this sunday, two huge stories upend iing the campaign. for the republicans, accepting the fact that donald trump is here to stay. >> let's assume that somebody else becomes president, wouldn't that be horrifying? and how do the opponents now deal with the juggernaut. for the democrats, it is the hillary's e-mails. >> nobody talks to me about it other than you guys. >> it adds fuel to the biden fire, and did the vice president just tease the 2016 dream ticket by meeting we liz beth warren, and plus trump on hillary. >> and in her rein, look at what happened. everything fell apart. >> and sitting down with car ll

furn t fiorentino. and joining me today, susan page, and former adviser to president george w. bush, george aguilar, and if it is sunday, it is "meet the press." this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. good sunday morning and what a week in politics. this is the week that republicans are accepting the e reality that donald trump is not going anywhere and the week that democrats are kcontemplating th possibility that hillary clinton's e-mails might derail her nomination. and we learn that joe biden is sitting down with a not so subtle message of what his dream ticket could look like. and now, looking at donald trump, 20,000 sure did show up to a football stadium in mobile,

alabama to hear him and cheer him. so we decided to send our own "meet the press" producer to embed him to go with the trump supporters to find out what is behind the trump surge. >> he is real. he is a real person, and he is not politically correct, and i'm glad. >> i never have voted republican in my life. i have been a democrat. >> and you could vote republican for donald trump? >> there is a possibility. a possibility. >> he is not exactly programmed. i think that he believe nas what he says. he is a little bit gruff, and i think that people like it. >> and one thing is that we have such sensitive skin, and he is showing what is it like to be republican. ♪ sweet home alabama ♪ where the skies are blue >> in hillary's case, she has done pretty well, but i don't know if she is going to make it.

but what if, just assume somebody else is going to be president, wouldn't that be horrible? we have 28,000 troops over there, and what if we fight and protect, and we get nothing. nothing. >> what was your favorite part of the speech? >> well, just the way he was not a politician. he would say what was on his mind, and i got the gut feeling, and i think that i'm right about it that he is going to do what he says he is going to do. >> what i like about trump is that he is taking everything and turning it upside down, and making people think again. >> and at this time, we don't know how it's going to turn out, and we are going to ride the wave the whole way. >> and interesting comment there at the end. enthusiasm for donald trump is real, and the question is, is will it last and how long? alex castellanos has worked on some of the biggest names, and

including president bush, and charley black has worked for reagan and bush 41 and this is donald trump's worst nightmare, because you are the guys who he is running against, the establishment. >> yes. >> and charley black, you heard the voices in the crowd, and that is what we are trying to get a handle on, who are these people who are gravitating toward trump, and what does that tell you? >> well, there is a lot of frustration and anger in the country about the federal government, and politicians in both parties, and donald is a vehicle for that kind of frustration. so i do based on your theme believe that he is here to stay for a while, and maybe through a few primaries, but he is is not going be the nominee. what he is doing is to be a more likable pat buchanan with a protectionist platform that is not going to sell for the majority of the republicans. he won't go when the field

narrows very far. >> and alex, what has clearly happened this week, all of the campaigns are saying, okay, now we have to deal with this for a long term, and we have to adjust. we know what jeb bush is doing, fine, we will make it about us and trump, and he sees trump as a way to black out the other candidates, but what about if you are the other candidates scott walker or marco rubio? >> well, he is sucking up all of the oxygen and pray for rain. he is sucking up all of the oxygen of the republican wing, and i think that is good news, but a i am not a fan of ted cruz, and i believe that charley is right, because the average winner of the primary caucus will get 40, 41%. so donald trump is not going to be growing to that. in all likelihood, and now he has surprised us, but i don't believe he is going to be the nominee in that sense.

