>> welcomeo the broadcast. night kurt andersen talk out his new book, a look at the global onomic crisis. >> my premisis that it is a rare historic oortunity where this long boon began the early 80s suddenly ben crashing down at t same time that this lo nservative political era end.

that rarely ppens in american history. we go back and forth and the whole history political and economically is this cycle going back and fth. but to havthese two big long powful eras end,ome crashing down at once, we suddly have a table to put ba upright, rese and lots of ings aren it that weren'tefore. >> wcontinue with paul giomatti and director sophie barthest talkingbout their new vie "cold uls" >> she feels overburdened. he's taking on this her russn characters fraught soul so i think he just feels like he's got a surps of thing goesing on. so mbe he'll relieve himself something and make it easier for him. and it does make it in s mind easier fo him to do. >> they try not toive any definition of the soul but just be playful th the metaphor that u can either let it shrink or you c ke care of it and try t expand your ul. it is like a issuef feelgs and mood.

>> we conclude wit lord peter levene, t largest oldest insurance market. >> for the last three or four years we will have yaruous -- various finance hoes coming along saying you're co sitting on a t of ch. we have great eas for to you use that cash d they will be quite complex and we look at them say very kind of you but thank y very mu. >> and you mis your chanc to make lot of money. >> well i haveo say today it being sf-satisfied with about it, we c say borin iseautiful. >> andersen, giomatti, and pevene, next

captiong sponsored by rose communications from our sdios in new york city, this is charlie rose >> rose: the global econom crisis has causeus to queson many fundamentals. such as what is e nature ofur economy? why do we consume so much? is america still global leader? en you peruse the book shelves and read t op ed pages you see titles le a failure of capitalis big government ahead. america the tarnished. now comes kurt andern who examines howe got here and where we go in a new book, reset, how the cri kiss restore our vues a renew erica. it grew out of a essa he ote in "ti" magazine called thend of exss.

i'm pleased to have our friend kurt andersen back at this table. you just saw me do a prograon iraq an afghanista so what are your thoughts abou america's efforts there and the risks that we have that afghanistan becomes a long slog as iraq became. >> it may welcome that. and at was a great show, to talk about. cause i don't think as your guest said thatpeople, americans generally understand wt a -- what a large engagentfghanistan may become. i dohink the factthat th obama adminiration, a guy who after all got elected as the ai-war candidate of thewo leading democratic candates has proven himself to be not any kind of cut and run dove at all. and to me, and this does work into the reset ia, i thinwe have gone from the vietnam syndrome which led to us recoil from any military pow anywre t you know, in sll

inements up to iraq into thinking that we were n longer subject to the normal rules of cost benef when it comes to exercising foreign wer. >> ros and the idea of offensivpower, that we had a militaryo much serior toverybody else weould do whatevere wanted >>recisely and i think we learned that lesson. and i'm hopeful, i'm hopeful that this administrion is willinto engage in a muscular park in places like afanistan but is not -- es not suffer from e hubris that we haveecently suered from. >> ros in terms of iraq, should we accelerate the withdrawal, shoul we be very cautious about not aving too early. ould we do all of the above? >> well, given where we a today versus wheree were two yrs ago, you kno we all arerossing our fingers an saying a collective whew. >> rose: did people on the left get it wrong out the surge because they didn' and the surge turned out to be a thing that gave us new opportunity? >> witho question. it seems to me that's true

cluding barack obama who was wrong about the surge. because in the politics of 2006/2007 and runni up to the presidential election, naturally the issue became divided inhis very black and white way. are you eith for gettg out rit now or you a for staying in until we fish the job. and course the truth as it off sen is somhere in between. >> someoneaid that liberals got the invion ght and the surge wrong and theyo cons an conservatives got the invasion wrong and the surge right. >> that's right. i think at's true and, and in terms of wha-- h slowlynd carefully and deliberately the obama administration is withdrawing, i think he, they understan thathis, at indeed the surge, the last couplof years have woed well. better thawe had any rht to eect and that they're trying not to mess it up. rose: you are a acowledged swooner, are you not. >> i swooned during the election. rose: you acknowledged it

too. >>bsolutely. >> ros you said count me among the swooners. >> absolutel yeah. to me, i mea, as soon as he -- myswooning phase ended the moment he wa elected, really. which isn't to say fell out of love with him but it was likeow he'she present, okay. let himbe the presint. so. >> rose: there aimit to your swooning, isn't there. >> there is. as soon as the pern is president -- and except f my wife. t as soon as he's president th for me my whole attitude changed. now he should be judged by the normal standds of judging execives. >> ros let's go through them. leadership. >> i think he's done, has done aswell as he one could imagine onhe leadership. >> re: foreign policy. i agree there, i think 's been properly tough with, r instance, israel. i thinke's beenareful, as i say inthe ira

