication. so i'd like to research that more and see if there are posted schedules. and that way they can work more closely with the attorneys and also prisoner legal services. again, like the visits, it's really like playing the lottery. if you've ever gone online to try to do it and agreed that the shutdown notifications need to be improved, but they actually were improved. one thing that was very notable to me was, and i don't know, member palmer, if you remember, one of the member, the incarcerated, he said, i think that there should be some counseling and it should be male centered. and so how often do we hear about really? it's stereotypical that men don't want to reach out and have counseling. so i really echo the urgency of member palmer talking about incarcerated coaches and counseling in there. and that's

also why i really wanted to have the service dog program. if you've seen some of that really successful programs, a lot of those incarcerated have never felt any kind of touch from a human or an animal for years and years. and they've been incarcerated. so really, it's that sense of warmth. and it can be your four legged, furry friend. and it also teaches them, you know, responsibility. and as my belief is that we are looking for all these services, supportive services pre reentry. so that means programs education. we and we can't just say five keys. we should say okay if you don't have your ged we want you to get your ged. we want you to be able to get certificates for job training so that when you go out. and then we also make sure that the city provides supportive services for post reentry, because in this, a really difficult economic environment, even if you had all the benefits of the world, it's hard to survive. let alone when

you're still tagged with you were formerly incarcerated, so not only with the clean slate program, but all the possible supportive programs that we can have. and i agree that we need to have the a mayor or the mayo, preferably the mayor, but or designee come speak to zdob because as everyone and i've been out there, i mean, you know, some of the supervisors don't necessarily run from me, but when they see me, they know i'm asking for a budget and money. so i think that that's kind of a good thing. it just shows that i've been really dogged about it because some of them kind of run and hide and pretend they're in another conversation. so and i just have to say, i really appreciate all the collaborative approach, you know, with the fellow members. i think we've advanced so far in the last two years. i mean, just think about when we were trying to establish everything and we had the ability to create a framework. we've done our annual benchmark and tasks. we will do that again. and hopefully, you

know, shore up things. it's still a grand experiment, but i think we've come this far. we all bring different skill set and different value. one thing i also wanted to really highlight again, that member brewster, really vice president brychta really brought up is really the working conditions of the deputies. so when i had to park far away this time and i noticed the trailers in the parking lot, i think the public needs to know that's where the deputies sleep at night. some deputies have really long shifts. it's too dangerous for them to drive back home, so they end up sleeping on the premises. so this is as it gets cold. and, you know, i also think about those who are unhoused. but is that really a proper working condition for our deputies to be sleeping in trailers in our parking lots? i, i was about two weeks ago coming in to city hall and going

through the metal detector, and i looked down at the deputy and i said, oh, how's it going? and she said, i'm in the middle of my second shift. and i go, so you're working 16 hours? she said, yes, i'm working 16 hours. oh my god. so and they don't have a choice. so i mean, they i think deputy nguyen could especially talk about this, but sometimes they just try to dress as soon as possible and get out of the locker room. otherwise they get involuntarily recruited for another shift. wow. that's interesting. yeah. you know. yeah, that's definitely true. most deputies are getting 3 to 4 hours of sleep per night and, well, it's based out of a seven day work week. two of those days, they get drafted for 16 hours. and some deputies live far away. so by the time they get home, they shower. they eat a little bit. if any, and then

they go to sleep for 3 or 4 hours and they have to get up really early in the morning to beat the traffic, get back to work. so it was true with the trailers, it's definitely a big help. and they they could get more sleep that way without beating the traffic. they just go straight to the trailer. they can shower at the jail. there's a showering facility and they could go straight to the trailer and get a couple more hours of sleep. so it's a lot better currently. currently i am working at cj three, but i'm detailed to recruitment, so we're trying to get staffing up as much as possible. and from my personal experience, sheriff command staff are doing everything possible to get us out there and the recruitment booths to hire as much deputies as possible, and it's very busy. we'll go to community engagement events, recruitment events, we'll engage with them, and we have a full time recruitment civilian officer that's hired

specifically to recruit, and we'll engage with them, get their contact information, do follow ups. i give out my personal cell phone numbers. i'm talking to two potential candidates right now. whatever they need to get on board, i'm communicating with them and we get a good turnout. like we'll have you know, 160, you know, come, 58 will come, you know, to do the physical agility oral board written tests. and we're running around trying to fulfill the oral board interviews, administering the physical agility test, and trying to trying to get them on board. right. so that's picking up really well. and we're getting a good turnout and hopefully the staffing will increase. so that the deputies won't get drafted as much like those mandatory two days out of the seven. right. i

just want to address a inspector general. wiley, you know, i wish you the best. i saw your letter and you did great work, and i just want to wish you the best on your your new endeavors. thank you. regarding the sunlight, you know, i'm not i'm not surprised when you gave your presentation regarding sheriff command staff being open to constructive criticism because from my personal experience, when the jail runs more efficiently, the deputies do less work. the inmates are happy. everybody's happy. right? so i'm not surprised when you said, you know, sheriff command staff was welcoming constructive criticism. so with that said, staffing shortages causes a safety issue, right? not just for the deputies but for the inmates. so, for example, if

there is a big fight in one pod and there's not enough deputies to respond to that, someone could get killed. and we have bigger issue than just the lockdown. so the lockdowns come in place. yeah, they're locked down for 24 hours, but someone's not going to get killed potentially. and that could happen when we're so severely understaffed. you know, safety for the inmates and the deputies is the main concern. so regarding the commissary, from my personal experience at work in kh3, we give them their commissary back after they're done with lockup. i think the issue comes into play is where when they go to lockup, and this is from my personal experience, they're asking for their commissary back when they're in lockup. no, they're being disciplined for something they did that was wrong. right. you're not going to get your commissary back. it's almost like rewarding a negative behavior. so i think there's a little bit misconception, misconception there. as soon as they're done with their lockup, they get their commissary back.

okay. right. programs regarding the programs, the manager of the program should be administering that. you know, the deputies have their issues dealing with the jails. they're very overworked, understaffed. the whatever program it is, when they when they complete their program, the program manager should have a checkbox right? okay. you completed it. here's your certificate. here's proof that you completed it. and boom, that's take care of that right. for the dogs, for the inmates. that's a great idea. like i would love a dog for the inmates, but for the deputies too, because that's going to make us happier. i got a cocker spaniel brightens my day. had her for like two years. love her to death. and i think the deputies would like to, you know, pet the dog. and you know, when they're feeling down from being drafted to play with the dog a little bit, you know, obviously they're going to do their stress reliever. exactly. yeah. when they get a break they could you know and that's that's

a great idea hvac system clean up. yeah i agree 100%. we're breathing that air too. we want clean air. so lastly yeah thank you all for everything you're doing. great idea about the parking pass. i'm on board with it. you know. yeah that's all i got. thank you. yeah. we thought you got to park in the back with all the sheriff deputies. yes. no. vice president. yeah. just really quick if i can. i mean, i think thank you for that, deputy nguyen, because i think that just speaks to the ecosystem. right. in terms of what we're talking about. we have an opportunity to really do something to really change, you know, the jails jail system across the state of california, right, starting here. so just really looking at that ecosystem. so i appreciate that there's just two things that i, that i missed out on. one, really love the conversation around the coaches. i think about us as an organization involved in education. we have educational coaches that are inside the schools that are dealing with the kids that are truant, the kids that they want to send to the principal's office like, no, you can send them here and we can have a much different conversation because

