♪ captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- ♪ >> hello, i'm llewellyn king, host of "white house chronicle," which is coming right up. but first, a few thoughts of my own. and a few props of my own. this is my summer hat. this is for going to the beach with. why would i be thinking about the beach? the answer is simple, do not forget the suntan oil, of course, and that is because the president has chosen to take his vacation in martha's vineyard.

if you do not know, mirthless vineyard is in the lead destination, an island off massachusetts where very rich bankers like to go. these sorts of people who have borrowed a lot of money from the taxpayer, from the obamas, and are now getting big bonuses. i just think it is the wrong place. when the president travels, a lot of prosperity goes with them. they do not needed on martha's vineyard, bunice as it is. no, no, mr. president. you need to go were the people are. were you leave a tale that will affect the areas for years like roosevelt and warm springs or nixon and florida, and of course, the california. these beings leave a mark.

they change patterns. biretta this moment, if the president were to take his vacation with his family, i would recommend the michigan peninsula, the upper peninsula. it is beautiful up there. it has not gotten any decent publicity since they made musicals of people swimming. with as their williams. unbelievable, but they did it up there. mr. president, you do not want to be with the rich, the oily from new york. go where the real people -- have a lovely holiday. i am planning to go to a nearby beach myself. i would show you the whole ensemble, but, you know, there may be children watching. we will be right back with three of the sharpest minds in politics to talk about the events of the day. >> "white house chronicle" is produced in collaboration with whut howard university television.

>> and now the program host, nationally syndicated columnist, llewellyn king, and co-host, linda gasparello. ♪ >> hello again. thank you for coming along. i promise you three of the brightest, sharpest minds in washington journalism, and here they are. linda gasparello, of this program. julie mason of "the washington examiner," and the great broadcaster and the columnist, bob franken. you saw him on the cnn for years. you have seen him on msnbc, and you can read him daily on the bid "politics daily." it is lovely to have all three of you on the board. let's begin with linda. the president -- congress is not here. the president is traveling around in effectively selling

the health care plan. what do you think is going on? >> i think the president is, not in effectively, trying very hard to sell his health care plan. there is a lot for us to hear. we have seen across the country. mickey personal experience -- appearances is a great idea. except he is going to up to tell the public what he wants. as of yet, he is not told the public what he wants. instead, rumor is flying everywhere. fear is flying everywhere. and loathing of what ever this plan is is flying everywhere. >> julie, is the problem with the president that he never told us what he wanted? >> he did want to avoid the mistakes of the clinton era and let congress becomes stakeholders by crafting the bill. we have five different bills as a result. no one has really read them. there are rumors, and the white

house is lost control. >> a lot of people are running around the country thinking they know what is in the. >> yes, crying and sobbing. it is ridiculous. it is like the immigration and social security debate. it makes you wonder if it will get derailed like those two. >> the you think we will see reform in health care of this congress this year? >> i think it is impossible until now. what we are seeing now is almost part of the script where people can go out and pretend that they have any influence whatsoever in the shape of the legislation, which we know will be total baloney. it will be decided by the special interests meeting in secret like everything else in our alleged marcie. but it is not going to happen. it is not even going to happen for real. the playoffs do not even begin until after congress come back. i predict we will get some sort of legislation, inadequate perhaps, but something so they can declare victory by december 30.

>> would you like to tell us what might be in this legislation? >> as much is needed that makes it -- that makes the summit they actually accomplished health care reform. probably not as much as what is needed. you'll still the insurance companies controlling the agenda. you'll still have a health care that is pretty much employee- based, employer-based which will mean a lot of out of work people. but i suspect what you might have is some sort of system or the insurance companies benefit, profit, by being able to get the money that comes from everybody required to have health insurance policy. in exchange, they will give up some of their onerous restrictions on pre-existing conditions or something like that. that would ease again reform. >> that would be a big change. but it would be far from the universal overall but obama promised. >> well, we're not going to have universal health care in this country.

