♪ captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- ♪ king, a, i'm llewellyn host of "white house chronicle." i am amazed at the way the president approaches energy issues. he goes right up to the break and withdraws. for example, he said and as

costly said he was for nuclear power but he refused to develop the yucca mountainside for the waste which means he put the whole business back 50 years. now we have the keystone pipeline bringing oil from the oil sands, we as to call them tar sands, oil that has been retorted out of the shale to the refineries on the gulf coast. it is an amorphous -- it is an enormous mining undertaking. it has considerable environmental impact. let us remember that canada is not somalia. it has some of the toughest environmental laws in the country and maybe in north america. and maybe the most completely developed environmental ethic in north america.

to give the back of his hand to the canadiens after they have done all their environmental studies and we have done all of ours and to go to the brink and to say we will delay and do it after the election is rude to our neighbors and their best energy suppliers and does he think they will not find other markets for this oil? linda and i were talking to the canadian minister of natural resources very recently and he said we will build a pipeline to the west coast of canada. will be big and expensive but we cannot not develop that resource. why does the president goes so close and chicken out at the last minute? it is very disturbing and is not good for our international relations and is not good for our energy supply and ultimately, politically, not good for the president. i have a wonderful team to

discuss the issues of the day with you today. i have some the best journalists in america and we will be right back. ♪ >> many have spoken out on the need to transition to a clean energy future. at exelon we are acting. we're helping our customers and communities reduce their emissions and offering more low carbon and electricity in the marketplace. actionon, we're taking and seeing results. ♪ >> white house chronicle is produced in collaboration with w h u t, howard university television. and now, the program, nationally syndicated columnist llewellyn king and coast linda gasparello. ♪

>> hello again and thank you for coming along grid i promised you a super group of people and here they are. linda gasparello of this program, honor, a legendary journalist from ", the washington ""terrance sammy baugh and from sirius xm radio, tim farley. this is just slightly different from what you are used to. we have cameras. you cannot scratch yourself. >> i shall be careful. >> that is the main difference. between radio and television. linda, the middle east, iran, more concerned that there will

be bombing, that israel will go in or that american hawks will persuade are sometimes wavering president to do something -- >> or the republican candidates may do it, to? >> they cannot do anything because they have not been elected yet. you have been to a run and you speak farsi. >> i think the president's approach which has been to isolate them and find out more about them and try to work with the international institutions is the best approach at this point. i cannot imagine that if iran is a tactic that it will destroy what they've got built up and it would lead to a huge conflagration in the area. >> i think we have forgotten

that the military have said that we need to live with an iranian bomb. three outgoing military leaders who retired this past year have said it would be madness to bomb iran. >> you wrote a very intriguing column recently about what you called the black swans in a conference in washington, a secret conference, did that touch on iran? can you tell us what that was? >> it is a group that meets the summer in the world and they don't like to be quoted by name. it is nothing sinister about it. people fly in from different parts of the world and they speak off the record. people were worried about the amount of black swans accumulating. if you look at the 99ers, you

can understand where the movement is coming from. you can read the gao report that 1% of the country owns 40% of the country. >> i hear those are your friends in palm beach. [laughter] >> i think to take your question back to american politics -- i think we are looking at an argument about the iranian bomb that is very abstract and very ideological and detached from reality. in some ways, it mirrors the argument we had about iraq and weapons of mass destruction. he listened to the republican candidates say they absolutely agree that we should be willing to go to war to stop iran from getting a bomb. i think that is in some ways very disturbing and senate us down a path where the

conversation does not seem rooted in reality. >> do you think it is something they talk about only for the primary? >> i would be more comfortable if i thought it was just a political fight for the primary but i think it is a position that is not very well thought out which allows you to stumble into situations where you cannot get out with huge consequences. >> 5 of the world's nuclear powers around iran, israel, india and pakistan, russia to the north, and the american fleet to the south. the hsah -- the shah said they would be a nuclear power. he was popped into that position by nixon. the iranians still think of the semi. >> geopolitically, what does that mean to be a nuclear power?

verses of 1971 or 1960? the thinking around this idea developed than. learning to live with it may be a strategic way to go at this point. >> called nuclear weapons are not that easily made -- nuclear weapons are not that easily made. the engineering is extraordinarily sophisticated. all the way down to the kinds of explosives used in the detonator. to assume a country wants a weapon and it has some ties -- scientists that it would automatically have one that is equal -- >> the material is is problematic. trying to get the uranium you need -- >> the nuclear industry which i used to know quite well is very upset when the israelis bombed the iraqi reactors in 1981. in hindsight, the israelis were right. there was no good intent to there at all.