our individuals have been there and understand what these young people are going through. sometimes they just need to eat. and so i think having coaches to assist the deputies as well to when there's things that are transpiring and be like, hey, these individuals can, can maintain and kind of take this on with your assistance. i think that's great. and then was there a timeline on the tablets like in terms of when they would get them back? that was one of the things i was thinking of. i think they have the tablets bac, but the, the, the, the key thing was that the contract is coming up, okay. to go with a different company. gotcha. okay. and that's what i think they should do. okay. i would because there are a lot of i didn't get a sense that anyone was really happy with nucleus as the tablet provider. okay. and that but we can follow up with that. okay. yeah. because i was just and that's good to know because i was also just thinking and concerned about the technology. like how is somebody able to hack into these, these tablets that we have that are supposed

to be secure inside the inside of the jail? so that was very concerning, because i know for us, as a community based organization, like we have to like cyber security is something we have to have in order to even be provided a contract. so that was that was it. that was it on my end. and i would just follow up on that when williams suggested, you know, providing a coach to the inmates in terms of managing their time, i think there was universal and that came from the sheriff's office. everybody was in agreement with that and thought it was a great idea. yeah, yeah, it's like with the police department doe terms of, you know, being out when they're walking the beat with somebody from d.p.h is there, and you have different individuals that can actually help, you know, de-escalate and do some, some things and have a different area of expertise. right. i'm thinking of u.p. urban alchemy. right. who we see outside. yeah, which is a program for folks who are former lifers. right. they have a different conversation with folks who are on the street. so absolutely, i was going to i was

i'm sorry before you, i know you're going to get into that. i wanted to say that reimagining jail. also, i would like to say that we can reimagine what punishment looks like when you do something inside of jail, right? the isolation part of it is to make sure that you get time to reflect on what you did, as well as keep everybody else safe, but the isolation itself or not having properties should not be the punishment. the punishment should be being able to correct your behavior. and as children, young adults and even as adults, sometimes we need people to talk to say, what did i do wrong? and how can i correct my behavior? so when we're taking food away from somebody, which should not be a punishment, food should not be weaponized. just in my opinion, as someone who's formerly incarcerated and someone who deals with people in correcting their cognitive behavior, right?

food and necessity, air, water, clothing, housing like these things should not be used or weaponized against anyone. so hopefully we can still have a conversation around what should be taken away from somebody when they're in isolation in order for them to correct their behavior and their thinking. yeah, i agree 100%. food and you know, the title 15 stuff that still continues. like they get food, water, clothing, you know, they're not denied their title. 15 they still get fed. right. it's just that they're not going to get the commissary at the time. right. you know, like top ramen that they ordered. they're not going to get that. they're not going to get their their goodies right. it's like almost like icing on the cake. they're not going to get that until they're off of lockup. so i actually had an inmate worker that was solid right? he was a solid inmate worker. really good. but when i looked back at his charges, i was surprised i was even him. so i actually

talked to him. i was like, how did you change from this to tha? right. and he told me the story. he was like, i was wild back then. i kept, you know, getting in trouble. i was acting out, i was rebellion, i was rebellious against deputies. i would get in fights with deputies all the time. but it wasn't until i got put in the safety cell going to lock up, having time to reflect that, i finally reformed myself and i was like, hey, you. i couldn't, i couldn't even tell them. i couldn't even tell the difference between him from his charges to, you know, someone out in the street like being a normal citizen, productive citizen. right. so i told him, good job and everything, but that was because of the system that was in place. again, we don't take away their, their, their meals. they get their meals, they get clothing, they get bedding, you know, they get everything that that is entitled to them. title 15 but if they're on lock up, they're not going to

get commissary and they're not going to get, you know, certain free time. right until, until until they fulfill their. punishment, so to speak. so i was going to say what was really heartbreaking is i met one gentleman, he had just turned 18. so he was in the pod. so he came from the juvenile justice center and he was one of the people who said, i'm not getting my braces tightened when they're supposed to. so i mean, that's how young he is. and so i also think it takes someone from the outside who will be caring. and i said, you know what? you know, you know what you need to do. this was a lower level thing. you can change. make sure you take advantage of the education programs moving forward because that's just too much of a life to waste when you're only 18 years old and you have the rest of your life to look forward to. so i just want people to know that, i mean, if they're able to

volunteer and go in, i know my uncle used to volunteer and my uncle's like a world war two veteran. so he's like a young 97 year old now. but he used to volunteer at san quentin to play chess with those incarcerated. it's just, you know, some kind of outside source. one thing i, i'd like the members to take on an issue, but i will not be forming committees because that would require that i have to do notice or dan has to do notice. so jan, jana, correct me if i'm wrong, but so down the road, if you have an issue that you'd like to take on, just email dan and i will say go for it and then i will ask for a report and particular timelines that we think that we meet and i'm happy to be supportive of it. and we and if there are issues that the board needs to vote on, we can bring it up. then. but that's why i'm hesitant to form committees, because then we have to notice everything. i wanted to just recognize that chief chu is here, and i want to congratulate a new graduating class from santa rosa. and that's why chief chu is a little

bit late today. he was there to graduation with sheriff miyamoto. one thing that i'm really heartened about is the junior deputy program. i'm so proud of those kids, and that's another area where they they show such great maturity and leadership and those i think hopefully are our, you know, future deputies. but, you know, it's really disconcerting to have this involuntary recruitment because that's no way for a family life. and especially i know member karen's been active and i was also on the commission on the status of women trying to reach 30 by 30. and dads play a great role. but you know what? when a kid is sick or needs something, they always ask for mom. and so it's harder to get women into our law enforcement when we don't have more stabilized scheduling. so but thank you for your much needed input, deputy. i mean, that's why you're here, to bring in that perspective. you're welcome. thank. so with that,

dan, can we call. and just to let you know, assemblymember jones-sawyer had just called. and so i don't know if he's logged on. he said he was actually in his car logging. can you resend him the link maybe on the on the text. but we'll take public comment in the meantime. at this time, members of the public wishing to provide comments regarding line item five, inspector general report are invited to approach the podium when it becomes availabl. this was a lot to absorb, but okay, so i think you could go back to self-control. you see, because not everybody has the same tolerance for isolation. for example, when it breaks anger, it's not the same as when you want to reflect self-control. so i think it it's linked. you don't adapt, you don't apply the same thing for everybody. you need psychology depending on the case. i mean, it makes it more difficult. but look at the four words i heard, the three words i heard the most is programs, tablets and covid.