tuation. i can't faultim on foreign policy. so maybe i'm still a swner. >> rose: well, we'll g to that. t there is also this thing which is very interesting. it is the imptance o lauageand speeches. i mean i talked tsomeone who used to be i our profession who is nownside the adminisation who said to me i never understood w important speeches wer and especiay to this group. they lay out strategy. they use it as aorum to really speak to people in thsame way that president kenneddid when he went to american univeity, et cetera. >>ell, i have thought from early onn the oma campaign that ronald reagan was very much his model. that he is the docrat's version of ronal reagan. and understds communation. ronald reagan was a great counicator. barackbama wants to be great communitor and barack obama h the greater virtue of being a very -- writ as well. so he kind brings it, it seems to me in the realm of

trng to explain to the world and his citizens what- what ought to be done. so so far he's done no wrong. >> no, he's done plenty o ong and certainly dostically. i mean i -- remains to be seen ihis approach tryi to doealth care and cap and trade and all these thgs a a at once and b the way he's doing it, i don't ow that he should ha capitulated to nancy pelosi a the liberal leadersh of the house of representives on health care. that may be a big mistake. it remains to be seen. >> do you have aidea about it how longoes it hav to main to be seen. >> until we see if we gets a bill-passed i guess >> rose: he will get a bill passed but wh kind of bill. >> it is, d as people have said presidents ten are ry consciously try to be not the esident that cam before them. d in his case --. >> rose: bill clinton. >> but y look back at93,

'94, '95, the clinto health-ce program going down in flames. this admistration is obviouy trying to avoid at. maybe to a fault by letting congre tinker and talk for too long. >> rose: it really itrue when y think about history. fdr dinot want to be hoover, obvious. rona reagan did not want to be jimmy carter. gege bush did not want to be bill clinton. bill clton did not want to george bush 4 -- he wantsed make sure -- >> and we an electorat have the same instinc we ect jimmy carter because he is the anti-next on. elect this incredible --. >> rose:ecause he was the an-carter. >> and barack ama because he is the antiush so iis a duet betweenthe electorate andhese presidents. >> rose: what do you tnk about clintos trip to noh korea. >> good usof billlinton and i am deeply fascinated, endilessly fascinated wi north kor and if, indeed, king jom il made some ecial request transmied

through theseomen that he held prison to get bill clinton, y know, if you wrote that in a screenplay t would be a little unbelievable. >> rose: that in fac he actual, that they, in fact, even though th crossed the border, whatever they did >> yeah. >> ros grabbed, got the attention of t north koreans ey saw it asn opportunity and ll use thespeople as a pawn and a hoage and will get bil clinton he so we can somehow speak tohe new administration >> sak to the new administrati. >> rose: that the machiavelln strategy maybe they were erating on. >> or maybe a narrower stragy machiavellian strategy o just internally saying look, i'm still the great lead and i can get a former president to come here and aear in a photo op wh me. >> more than photo . he sat dow with all the major figures forhree hours. >> it's about reect. i me as othersave said. the respe as a motive in the world's affairs is not to be overstated, hink. >> rose: l's turn to reset. how this crisis ca restore.

your premise is -- >> myremise is at its a rare historic opportunity ere this lg boom began in the early 80ss, suddenl came crashing down last fall at theame timehat this long conservive political era ended. thatarely happens i american htory. we go back d for and the whole history, pitically and economically is this cycle going ba and forth. but to have these two big long powerful eras en come crashing down a at once. we ddenly have aableto put back upright, reset. d lots of things are on i that weren't befor we weren talking serious about alth care before. we wer't talking siously about regution of wall street befor we weren't talng seriously about energy before. suddenlynd not just because of democratic presidt is in office. all these open questns are on t table. and inur own lives. >>ut i think an impornt point, here'my reading of your book which is more portant it seems to me. that's all true what you just said. but it caused us to rethink our lifestyle. >> absolely.

>> that's the crucial pot you make. >> absolutel it'sike people who have art attacks. and suddenly ey think oh, i have got, i'm not livg the wai should if i want to live aile longer. >> ian't be 300ounds and never exercise if i wa to live. >> and maybe smokingnd all the rest. we for a long time thoht therwere no conquences. we got that into our heads and it worked pretty well for a long time. and suddenly whack last fall was like the heart a tand ago now we have to change lifestylen every nse. >> rose: b do you think at will be temporary as often is >> it is always temporary. anthe question is how long the tporary period will last. we have a fairly bri moment historicall a few years to try to get ck on track and get back in touch wh the ameran valu of discipline and prudence and frugality and ose things. and ineviy we'll start, you knowwe'll put the pedal to the metal again and probably end up in a ditch in024. >> rose: tell me aut the story the aunt and -- t ant and the grasshopper.

