>> good evening. from los angeles i am tavis smiley. tonight a conversation with one of the biggest names in popular music, dave matthews. they are coming out with our first project. the new disc is called big whiskey, which made its debut at number one on the billboard charts. the c.d. is dedicated to moore and the city of new orleans. dave matthews coming up right now. >> there are so many things that

wal-mart is looking forward to doing, like helping people live better. but mostly, we are looking forward to helping build stronger communities and relationships. because of your help, the best is yet to come. >> nationwide insurance proudly supports tavis smiley. tavis and nationwide insurance, working to improve financial literacy and the economic empowerment that comes with it. >> nation wide is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ tavis: a few quick programming notes. tomorrow night i will be joined by ken burns on his documentary

on the national parks system. on wednesday, a conversation with ted kennedy, jr. on the release of his father's memoir and rumors that he may seek the senate held by his father. today i am please todd kick off the week with dave matthews, the front man for the band that bears his name. the band formed 20 years ago. the latest project is called big whiskey. say that fast three times. >> did you that very well. >> dedicated to the band's late great sacks player. here is some of the video for "why i am." ♪

♪ tavis: nice to meet you. >> great to meet you. >> great to have you on this program finally. >> i have been trying to get on here for a while. i know we have been almost getting to each other. tavis: a couple of times our paths almost crossed. the first time our paths crossed was a couple of years ago in new york, sitting outside a restaurant i like in new york in mid town. i am sitting there eating, and i look up and you and one of your bapped mates were casually walking down the street. i about spit my food up and almost jumped on you jumping down the street. i am glad i didn't. >> if i had seen you, i don't know if i would have jumped on

you. i might have, but i am exciteded. >> i am glad you are here, number one. >> thank you. >> the second time our paths almost crossed, you were actually booked on our program a while ago, and literally the day that you were booked to come on, you lost your band mate. >> yes. >> who this at bum is partly dedicated to. obviously his passing has a locality to do -- lot to do with this project. >> we were half way through it. we had written a lot of the music and sort of had the spirit of the album creating. it was coming together, and we dependent know exact hi how. we were bringing it into focus. he was injured and some months late died from his injuries from an tavis on his form in virginia. it was devastating for us because we had been together for almost 20 years and been friends for more than that. but it did bring a focus to what

we were doing. we had a show that night here in l.a., whether we were going to play the show or not. and carter and i decided right then that we should play the show because that was sort of -- it was our first choice i think in a series of right choices or healing choices, was to mourn him doing what we did with him rather than mourn him by stopping. tavis: yes. >> and then the at bum, i think its focus came because of all the things we had learned from him and all the time we had with him, both god and bad. he was a tough friend. tavis: yes. >> but i'm grateful to have known him, and i think the result shows there. tavis: two follow-ups on that. one, how does losing someone to integral to the band, the sound of the bad, how does that change the band in the months and years

that follow? >> well, i suppose being together for so long, you have both positive and negative things that you grow in a relationship. you try and newerish the things that are good -- nourish the things that are good in a relationship. it so happens at that point when he was injured, we were in a way in one of the best places that the band hmb in -- had ever been in. in a way, that was fortunate, not that he had the accident, but that we were in a great place so that it didn't leave a blanket of negative over us. but it cast a light over us, you know, his music and what he did. but i guess what became more

profound or pertinent in the band was his -- was the things he talked about musically, and that was i guess the honesty. he would always talk about these things even when i wanted to choke him. he would come out of his dark place and say you know, you have got to be honest. remember those jewels of our friendship, although it was a difficult one. those great things. it is as if all the bad things in a -- and in a relationship i guess this often happens -- the bad things turn to dust, and the wisdom and all that he left us really stayed and was a motor yator. i miss him, and there will be moments when we are on stage when i -- you swear -- i feel hick in the room, you know. there will be a moment when i am turning and i expect -- and i

imagine that will become less and less, but i turn and expect to see him there because he is so ingrained in my mind. there are many ways to react, but i think the best is to honor him by carrying on with as much depraved abandon as he would permit. tavis: i lost a dear friend here recently that we talked about here on this program, a long-time producer, 42 years of age, who died of breast cancer. you said something a moment ago that got my attention, and i think i get it, but i want to be sure i get it. you referred to leroy as a tough friend. is that like tough love? >> it is interesting because i am not easy. but he was a very tortured soul. but also, not only was he tortured and sometimes angry and

sometimes -- he was almost infuriating and repulsing, but it was because he was tortured by whatever it was in his life. by frustration, maybe the same things we are all frustrated by, maybe not able to say or get your ideas across, not feeling the freedom that you want when you want it, whatever holds us back. he was frustrated by things, and he would take it out on himself and take it out on his friends. but also inside that was someone that would tell you things or at moments would be so generous and so kind, the way he was with his music. when he put the horn in his mouth, it was genuine, and he was searching. you could hear it because it was never the same thing. he was always looking for something else.