so program. so make sure the program who makes the program? what's the goal? that's it. because program. what is this program? yes. like robots. so tablets. be careful technology. it shouldn't prevent the guys to learn how to write again. you see rights read not on a tablet you can use it for. of course you know it's there. last thing. covid. okay. sorry, guys. it's going to be something as you might have understood in the especially in the recent years, especially since the pandemic of an intelligence called covid, many things are reversed. so let me explain to you quickly. it's going to be a scoop. i said it to the board of supervisors and the police department already. so we don't need the public here to watch too much. it's okay. covid means certificate of

vaccination id from the very beginning in reverse. it reads devoxx, which in the language called hebrew means demon. you can verify it. so that's it. it gives you another perspective. and to anticipate what is probably going to come again at us from unfortunate unintelligence over there. sorr. thank you. member jones sawyer. okay. just go on to the next agenda item and then. okay. calling line item six evaluation of amendment to sd of rules of order discussion and possible action item review. the updated zdob rules of order, specifically rule 1.14 a and

rule and rule 1.14 b, which were approved on may third, 2024 with an agreement to reassess in six months. so members, we had the forms requesting information, and i wanted to thank member nguyen for suggesting a form. and it does give us a paper trail and so i'm kind of agnostic as to if we take action or not. we continue it, but it's been, i think, a more orderly fashion of asking for information. and i just want to, you know, ask members not to do public records, act when we can just make simple requests. but this is this was a vehicle to just keep things a little bit more orderly when we were requesting information. and just to let you know, the requests that were made on the settlements, all that that's come through and we will be discussing it in the new year.

so do i have any kind of discussion on this matter? thank you for that acknowledgment regarding the forms and, you know, it's nothing new. actually. it's a standard form. anybody who requests documents have to fill out a form you could go into, you know, sfpd foia requests, any type of document reports, anything that you request, you're going to have to fill out a form first, last name. right. so it's nothing new, really. i just just thought of that idea based on other organizations that already had it. but thank you for that. i think it keeps us accountable to make sure that we're processing the request for information as well. i had a question about this. what are we defining as like a presiding officer? because i'm assuming i'm assuming that that means whoever is running the meeting.

yeah, we initially we had had we thought we would coordinate president, vice president and then it was just better to just have the president. so maybe we need to fix that language if we continue this. right. it's just not used any. well, it is actually in rule 2.5 i see it okay. no, it's fine. i move to approve this. okay. oh. do we have the form here? i guess we don't. do we have the form? i guess we don't have the form here. that's okay. i don't i don't it depends. i'm. i will move to approve this. i don't see why we need to continue it further. i don't have an issue with the language as long as it was. you know, my concern was presiding officer. but i see that it is being used. we want

to review. you know, how things worked out after six months. so it wasn't meant to be permanent. but we can make it permanent moving forward. i just want one second just to read this through this. i think my only thing because i know the last time we talked about this, i was like having an issue about like the 21 calendar days proceeding before the meeting. and if we find it necessary, if we can kind of truncate it a little bit, i think at least for me, i just yeah, there's flexibility. okay. yeah. it's just that if we are making a request from the sheriff's office, we try to do it three weeks in advance so

that they can get the information for us. totally. i totally understand that piece. except as provided the board. so, commissioner, do you would you have a recommendation of just doing it less or is it more so that less okay. and then the other change, i just want to just make sure i understand is this is not different from the last time we talked about this, right. no. okay. same language. the president shall prepare the agenda because previous to this role, it was the president and the vice president would prepare the agenda. yeah, we still i mean, we still confer in general anyway. it's always been a collaborative effort. effort. yeah. yeah. i mean, it wasn't for the first year, let's say that. yeah. that's why we had to learn how to manage that as the vp for both presidents. but

that's a non-issue anymore. so we don't have that drama anymor. right? right. and i guess my the reason why i'm bringing it up is do we actually need to make a policy out of it. oh, interesting. well, i mean, the issue is even with the form, it could potentially be viewed as a committee. so i just didn't want to enter into that possible brownout violation. if the president and vice president were acting as a committee. so that was a recommendation that i just have the president. but i think that i hopefully have been collaborative enough to just take in whatever people. it's totally not. it's totally not a reflection on this board, but even just for future. yeah, yea, yeah, it's creating a good. yeah. you know, and i like to have evergreen policies where it's not based on people, but based on best practices. yeah. what would you think about ten calendar days preceding a regular board meeting? ten. and you know, before i just want to comment, like, you know, we all agree that there's a staffing

shortage in the sheriff's office, and that's no different than the personnel office. so the longer i mean the standard would be like 25 to 30 days, right? i think that's a fair, reasonable amount of time. so when somebody does a records request, personnel can go get it. sometimes, you know, they only have one person working in there. so they need time to find and they're not just getting one request from us. they're getting multiple requests. right. so i think i maybe i misunderstood because i didn't realize this rule was written on behalf of the requesting from the sheriff's department. i thought it was just in general to set the agenda. no, no, it's not just even setting the agenda. so if let's say you wanted a report, right? and you'd say, i want this report, and whether it be from the sheriff's office or another office that works with the sheriff's office, i still need to coordinate it. and so even if we shorten the deadline, it's unlikely that i would get the information to even place on the agenda, because the person providing the information wouldn't be available. yeah, i'm under the same impression as

commissioner mango because it's literally in the section of meeting agenda. and there is no in the subdivision b, there is no timetable, right, that's established. so it seems that the focus point is only the 21 days for an agenda item, and there is no mention of any records. records like deadline in. yeah. in 1.14 b so if that's the intent, i think then we should also include the they need to, you know, the same language that all items need to be submitted or the request for material, you know. yeah. i mean the form we don't have the form here, but then the form also it's not necessarily immediate, it's just that it's not a public records request. so then we can be a little bit more relaxed on the deadline. yes i understand. okay. well we're still it's back

under now and i may i'll withdraw it. yeah i'll withdraw my motion as we you know, thank you so much for your points. and then just and just to they're very helpful just to check to see if assembly member jones sawyer is on and if he is, maybe there'll be a motion to continue this item while we i'll motion to continue it so we can give it a little bit more thought. second, that okay, any objectio. okay. and then plus we would need to have pretty much a unanimous vote because it's still by the number of seats and not by and member palmer is no longer with in the meeting. is he on. oh let me call you back. oh okay. let's take public comment. i'm sorry. oh no. oh no. we take public comment for public comment. sorry. nope. you're spot on. at this time, members of the public wishing to provide comments regarding line item six evaluation of amendment to be rules of order, are

invited to approach the podium when it becomes available. there is no public comment. should i call the roll on the motion? member mango i have mango is i vice president brooker i is i member carry on i carry on is i member win i win is i member palmer. is yeah i had to leave okay president suh i there are five ayes. the motion passes and this line item will be continued for future consideration. yeah. that's a settlement. yeah. did you do to his email and. i'll take a break. do you wanna take a five minute break? i'll take a

five minute break. oh. okay. recalling line item for presentation from reginald. do we take public comment on that last item? we did. i don't know. i can't remember. i thought we did. oh, we did. okay. okay. all right. recalling line item for presentation from reginald byron jones-sawyer, senior informational item. assembly member reginald byron jones, senior, sawyer senior, representing the 57th california assembly district, will discuss his efforts as an assembly member as well as his individual contributions to criminal justice reform and potential state funding for civilian oversight of law enforcement. mr. jones-sawyer, can you hear us? oh, yeah, i definitely hear

you coming in loud and clear. thank you, reggie, for joining us. and i wish we could see your face, but i just want to put out there to the public. you've been a great mentor to me on the california democratic party platform committee. that's when we first came up with civil justice reform. as well as criminal justice reform. and you've always been out there. so as a great mentor and you're still doing the work. that's why i thought it was important for you to be here. and we have our inspector general. unfortunately, because of lack of funding, he's tendered his resignation. but you will help us. i'm confident of making sure that the work that we're moving forward can be a model for the rest of the state, if not the nation. okay, great. and it is ironic that because i never really thought about how much interaction i had with inspector general or even civilian oversight or or most important,