it seems to violate a reduce feelings about what this country is going to be. we seem to be having a battle now between people who argue socialism and of those who seem to advocate libertarianism. there is a middle ground, of course. what do you see anything that looks like socialism coming down the pike with us? >> i do not. i do not see the red flag waving. i do not see anything like that. i see the administration that cares about getting these over 40 million people who are uninsured some kind of health care. and of course what nancy pelosi, the speaker of the house, has said, some kind of peace of mind. so if they're losing jobs, they will have something there to give them the comfort the they're not going to be destitute. >> peace of mind is a very potent phrase. it is the first thing the democrats have come up with that

is easily understood and fits into a sound bite and has meaning. >> exactly. and why we should have cheers and jeers when what i think the president is trying to deliver is government that will give people some peace of mind. i'd think is very, very sad. i mean, do people in the u.s. believe that there's so ill- served by government, the government wants to work against them in such an awful way, the villages destroyed the country as we have known? i do not think so. >> but there are a lot of angry and frightened people. and now we're crashing down meetings. a very respectable people are going and shouting as though they're on a decline in a town meeting. some have been denied the pleasures of the barricades since childhood, and now they have them in a middle-aged when they, themselves, are often the beneficiaries of the vast

government programs are medicare. >> well, we should haeckel our leaders. we should do it in public. >> i am going to heckle the white house correspondents. >> we're going to come down hard on you for that. gluc>> you hear people saying tt the government cannot even tell and the cars program, so how are they going to handle health care? the government did not create the problems in the automobile business. they tried to alleviate some of those problems. government cannot create a lot of the problems we have in health care, but they're trying to alleviate some of those. why do we have no respect for would government can do? government has done a lot of good. i think the bush administration did have -- >> are you carrying the red flag? >> with a minute.

maybe people are thinking about fema and how the government handled new orleans after katrina, but this is a different government right now. >> they're also thinking in the present tense about the inability of the government to get the stimulus package out the door because of government regulations. i am would you. the government does a lot of things quite well, but we do not look at them. we also expect the government to do an enormous number of things. we expect them to get the in the six species out of the rivers and the lookout for the swine flu and defend us. >> let's be fair. >> why is this not being fair? >> i know. it is a concept they used to be a motivation for journalism which i realize now is obsolete. but the government and also really screw things up. let's look no further than the food poisoning problems that we have had.

they're supposed to be efforts that are uncovered in the regulated by the various agencies that do that. it has been a debacle. >> with a minute, bob. i want to stop you right there. i was a reporter for a long time for food. one of the reasons why we had that the debacle was because government, with the push of industry, had decided not to regulate the way it needs to. >> but we have the government, quite frankly, that is perhaps influenced by the people that it is supposed to be regulating. that is a condition the government. i think the people are out there -- >> as we have now with health care. >> we do, without a doubt. i have written several times that if you want to talk about bureaucrats getting between you and your doctor, look no further than the insurance bureaucrats. >> right. >> all true. discussing, again, you have

that. you also have the effect that while the cold war may be over 20 years ago, people are still fighting it. they still worry that god was communists are going to take over our society. particularly where you get out there were people are not up to date on the fact of the cold war is over. in addition to which, to be fair, and the net will stop, but to be fair, we have to remember that while it is the conservatives pushing this one and manning the barricades, it has been on the other side of the spectrum, on the left, where we seen the more recent examples of people who act up. light act up or cold pink or the anti-were demonstrators. it is almost like an american tradition to go yell at somebody and you're upset. >> i would like to welcome our listeners on the sirius/xm radio, channels 110 and 130 listen to this program to reintroduce our panel.

linda gasparello, of this program. myself, llewellyn king, the most. julie mason of "the washington examiner." and bob franken of "politics daily." we appear every sunday -- a bigger part in, every saturday and at 9:30 a.m. eastern on the radio. julie, where is this anger among the well-addressed to the to these meetings to raise the barricades? there was a fun that little is used to have about that. the great unwashed liberals in the street. now, we have the super well- washed, squeaky clean destroying or certainly upsetting and bring a degree of angry debate into downhaul meetings -- into a town hall

meetings. >> no one would never cover the before, and now we cannot stop covering them. robert gibbs accused white house court -- the press corps of being disappointed because the president was not screened at in there was a bit of truth there. a lot of people went thinking that there would be fireworks, and there really was not. >> it is certainly ramp up. as you said earlier, there are five bills. yet, these people are certain they know what is in them. this is very frightening. >> of these are people who do not believe what they read a newspaper but apparently believe what ever they receive in an e-mail over the internet. there is a lot of the center -- misinformation. journalists are trying to correct what is being said. but the problem is we still do not really know what is in the bill. we know it is being talked about. but you cannot deduct the rumor when you have a lot of ambiguities and very little direction from the president.