>> and charlie, "wall street journal" did a piece where they categorized the field, and some are attacking the trump, and a that is lindsey graham, and scott walker, and i am still trying to figure out the scott walker birthright citizenship position, but others are trying to fig for the him, but does it depend what to do and all of them need to change the strategies? >> no, it depends who you are and where you are in the race. for some people to attack trump right now, it is a good way to get attention. for jeb, jeb in some ways is the front-runner, although not really in the polls right now, and so the two of them are the two front-runners in the moment and for them to get into it makes good sense, but the other thing about trump's candidacy, the folks who are angry and frustrate and coming out to see him are conservative. wait until they learn that guy has been a democrat longer than a republican, and he has

advocated for things like partial birth abortion, and universal health care for the government and you can't trust what he says on the issues. >> i hear that, but why do i have a feeling that it does not impact the conservatives, because i think of mobile, alabama. >> they don't know yet. >> but they are also former democrats, alex. >> well, it impacts a hunk of the republican party, but only about 25 or maybe a little bit more than that percent. what a real appeal for trump is that he is a manly candidate. it is not -- >> alpha. >> and we know that these are the gladiatorial contests and who is strong enough to bring order to a country that is spinning apart. and kathleen parker once wrote that barack obama is the first female president, and he is about soft speak and cross iing the lines, and donald trump is the reaction to that, and at the end of the day, he is a big

government republican, and he does not fit the party. >> and it is interesting that you brought it up, because david axelrod brought it up, charlie, and this quote this morning, tr trump is the proverbial strongman, and nobody more opposite to obama, and the vo voters wanted somebody thoughtful and deliberative and now they have had enough gray and they want to go back the black and white, and that is trump. should the other republican candidates embrace this, charlie? >> well, no, you have 70% of the republican primary voter saying they would not vote for trump, and those who are will shrink as they find out about his positions. >> and ignore them? >> well, no, not ignore them, but you don't go into the other guy's base to get his vote. i am a friend and admirer of donald trump, but he is not

going to be president. >> and he is making the other guys look small. and you want to cast a big vote and not a small one. >> it is an interesting challenge for them, and want to thank you both. and now i want to turn to what rand paul had to say about him. and my colleague chris jansing caught up with him in haiti, and he did not hold back. >> people have to decide if they want somebody who is a, oh, she is fat, and i'm so good looking, and she is stupid and i'm smart, because i am rich, and we have to deside if we want empty platitudes or if we are going to be look at the substance, and for donald trump, conservatives have to decide if he is a fake conservative, and he is truly a fake kon ser conservative, beca has been on every side of every issue in the last five years. >> and chris's extensive interview with rand paul is going to be coming up, and so, hello to the panel. john ralston may be the smartest

political reporter out west in nevada, and amy walter, and susan page here, and america's newspaper, "usa today," and alphonso aguilar is running a conservative hispanic outreach group, and i have to say that i will start with you, because one thing that donald trump did is that he threw the issue of birthright citizenship front and center and made the entire campaign have to react. >> you are right. we knew that immigration would be a top issue in the campaign and it was in the last cycle, but candidates did not expect it so early on they would have to detail the position on immigration. and by trump coming out and calling for an end to birthright citizenship, and mass deportation, they have to express their views. and now, this is an opportunity for some to show that they disagree with trump, and they want to be constructive on the immigration issue, and in that way, get some pull from the

latino voters if they become the republican nominee or take the path to say nothing or worse, i agree with trump. if that happens, they are doom ed in the general re-election. >> and point out to scott walker, because i pointed it out earlier, he didn't know what to say. >> well, we don't know, because scott walker, he was for it and then against and then for birthright citizenship, trump came out to say he was for it, and then he came out, and said, well, i am against it, and then they said, he is viable, but after that comment, he is not viable with the latino voters, a and he is done. >> susan, i did an entire segment with the assumption that trump is not going to be the nominee, and we are all of the nominee that trump is going to b be the nominee, and we should stop that assumption? >> well, i think that it is unlikely that he is the nominee,

but it is no longer inconceivable that he is the no, ma'am knee. and looking at the the reuters poll, and online poll and not a traditional television poll, that is what is to be undermining it when it is winnowed to carson and bush, and he got 44%, and that is not only going to win in iowa and new hampshire, and that can carry you quite a ways. >> what did you get from alex and charlie, and do you feel that you made more sense of it? >> well, do i make sense of any of this, no. susan is right that all of the assumptions have been blown up in our face, but we still have to go back to the political physics, and there are laws of gravity that still kick in at some point. >> when? >> and that is the point that we have to remember -- >> and apparently, it is mars and not earth, and the gravity