when you have consent decrees, which is another form of federal oversight which you never want to have. and as a as a member of the city of los angeles, director of real estate, i worked with lapd as they had to work through all the consent decrees that they went through, even though they they had a police commission, which is an oversight, they still had a federal oversight mandate on them that lasted for years. in addition. and so i worked for the city for about 25 years, and i remember the struggles they had during that time. and then when i worked for the state of california, i just now just turned out this past monday, and i've been on public safety all 12 years, chair of public safety for seven of those years. and during that time, we were under

a consent decree, and we also were struggling in the state level, struggling with an inspector general and how to have an inspector general in the cspoa most important, our correctional institutions, making sure that we were doing the right things because they were under a consent decree or for almost all the time that i was there. and i even remember jerry brown was unbelievably frustrated with not only the inspector general at that time, but just the whole process of consent decree. so what i usually tell people when you talk about inspector generals, i always say that it's almost it's almost like a check and balance and for you as, as elected officials and for the public, it's someone that has a everyday

window into what's going on. so that they can give you some ideas, suggestions so that you can you can make corrections within law enforcement. if you're doing this to be a i gotcha and to punish law enforcement for doing what they're they're doing wrong. that is the wrong attitude to go in with. this is really about trying to prevent them from doing things that are wrong. and one of the things i tell people is that's why i was unbelievably in favor of instituting cameras in on, on law enforcement officers and in cars, because i looked at that as a window for a law enforcement officer, their supervisors and the public to actually see the interaction and see what's going on, and so that they could make corrections before things turned either lethal or violent or turn into a

lawsuit. and the reason i came up with that is i was watching some videos of some enforcement officers talking to minorities, and i noticed that they would have their hand on the gun. and when we showed it to those same officers that they had their hand on the gun and how intimidating that was and how that could cause where someone would run or someone would become more aggressive or how things would get out of control. they were able to monitor and change their habits so that we wouldn't have those those terrible interactions that we were having. and when it comes to funding an inspector general, which has been even at the state level, we and i was on budget budgets of five which funds the

corrections institutions and the inspector general. i tried to get more money for them to be able to do their job. you know, it's like a two for one. you want them to do their job, and two, you want them to have some kind of authority to be able to make corrections, but not in a in a way where they, they, they're doing the job of law enforcement, but be able to both of them work together to make those corrections. why? one, if you're talking about funding, take a look at and i don't know what your what your what your lawsuit rate when it comes to the amount of money you put out for officer-involved, adverse interactions. i know the city of los angeles and the state of california. it is quite a large

number. it more than covers the salaries of the inspector general and all of their staff that they have. and if they if the inspector general could help reduce that or eliminate that, that cost. i look at that as a cost savings or cost avoidance because at the end of the day, you're not going to get a lot of funding from the state or the federal government. in fact, it will be the opposite. and the example i give is when we were cdcr, the california corrections rehabilitation, when they were under a consent decree. during that time, when we did not have money in the budget. i know it's been a long time since we had a budget deficit, but if you remember those hard times when we had 30 and $60 billion budget deficits, the over the guy that

was over the consent decree still required the state of california to put in hundreds of millions of dollars to make corrections that we didn't have the money to do it. and it ended where we were taking money from other places to be able to, to cover that. and so from my perspective, if we had just just gone ahead and made those corrections on our own at their own speed, but just made sure we did those corrections or avoided a lot of the things that were going on, we could have saved taxpayers so much money. and i always tell people at the end of the day, what you're trying to do is stop the lawsuits. one, two, you want to ensure that you

never and i and i, i implore you to never wear it, make it get to the point where you have a federal government come in and force you to make the changes that you need so that citizens in your community can feel safer if you think that is onerous, you you have no idea what what it could be like to have that kind of requirement. put upon you. and so when i when i talk to people, one, when you look at an inspector general, please do not look at this as a way to slap people on their hand. but if you could figure out a way that this could be an a collaborative effort so that your department can be the

shining example of what law enforcement should be in this country with the help of your inspector general. that would be great, because a lot of times, and it's unfortunate you have senior members of law enforcement that get ingrained in what they're used to doing, and they don't realize that society has changed. morality has changed. people have changed. and even just talking to people and saying certain things to people, you know, as as julie sue and i will tell you, you can't even just say, yes, sir, yes, ma'am, because you got transgendered. i mean, things are so different now. and it's not just woke, it's just what people want to be called or people want to be treated a certain way. and you've got to get up to date to what that is and not become entrenched in

what you grew up with. but what is what is going on now to be able to be able to law enforcement, to be able to deal with today's problems now, which are much more complex and, and difficult than it was before tech. i, i, i remember people who lived on the street. we would we had really horrible names for them. we just kind of ignored them. they weren't that many of them. but look at it now. there are homeless people everywhere and law enforcement now, how do they deal with that? in the old days, i'm an old guy. i'm 67 years old. i remember if someone was mentally had some mental problems, there was a there was a wagon that would just pick them up and cart them away to camarillo or some way out of sight, out of mind. well, you can't do that anymore. and

in fact, it's almost illegal now to just do some of the things we used to do back in the day. and, and we can't criminalize people who are mentally, mentally have mental challenges or people who are just poor and, and their, their way of life is, is where they have to live on the street and they have to live from day to day, mouth to mouth to mouth. and so law enforcement has to deal with that. now. and until we can create our own cadre of people to deal with them, we're going to have to figure that ou. and an inspector general would be great at being that buffer to be able to get them, to be able to deal with just an arm, just using one instance of something called homelessness. how to deal with that? an inspector general can can make sure that if an officer is using a technique

that they were taught in, that they were taught in the academy, that may not work out on the street right now, that you can make adjustments immediately and not have an unfortunate incident where someone may lose their life or it gets videotaped and it has this horrible, horrible, egregious assault from a law enforcement officer have that look that this looks crazy on a on when you when you look at the film, which again, we didn't have back in the day. so i will just leave it at that. i know there's limited to no state funding. i wish i wish we had had this conversation when i was in the assembly, when i was on budget, because this is a great idea. i never thought about

trying to find funding for local jurisdictions so that they could create their own inspector general. i think it would be a great idea, and in fact, i may steal that idea now that i thought of it just now. but to be able to come up with funding so that communities like yours who are actively wanting to pursue this, the state should provide some type of matching funds or funding to, to make this happen. and i know there are people in the assembly now that if i bring this idea to them, they may take it on as one of their one of the things that they want to do. that would be so with that, i will reply and open up for. yeah, the question i was going to say a little too long that would be great, reggie, if you could be our

champion. we are so pleased with our inspector general that we've been honored to have for almost a year now. and i think we've accomplished more in, you know, the 11 months than someone would take in three years. i mean, we now even have a real time dashboard on where people are incarcerated and our population. we've done the in jail visits. we've addressed issues with those incarcerated, the conditions we have a great rapport with our sheriff, sheriff miyamoto. deputy mike nguyen is on our board right now. so he tells us about the working conditions because as i see it, oversight is you know, it involves the incarcerated and their families, but also the working conditions of the deputy. it's a whole spectrum. and if everyone's happy, we feel happy. but i'm going to open up to my fellow members and we have inspector general wiley sitting with us. but we'll have him talk and then our vice president,