i fell first in love with him as a musician listening to him play, and that blew my mind. right from the beginning, he was that same person. hey, dave, how's it going? right away he treated me like a peer. he made me feel like a man. he would go hey, dave, how's it going? at the same time he could walk in and say get away from me. he was two people at the same time. i deeply loved him, and also he could walk into a room and just destroy how you felt. but he could walk into the room, and he would come in a and be like tell a joke or say something joyful, and everybody right away -- it would lift everyone's spirits up. you remember people often, and to sort of honor them we tend to say all the great and wonderful

things they did. but i think if he were alive now, and he heard me talking about him and talking about all the shiny good-looking bits, and i didn't talk about the fact that to many people, and to me quite often, he was someone that i wanted to choke, he would be disappointed because he didn't suffer to be a fluffy bunny. tavis: i want to move on now. when i asked you about what you meant by refering to him as a tough friend, your first response was ok, i know i can be tough. what did you mean by that? i want to explore this. we love you on you're on staining. i am trying to figure out whether we would want to spend time hanging out and working with dave matthews? what it you mean? >> we are all in different ways. i think -- i mean it may be tougher for my friends to figure out where i am going, because i tend to walk into a room and

just be a fairly positive person. but that can be difficult when you're trying to get something done. i have more of the fluffy bunny syndrome than my friend leroy did. when he would come into a room, i would say everything's good. he was like i am going to kill him. i could see it in his face. he used to call me a could meal on. he would be next to me. someone would walk into a room, and i could turn into somebody else in a sense. i don't notice it. he used to say he enindividual -- envied it a bit. he took it as sort of dishonest. i took it as taking the easiest route. if i want to get over there, i

will tend to go straight to it. but if there's a fire over there , a comfortable chair over there, and i can get there a round about way, i will do it that way rather than try to jump over the fire. tavis: would you say that you are a camille onchameleon -- chameleon musically, or have you found your niche and will stay in it? >> i have heard people say they don't have an identity, or the band doesn't know what it wants to be, and i like that. i love music. as a writer, and i don't know if i succeed or not. it is hard to be objective from this side. i suppose someone else can be. i try and find something different. i try and change. you know, i am going to be trapped inside my own mind in a

way, but i try and look for something that will be new for me to play. not like another version of the same thing. so i hope that i'm a chameleon. i hope that to a point. tavis: i have seen these same critiques. when critics say the band doesn't know what it wants to be or who it wants to be, you you said earlier that you don't mind troubled by that. the question is how does a band that doesn't know what it is or what it wants to be find such a massive, loyal following? >> i'm not sure, but maybe -- tavis: would you say your fans are lost too? we are all lost? >> yes. say someone like marvin gaye or someone like cat stephens, i think one of the things about --

not only them. bob marley or john lennon, one of the things that appeals about their music is they sound like they are searching for something. not always, but there's a quality of like where do i go from here, and i think maybe that appeals to people. but also, the band is pretty open when we perform. i am sure there are fans that would like us to be more open, but we try and keep a freshness about what we are doing. so some things will be unexpected, and hopefully there will be surprises for us to keep us interested, and as well, surprises for the audience. so that they don't know necessarily what to expect when they come to a show, but only that we are committed to giving the very best that we have to give. i think that is something that people sense, is that we are not

pretending, you know. at least i hope people don't get that impression because i know that we give everything that we have when we are performing. tavis: i am going to out you right quick here on national television. when you sat down in the chair and we had a chance to chat, as we typically do with musical guests, we played a clip of you guys live in london, and dave leaned over to me and said to me, tavis, maybe one day i am going to learn to sing in key. those are your words, not mine, that maybe one day you will learn to sing in key. talk to me about that? how can you hear you have receive and say -- yourself and say i am learning how to sing in key and justify all these records that you are selling and the stadiums sold out around the world? saying i am learning how to sing in key? >> in the studio, i would hear

my voice and say oh, that sounds pretty good. i can say i don't want to ever hear that again, and someone will mute it. but live, i feel like this is going pretty well. but then when i hear it back, quite often, i am like oh, boy. i don't know why i can't decide just to go in tune. i live just a little sharp or a little flat. that is my comfort zone, out of tune, and it is just infuriating, i know. [laughter] tavis: can i quote you on that? my comfort zone is out of tune. >> and i don't want it to be. obviously it is. i'm hearing something different. somebody could give me a lesson. tavis: apparently it doesn't matter to the audience. what they are hearing is, to your phrase, good music. they are hearing and seeing your thenitiesity.

