the u.s. operation over the weekend that sees top al qaeda suspect al-liby from the streets of tripoli. ali zeidan was reportedly released after a group of armed protesters fired on the building where he was being held. the obama administration plans to scale back a egypt's military government three months after the ouster mohamed morsi. the state department said the u.s. will withhold hundreds of millions of dollars in military assistance until credible progress is made toward a "inclusive democratically elected civilian government." the withheld equipment reportedly include tanks, f-16 aircraft, apache helicopters, and harpoon missiles. military training will continue. the white house has avoided the automatic suspension of military aid to egypt by refusing to deem or see's ouster a coup. a group of haitians and their advocates have filed a lawsuit against the united nations for

the cholera outbreak in haiti that has killed more than 8000 people and sickened more than 600,000. the disease strain has been traced to you in peacekeepers from nepal who deployed after haiti's 2010 earthquake. the u.n. rejected a formal petition for compensation to the victims earlier this year. the suit seeks damages from the u.n. and class-action status on behalf of thousands of victims and their families. a new study is warning global temperatures could increase the point of no return the middle of the century. based on climate modeling for researchers at the university of hawaii say if greenhouse gas emissions are not reined in, average worldwide temperatures around 24/7 will be warmer than at any point between 1860-2005. the changes could be so extreme the coldest year the future could still be warmer than the hottest year in the past. the head of greenpeace international has offered to exchange his own freedom for the

release of 28 environmentalists and two journalists facing piracy charges in russia. the arctic 30 were detained in a greenpeace direct action against russia's first arctic offshore oil rig last month. greenpeace executive director offered to live in russia as a guarantor for the activists release on bail. >> given our activists have been denied bail yet again today, i have gone to president putin, seeking and urgent meeting with him and offering myself as a for bail in exchange for the activists and to stay in russia for as long as the trial takes. i recognize the risk in this given i have participated in exactly the same action last year, however, given the urgency the united nations has just called on us to act on climate change and the fact the a are running out of time, this is a

risk we are prepared to take. >> russia says it plans to bring new charges against the detained activists after claiming to have found illegal drugs and potential military equipment on board the seized ship. to hear our extended interview with kumi naidoo, you can go to democracynow.org. president obama has formally unveiled janet yellen as the next pitcher of the federal reserve. she currently serves as the vice chair under current head ben bernanke, whose term ends in january. record.ed her track >> she is renowned for her good judgment. she sounded the alarm early about the housing bubble, excesses and the financial sector, and risks of a major recession. she doesn't have a crystal ball, but she does have a keen understanding how markets and

the economy work. not just in theory, but in the real world. >> i think we all agree, mr. president, that more needs to be done to strengthen the recovery. particularly for those hardest hit by the great recession. we have made progress. the economy is stronger and the financial system sounder. >> she will be the first woman to serve as federal reserve chair, although she is been described as a progressive nominee, she previously supported the repeal of the glass-steagall act that separated the marshall and investment banking. she back to 1993 nafta agreement , which critics say has undermined worker and environmental rights. in other white house does, heather zichal, president obama's chief climate advisor, has resigned. -- her tenure was marked by speculation she wasn't given enough authority to tackle

global warming initiatives. california governor jerry brown has signed into law a measure expanding access to abortions by allowing more health practitioners to provide them. under the law, nurse practitioners, nurse midwives and physician assistants will be able to perform the common surgical procedure known as aspiration during the early stages of pregnancy. four other states allow nurse practitioners to provide such abortions. the law's authors say it will help bring abortion to remote areas that lack providers. relatives of a slain african- american man in georgia are accusing police of shooting him dead without cause in his own home. police were purely summer to the home of jack lamar roberson by accident after his fiancée called 911 to seek emergency medical help. he was diabetic and a purely had been acting erratically. when police showed up instead of an ambulance, officers say he was armed with two knives, but his fiancée tearfully denied the police account.