>> we all ow the sto. >> rose: i want to y tell it. >> the ant in the table was the prudent, hard work careful collectinfood for the wier character. the asshopper didn't do that, parti, partied, partied. sang, danced. and winter comes. and th grasopper is in big trouble. my viewss i was thinking abt what had happened ove the last 25 yrs what has happened over the last 2 years in american histor is that americans are both. americanshave the ant this in them and the grasshopper in tm to a degree that i don't ink -- i think that most defines our national character this wild and crazy speculative side. and thisdisciplined hardworking sober yankeeee foder side. and we indulge one foa while, then that doesn't work so we or it gets boring then we indulge the other. and now it isime to sort of g back in touch with our inner ant. >> what might pla a ro , other than this book, in making this point and

encourage a kindf catharsis aboueverything? >> wl, i think people did, you know, not all at once and people don't change 180° overnight. we're lking about, y know 45° if we're lucky. 90° if we were really lucky. i think people did undersnd that hey, my life you know, worrng about whether i cod afford get an ext tv or ts bigger house i couldn afford and didn't really ne, i think people really have recalibrated what mas them hay and the difference tween what they ssingly want and what th really need. >> rose: you make that very int. we have to dermine what we neednd what we -- >> ihink. i think. and i think my experiee people a doing that. and then tre are lo of people that are t of work and eling real pain. and in some cases,i'm not saying this is a grea i don't see a lver lining hind every cloud but i talk to a lot of people wh have bn put out ofork in the last nine months who actually, you know, what choice dthey have. th have to figure out what to do xt. the ones i talked to, aot

ofhem are saying whyon't i something that i really might love to do raerhan this oth than thing that i stumblednto that was a way earn a livingfor 10 or 20 years. the untnk handled to individuals who get laid off. to the coury. and in termsf the financial system and pointis that we can keep thinking th unthinkable bu on the upside. >> rose: do you think we are entering aew age of politics in the sse that sort of were enterin an age of govnment inrvention and government playing a larger role our life. again, not to reduc everythi to historical cycleshat are out of our control but tosome degree if you look at 225iers of history, yes. >> rose: t 30s all over again. >> i don't knowf this is the 30z all over agn. but it's not the 80s all er again. the '80s final after 25 ars essentially operating ended and yeah, the idea, this idea that no regulation is the best regulation and

that's all you need know, i think i at an end. and some degree of one hopes subtle careful --. >> rose:ut that is clear to see that. everybody talks about we have got to have a new regulatory framework. >> a year ag, two years ago that wasn't so cle. >> how clear was it. >> obviously it wasn't b what else abo beyond that, i mean regulation is t easy o. terms of what's t role of government ought to be. should the government go around and saving failing companies. should the goverent -- >> well, i tnk that shall did --. >> rose: should the government be owning shares of majormerican corporations shoul capilism become some kind of -- >> no and i thk this adminiration made very clear that they don't want to be in that business. they don't wanto be socialists they don't want nationalize things >> rose:r social mocrats. >> wel whichever. but i thk it's a little bit ke iraq. you're there, ok. maybe we shoul't have invaded but we're the. so let's t to make the bestf it. i think th's how any administration and this e is reacting to the financial cris. okay, it happed. let's make the best of the bad situation.

let's, yea, we'll t propping up. >> have the surge. >> the giant banksand we' try buying a share of t auto indtries. >> many people have said i thk hank paulson said at firsit's a very hard sell to say if i didn't do this things would be much worse. >> yes. >> that's a hard sell. >> it is a hard se. although of cour in terms of national securitythe bush administration made actly that claim for many years ofaying ife didn't do all tse things we did, lo, we didn't have any terrorist tack in the united statein the last eight yes. thas can made. but it is a hard sell. as i s in the bk. one of the this i think litically that this reset opportity is,iso get, to notet the extremes politicall so manage and gorn the discourse whetr it the professial left wingers or the pressional right wings. i think the majority of americans really a neither ofhose things. and indee there is a consensus. but the professionals in

washington and on other television channels were vested in preacng to the choir. the respecve choirs. and i think, hope that when the wle thing went kaflooey it gave ople a lot of people in that big middle the opportunity t say hey, let's fige out what works. let's not jt stick with ou talking pointsf the right or the lef >> lots of boo haveeen written aboutort of that 19th century belongeto itan. 20th cenry belonged to t united states and 21st century belongs to china. >> i think it's, you know, i look at a lot of historil parallels in reset. and the -- if you look a hundred years agright now, england was a th height and as i turned outhe end of their gat century o power invery rem. and who was about to beat em, this big upstart feverish, ambitious nation manufacturer to theorld, you know. so there is a chance that we,

our best yearsre behind us anwe become sort of a supersized greatritain for the next00 years. that's psible. i think it's avoidable if we sort of go back to our first, some of r first princiess and american values like technological creativity. like what i call the ateur spit. which is not abdicating everything -- >> talk about amateur spirit. that is a very intesting point you made. >> i really thk this country is aountry of amateurs in the literal sense. ben franklin and thomas jefferson were amateur poticians who put together this count. en it came here in the 19th cenry was amazed and love the fact that our political class were not bunch of professnal politicians like ty were in frae. >> people didn't leave college too into government. >> that's right. they were amateu it. when you look inventors from the wright brhers to ste jobs, they really had this passionor what they were doing. yeah, they wand to make money, probably. buit was really about the passio and that, that really is part of what makes us great.