is not as strong on the planet we are on. >> and what you are hearing from the piece and hearing from the voters is that they want to send a message, and at some point they have to cast a vote. and as a message more important to them than winning the election? because that is the choice. is donald trump worth losing an election, a general election over as a candidate, if the field narrows, which it are will, it is going to be a tougher debate for him, and it is also the summer. nobody is thinking about electable, and nobody is thinking about november except for us. >> washington, washington, washington, amy. and let me go to nevada, and a guy in america. >> and finally a real person. >> let me talk to a guy who is in america, and actually, nevada is not there, or neva-duh. >> well, they were so definitive that trump is the fom e knenekn

nominee, and nobody in our business wants to say, i don't know, because he has defied gravity, and the gravitational pull, he is pulling the other republican candidates to say things that are going to be costing them in the general election, and walker example is the best. he is for or gaiagainst, and th best quote, chuck, i don't know if i am for or against, and let's secure the border, and everything is drawn to him, and people don't know where it is going, and as susan is pointing out, many of the assumptions is wrong, and he won't run, it won't last long, and performance art, and we don't know where it is going, and look at that, chuck, i dont n't know. and we don't know. >> look at you, reality. we don't know. and the other big story of the week, could hillary clinton's e-mails derail her candidacy? here is what donald trump says hillary. . >> i think she's the worst secretary of state in the [ male announcer ] some come here to build something smarter. ♪ some come here to build something stronger.

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welcome back. as you know, donald trump is happy to share his opinions about his opponents, really about anything. i asked him about criticism from conservatives, that he had been too close to bill and hillary. >> first of all, nobody's been tough other hillary clinton than me. and when bill clinton called me, hi already made up my decision, i understand. he called me long after i made a decision and everyone knew i was running. so, it wasn't like that. i think he's very disappointed

i'm running because i'm the one person who can beat her. i don't think she'll be able to run because this e-mail thing is a horrible thing. general petraeus' life has been destroyed and he did 5% of what she did. assuming she would be able to run, which to me would be an absolute miracle at this point, i will beat her. and i don't see the other people running against me currently -- >> you regularly call her the worst secretary of state. >> i think she's the worst secretary of state in the history of our country. look what happened -- >> well, it begs the queshtion, who was the worst -- >> who's the worst after her, kerry. >> who's the worst before -- >> i insult so many people. i don't want to insult people. >> i understand. everything with you is the best or the worst. there's no nuance. >> chuck, during her reign, the entire world fell apart. it fell apart. du during her reign, look what happened, the entire world --

>> the arab spring it on her? >> i mean, you could sort of say maybe, a little bit. sort of, right? >> that's a big charge. >> look at kerry. now, kerry may top her. >> that was donald trump on our last two secretaries of state. when we come back, the hillary clinton e-mail that won't go away and the growing possibility from joe biden is itching for rationale to jump into the race. >> announcer: mn "meet the press" is here is a simple math problem. two trains leave st. louis for albuquerque at the same time. same cargo, same size, same power. which one arrives first? hint: it's not the one on the left. the speedy guy on the right is part of an intelligent system that creates the optimal trip profile for all trains on the line. and the one on the left? uh, looks like it'll be counting cows for awhile. so maybe the same things aren't quite the same. ge software. get connected. get insights. get optimized.

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welcome back. hillary clinton's e-mail troubles have grown from something she tried to dismiss to a saga that pulled down her poll numbers and encouraged very real talk about joe biden getting into the race. with her campaign in full damage control mode this week, let's take a look at how her position on this e-mail debacle, frankly, has evolved over recent months. >> i did not e-mail any classified material to anyone on my e-mail. there is no classified material, so i'm certainly well aware of the classification requirements. i am confident that i never sent nor received any information that was classified at the time it was sent and received. >> just yesterday the state department said 305 e-mails have been flagged for further review to see if they contained

classified information. >> i did not send classified material and i did not receive any material that was marked or designated classified. >> i opted for convenience to use my personal e-ma account, which was allowed by the state department. >> in retrospect, this didn't turn out to be convenient at all. i regret this has become such a cause celebre, but that does not change the facts. >> the server contains personal communications from my husband and me and i believe i have met all of my responsibilities. and the server will remain prevent private. >> i just provided my server to the justice department. >> did you wipt server? >> with a cloth or something? >> this is the usual partisanization, which i may have just made up a word, of what goes on. >> nobody talks to me about it other than you guys. >> so to discuss the state of hillary clinton's campaign and