>> he didn't have nothing in his hands at any time at all before -- anytime why they was here. they just came in and shot him. he didn't say nothing. the police did not say nothing. anything. it was like a silent movie. you couldn't hear anything. all you heard were the gunshots go off. he just fell down. >> an undercover new york city police officer arrested in the infamous motorcycle gang incident on the west side highway has been found to have previously spied on occupy wall street. the detective was detained after taking part in the an attack on a motorist in an suv that was caught on video. occupy activists that he was previously arrested as an undercover officer posing as a demonstrator in grand central station. he is with the nypd's

intelligence division. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. >> welcome to all our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. the white house has announced it will suspend some of its $1.5 billion in annual military aid egypt until the country ushers in democratic governance. reuters report that some of the items to be withheld include abrams tanks, f-16 aircraft, apache helicopters, and harpoon missiles. the u.s. has avoided the automatic suspension of all military aid to egypt by refusing to deem mohamed morsi's ouster a coup. in a speech to the united nations in late september, president obama said the united states had avoided choosing sides in egypt after the military's july 3 overthrow of morsi. has been attacked by all sides of this internal conflict. simultaneously accused of supporting the muslim brotherhood and engineering the removal of power.

in fact, the u.s. has purposely avoided choosing sides. our overriding interest throughout these past few years has been to encourage a government that legitimately reflects the will of the objection -- egyptian people and recognizes true democracy as a respect for minority rights and the rule of law. freedom of speech and assembly, and a strong civil society. >> egypt has set a date of november for for ousted president mohamed morsi to stand trial for inciting the murder protesters. morsi faces charges surrounding the deaths of at least 10 demonstrators killed in a protest against his government last december. hundreds of morsi supporters have been killed by state forces since his ouster in july. for more we're joined by hossam rights egyptian human activist and the founder and executive director director of the egyptian initiative for personal rights. remainsituation unchanged.

unfortunately, we had a fresh round of killings on sunday of this week. more violence is expected as both sides continue with their zero approach to this political crisis. perhapse talks mediation efforts of reaching a theromise or a solution to current political crisis. the problem from a human rights perspective is that the security forces the police appear to have been given the green light to kill just as many people as necessary and round up any number of people in order to break the protests of the pro- morsi supporters. right now we are not optimistic there is going to be any serious attempt at holding the

perpetrators of these worst incidents of mass killing egyptian history accountable. there has been no accountability for the mubarak era. or for killing a protesters under morsi himself during the muslim brotherhood rule. and now with the military back in power and the judiciary must completely in support of the new military-backed government, the hopes for accountability for those necessary or even dimmer. >> this whole idea of bringing to trial now in reality has basically been held incommunicado. how can anyone in the international community expect there'll be any kind of fair judicial process under the conditions of this coup and basically this disappearance of egypt's elected president? >> there are two issues of concern here. one, of course, is the refusal

to disclose the location where the former president is held. the refusal to allow him visits by his lawyers and his family members. not technically disappeared because he was allowed a visit from catherine ashton, the du foreign-policy chief, and from an african union panel. the military effectively allowed these visits as well as visits by to selected human rights thatrs in order to prove legally speaking he is not disappeared, that the state is taking responsibility for his to tension but refusing, for security reasons, to disclose his location. having said that, he is denied due process rights, the rights of her printer to have access to family visits, medical visits, and to a lawyer -- the rights to have family visits, medical visits, and a lawyer.

we believe former morsi should be prosecuted. he should be held accountable for crimes that he offered during his one year in office. he did praise the police and .rder them to kill protesters in january, he did allow his supporters to set up effectively a torture camp for his opponents outside the gates of the presidential palace, among many other human rights violations. and we're not talking about governance, we are talking about recognizable criminal offense that he threw commission or omission allowed during his one year in office. the kinds of prosecutions where singh is completely selective and punitive. it makes no sense for any observer to see morsi been prosecuted and about to stand trial as you said on november 1 for having allowed the killing or incited the killing of jim

protesters when 1000 protesters were killed on august 14 and there isn't even an investigation into it. about the twosk recently released canadians who spent almost two months in an egyptian prison and have posted a video to thank those who help them get out of prison. they are still in egypt. this is john greyson, a toronto film maker, and tarek loubani, a doctor, who were freed unexpectedly on sunday. >> we're just getting a sense now of incredible support that was there that came together from every corner, canadians, people around the world, people here in egypt emma to make this day possible -- in egypt, to make this day possible. it is not over, but for now with that we would say hi, peace. importantly,very we thank you. thank you for your support. thank you so much for your help. they use so much for everything. >> the pair of hunger striking