>>ou reminded me because it's in the book aut remembering whatteve jobs said. heaid it in a famous speech he made at the sanford business schl. >> yeah. >> what he said abt the most freeing time for him was when he was he lost his compan >> he was sked. >> he wasacked from apple. >> and he had to sort of start all over and h went anbought and created pixar and got back at apple. but what did he say about th period for him? he said that he ddenly felt's gat lightnes of ing freed of this, this, you know, success. and tha after having this success that he was suddenly freed to reinvent himself. to do what he wanted to do. be creative. anyou know, i really do think that's an applicable lesson to ussindividuals as we've been knock off our hors this last ye. and as country. >> this fromin time, august 3rd, this is par of your

blowing on "time"agazine.co >> for a while iave been. >> in the reset padigm. >> yeah. >> yes, it's true andhe probm with the reset metaphor, theidea of pushing areset button is it's implicaonhat the excesses and madness and sfunction in our complex econic systems can be fixedasily. right. and americans, another american trait i think is beeving in wishing for sh the button, ey solutions. and this isn't going to be easy. and as y look at the heal-care bill and everything elsgoing through washingt these last month you see, i is a sausage maki factory. and i can talk about how wonderful it is that we now have this opportunit to reset but seeing it actually done is a slow, ugly process. but i am hopeful that by the d of it we're going to be in a better pce than we were before. >> rose: tell me aut the sear sucker. >> wel charlesie, it's -- it a sear sucker suit and

when it's hot as is tay in new york city. >> rose: with thhorn rim glasses and the sear sucker it, you look like you cod play right out of any movie uthern lawyer. >> oh, really. >> rose: or soutrn law professor. >> i will take that as a compliment. >>ose: who does something interesting apt from teaching conitutional law. >> really, it's the jimmy stewt character. >> rose: more southern tha the jimmy stewart character. >> gregory peck. rose: more gregory peck, to kill aocking byrd,ur diemer to your juement about what is sohern and --. >> rose: all right reset. how this crisis can restore. our vaes and renew ameri. >> it all stard with a dream one ght, filmmaker sophie barthest stood togethern line hding their sou in boxes. that vision inspired a screenpl featuring a character named paul

giomat and after chance meing with the rlaul giatti at the ntucket lm festival it became a vie. the movie is called "cold souls" and here is the trair. can't see my feet. i see my feet. >> paul at is going on with you? >> you want to te a break, paul. >> i havehis throb in my stomach. i have a pain in my chest like somebody put my heart in a vic and just tightened it. >> things n be ptty strae around here recently >> i fee stuck. as your ul weighing u down. >> i wn't quite surebout the services provided. >> the only offer, possibility to desl the bo or disembody the soul. >> believe me, when you get rid of the soulverything makes so much more sense.

>> good luck. how are you feeling? >>. >> well, maybe lighter, yes, slight, light. >> the first feways were fine. >> are you sick? >> no, just the usualtuff. >> now i'veeen sick as a dog. i can't make love to my wife. >> youmell different, feel different. >> ian't feel a thing, nothing. i cat feel anythg. i just want my soul back. >> this has ver happene before. werobably spped it to our new jersey warehouse. >> oh, go >> how did we get to this pot. >> this is a serious business, soul trafficking. >> you know wherit is. >> yr soul is in russia. >> wt? >> well i'm really sorry that things didn't work out with al pacno.

>> joing me now the film ar actor pl giomatti and rector sophie barthest'm pleased to have both of us here. so l's get to the dream first. what did you dream. >> twa did i dream. i'm so story forpaul beuse he heard that so many times. i dreamed at i was in the office very ch like the office in seper i had just seen the woody allen vie sleeper and i was holding this box and woodi allen wain line with other patients. we were a hold august a quite boxn our sou h beenextracted so the doctor came and said we will look at the shape of our souls. and so when woody allen's turn ce and he opened his box his so was just a little chick pea and so in the drm he very fij ety, nervous and up set about it.

>>ose: and how much longer was there a movie in your head, how long diit take to have a movie. >> wel when iwoke up from the dream i thought sometimes yohave the dream that aren't ry narrative but jt impressions. but is one was stranly narrative and it d this absurd premise. >> rose:rom the beginning the character was lled paul giomatti. >> t idea what to have woody allen playing the role but justor, you kno, a few wes. and then i thought. >> -- >> unavailable. >> no, sometime --. >>ose: he wasn't making movies. >> i happene be availae. >> rose: you we at home watcng tv. exactly. >> rose: so she comeup to you in nantuct. >> yeah, she ought up, well. >> ros i have a movie named after you, are you available for the ro. >> yeah, kind of, basically. she approached my wifewho, and told my wife the story and my wife pulled her over to me and said you should listen this man's story and i tught -- and she tolde and --. >> rose: i have heard this

bere. >> please, lve me alone. and the premise of it actually sounded so gre i thought this aually does sound great. then he is sent itoe, i re it, i thought it was great. >> rose: evidely she sn't finished with the script and you sa send it anyway, i will take what you've got. >> exactly. d it was fantastic. i ved it. >> rose: so what iour perception of a ul here. >> the idea is not to give any definition of the soul but just be playfulith the metaphor. that it's a strae muse and you can eitheret it shrink or you can take care of it and try to expand your soul as if it's tissue o feelingsnd moods. >> rose:ut is it se kind of guide and protector of values? >> i wouldn'that be moralistic about the soul. >> somebody did say and i n't want to --i'm always wired to putany cotruction on something because it piss sophie off. i don't want to pissn sophie,he nice fnch lady. >> rose: exactly. after all e brought us movie. >> sheave me a b.