d.o.j. brewster, he he previously sat on the police commission. so he brings a wealth of information for us on our sheriff's oversight board. so with that, i'm going to have inspector general wiley address you, terry wiley, all right. how are you doing, mr. jones-sawyer? hi. how are you doing? all right. well, you know, for me, this has been an unbelievable opportunity to conduct oversight and but, you know, to also do it over an agency that has strong leadership because the one thing about oversight that i was looking for from day one was what kind of transparency was i going to find? was i going to receive resistance, if any? and what i, what i was pleasantly surprised to find was a

department in the in the form of sheriff paul miyamoto, was someone who was really open to and welcomed oversight of the agency. and it makes a huge difference in terms of your ability to try to bring positive change to an agency, to life of inmates and also if they're, you know, operating outside in the community, you know, being able to monitor and monitor those activities. so for me in san francisco, it's been an absolute pleasure to be the inspector general here. and although i'm i'm leaving it, it is bittersweet. trust me. so but

you know, what is the budget like? oh, it's terrible zero. so you know how much. yeah. and how much more do you need as an example. well i mean i, i think that to really get the agency up and running and to have all of the pieces that you need in place, you, you definitely would need at a minimum of 5 million. and so we need ten. yeah. i mean, you know, 5 million is, is really just to get the agency in the state of california. pardon me. what was the question? i said $5 million of budget dust in the state of california. oh, we have budget dust. yeah. oh, i agree. absolutely. and, you know, we were so absolutely nothing. yeah. we were so fortunate, reggie, in that we

had the help of the department of police accountability. that's very well established right now. we are sharing the chief attorney and a couple of investigators. but that's really not sustainable because you know, the department of police accountability has won awards for their efficiency and not missing statutory deadlines. so we don't want them to start missing statutory deadlines to try to cover what we do. and it's under an mou that they actually look at the more serious issues with with sheriff when there are particular complaints. so and the voice that you heard was our former vice president member, shoji carreon, who was a former prosecutor. so when she said, you know, we need 10 million, that would be ideal. but, you know, even with the budget, we were asking for just 2.5 million just to even have an assistant, because our inspector general didn't even have an assistant to calendar things. and we're borrowing resources. so that's been a really tough haul for us.

so, inspector general, did you have anything else? no. anything you can do to assist us with getting 5 million to start would be fantastic. and we will. we also have now d.o.j. brewster, our vice president, and he was formerly with the police commission and works deeply in the community on programs for those in reentry, but also more importantly, to prevent our at risk youth from entering the criminal justice system to begin with. member jones-sawyer, how are you? i'm fine, thank you. and i want to say, first and foremost, thank you for your work. i have been a fan of your work and have been able to follow what you've been doing in los angeles. i have some friends that are along the dim circuit, and former state senator isadore hall and senator steven bradford and member mike gibson. so i spend quite a bit of time in los

angeles and have heard of and been around and been able to see your work. so i want to say thank you for what you have done and kind of continue to do. it was great to hear about the budget dust. i think that is something we should coin and maybe even look into having some conversations with our excuse me, our assembly members here. i think being able to have a conversation with member haney and member stephanie, i think would be great for us as we also have a new mayor elect as well, too, as a member, palmer was sharing to have the discussion with with the new mayor that's put in place to talk about how important this oversight board is, as well as the position of inspector general. i was also happy to hear, you know, member jones sawyer, you shared what i think we've been really talking about today as a group, especially when we had our ig's report was around, you know, collaboration and just the complexity of the role of the ig and how much good it can do. and as an entire ecosystem. right. not coming in. and i think

formerly being on the police commission, not coming in and, and slapping hands and thinking about discipline as much as it is, like, how can we work together to make the entire system better for everybody that's involved from our deputies to those who are housed and also looking at, you know, how things look for them when they come out. so i just really appreciate hearing the reiteration of how we're thinking and how we are operating as a body of this oversight board now moving forward, that those are the conversations that we're having. so i just want to say thank you for your time. and again, just just a fan of your work and what you've been able to do. so hope we can continue to tap into to you and to the to the resources and connections that you have. as we continue on this journey. so without a doubt and i'm i'm always willing to help communities that want to shape. i mean, we have to reshape the way the inspector general even is perceived right now. it's

perceived as a disciplinary tool and we've we've got to change that image. and the only way we can do that is having an example of an inspector general that is not. and you heard what happened with our sheriff's inspector general. he was the last one that just left. but not not the one before that would not work with the inspector general at all. and it created and we spent more money and time and resources watching them fight each other. and it never really helped that los angeles county sheriff's department and their morale went down. their their incidence of officers calling out sick went up. and the ability to have good law enforcement in the community went way down. and that's because it was like a i like to always call it it's like two divorced parents or two parents who are about to divorce, fighting all the time. they love

their children. they all want the best for them. i mean, both sides love the community, want to do the best for them, but they fought so much that it just you. and if you've never been the i'm. i'm a product of a divorced parents, so i know how devastating that can be. and watching that happen. and so that's what happens in our community when both aren't working well together. no, absolutely. and i concur. and i can share i think i'm a millennial, but i definitely know that my niece, who is ten years old, gets disciplined far different than i did when i was growing up. and so, you know, just even looking at that very basis, right, i think is something that we have to take into consideration the generations have changed, technology is changing, and evolving. so we need to make sure that we do so with it. when it comes to, you know, our laws and, and things that that we put into place right for folks.

right? right. definitely. i'm glad to hear it that this is, this is really encouraging for especially in your area. i mean, that's that's why people come to california to, to do new things and to step out beyond what their comfort level is. this is great. and i just need you to know that we have great representation on our board. coming from the community. we also invite people from our reentry programs, people who have, you know, lived the life and know what's going on and to make recommendations. i'm sorry that member palmer william palmer, had to leave early, but he comes with the experience of having been incarcerated for over 30 years and he was incarcerated. he was incarcerated in los angeles, really in his late teens. and so he's come out. he's been very inspirational. he's a writer and artist, and he's tried to make life better for people coming out. we you know, in our most recent jail visit with the

inspector general, this is something that maybe in the past, we hadn't heard of. but, you know, those incarcerated we were in the men's pod and they talked about wanting counseling, you know, male centered counseling. so where would you have heard that even five years ago? right, right. so, you know, and member palmer actually talked about having incarceration coaches in there just to talk about life in there and what you can do while you're on the inside to make yourself a better person. so when you get to the outside, but, you know, a lot of this, i don't think people understand that we need a lot of support services pre reentry and post reentry because we live in a very expensive state. even if you grew up with, you know, all the possible amenities, it's still tough to make a living and let alone if you've got that label of being a formerly incarcerated person. oh definitely. i, i, i went to norway where they have they,

they have a rule that no matter what you do, you're going to get out in 25, 26 years. and so they're there to rehabilitate everyone. i mean everyone for every crime. i think there may be 1 or 2 people that did some really horrendous things that probably will not get out because they just they probably won't get out, but that's 1 or 2 out of the whole system. and it's based on the fact that during world war two, adolf hitler incarcerated all of the politicians in norway when he took over and they were under extreme abuse during that time when they were liberated, they went and said that when you get incarcerated, we should think about rehabilitation. and they made rehabilitation the number one priority and they changed the rules. so that people would get out. and so they worked real hard to make sure you have a