the chances of joe biden jumping in, i'm joined by howard dean, who ran for the democratic nomination in 2004. he is publicly backing hillary clinton right now. peter hart, a hugely influential pollster, and he's one-half of the nbc/wall street journal polling team we use. good morning to both of you. governor dean, let me start with you. the evolving answers here. >> i don't think the answers are steady. i think they're steady as she goes. this is manufactured partly by a press that's bored and partly by republicans. she did not break any rules. she may have sent classified that wasn't labeled and the state department is trying to get stuff classified after the fact. she can't be blamed for this. i look at this as the usual press frenzy, the pack journalism, and i think it will go away because there's no substance to it.

>> you'll hear a quoted from jerry brown where he says, this thing is like a vampire, the story won't go away and she has to figure out essentially a way to just stab it and get rid of it. what could she be doing better? >> she's? a hide and seek, period. that's a terrible place to be because it's going to continue to evolve, evolve and evolve until she essentially ends it. she's a terrible front-runner but she's a marvelous candidate when she gets to the middle of the race. you see her toughness. at this sfaj it's all fumbles. >> it's interesting you say that because that would make an argument that says, joe biden getting into the race may be the best thing to happen to hillary clinton. >> it's not impossible. as i was watching that tape, i was thinking, this is a lawyerly answer. hillary clinton is an incredible lawyer. >> more lawyer and not politician. >> i do work with people that

are in trouble and one thing i try to do is have the lawyers not have everything to say about what you present. you have to think about this in plain language. maybe that's what she needs to do. if joe gets in the race, joe gets in the race. that's a tough one for him. he's a great guy, a terrific vice president but 100% name recognition and he's already behind hillary clinton and bernie sanders, so where is his space. >> peter, you've been involved in campaigns. >> what it comes down to, he's the happy warrior. he reaches the reagan democrats. he reaches across more than anybody else. the difficulty is, where is the opening on the field? i think that's his real challenge. you know, 80% said they might vote for him. only 45% want him to run. and the difficulty is, how do you find that space on the track? and that's what i think challenges -- you know, he has

to get the dough or it's no go. >> you think it's money -- it's interesting he did the elizabeth warren meeting. what does that significantle -- >> i thought for a long time elizabeth warren makes more sense in the main stream media. i think she's right about the banks and i think joe is right to touch base with her. hillary clearly has talked to her because her view are not that different from warren on these major economic issues about the top 20% getting all the raises and the rest not getting much. >> what did the warren message say to you? >> obviously, it says there's a constituency there he wants to reach across. what we're forgetting are the voters. this election is one part anger and two parts anxiety. and you look at the stock market, there's a drop there. people are anxious. nobody's talked to anxieties. everybody's talked to anger. >> that's a great point. and i think that's why hillary

wins in the end, wins the whole thing in the end because she's a steady person. there's nobody more qualified in the country to be president of the united states than hillary clinton. that is something that's going to be a huge advantage for her as time goes on. >> i'm going to leave the conversation will. we will watch and see. for more on the clinton campaign, a bit in crisis this week, i was joined by a man who knows a thing or two about running for president himself, california governor, jerry brown. >> you were here in watch washington in march, right when the kerfuffle with hillary clinton and the e-mails was happening. somebody asked you if this was going to -- an issue that would just go away. you cautioned, i don't know that. with these things, what makes a difference? you often don't know until it unfolds because nothing is just what it is. it's also in part of a larger context. things unfold, things happen. jerry brown, march 2015, august 2015, she's still dealing with it. you were right. what should she be doing better?