the world moves on. our nuclear weapons are fairly sophisticated. the first generation of a nuclear weapon as in north korea is obviously very primitive, probably as dangerous to the people making it as it is to the people to whom it might be delivered and we don't know about the state or we don't know publicly what the state of the pakistani weapons are. >> there was a story recently that showed that after a fair amount of testing, computer modeling, that many of our early nuclear weapons would not have detonated because of a catastrophic failure. it was not because we test of that because we model de. >> was a because they were assembled on the plane? they thought it was so lethal. let's get off nuclear weapons. >> thank-you. >> we have a small suitcase

outside. coming down to the wire on the super committee -- what is your feeling? >> un die have had this conversation and i think at that time i was confident and my confidence has eroded and i have become more contentious. it is difficult to imagine how the committee is getting its way through this. i would not say it is hopeless but -- >> does it remind you of a couple of drugs arguing about the bar bill? >> i thought someone on the committee might tip the balance because you only need one more. >> as more and more stories have come out about this, congress does not feel as bound as we thought it once was to use the ghastly phrase that you can kick

this once more down the road. i remember on your own program on channel 124, i thought there were glimmers of hope in the beginning and that i, too, feel discouraged. >> the super committee is itself -- it will fail but the super committee is about failure. the only reason it exists to do what it is supposed to do. you have 12 people tasked with what 535 people were supposed to do so you essentially have a very concentrated form of the failure we have seen in washington for last 10 months or year. >> they tried to make the consequences of reaching an

agreement so heinous and now they will let the mandated cuts go away and somehow they will undo those or live with the cuts until such time as that won't. they have just changed the rules. >> an english philosopher said democracy works until people finally vote themselves money. >> it was not made. >> i don't think of you as an english philosopher. i think of you as a washington philosopher. you are probably right up there with the best of the english philosophers. >> i don't think you could insult me more. >> down to think the principal reason is because defense is considered a sacred cow and yet the defense is the first thing we should cut after wasting $1 trillion in a rock and half a trillion dollars in afghanistan? >> i agree, he to the tribes as

their own sacred cows. the democrats have theirs and republican have there's. defense is not really touch the ball and the republicans do not believe it should be touched in any way. >> they don't have the imagination to think of what happens next with -- which is robotic or fair. >> that's where the cuts could be made. >> leon panetta is concerned that these mandated cuts would be very damaging to security. >> his job would not be as big. >> at exactly. >> the immediate problem -- immediate meeting next week or two weeks from now -- what won't happen is because there is no sense of urgency -- there is no sense the government will shut down and without a crisis triggered, nobody does anything. i think that is reflective of the larger problem where people don't understand the problem or

agree on what the problem is. there is a sense that we need to do something about the deficit but we can do it either on one side or the other with people trading off is foolhardy. >> we will borrow more money from china. >> i would like to take a moment to remind our listeners on channel 124, the channel that has the best political radio in the nation and it can be heard across the nation. you're listening to "white house chronicles." ." king andself llewellyn linda gasparello. >> i am with csis. the world.it around i don't work there. >> that is quite a distinction. of csis and from "the washington

post," and tim farley. this program can be seen around the world on the station's of the voice of america. we have this situation and nobody now cares and are we informed about the situation in europe where it tilly is teetering and greece is in horrible shape -- where italy is teetering increases in horrible shape and spain may go. >> the three networks are far more interested in domestic stories. >> what about the political class? are they not informed by what happens elsewhere in the world? >> i think there is a disconnect. part of this is the idea of american exceptionalism that that cannot happen to us. there is a smaller group of

people worried that we could be infected by this but largely, no, this is a sense -- >> it has been reduced largely to a punch line that we're not increase. it is interesting we see a change in the players like silvio berlusconi and a change in the government of greece and with the euro existing with its disparate group of the economies that are different from one another and they have different interests and yet they have a common currency -- you wonder how long that can continue. >> we had the president going to europe. we have had tim geithner going to europe. there is a sense that it is their problem and they will have to straighten it out and we have left them to do it. they did not really want to take advice from us because all they felt we began the whole thing with our own problems. >> with the mortgage disaster.

>> right, i think it begs the question about whether the euro really is going to be viable. how much longer will germany going to put up with this? >> consider how you dismantle the currency. it is like an empire. empires are messy and when they come apart. dismantling a currency, you have to have amazing cohesion to do it. >> what happens is it collapses. >> at exactly. >> we're not as looking at greece but spain. >> i don't understand what you mean by collapse. you will have to replace it with local currencies that preceded it but there is no orderly way. there is no economic textbooks

which says how to get out of that multi-national currency back international currency. >> i have seen gold at $5,000. >> i am very disturbed by the price of gold for other reasons. it is the effect is having in africa. my father used to mine for gold from time to time in what is now zimbabwe. it was pegged by the united states government because the gold standard at $35 per ounce -- it was not enough money to survive on -- there is another effect of the high price of gold -- >> along that river you have all the terrible things that can go wrong an average fell like loss and as an murder and claim- jumping, theft and massive

pollution of the river. it has been torn up. this is what the unintended consequences are so that gold has become white blood diamonds, a source of misery. i just mention that and maybe a bit of an aside. people say gold is marvelous but it does not do anything. once they buy gold they have gold. >> the effect on the market is of a buy gold, they are not getting into stocks. there are wild gyrations in the market. >> if we have the euro collapse, they will not be able to go to gold. if they buy gold, it is expensive. the largest gold reserves in the world are still in fort knox. >> are not sure of this is a function of our economic times but the isolationism seems to be increasing in this country.