skill. you're able to go back in the community to do whatever because they know you're getting out. think about what i'm saying. we know you're getting out. so we got to make sure you're better off coming out than when you went in. and i saw some amazing things where i saw these guys just sitting in the cell with, with, with the women's guards and i said, don't you worry about infractions and things of that nature. and they looked at me like, that never happens because they know they're going to get out. and it just just something they just don't do. and their guards in norway are considered almost like rock stars. they're considered people who do the good in the community. and they're, they're, they're they're they're lauded and they get the right education and backing that they need so that they're able to give social, the

social science, psychiatry, all of the human sciences that you need to be able to get somebody out of that criminality. and it was it was an amazing thing. and i think we need to do that with our criminal justice system so that people can get out and do better. and that's why i was so proud that when i came in, it was 169,000 people who were incarcerated is now down to 90 something. most of those people had not recidivated. they have not recommitted their crimes. and it's because we instituted a lot of things that they're able to get out and be able to lead a regular life. we have a whole lot of work to do, but think about that. at $139,000 per inmate that we spend, think about how many inmates we would need just to fund you if we

could get them out of and back on the street and become working members of society. how much money we would save it's budget wise, it's a it's a it's a great idea to be able to, like you said, to be able to find the resources so that they don't recidivate. and, you know, part of the other part of the equation is also having particular treatment centers for mental health as well as addiction, because that's not what the jails are meant for. and there is not the capacity to have full blown treatment while someone is incarcerated. that's not the, you know, environment for them. and it causes an extra strain on the deputies and the staff. oh, yeah. well, l.a. county at one time had the largest mental health facility in the nation, and that was our l.a. county jail. and it was not set up for that. and so you you

had people and they had their bunks stacked one, two, three, four tiers high, like bunk beds, four tiers high, just stacking them in there it was. and it probably still is a horrible sight to see. and so we've got to do better with our, with people i call it. we got to send them not to a mental institution or an institution. i like to call it a happy place. we've got to figure out a place where you're absolutely they can get the treatment they need and understand that it's not a pill. it's not like you give them a shot and guess what? they're mentally stable now. you can't give them a shot and they're offered drugs. it's a long, long process. may take 6 or 7 tries at this before you can get them off or get them well again, to be able to society. and once we learn that, then we're going to be able to fund that on an

ongoing basis and, and be able to handle that in a much better. well. so i know that you're not going to stop your work, even if you've been termed out. so i hope that we can count on you as a resource to help us move forward. and i know other jurisdictions are looking to san francisco to try to establish an office of inspector general and be able to fund an inspector general and staff in other jurisdictions as well. well, that's good to hear. i was i was worried that you know, let's be honest with the with the new federal administration coming in and people who don't really believe in what you're talking about, who actually believe in the opposite of it, that we would have trouble continuing the good work that is going on. so i'm so happy to hear that there are there are communities that that believe in it and want want it to happen. so i thank

you. you you have no idea what you're starting now, i know it doesn't seem like it'll bear fruit, but i guarantee you it will and you'll be able to look back ten years from now and go, oh my god, look what i did. and like i always tell people, like, i tell the people in the assembly 12 years, i said to do the best you can in 12 years. and they all kind of grumbled, you can't do a lot in 12 years. and i said, i know of a young minister that started a boycott with the bus companies. 12 years later, he was assassinated and changed the world, and that's martin luther king. so from the montgomery boycott until he was assassinated in march on washington, he changed the world. in 12 years. so you can do it. you can change everything in a relatively short period of time. well, thank you for this partnership. and we look forward

to a continued association with you and we will give you back the rest of your evening unless other members have any contributions. thank you. other than to say thank you so much for calling in. all right. thank you. and thank you. and now that you're you're termed out, you might have some time to visit us here in san francisco. and we would welcome you. yeah, it'd be fun. okay. thank you. thanks a lot. thanks. you're welcome. thank you. at this time, members of the public wishing to provide provide comments regarding line item four presentation from reginald byron jones, sawyer senior are invited to approach the podium when it becomes available. yes, sir. you can change the world in that you need to be serious. you need to use self-control. 12 years. okay, i could hear everything that was said, but okay. okay,

you got to sort out what is not accurate from history. you know? so stay focused. and yeah, we can we can do it. we need to do it. we're going to do it. it's going to be in san francisco as an example, not only for the us of a, but for the entire world, including in my country, france, because it's a mess there too. okay, so never mind. thank you. calling line item seven. possible revision of january meeting schedule discussion and possible action. consideration of the possibility to either reschedule or cancel the regular meeting schedule for january. january third. in light of holidays, holidays, travel. so i think i have an initial

question. so inspector general wiley, are you available on the 10th or. okay, i would prefer the 10th as well. yep. i'll be out of town on the third. okay. the country actually. do i have a motion. so move. second. any opposition? seeing none, i think we're good. public comment. sorry. public comment. at this time, members of the public wishing to provide. oh, you're away on vacation? okay. yeah. oh, good for you. yes. i'm glad. i hope you're bringing mom on vacation again. yeah. most likely. it's like i'm still going through it. at this time, members of the public wishing to provide comments regarding line item seven. possible revision of january meeting schedule. i invite you to approach the podium when it becomes availabl. there appears to be no public comment calling the roll on the

motion member mango i have a mango. i vice president bruckner i. bruckner i member carry on, i carry on i member nguyen i minh i president icu i. there are five ayes and no no's. the motion passes. the january 3rd meeting will be continued to january 10th. calling line item eight future agenda item discussion and possible action item. so colleagues on that rule please send any kind of amendments to dan. oh, sorry. member. karen, did you want to say something? oh yeah. but if you're done, i just wanted to add to the agenda and see if we can get air. ben here so we can talk about recruitment for a new ig. yes, yes. that's your agenda. yes, yes. we will. that's that's kind of forced it for us. but the other thing was on the rules, if we do have possible vote on that, just a

reminder dan, that we need ten days notice on that. and then any additional items, just as we culminated a calendar, i think the second time on recruitment might be a little bit easier. we at least have that job description. we know what we've been through, and i think we actually did pretty well in the job description. we were just actually really fortunate to have inspector general wiley apply even and hopefully some of the people that we did interview will reapply. yes. and then we also will have to calendar, you know, interviews and then that will come down. but if we get it done in start the ball rolling in january, i think maybe we can look at the first quarter, having someone new on board and the continuation, because i'm looking at like the fiscal years coming up and then it's already budget time already. anyway, by the time we talk about march. so yeah, just send everything and we will put it together and we can discuss the year's calendar.