>> well, i don't know. this e-mail thing, it has kind of a mystique to it. an e-mail is an utterance in digital form but it has some kind of dark energy that gets everybody excited. so, i don't know how -- it's almost like a vampire. she has to find a stake and put it through the heart of these e-mails in some way. but i don't think a leading candidate for president needs the advice of another politician. generally, they don't follow it. and i think they know everything i can figure out on their own. >> as a democrat, as somebody who you said you expect hillary clinton to be the nominee, do you think she needs to handle this better? >> well, i mean, just the facts are out there. how do you handle -- i'm telling you, this e-mail business has a certain buzz that keeps buzzing. and i have a hard time figuring out, why is it such a big deal? but it is. and she'll have to use her best

imagination to deal with it. so, these are things that happen. it's still very early. and i hope she can get beyond this because i think as a matter of fact and laws and ethics, these e-mails are not what the pundits are thinking they are. >> let's go to the other candidates potentially in this race. would you like to see vice president biden jump in? >> again, you're asking me presidential advice. fifs hillary, i would say, don't jump in. if i were biden, i was really think of it. >> bernie sanders, reminds me of jerry brown 1992. do you see the similarity? >> i see the similarity that he's running as the critic of the status quo. given the general discontent, if you look at surveys, less than 20% have confidence in congress, and only a third thinks the

country is going in the right direction. that means there's always an open for the criticings, the outsider and that's what sanders is doing. >> do you fully expect hillary clinton to be the nominee? >> i don't make these expectations. i've been around politics long enough to know things are uncertainpy don't know. i think she's a good person. she's got a lot of experience but the vaguers of politics are such, i think expectations are worth about that. >> okay. why wouldn't you jump into this race? >> because i've got a lot to do in california. we've got is fires that are burning. we have this budget still to be kept in check. this is the seventh or eighth largest economy in the world. and i find it completely absorbing and challenging. and i've given myself to this job and i'm going to be fully engaged in it. >> a lot more from jerry brown. you can see the entire interview on our website, meetthepre meetthepress.com.

let me bring in the panel. jon ralston, the lawyerly answer there from dean. that's what every defense they've sounded off on. sounds like a lawyer, not a political consultant. >> i thought that was terrible from her that governor dean said that, but, chuck, it depends on what the definition of classified is what people in real america are thinking. even if it wasn't classified, why did she have to do this? was there sensitive information on there? why did she have that on an insecure server? this is not as governor dean said, a media manufactured story. it's her handling of this. someone should have given her this advice before that appearance. nevada, where she's at. here's the first thing you shouldn't do, hillary, joke about it. don't joke about it. people, even if they don't understand the nuances, say wipe it with a cloth. you know it's going to go viral right away and it did. >> is there a competency thing e-mail me saying, it's a big

deal, but if she can't handle this mess, what does it say about her managerial expertise as 39. >> it goes to the heart of what her campaign message is. i'm one of you. i'm going to fight for you. the reality is, and this is where the campaign still has its biggest problem s explaining why on earth she set up a separate server in the first place. normal people don't do that. normal people that work in the government know what she have to do. that distanced her even more and it sets up this sense that she is -- >> special, elite. >> she's special, elite, she's not going to -- >> plays by her own rules. >> and that to me is a bigger problem. let's switch to joe biden. where is this going? >> on behalf of political reporters everywhere, i would like to ask joe biden and elizabeth warren to run as a ticket. i think that would be fantastic to cover. i'm 100% -- >> you and the rnc. >> i'm totally for that. peter hart made -- he didn't

make this point but you picked up on it. i think it would be good for hillary clinton if joe biden ran because it would give her a really serious pope and at the end of the day, she would prevail. that would be good for her. when was the one time she was a good candidate? when she was under the gun in 2008 against barack obama. so, i do think this would be -- while some sort-term costs i think the long termite be the best thing to happen to hillary clinton. >> i'm looking at this race and it's like donald trump is doing everything he can to hurt the republican nominee and the hillary is doing everything she can to hurt herself. the republicans love to talk e-mails. the democrats love to talk immigration. >> well, i don't know. in terms of hillary, jerry brown says this is like a vampire. i think it's starting to feel like the entire twilight saga. look, and i think the point that jon and amy have made is very important. regardless of if there's a

criminal investigation, regardless if criminal charges are filed, the reality is, why was she using an unsecure server in managing sensitive communities? when you're at the state department, every single state department official is told, don't use the -- a no-secure server for official communications. why did she do it? the other problem she has is she hasn't been forthcoming in providing all the e-mails and finally the server. so, they look and sound like they're lying. >> let me do -- short response real quick. biden or clinton, tougher party for the -- >> clinton. >> can joe biden put together a competitive campaign if he jumps in tomorrow? >> it's going to be tough. hillary have people who have experience with her and the obama campaign. they've been smart playing up the hispanic votes. hispanic vote is going to be huge. maybe 20% of the elector ralt.