>> rose: exact withness t if somebody says it seems to financial abit li a superego like a regulating device, not cessarily in a moralistic way but seems to take away some idea, e guys selfnvolved to begin with and i take t soul away and i become more, i'm horribly self-invved. >> it's intesting because yohave people say ty're ulmates. then youave people sayhe has no soul. >> right. >>e's got a lot of soul. >> in apositive way. >> but itillon't -- it ems to me means somehow authentic o there something -- >> right or it see sort of to me in some ways inthis movie to suggt some sort of ability to empathize with otr human beings. >> sougives you that. >> seems likit. >> sthen you want to get d of your soul so you can play in cle -- uh-huh. >> w do you need to get rid of your soul. >> well, the guy is just, in the movie -- it's not the artest idea. he clearly is actor. what do you wantne. >> so i meane figures he's having so mu, he feels

overrdened. his own ul is troubled and then hs playing. he's taking on thisother russian character's fraug soul so i thi he just els like he's got a surplus of this going on so maybe he'll relieve himsf of something and make it easier for him. and it does make it in s mind easier for him to nes. >> to playff. >> and ihis own mind. >> ithis science fictio >> i think so. 's maybe morebsurdist than science fiction. it is -- they're not -- >> whicmeans no money. >> too mu --. >> this your first direct orial is is your dect orial debut. >> were you scar? >> i was a bit intimidat. >> just,you know to direct. >>orking with great acrs. >> really g actors so i was a bit, th first few days i was a bit worried but then you forget about it, you're just shootg. >> and so then thiis what directors and producerdo. you have t choose between going to minneolis and

going to . petersburg. >> rht, exactly. >> and we probly could have gone to minneapoli with this but we went to st. peters. >> why did you go to st. petersbg rather than minneapo >> wel a particularly fine townment i don want to get tters from people in minute at- minneapolis. >>l franken's place. >> exactly. i think it alway matters. location can really ve you an enormous amount. >> rose: what does it give an actor. >> it gives an enormous amount, i always le going to these sange locations, particarly if they're relevant to the movie. if i have to shoot new england and i'm in buddha pest and these a little weird. >> rose: or miam >> exact. th's a little stnge but if have to be in cleveland and the movie is about cleveland and i can really be in eveland for ahile. >> rose: youoak it up. >> igives you everything st. petersburg, it gav you a whe lot. and it was all, we had ssian actors and from st. petersburg so it mtered. >> rose: does russia have a so. >> yeah, i was going t say.

st. persburg has aheavy so. you can feelt in the architture and there is a avyness there, th middle of the winter. >> rose: heavy meaning gravitas or something ee. >> the lights different is verygreen light. there is oy four hours of daight during the winter. rose: in st.etersburg. >> in the winter. >> rose: four hours daytime. >> it's higher up than you woulimagine. it closer to the arctic rcle than would you think. so it's winter --. >> re: i would be depressed. >> tre you go. that is why everybody is depressed it is very lancholy. >>ou feel the melancholee, that is th reason why a the pos were living i st. petersburg. >> rose: becausehey had nothing to do but write poetry. >> exactly. >> reduc to wring poetry. >> rose: they have a good museum there too >> a very strange museum. >> rose: so d you have any reservatio about doing a moviand wityour name as the lead character. >> i didn't really. no, i'm glad i showed up to just say tt. no, i didn't really.

i meant didn't el any more or less of a character than any otherharacter i played. noto be -- the srt answer to its no, i didn't really. i dn't want it to in any way actually resemble me. i wanted it toe a character. >> rose: but she thought of you and your persona when she wrote this scrnplay. that's more what it was about was persona rather than actual person, does that make any -- actuality. persona ani like to think thatpersona is different from the actual personaty. >> rose: how does one act without a soul? >> well, that was again, sortf the idea of roving some sort regulating device sthat the y --. >> rose: would bbetter. >> wl, we beverly confidt. there this kinof senseof him beinginng inedibly fu of himsf in some way so that's mostly t idea that sophee wanted me to pursue, was thatt's the narcsism increases teold.

>> rose: but one thi we noticed is tt he may be more pround but as a -- ambition. >> the bigst thing he is worried abouis my carr is ove that's the major thing, good god wa, have i done to my career that's it i mean that's exactly what ha is that that what he cas about. >> so when you set about to make thi what wereyou worried about? >> d we get it. >> the tone, because the tone is very triy. >> ros what does tone . >>ou know, it's on a diatribe bween mancholy andometimes slapstick and comedy. so it's difficult you try to infuse it with somsort of medy but are you asking a lot fromhe audienceo have to shiftrom these ments of laughter and then it becomeseally serious. so i was worried about nailing the tone. but i think paul has ts, he's so versati an actor he has this capacity to be

deadan and slapstick. >> how did you getim to proach the idea of acting badl >> he hirede. >> we had different, w mrworried about different things. i knew coact wl. he couldt pull vania wel and he could do theadly actingment and i was worried that the acting badly would ll very flat. >> rose: i read an inresting thing about you which basically went like this. that the one thing yo were ve about is not being vein out being vein. >>ight. i'm vein about not being in. >> rose: aut the idea that you may not be carry grant. >> right. no i think that's true. >>ose: or george clooney or that kind of actor. >> i think it'a bit of a kind of macho thing it's aittle kind of,t's a funny sort of -- it' nothing prmatic about t i'm not ever going toook like those guys.