and then we also will have, i think eddie jiang will be coming in january. we also have the sheriff's legal office, ronnie singh, talking about some of the policy changes that have been incorporated. right. dan? yep. so yep. i think we're good even for the january meeting. and so and then any suggestions? i would welcome them. so i think oh okay. you want me to recall. no thanks. i'll just look for a copy and then so i guess we're ready for public comment at this time, members of the public wishing to provide comments regarding line item eight future agenda items are invited to approach the podium when it becomes available. there appears to be no public comment. oh, i think we have one. is the last item here or there is general public comment that will be next. we'll have general

comment. this is for the agenda item okay. but this one. yes okay. so push the food growing. it's key. you are right. farming okay. that's it. anybody who objects i mean against it show it. see you can't object about us. i mean, in jail or anywhere from growing food. again. farming. there is not better for future agenda. but yes. for example, you want to save your comments to general comments. oh no. he wanted to add it's part of it. you could add this. i mean, think about it at least. calling line item eight. general public comment. at this moment, members of the public are invited to speak to the line nine nine general comment i'm sorry. nine yes, calling nine. number eight i mean nine sorry. chairman. public comment. at this moment, members of the public are invited to speak to the board for a duration of two minutes regarding matters that were not included in this afternoon's agenda that fall

within the jurisdiction of the sheriff's department oversight board. during this public comment period, neither sheriff personnel, the inspector general, nor board members are obligated to answer questions posed by the public, although they may offer a brief response if they choose to do so. if you wish to provide public comment, please approach the podium when it becomes available. please remember that you have a maximum of two minutes to express your comments. mr. few, what a formula! good luck to you sir. happy holiday! it's coming up dutch, because i think december is not going to be like a, you know, a piece of cake. i know i've got my source. i know. to end with. yes. make sure there is something that is troubling me. it looks like in fact, you are the jail department oversight board. i mean, you have to talk about the function of the sheriff themselves. the sheriff is in charge of the

government's right to make sure the government is not doing something no good. it's the truth. so, you see, i mean, i don't know, because i think you are targeted to think only about the jail system, forgetting that the sheriff is supposed to be responsible. yes, sir. i mean, you represent the sheriff. well, it's clear enough because otherwise it's like you distort the real oversight here again. happy holiday. have a nice everything else. happy holidays to you. holidays and calling line item ten. adjournment. action item. all those in favor? aye. any nays? meeting is adjourned at 4:43 p.m. happy holidays everyone. holidays.

>> you are watching san francisco rising with chris manners. today's special guest, carolyn mante. >> hi, i'm chris manners and you are watching san francisco the stow about restaffing rebuilding and reimaging the city. the guest is carolyn manteto talk about the organization is helping to preserve the city cultural heritage and architecture. welcome to the show. >> thank you for having me e. >> good to have you here. >> can we talk bat the history of your organization and the

mission. >> sure, thank you. san francisco heritage started 51 years ago and the main mission is to preserve and enhance the architectural and cultural identity of san francisco. when it started out the focus was really on the buildings, historic landmark listings and really concentrated on downtown area with all the development happening. our organization was raising a reg red flag with historic landmarks in danger and victorian mansions so a hallmark of our organization is moving these victorian mansions in the way of development to inwestern addition neighborhood and other areas to get out of the way of development and preserve them. our organization was around before there was the historic preservation commission of the city so we were at the forefront drawings attention to historic preservation, landmarking and over

the last 51 years we have seen how there are more then just buildsings in safeguarding the city cultural resources, there is also small businesses and the different neighborhood icons that make a neighborhood special, so our outreach has really-it is really come full circle in a way because it moved downtown into the neighborhoods and now with the covid epidemic it is really going back to downtown again looking at how we can play a role in the economic recovery and revitalization of downtown san francisco. >> that's great. so, now i understand your organization is also responsible for maintaining a couple properties. could you tell us a little about those? >> yes, our non profit was gifted in 1973, the historic (inaudible) house. it is now a historic house museum but this was a family since 1886 built

this victorian mansion in the same family year after year and one of the last resident of the family when she passed way gifted the mansion to san francisco heritage so since then we have been running this historic house and the home of our office. in 2018, one of the long time members nor aa lasten gifting a building on the e h-as hate polk became a commercial corridor after the earthquake, the owner at the time, he raised the house and put 6 store front underneath in order to take advantage of the commerce so we are in charge of the house on the corner and it has been a wonderful way to get new numbers, new

audiences interested in the work of our organization. during the pandemic, we have been using it as a artson residents and partnering with different bay area artists as well as cultural institutions, cultural districts and then one of the storefronts we converted into a pop up galleries so gives a opportunity to raise awareness of the importance of the art and cultural resources in san francisco. >> that's fantastic. so, now, let's talk about legacy business. what does the designation mean? how does somebody get add today the legacy business registry and what benefits does being named a legacy business? >> i love this program. it was started by san francisco heritage and adopt ed by the city and run by the office of small business but the program looks what are the businesses really contributing to san francisco and the

neighborhood. when we started the first focus was bars and restaurants but over the years it exb panded to include other businesses so these are places that contribute to the character of a neighborhood, so sam's grill downtown, the amazingarian press in the presidio. book stores like city lights oergreen apple recently named. this year we had a lot of attention on the legacy business program. we put out a contest to the public of what you think should be the next legacy business and one of the businesses that was recommended was the club deluxe, jazz club on the corner, and 2 or 3 days after we launched the contest, the owners announced they would have to close. the rent was driven up, they couldn't afford it, coming out of the pandemic so we worked at speed to get that application submitted with them and that status

convinced their landlord to negotiate with them a lower rent and this way they have been able to stay, there was a lot of social media support around this, so when you become a legacy business, not only do you get marketing and business support from the office of small business, but you also eligible for grants and we work closely with the legacy businesses as we do our work for san francisco heritage. >> that's great. so, apart from architecture and buildings, you also work with cultural districts, and the castro theater strikes me as a place that is both. a beautiful building and cultural hub and center. what has been happening with the recent acquisition by new owners; >> it is leased to another planet entertainment and been in contact with planet entertainment by the castro theater is historic

land mark building. it is recognized as a very important architectural monument. one thing-one of the main activist organizations of the preservation of the theater we work together with supervisor mandelman on a interior landmark historic landmark designation for interior, but what happened over the is summer and people learned is there is a lot of concern not just by san franciscans but people all over the world, movie directors, stars who are very concerned about the risk to the lgbtq and film programming at the castro theater. another planet

hosted community stakeholder in august, and it was so moving to see the number of people who took the microphone-everyone had two minutes to say their testimony of what castro theater meant to them and those testimonys showed this building is contributing not just as a architectural monument but plays a role in the lgbtq community that is irrelaceuble able. >> it is beautiful theater. >> it is. my involvement in the theater raised awareness to not only the castro theater to be emblematic of the lgbtq culture and history but also there are many other sites in the city that also contribute to the identity. that is why so many people come to san francisco as a place of freedom and diversity so in my previous work i worked at the

world heritage center, so when i joined san francisco heritage i was thinking why isn't san francisco a world heritage city? for the architecture alone it could be inscribed. golden gate bridge to name a few but the city is so unique in the architecture, the mansioned and historic landmarks so hoping to start a conversation on that with city stakeholders this year. >> that is great. let's talk about your relationship with other agencies. you mentioned economic and office of work force development and planning commission. how do you unt integrate to them? >> these relationships are essential. we are working with office of small business for the legacy business program and the planning department is really one of our most crucial relationships. we meet quarterly with them and we really see how we can

support not only historic land mark listings and historical cultural context statements, strategy for culture districts and city survey among many other activities that really are of concern to both of us. for the office of workforce development, i attended a etmooing recently that the chamber of commerce organized with them on the downtown revitalization and a key goal in that meeting and in the downtown revitalization is to make sure that the city historic culture resources play a key #r0e8 in the economic recovery and revitalization especially after the pandemic. the office of workforce development has the city build program which is admirable program where youth are trained in construction techniques for rebuilding and especially with the new housing legislation, and we really want to see how can that workforce be

expanded to include training in historic preservation. we have so many victorian homes, historic buildings and other places that really need a skilled labor force to make sure that they are preserved and that they help keep the special identify of the city. we really value these relationships, we meet quarterly with the various organizations and we are really grateful for grants of the arts we receive and other supports so definitely that is a key relationship for san francisco heritage. >> the city build is great. i like that a lot. thank you so much for the time you have given today. appreciate you coming on the show. >> thank you so much raising awareness about san francisco heritage. we hope the people watching will join us in the mission to help keep san francisco special. thank you. >> that's it for this episode. we'll be back shortly.