i see no chance he could set up a comparable infrastructure in nevada. >> amy, that's the thing suspect there-s there a path -- >> natural constituency. is he younger than hillary clinton? >> no. does he have a constituency that looks different -- >> you look like ryan lizzy, he says, is it youth? no. lefty credentials? maybe. >> one thing you would put on that list, does he want to run? we know joe biden wants to run. and that means although those calculations may not be -- >> i think susan makes a very good point. this is true about trump and biden. we are trying to be logical about all of this. this is emotional. voting is emotional and campaigns are emotional. that makes this all very, very different. >> which is why we all love topics. that's a passion and he's to it that helps create an illogical

way. my sitdown with carly fiorina. 80% of the poor in africa are rural farmers.

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i caught up with her last week when i was at the fair. here's a quick excerpt of where i asked her if she thought the government would be shut down in the fall over funding planned parenthood. >> i think it's very, very important. what do american taxpayers to want see their dollars going toward? the video we've seen have raised very serious issues. >> there are other ways to avoid a showdown like that in. >> i think so. i think we can all work together to move toward a common goal. >> an optimistic nonshutdown republican there. you can see more of my interview on meetthepress.com. up next, it's republican carly fiorina. and a little later, check out this campaign photo of jeb bush. how exactly did that happen? kid: hey dad, who was that man? dad: he's our broker. he helps looks after all our money. kid: do you pay him? dad: of course.

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we are back. donald trump is not the only sort of oner from republicans debate night, former hewlett-packard ceo carly fiorina was called the winner of the happy hour. fiorina is hoping to join the big table at next month's second debate. i, meanwhile, sat down with her for a middle east the candidates interview yesterday in new hampshire. >> let me start with the news of the week in the markets. you're obviously, as a former ceo, what's going on? >> well, frankly, i think it's inevitable. i was expecting this a bit sooner. it's inevitable because you have a huge economy like china slowing down, the chinese

economy sleerly is struggling now in a serious way. that has a big impact. the federal reserve has to stop printing money eventually and people see that coming. >> you're running as a political outsideser. >> i am a political outsider. >> no, i say that the last seven years, adviser to john mccain, you worked at a fund-raising arm for the republican party. that doesn't sound like -- that sounds like someone who wanted to be a member of the professional class. >> no, it's someone who believes this is a citizen government. citizens have to be engaged in the process of governance and politics. we need more citizens in politics. we have too many professional politicians. the vast majority of american people say, we're delighted you haven't been on the inside in washington. we're delighted you haven't held elected office before. what all those experiences say is i understand how the process works. that's important. i have relevant experience.

>> this weekend a column in the "new york times," and he's pretty tough on you saying experience can be a badge of honor or a badge of shame. and he said -- he compared your tenure to the captain who cause the ship wreck of carnival. captains must also be held accountable. >> well, i was held accountable, absolutely and stand by my record. jeffrey sonnenfeld has been critical since i arrived at hp. he's a close adviser of bill clinton. i'm not at surprised. he's been saying that for 15 years. the conventional wisdom is frequently wrong. >> the issue of birth right citizenship came up. can you -- >> i don't agree we should be trying to amend the constitution. >> you would not amend it. >> i would not amend it. no, absolutely not. by the way, this has been talked

about for 20 years as well. you see, i think -- donald trump may not be a politician but he's sure acting like a politician in this regard. there are two fundamental things that must be done and they have never been done. we must secure our border. it's not rocket science. it's our job to do it. it takes money, man power and technology. it hasn't been done in 25 years. we must fix the legal immigration system which is contributing to this problem. every single one of the problems i just mentioned has been festering for 25 years but what do politicians do? every election hykel they hold up a bright shiny object. let's talk about birth right citizenship. even if you like that idea, the chance of getting a constitutional amendment passed, the 14th amendment overturned by the supreme court are extremely small. >> what do you do with the 11 million? >> my own view f you have come here illegally and stayed illegally, you do not have a right to pathway.