america sometimes draws in on itself. we sought in the 1930's and we see it now and not sure if it is necessarily a good thing. people have their own lives to worry about and don't want to be concerned about other countries. >> this is quite dangerous which is when you come to believe in america unexceptionalism, that the rules of the economies and war do not apply to us because we are different. >> there was some is to support that up until -- the world economy has changed and we are connected in a different way. the way that many people in this town think about it is europe has problems and we have problems but most of our problems -- this is a very american view -- we are looking to the future and that is not europe or asia. that was the theme of the entire trip the president embarked on. >> europe, not asia?

>> asia, not europe. >> what about the united states? it seems that a candidate who would be a brilliant speaker and very knowledgeable who says it is time to come home and rebuild america before china each our lunch would be a popular candidate. >> does anybody want to venture an opinion about what is happening in the republican race? >> they are keeping the comedians in business. >> it seems to be giving -- there seems to be a law that made from the as to get 24% in every poll. -- there seems to be able mi thattt romney has to get 24% in every poll. it is not necessarily parlor games. >> linda, what about these two

public outpourings on the extreme fringes, the 99ers, they occupy wall street, the tea party? they are probably quite close in their anxiety and frustration. what does it say about our political system and do they have enough traction to change anything? i think that tea party may have changed of the republicans. >> the tea party is a party of the past. they were comfortable with the way things were done in the past and have their feet firmly planted there. i think the occupied walle streetsrs are the movement of the future. they said we're not getting jobs and are not happy with institutions. if we're going to have a future that does not just reward the 1%, we have to do things to change that. >> they don't seem to have a

political component that could bring about that change unlike the tea party. >> exactly. >> it may be an impotent movement. >> you are reminded that karl marx said that capitalism would eventually so this is of its own destruction. when you see the $70 million bonuses on wall street and one guy created his own hedge fund and made $200 million, something is clearly wrong with the capitalist system. >> h.g. wells >> i feel i am in an intergalactic temporal times on. >> you are. >> h. g. wells said, and he was wrong, that capitalism would perish in the face of socialism because socialism was a system and capitalism was not a system. >> what we are practicing today

is not democratic capitalism . >> no, i can get more and tough on you. >> let's go back to the tea party vs occupy wall street -- what you see on both sides is this kind of in articulated anger and anxiety about the way things are. with the tea party, they attach themselves to the republican party which was flagging in energy and enthusiasm. there was a deal made, a bargain, that in some ways the republican party is regreting and i don't know the democrats will go down the same road with occupy wall street. >> linda, give me a high note or loan note. >> my high node is the unhairing sense of humor in new york when they occupy whate straightrs or even do i -- or of a duet from the park -- were evicted from

the park harass someone came back and said under new management. >> my height now it is that i hope someone will be elected to try to save what i consider the best system in the world which is democratic capitalism. we don't know how this will play alabaout. >> i have to go to nancy pelosi who in response to a request from rick perry to debate says she was not sure she could do because she was in portland one day, california the next day, and she could not remember where she was the third day. >> i will echo that in that this is a process that can be messy but it is the best process by which we can choose leaders in this country. >> we can't just say that and said with it. it has to continue to work and

we have paralysis and the political system. would you say we have paralysis on capitol hill? >> i would say we have paralysis on capitol hill. >> only that the its activism and activism will begin activity. >> when you have committees and subcommittees, you know something is seriously wrong. >> what would your solution be? >> a candidate who understands what is wrong with the system and will leave the country into reforming it. >> do you see such a person? >> my candidate is john hulsman. >> i agree with you but that is your show for today. good luck to you, mr. huntsman. have a good time, all the best, cheers. ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ >> many have spoken out on the need to transition to a clean energy futures. at exelon we are acting, by 2020, we are committed to offsetting 15 million metric tons of greenhouse gas emissions annually through greening our operations, helping our customers reduce their emissions, and offering more low carbon electricity in the marketplace. at exelon, we're taking action and seeing results. ♪ >> white house chronicle is produced in collaboration with w. h. beauty, howard univ. tell. vision from washington, d.c., this has been white house chronicle, a weekly analysis of the news with insight and a sense of humor featuring

llewellyn king, linda gasparello, and guests. this program may be seen on pbs stations and cable access channels. did you the program on line, this of us as white ho