so there is a certain pride i take it in in a funny way. no, i'm not one of ose guys. >> rose: did you always believe though tt you would ach the point that yoare, that somehow y cared enough enough talent, engh will -- >> i had -- when i stted out i had a fny pacity, i didn't, i always thought i would work. i don't thin i thought it would gony teresting, i mean i hoped it wouldmen but i alwayfelt like i would work, yes. but where it woulgo, i didn't know. and liked that about it, not hang any particur goal except to just work. d i maned to d that. >> re: and how much direction does he lik he takes, i was surised, you know an ackerhat is accomplished, he tak any direction. this is not to ilude myself in thisategory but i think good actors do take direction. >> rose: you should be in the category and a aee

with you. meryl streep who you were speaking about, iaveeard hesay that she will do a couple of takes but the that's what she did going to do so if you want her to do somethin give her direction. he she wants it. >>t was very different to work with american aors and rush arne aors. because russian ackers are heavil traedn e strap -- meth so theyeed an intention open the doo >> they have to ta about it aot. yeah. with pl it was easier. i ink he is a ttle bit like a gra pio, can play any notes. >> re: especially if you say it in a french accent. >> exactly. exactly, veryharp. i'll do anything. >> rose: say it again. >> exactly, i'll do ything. ank you, pleasure to meet you. thank you my friend, gat to s you again. are youff next to see a movie with dustin hoffman. >> i am, bar yee's version. see yothen. >> yes, sir.

peter levene isere, the chairman of lld's of london the world's largest and oldest insurce market it posted a .9 billion pound profit for 08. it's trd most profitable year. unke many of its u.s. and european rivals, lloyd steered ear of theomplex investment produs that nely halted the global financial stem last fall. the british marketas is exnding into asia, tin america and the gulf oil states. i'm pleased to have lloyd levene bacat this table. welcome. charlesie, good to see you. >> cha is your assessment of where we a in this global economy? >>ell, i think that if you look at wh happened in the last 18 months it's been tremendous ltdown. and a change in the system dramaticly. i think it's also showing a bi shift in real economic from west to et. i was inhina ten days ago. and i gett frequently, i

s on the board of th secondargest bank in chin and they're just getting on th building their economy and builng up the country. and course the have trlions of dollars sitting there. and i thk, they are very realistic now. and they are very well versed in the ways of the rld. for them to do anythg which damages the value of dollar when theye got so much otheir own wealth tied up in dollars would be potless. so they -- >> and counterproductive. >> totally counteroductive. and ihink ty're realisc enough to see at. and i don't think they have any particularnterest in wanting to -- >> they nt to growheir oweconomy. they wanto grow what they've done i their untry. >> and theknow that growing theiown economy as they see it is crucial to social, to tamping down social tension. >> well, ofcourse. becae you've got the regions where people a doing very nicely, tnk you very much. and you go further inland and th've got a ll of a lot that they are waiting for. >> but stimulus program the have has worked,500 plus

billn dollars. >>es. >> are they ing to be back at 7 and 8% growth rates. >> yes. >> in 20. >> absutely. ithink they are stil looking at 8% this year. >> thiyear. so maybe uto 9, maybe -- >> well,. >> and indias doing the same, do youhink or is that -- >> ion't know. mi far les familiar with what is going on but i think havi had the election inndiahich the first time has giv them a pretty strg mandate in the governmenti think they will be able to move ahe much me easily than in the past wre there have been so many political factions fighting to try and be on top of thing so i think india hashe ability noto get into much stronger position than it was in befehand. >> most people look at india and china as leading the economicecovery. and perhaps brazil coming i and then the united states and they see eure lagging. >> well, i wouldgree with yoabout this. ina, india, bzil. i thi they are already showing it. they a already goinging

that far. 9 united states knew far better than i h things are ing. but you still see bo in the united stas and europe news of j layoffs andlthough theinancial sector seems to be in less bad shape, let's put it that way, the realconomy, one hopes against hope that things a going to look better. but you still kee reading about job layoffs. and until that allyurns, and i don't know if that i going to happen before the end of this year, it's very difficult toell how, when we're gointo come out of it. i don't think it a question off, ofourse we will come out oit. so when we come out of this, when the global economy is back, what will be different? >> i think there will be a lot mo caution. people are going to be a lot moreautious about what th're investing in. i think govnments are going to have to b more cautious. i thinkhe companies going out and doing multimilli dollar acquisitionsre