you guys are having a good time and not pretending. >> maybe i am a little more critical than they are. i don't want to be sure like that. i don't know. maybe in my head i hear this great big powerful voice when i am singing. and then when i hear it, it sounds more like the lollipop guild, and i am representing. when i hear it recorded, i say oh, no. i remember as a kid with the tape decks, the first time i was shocked. why i chose music, i have no idea. i remember being a kid and recording that voice, hello, hello. what is that? hearing my voice back, and you go oh, my goodness. tavis: that moment. i hated the way i sounded. >> yeah. who is that? that's terrible. but i still love doing it. that's my focus. if i am allowed to do it, and

i'm so fortunate to be able to do it. and it is a therapy for me, too, when i sing. i am certainly as much there for myself as i am for the audience whatever frustrations i have in my life, i can open my mouth and shout, even if it doesn't having anything to do with the song. i can just scream. tavis: my mother -- the audience can't see this, my mother watches the show every night and lives in indiana. you can't see her, but she is sitting on the set off camera over there. she made me promise the last time when i came back from south africa, if i ever went again, i would take her. i haven't told her yet, but i just agreed to give a speech there, and i am taking my mom. i say that because i know you were born in south africa. i hear it on certain words. what does being born there and living there have to do with the influences on your music, if

any? >> my mom always says that she hears a lot of south african music in the songs i write, sometimes more than in others. i think one of the things that i always loved about the music, like when i would be at my uncle's house, he owned a dairy, and i would sneak down to where the workers were living, and i would listen to at-bat ar players and sing. it could be really complicated music that they were playing, but there was an openness to how they approached it. that was very different then. here's a song in a sort of european kind of way or the way we are used to. verse-chorus >> verse chorus

>> bridge. not to oversimplify it. there was a way, conversational like in bluegrass or jazz, and they are all playing, but it didn't necessarily look like a crazy person. there was a circular quality to it that thrilled me then. i don't try to make it aparent -- apparent. in high school i became obsessed with the music around me. i was surrounded, because of apartheid with white kids.

so it was interesting for me to have this whole other music that was right there that wasn't being embraced as much. as we got older, those of us that sort of joined the liberal movement and the progressive movements in that country, liberal being not the popular word here. i am a raging liberal. i haven't seen them. tavis: i thought ted kennedy was the last one. dave matthews is here. >> he was almost one. i thank him for his efforts. [laughter] there was this music that was happening right there around us when any of his high school. i remember the first time i heard it, heard some music -- i was 15 or something.

and down in the valley near a house, i heard these whistles. and then the other whistles came in, and it changed the time signature. i was like what is going on down there? that is unbelievable what they are doing down there. there was all this group of people playing, and i didn't want to interrupt them. just sitting on my lawn and listening to these people. that ends up in being in 13 or some crazy time signature. and then i was listening to a peter gabriel record, and right at the beginning of one of the songs -- i may be wrong, but i think tflings like "mercy street" or something, and i heard the same sound. a guy from across the world could find this and slip it into his music. and it was right there, and my friends, the way the culture was growing up, we were being

separated from this vast and deep well of music that goes back forever. it seemed like an additional insult to how much we can get from each other, and i think that inspired as much my view of bigotry and politics, and social change. music probably affected my view of it, of the problems of the world, as much as words, or speeches, or individuals that were in politics. tavis: whatever you were supposed to get from hearing that, you got it. dave matthews has got soul, y'all, a lot of soul, and i love that about him. the new project from the dave matthews band is called big whiskey and the king. if you get a chance to see him on tour, check him out.

enjoyed talking to you. >> what a delight to meet you. >> that is my show for tonight. catch me on p.r.i. or access through a podcast from our website. until then, good night from l.a. , and as always, keep the faith. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley. >> join me next time with ken burns on his documentary on the national parks system. that is next time.

we will see you then. >> there are so many things that wal-mart is looking forward to doing, like helping people live better. but mostly, we are looking forward to helping build stronger communities and relationships. because of your head, the best is yet to come. >> nationwide insurance proudly supports tavis smiley. tavis and nationwide insurance, working to improve financial literacy and the economic empowerment that comes with it. nation is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like thank you.