i'm chris manners, thanks [trolley bells] >> where the heck are we? >> also, when the heck where r we? >> who cares, we are here. >> we are here union square in the city of saint francis; what do we do first? >> let's go shopping. >> who is paying? no! [music] >> my gosh, we have so many present isn't this wonderful >> yeah. >> let's take these to saint

francis. >> welcome to saint francis, can i take your bag? >> we have lots of shopping for you. thank you so much. >> that's for you. thank you very much. what a awe inspiring view! >> wait mr. scrouge. eme i'm getting hungry again. come on, wake up. wake up. get your wallet out. come on. >> i have already eaton. >> my gosh, there is so much amazing food on this menu. i want to get everything. >> yeah. >> guess [indiscernible] >> alright. >> let's get it all! >> yeah! >> look at the-- hurry hurry!

>> see you. >> this holiday season, shop and dine in union square! and don't miss the world premier of, a why [music] >> san francisco city clinic provides a broad range of sexual health services from stephanie tran medical director at san francisco city clinic. we are here to provide easy access to conference of

low-cost culturally sensitive sexual health services and to everyone who walks through our door. so we providestd checkups, diagnosis and treatment. we also provide hiv screening we provide hiv treatment for people living with hiv and are uninsured and then we hope them health benefits and rage into conference of primary care. we also provide both pre-nd post exposure prophylactics for hiv prevention we also provide a range of women's reproductive health services including contraception, emergency contraception. sometimes known as plan b. pap smears and [inaudible]. we are was entirely [inaudible]people will come as soon as were open even a little before opening. weight buries a lip it could be the first person here at your in and out within a few minutes. there are some days we do have a pretty considerable weight. in general, people can just

walk right in and register with her front desk seen that day. >> my name is yvonne piper on the nurse practitioner here at sf city clinic. he was the first time i came to city clinic was a little intimidated. the first time i got treated for [inaudible]. i walked up to the redline and was greeted with a warm welcome i'm chad redden and anna client of city clinic >> even has had an std clinic since all the way back to 1911. at that time, the clinic was founded to provide std diagnosis treatment for sex workers. there's been a big increase in std rates after the earthquake and the fire a lot of people were homeless and there were more sex work and were homeless sex workers. there were some public health experts who are pretty progressive for their time thought that by providing std diagnosis and treatmentsex workers that we might be able to get a handle on std rates in san francisco. >> when you're at the clinic

you're going to wait with whoever else is able to register at the front desk first. after you register your seat in the waiting room and wait to be seen. after you are called you come to the back and meet with a healthcare provider can we determine what kind of testing to do, what samples to collect what medication somebody might need. plus prophylactics is an hiv prevention method highly effective it involves folks taking a daily pill to prevent hiv. recommended both by the cdc, center for disease control and prevention, as well as fight sf dph, two individuals clients were elevated risk for hiv. >> i actually was in the project here when i first started here it was in trials. i'm currently on prep. i do prep through city clinic. you know i get my tests read here regularly and i highly recommend prep >> a lot of patients inclined to think that there's no way they could afford to pay for prep. we really encourage

people to come in and talk to one of our prep navigators. we find that we can help almost everyone find a way to access prep so it's affordable for them. >> if you times we do have opponents would be on thursday morning. we have two different clinics going on at that time. when is women's health services. people can make an appointment either by calling them a dropping in or emailing us for that. we also have an hiv care clinic that happens on that morning as well also by appointment only. he was city clinic has been like home to me. i been coming here since 2011. my name iskim troy, client of city clinic. when i first learned i was hiv positive i do not know what it was. i felt my life would be just ending there but all the support they gave me and all the information i need to know was very helpful. so i

[inaudible] hiv care with their health >> about a quarter of our patients are women. the rest, 75% are men and about half of the men who come here are gay men or other men who have sex with men. a small percent about 1% of our clients, identify as transgender. >> we ask at the front for $25 fee for services but we don't turn anyone away for funds. we also work with outside it's going out so any amount people can pay we will be happy to accept. >> i get casted for a pap smear and i also informed the contraceptive method. accessibility to the clinic was very easy. you can just walk in and talk to a registration staff. i feel i'm taken care of and i'm been supportive. >> all the information were collecting here is kept confidential. so this means we can't release your information without your explicit

permission get a lot of folks are concerned especially come to a sexual health clinic unless you have signed a document that told us exactly who can receive your information, we can give it to anybody outside of our clinic. >> trance men and women face really significant levels of discrimination and stigma in their daily lives. and in healthcare. hiv and std rates in san francisco are particularly and strikingly high were trans women. so we really try to make city clinic a place that strands-friendly trance competent and trans-welcoming >> everyone from the front desk to behind our amazement there are completely knowledgeable. they are friendly good for me being a sex worker, i've gone through a lot of difficult different different medical practice and sometimes they weren't competent and were not friendly good they kind of made me feel like they slapped me on the hands but living the sex life that i do. i have been coming here for seven years. when i

come here i know they my services are going to be met. to be confidential but i don't have to worry about anyone looking at me or making me feel less >> a visit with a clinician come take anywhere from 10 minutes if you have a straightforward concern, to over an hour if something goes on that needs a little bit more help. we have some testing with you on site. so all of our samples we collect here. including blood draws. we sent to the lab from here so people will need to go elsewhere to get their specimens collect. then we have a few test we do run on site. so those would be pregnancy test, hiv rapid test, and hepatitis b rapid test. people get those results the same day of their visit. >> i think it's important for transgender, gender neutral people to understand this is the most confidence, the most comfortable and the most knowledgeable place that you can come to. >> on-site we have condoms as well as depo-provera which is

also known as [inaudible] shot. we can prescribe other forms of contraception. pills, a patch and rain. we provide pap smears to women who are uninsured in san francisco residents or, to women who are enrolled in a state-funded program called family pack. pap smears are the recommendation-recommended screening test for monitoring for early signs of cervical cancer. we do have a fair amount of our own stuff the day of his we can try to get answers for folks while they are here. whenever we have that as an option we like to do that obviously to get some diagnosed and treated on the same day as we can. >> in terms of how many people were able to see in a day, we say roughly 100 people.if people are very brief and straightforward visits, we can sternly see 100, maybe a little more. we might be understaffed that they would have a little complicated visits we might not see as many folks. so if we reach our target number of 100

patients early in the day we may close our doors early for droppings. to my best advice to be senior is get here early.we do have a website but it's sf city clinic.working there's a wealth of information on the website but our hours and our location. as well as a kind of kind of information about stds, hiv,there's a lot of information for providers on our list as well. >> patients are always welcome to call the clinic for there's a lot of information for providers on our list as well. >> patients are always welcome to call the clinic for 15, 40 75500. the phones answered during hours for clients to questions. >> >>