going to be a lot more utious. and th may not be a bad thin it's been said that if you analyze a lo of t mger acquisitions taking place in recent years, the numbers ere there has been genui two pl two equalg more than fou, are not so great. so if ople are going to look at things aroundore carefully, i ink we should go along with that. and think that they have a chance to t us into rather better position than we have been inor the last few years. >> we'll talk a bit abou your busins. whenou look at what haened to aig what do you sa >> well, aig has been the largest insurern the world. aig got into very serious trouble as a corporation. because -- >> they boug a financial prodts division. >> ectly. which had thing to do with their insurae business. >>nd they did it because it offered, theythought, a ratef return that would ju enhance its stock lue. >> i'm surthat they did i becausthey thought it was a good ia at theime. buif we look at -- >> why didn'tyou do it? >> why didn'te do it? >> yeah, becae we didn't

ink it was a good idea. >> why do we have two different opinions. what made u sure it was noright and they thought it was right. >> well, i cannot get inside what their thinking wa what i can tell you what our thinking has been. our thinking has been that years gone by, lloyds got itself into serious trouble. >> right exactly. >> fortunate we got out of at mess and we are in a very stron position. and we said we're not getting into that position again. therefe any risky proposals th come along, no, thank you very much. fothe last three or four years we wl have various fince houses come along sang you're sitting on a lot of ch. we have some great ideas for you aso how to use that cash. and they would be quite colex and we would look at them and say very kind of you, but no, thank y very mu. anthey would say you know what, are you really boring. and i have to say --. >> rose: and you are missi your chance to make a lot money. >> well, i have to sayoday ing a little bit self satisfied about itwe can say ring is beaiful.

rose: whas interesting what you just said is that you learned abourisk in a way that had proound -- profound impact. >> o whole business is risk. >> re: is that what is going to be one of the lastg legacys of this global crisis? >> well, how long --. >> rose: a different appreciation ofrisk. >> risk isery important. risk for lloyds is the whole of our busiss anyway. but if you look on the narr perspective of it is w this economy and how siness is going to grow and chan in the future. then i tnk it's a question of h much people actually take note of that experience in the past. and i tked to a lot of peop who said well, we've got younger ople here who have nevereen through such a ba situation th they are in now. some of uhave had to deal with in the pa. and we have bee rather mor risk averse. and i thk that th likely outcome is that the present

generation will bemeore risk averse. but howthat longhat lasts through their colctive corporate memory of reins to be seen. >> so what ought to be the new regulato fmework? >> well, the new regulatory framork has to be one that allowshe businesses to work. and in t financial sector you cannot run a busine with no ris ifhere is no risk, there is no biness. because somebody has to stick their neckut in an intelligent way. >> right. >> so if you cut off every single element of risk,hen u're going to leave a very rrow window of opportuny for business. wh you have to do is to say there will be risk out there. but we're ing to exami it far more cloly than we d in the past. and unless the ris sometng within a pareter that we're preparedo accept the doside of if it goes wrong, then we're just not gng to do it. >> but o of the aspects that t president has spok to and people, seetary and others is that

this,hat is essential is global regatory restraints. >>ell, globa is all very well ande he st o demi global. we he demi global in europe whe the eu won't put on in t fincial sector. they won't have an you br regulator in brusels o corols everything. london we don't le that ea at all. i'llell you why. the two financial capitals of the world, and it doesn't mater who is nber one and number t have been an still e -- >> london versus new york. >> inot even london versu new york it london and new york. d they've been able to process, ty've been able to doell because they've run thgs in a pretty od way until things srted to horriblyrong. do you therefore ed to fix the regulation, yes. but w need to have regulation which is fixed i such a w that nobody is able to opera, no. d we believe particularl inlondon i think theame is true inew york, that we ould be able t he our

regulators working, having leard from the lesso of the past, and woing within a framewk that if a you going to have in europe and let's take europe for an example. if are you gng to have a framework ich lays down the major parameter, that's fine. but wh it comes to actually being the day-to-dayegulator, we want the local regulators do that who understand it. and don't want to get into a position wherwe are stifled by regulators wh don't understandhis busine. we need to have the people unrstand it and who are us to it. >> have you follow the americanegulatory recommendations of the oma administration? >> i've been looking at the insurance on becae those are e ones that afct us the most. which are a step in the right direction if a when they areut into effect. but i dot think for the is administratiothe insurance regulation is the biggest issue. it's clearly the banking. >> no, it , but it also clearly administration that wants to put re power the federalreserve. >> yes. >> and also it clearly has

this consumer aect to it that they constantly underline. >> wl, why not. you ow, imean the consumer is e voter at the end of the day. you ha to look after the consum. you have to do it on a sensible basis. anof course in the k. 've had this new constellation between the trsury, the bank of england and the s. and for whatever reason it hasn'torked well and that nes to be changed. and there's a lot of work being put in now and a lot of people have different viewss too which wayo fix it. we have to get it rig. >> take me and just inside of, when are you sitng at your office in lonn and are u on the phone wh peop around the worldand aryou sitting there with your principal advisors d you ok outand say, okay, wh is our assessment of whe the world is going. well, for us, a i'm talking narrowly aboutur owbusiness, number one market in thworld is the united states. our numberwo market is th u.k. and our number ree