>> we have an entrenched broadcasting right wing. it is on cable and radio. >> the fab four? >> if you want to call them that. how much do you think that this is -- kennedy, a bill in bed -- the want to name names? -- glen beck? >> i think it has been enflamed allowed by them. they have gotten into trouble for, too, because it is ugly. to spread fear and loathing -- what ever happened to the idea of we have nothing to fear but fear itself? what happened to american courage? >> it is alive and well in your town hall meetings. you see it everywhere. >> i am a product of town hall meetings. i grew up in massachusetts. town hall meetings were pieces for the aggrieved went.

>> of the doctor's been able to help you? [laughter] >> certainly not. the fact was that the town hall meetings, you were able to have civil conversations about the problems in town. everything from parking spaces to where the dogs pooped. we should be able to learn from the way things were done in the past tenderly as civil conversation going on. >> well, you talk about -- i've been the the fear of fear itself has been replaced, certainly in broadcast executive suite, but the fear of falling ratings. >> yes, sir. you said it. >> yes. and i believe that the ratings will show the those or other fanning the flames are also drawing the viewer is. we talked about reading what is

in journalism, per to go early in the newspapers, and people can get whatever information there is out there. they do not read any more. they followed the grants of whoever is preaching to their choir. it is not just the right wing thing. it is a left-wing thing, too. >> it is all on margin. they're the is viewers and of these fantastic of yours that cling to the fab four were cling to their counterparts on the other side of frankly, where we not hearing from the silent middle? where the people in the middle? wire they not coming into the town hall meetings? >> you said it. they are the silent middle. >> there might be something much larger going on. that is there is a change in the country, demographically and otherwise, and people are having the goatee is adjusting to this. the time of the traditional anglo-american ascendancy may be

over. that is an enormous change in the very hard for people to come to terms with. >> but let's be very cynical here, ok? i know that is really foreign to our profession. but let's be very cynical. one can argue that the conservative manipulators' really provoked their followers into going up and the screaming and the elected officials. now i think there will be this paradoxical cynicism or the elected officials have this -- the one to get reelected? here is the best way to do that. take all of this, and you'll get huge sympathy from the great bulk of people in that area you call the silent middle. and in the good is happening is that there is this kind of backlash. and the people yelling are making fools of themselves. >> right. >> let's discuss ourselves. bob franken, "politics daily,"

you are right thing for them. i happen to know that you are a very fine writer and quite witty. the you do a column every day? >> yes, i do. >> in der college a column, a piece, a blog? where can our viewers read you? >> www. politicsdaily.com. >> julie mason, tell me about "the washington examiner." >> it is a very frolicsome tabloid. >> i like that word. >> it is absolutely full of life and news, and i am the white house correspondent. >> your gut of the white house. you have one of those tiny spaces where you tried to typewrite. >> yes, and down in the basement like something out of dickens.

>> you know, everybody who goes over there for the first time and sees the press facilities, especially reporters from overseas, are appalled. >> shoulder-to-shoulder. >> other places that enormous rooms with adjustable seats and a place for a computer. you come back to the white house and it is much more insignificant. and there you are. they spend a lot of money we doing it, but all they have done is painted and closed up some of the rat holes we're real life white house rats years to come into the briefing room. >> considered the possibility when they close guantanamo down, simply transferring the detainees to the white house press area. although the may really be a violation. >> i was talking about the obama vacation before we went on the air.

and bob franken said, why does he not go to guantanamo? >> it is beautiful, and talk about great security. if you want to talk about a gated community, that is it. [laughter] >> tell us more about this frolicsome newspaper? the idea of a frolicsome newspaper is intriguing. >> we have a lot of fun with it. it is terrific. you can find it at washington andexamine your dog, -- washingtonexaminer.com. the sea is a very liberal city, but most of our opinion writers are very conservative. they bring a different aspect. >> they are conservative. >> right, but our news pages are very straight. >> that is excellent. you have been wearing your hat as general manager of this program, linda, and we have picked up a lot of new stations. >> yes. >> we welcome all those viewers.