i think there should be consequence. >> do you have admiration for hillary clinton? >> absolutely i do. she's dedicated herself to public service. it is also true, however, she's not trustworthy. she's lied about certain things, benghazi, her e-mail server -- >> do you know -- why do you know she's lying ie ing oying o? >> well, for heaven's sake. the night of the benghazi attacks we now know that the state department and the white house knew this was a purple, preplanned terrorist attack. nevertheless, the next morning she went into the state department and she addressed the american people and talked about a video that did not represent the values of this nation. several days later she said the same thing over the bodies of the fallen. what she should have said was this was a purple terrorist attack and we will secret bugs. >> you belief she purposely lied? >> absolutely i do. >> in the home state of

california, brought, wildfires. more is coming out from the scientific community saying climate change has made it worse. >> what's made it worse is politicians, liberal politicians who stood up for 40 years as the population of california doubled saying, you cannot build a new reservoir and you cannot build a water conveyance system. so 70% of the rainfall has washed out to sea. that's pretty dumb if you know you have droughts every three years. >> the other day i asked jerry brown to responsibility to that exact criticism you made. i said, do you blame liberal environmentalist on dams and reser voirs. >> i've never heard of such utter ignorance. building i dam won't do a damn thing about fires or climate change or the absence of moisture in the ground and vegetation in california. i think these people f they want to run for president, better do

kind of eighth grade science before they make any more utterances. >> that's a lot of insults but it makes no sense what he just said. it would be helpful if you were fighting fires to have more water. firefighters in california have difficulty getting enough water now, so they're using other means. it would be helpful to agriculture and everything else to have water saved in the good years so that you could use it in the bad years. i'm not denying that california's air is dry. that's obvious. i'm not denying there is a drought. but there is no denying that politicians have made this problem immeasurably worst. >> you at hp made a -- made it a policy that any job opening that senior job opening you had to swer view a woman. >> we had to have diverse candidate. >> is that a pledge as a president? >> yes, that's how you get

ameritocricy. >> facebook question. ms. fiorina, having experience in the technology field what would you do to implement true cyber security for our nation's core infrastructure and would you put our nation on a cyber offensive? >> yes. so, yes, i would, by the way. first of all, there's a level of collaboration required between the private sector and public sector to repel and detect attacks. there's a bill languishing, frankly, in congress for several years now. we need to get that bill pass sod that level of collaboration is possible. second, it's important to recognize that these cyber attacks that have been going on against the federal government system, none of those are a surprise. i chaired the advisory board of the cia for several years. we've known for over a decade the chinese were coming after our most important -- >> russians too, i think. >> absolutely. we need to make it very painful for the chinese to be aggressive in cyber warfare so, yes.

>> for my full sitdown with carly fiorina, including her take on iran, isis and a whole host of other issues, it's available at meetthepressnbc.com. if you can't catch us live on sunday mornings, no problem, we're always available on demand. season pass, you name it or make sure there's no blinking 12:00 light on your cvr. here it is, even if it's not sunday, it's "meet the press." coming up, our "end game" segment. again, what's wrong with this picture? here's a hint. check out jeb bush's left hand. how exactly does that happen? >> announcer: stay tuned "end

- you can collect rainwater to shower with, but there are easier ways to go green. like taking shorter showers, which conserves water and lowers your bill. you'll sing long ballads in the rain and short ditties in the shower. ♪ the more you know >> announcer: time for "end game" brought to you by bowing, where the drive to build something inspires us every day. >> "end game time." reaction to carly fiorina, top tier candidate? >> i don't know about top tier. she definitely belongs in the next debate of top ten candidates. i think she's getting a lot of support from the conservative

base, social conservatives. and i think -- while i don't think she's going to make it all the way, i think she seriously is going to be considered for vp. >> you think that's what she's running for? >> yes. >> the cynics out there think that's what she's doing. >> it's hard to believe her as a presidential candidate. trump has been a surprise. she's been the most surprising dark horse that has come out and forced us to take her seriously. look at her answer to birth right citizenship. she gave you an answer. i don't think that's a good idea, gave you three reasons. >> straightforward. >> trump, carson, carly. >> that's the problem. she's in that field of those other two trying to be the outsider but she has to overtake a donald trump, when she's never going to outbombbast him or trying to be -- she's trying to be a little outsider but she