market interesngly enough canada. and i don't see --. >> rose: where is china. well, china is a longay down the line. but you know in 5 years. >> rose: if you lookt wealthy individuals and althy corporations as -- >> n we're just looking at the insunce business. and where the iurance business is going to b coming from. rose: okay. >> iare you look at it much more broadly and we're saying what's coming up, yes then china is moving up very fast. cha it depends which statisticsou consult but it's eitr now the second or third largest enomy in the world. and in the fullness ofime one day will change to the biggest economy of t world. and that is wher people have g to look. and the chinese, i think the chineseis stocking it, saying what can we buy with the dollars that wve got because this the help us. you know what we've got 1.3 billion peopleere f we get this econo going right, there this igoing to be a megaa mark for us. >> if weet themso they

are participatin they will ke the demand that the united states does now. >> but chaie, this is wh they a doing now. the chinese have given discount vouchers to the rural areas for people to go t and buy fringes and tvs on. the se thas they're going to stimulate the demand. and it's staing to work. and nass why, i tnk f what they are predicting is correct, they are going to get back to 8% groh. >> rose: are you iressed withhe ldership over there. >> look, their leadership works from aery different basis from ours. >> rose: yes, it does. >>ut if you --. >>ose: called democra, demand economy. >> absolutel but how doouudge it. you judge it by results, ifou go around the untry --. >> rose:'m judging about the quality of the men and women who lead the country. >> i think they're very smart. i s in the world econic forum in janry an heard a lot of the world leaders speaking there. and you had premier speaking and i listened to h. and i'veeard him and i've

met him. but i listen to what he said and i thought this is a western politician speing. rose: exactly. he ask a art guy. >> rose: y. >> he really i >> rose:ou know what is interesting ask to talk to americans who go to chinar india as wel, at questions are they asked. you kn, and y get from people without gto china that there ian intensity of they want to know everything they can learn that you kno they want just, you know, be a sponge inabsorbing everythi you know. and as a growing condence in wt they can do with it. >> wl, we have 70,000 inese students at univerty just in the u.k. today. >> ros yeah. they're learning english. theye learninged subjects we have. anthey go back and put it into affec and if you there people can say this is just show piece. but if you went as i did the last couple day in the olympics a saw what they did if beijing, and i s there ten daysgo, theost aming thing what i saw, wasn the olympi.

friday befe last, i went to a concert in t national center for the performing arts if beijing most spectacular buiing, i don't know if you have en it, absolutely amazing. went to a concert there who was performing? the natnal symphony orchestra of washingto d.c. it was a wonderf, wondful performance. i saw it live in there. with a huge audnce of chines who were cheering tohe fters. and i said to a colleague of mine who was sittingext to me who was a american. i said wou you have believ 25 years agothat yocould be doing ts in here i this place. and he sai not in a million years. and that's wt's changing. >> rose:he new world. >> it is a neworld. >> rose: tell me how you thinpresident obama is dog, d what -- and what it is th you think people expect froamerica under his leadehip.

>> wel i think what most people believe the president is now doing is that he's got a difrent approach to thing when you hear hi ask about something, he stopand he thinks and he ges a measured reply. now whether u agree wit s reply or you don't, is not just off pat here we go it a measured reply >> rose: and that's impressive for peoe like you. >> that is impresse. you see someonewhose's thinking. now whether it is the bt answer or not mains to be seen. >> rose: do you ha great concns about some of the decisions thathis adnistration has made. it's too early to say. mean you know, give the guy a chance. he hasn't beenhere that long and heas dealt pret lousy hand of cards to pick up. and still, you kw, whenever he appearsin europe, is acclaimed. he's regarded as a new breed ofolitician. the people respect, now-. >> rose: and who hashe command of the lanage. >> he certainly haa command of the lguage. and the proo of the pudding is in the eatin once we seehe effect of what he is trying to do now,

if iworks, he wille the great hero if it esn't work, then he n't. so give th guy a cnce. >> rose: what do y think is lely. >> i don't know. >> rose: so whatan we say about the chelsee fooall club owned now by roman -- >> he has ned it quite a lo time. since he owned it it's done very well. they had a prty quick -- ofanagers going in and out am they brought in one las season, a brazilian who wasn't a gat success. they brought inhe manager of the russian team on a standby parttime basis who d an amazing job. and if it hadn't been for some rather extraoinary referring decisions th would haveon the euroan cup. t you know they're a good team and we're looking forward to see what ty do next season. >> it's your psion. >> it'not my passion but 's a great release. >> whas your passion? >>y passion i suppose is my family. >> and what out the formula one s that going to -- >> that's a rea mtery.

>> amazing. >> the financi of that is off. >> it nes some -- >> yeah. it great to see you as always. >> charlie, thank you very much. >> lloyd's of ndon continues toe successful. >> thank you. >> under your leadershi >> did they have to ve you special dispensation so yo could see another term? yes. we had to actually had to go a new act o parliame but . >> rose: nothi like being wanted s it. >> iis nice that someby wants you. >> thank you again. >> thank you very much.

>> is. >>pding for charlie rose s been provided by the followin.

>>dditional funding for charlie rose was also provided by the funders