>> by my count, we have about 200 in some great cities like miami, los angeles, and denver. today, "white house chronicle," and tomorrow, the "leno show." >> how about that? we have not discussed what is going on internationally. the president is on the the television all the time he may be one of the most exposed president in that sense. at was speaking to them lady who does that make up for us here, and she does the president quite often. she says she's always been called to the white house these days. incidently, she says he is a very nice and very humorous man. good to year. -- that is good to here. tell me, why is he not talking about the middle east or afghanistan? >> why would you talk about

afghanistan? >> and why is it not talking about iraq? these are things on his plate. he cannot push them away. >> you know, the problems in the middle east are so entrenched and will include afghanistan and the greater middle east. afghanistan is going to prove to be one of the most of the cult things we have ever done. i do not think it is a matter of as surging troops into a culture -- a country that has been basically routed out the english, the russian, and of course, in the end. they will route us out, too. if we do not citigroup on what tribal societies like in afghanistan, -- if we do not get a grip on what troubled society is like in afghanistan, we will never get it. >> you traveled in afghanistan before the taliban and this. what was it like then? >> it was a very tribal with the

difficult terrain. yet, there were things about afghanistan that were quite wonderful. in northeast afghanistan, it is an area that had university, where women went to university. there was order in it, but it was a very troubled country. you had to remember that. -- it was a very tribal country, and you have to remember that. the rounding out of the taliban is like cockroaches. you'll get them out of one area like helmand province, but they will scattered to other areas. >> are you saying we cannot win? it will have to declare an informal victory? >> how do you win against the opium trade? >> not with the war on drugs but we proved that. >> and that is key to everything. they are planting open production with eggplants.

-- opium production with eggplant. >> when the philip morris co., in the 1960's, decided it had to get out of tobacco because the new tobacco was a killer -- they would not admit it, but i knew it. they knew the country was busy trying to give up smoking in the 1960's. the thing about that was the they were going to give it up, so they thought it would get into other things like chewing gum, razor blades, and with their marketing muscle, they said we will just plow through. but it is easier to sell a drug. they could not use the marketing that was so effective in getting people to change cigarettes. it did not work for the razor blades. this is the same. people will do incredible things and pay incredible prices for drugs. it is time now for our high

notes and our low notes. bob franken -- >> i will talk about high. you'll have to stay with me. linda was talking about how what would be that we could replace the opium crop in afghanistan with the eggplant crop. if somebody could find out how to create an eggplant heigh, i guess we could do that. >> purple haze. [laughter] >> i used to have some relationship with the fillmores company in the 1960's in new york. they did not understand that it was easier to sell a drug, tobacco, that was to sell anything else. they thought they had marketing skills that they actually did not have. they had marketing skills that could give you to switch from camel to fillmores, but they took on other consumer products -- no problem, they thought it would be able to do it.

of course, it was a disaster. they cannot sell chewing gum or shaving cream. my dear, what about yours? >> mine is a high and low. i am taking both. levi johnston, a great looking kid, interesting to watch. he needs to zip it. it looks like my high-school boyfriend. i have no problem with that. the stop talking about sarah palin. >> my is -- minus the loan. the passengers on their plan strapped for nine hours. this is an abomination. we need a passenger's bill of rights. we needed now. >> we were about people who are kidnapped, essentially, a corporation kidnapping these people. we will let you go now. our show is over. no kidnapping. we'll be will come out next week for more of "white house chronicle." until then, all the best and

watch what airplane you're right in. cheers. ♪ >> "white house chronicle" is produced in collaboration with whut howard university television. from washington, d.c., this has been "white house chronicle" -- a weekly analysis of the news with insight and a sense of humor, featuring llewellyn king, linda gasparello, and guests. this program may be seen on pbs stations and cable access channels. to see the program online, visit us at whitehousechronicle.com. whitehousechronicle.com.