also says, i also have experience. to be a citizen legislator, i know how this works, donald trump sounds like a rel politician. >> although the end of the day, the one silver bullet for her, to take her down as a candidate, you run these hp stories. the headlines are terrible. she's trying to deal with it and she owns up to it. she says, yes, it was ugly. that's a tough thing for her to overcome. >> yes, especially in the paid media. she pivoted off the professor -- >> no, no. >> kill the messenger. firing 30,000 people, the disaster that was the copaq deal. she can say it was the dotcom bust, i was in the boardroom with a bunch of guys, that's in the short term. in the long term that's a devastating -- for someone who says she's not a politician, boy, she was very good in that interview acting like a politician. >> you've seen her out in nevada. how is she doing? >> he was at a forum last weekend and she did very well, i

thought. it was just talking to the faithf faithful. one good nugget, she met with sheldon adelson who said he's trying to save her candidacy because she's not doing well through the super pac mechanism and c-4s. >> that's fascinating. this has gotten lost in the presidential politics. jimmy carter with that heart-wrenching press conference he held to describe his cancer. somebody threw out a question, do you have any regrets. listen to what he said. >> and anything you wish, i'm sorry, that you had not done or that you had done differently? >> i wish i had sent one more helicopter to get the hostages and we would have rescued and i would have been re-elected. >> i would have been re-elected. every sincele losing presidential nominee, they never get over it. >> they never get over. >> he's 91. this is 30 years later. one more helicopter. >> i interviewed senator warren

hatch and he alluded to his presidential candidate. he had a difficult path there when he ran for president, when was that, 19 -- don't even know. >> 2000, i think. >> you never get over it. look at mitt romney f there was a path for him this time, he would run again. you get close, it's so close. if you only did this, you might get there. >> amy walter, there's that famous story that supposedly walter mondale calls up george mcgovern and says, when do you get over it? and mcgovern says, i'll let you know. that's when it came out. you realize, they're all wired the same way. >> this is a personality type. this is the person that decides to run for office. these are the things that draif them and the things that drive them crazy which is, they can't get beyond some of those things. we were talking about this earlier, the first person who believed in you, the first person who wrote you a check, they'll also remember the person who denied you 30 years ago.

>> wrote you off early, said you will never go anywhere. >> will never forget that. >> fascinating. carter, that was a tremendous thing. 91, here is he standing in front, unbelievable, president carter, please, please, please, beat this and fight it. before we go, a little something fun. let's put this up. it created a little viral meme here. here's jeb bush. clearly photoshop got the best of the jeb bush superpc. he's standing with two hands. one appears to be jeb bush's hand, the other appears to be the hand of an african-american. we went to right to rise guys who admitted it's photo shopped. here's the real photo they clip arted there. jeb bush who appears to be at the state fair. you can see, there are shadows there and that's what happened. alfonso, is it just a funny problem or is it at all say to -- geez, these super pac guys

have to be a little more careful? >> look, it's certainly shoddy work, bad artwork. but i think some are going to take advantage of it, certainly democrats to make a few cute jokes about republicans and jeb's relations with minority communities. but the reality is that, look, they're afraid of jeb because they know that he has good relations with the latino community. that if he is the candidate, he will be very competitive. >> mike murphy said to me, maybe more people actually read it now. >> at least he didn't hit a kid in the head with a football. >> there you go. take that, marco rubio. that's all for today. we'll be back next week because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press."

"nbc10@issue" starts now. >> he's the man who wants to oust pennsylvania senator pat toomey. he came close five years ago. now joe sestak believes he can seal the deal. today we learn where he stands on the issues. >> plus the science doesn't support parents who oppose vaccines but they can't be convinced. now an area psychologist thinks she knows why. we'll tell you about a local push to spread kindness. good morning. i'm keith jones for "nbc10@issue." today we begin with pennsylvania senate race. two democrats want a shot at taking on republican pat toomey in the general election.