canadians are now being prevented from leaving egypt. they've been in touch with their families and say they are in a safe location as they clear up the red tape or return home to canada. they were arrested august 16 after rushing to the scene of a mass shooting by state forces of supporters of ousted president mohammed morsi. they staged a three-week hunger strike while being kept in a crowded and cockroach infested cell. with 600 peoples. there were such international outcry over their arrests because they're canadian and canadians were putting pressure on our government that they have been released. but if you could talk about that. >> we are very pleased they are out. we're also very grateful. because of their canadian citizenship, we had this rare glimpse into the detention conditions, but also the

campaign of arbitrary arrests of hundreds of people that just happen to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. we certainly believe that tarek and john were there to provide medical help and we know of countless other medics working field hospitals and places where violence is taking place, journalists, sometimes children, sometimes just people trying to go home and passing through the side of violence or breaking the curfew. and we're talking now perhaps that have00 people been arrested in the context of his current crackdown. that is a huge number. that adds to or fuels the political crisis because you have just as many families now part of this process. >> i want to ask about the

situation of journalist, of the media in egypt. clearly after the downfall of mubarak weather was the flowering of much more popular media in egypt. what has been the status since the coup against morsi of how the ability of his citizens and independent journalist to get out information? >> the organization deeply affected the media scene. first days that morsi was ousted, they shut down a few islamist channels that were supporters of him. ofn there was the harassment al jazeera, in particular, and it's egyptian affiliate. a few other foreign journalists that were there, the foreign ministry and the state information service deemed their coverage to be one-sided or to be too supportive or to fail to

endorse the new government. there has been an unprecedented hike an increase in the number of physical attacks and harassment of foreign journalists. part of it is because they are journalists, part of it is because of the atmosphere that is promoted by state and private media and state officials about a foreign conspiracy against egypt. the problem now has been also that throughout july and august, it is getting slightly better now but there is still a media blackout to shut out any voice of public dissent from anyone who is not completely supportive of the new military backed regime is effectively capped off air whether in public or private tv. , we would liket you to stay with us.

we are going to broaden this to look at what is happening in different places around the world. because of the new aclu report out called, "take back the streets: repression and criminalization of protest around the world." stay with us. ♪ [music break]

>> this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we turn now to a major new report detailing the global crack out on peaceful protests, both are excessive police force in the criminalization of dissent. the report is called, "take back the streets: repression and criminalization of protest around the world." it was put up with the international network of civil liberties organizations. the name of the report comes from a police report filed in june 2010 when hundreds of thousands of canadians took to the streets of toronto to nonviolently protest the g 20 summit. a senior toronto police commander responded to the protest by issuing an order to "take back the streets."

within a span of 36 hours, over 30 -- over 1000 people -- peaceful protesters, journalists, human rights monitors and downtown residents -- were arrested. >> according to the report, what happened in connecticut -- dramatic of government conduct in the face of protest around the world. the case studies detailed in this report show how governments have reacted to peaceful protest in the u.s., israel, canada, argentina, egypt, hungary, kenya, south africa, and britain. for more we're joined by the coeditor of the report, abby deshman, a lawyer and program director with the canadian civil liberties association. rossa joined by anthony romero, executive director, american civil liberties union. he is the author of, "in defense of our america: the fight for civil liberties in the age of

terror." we continue to be with hossam bahgat. >> this is a collaboration between multiple domestic human rights and civil liberties organizations that we have really come together to group our domestic work, group our national work, and the governments are responding to democratic dissent and protest in the streets. gathering together this number of practitioners really to provide practitioners notes shows there are very disturbing trends. people are taking to the streets across the world. governments are responding with criminalization and repression and excessive use of force. >> governments have never looked kindly on dissent within their borders by their own citizens. what do you see as new about what is occurring now? re: member years back when democracy now! cover the protests in seattle live. there clearly were new tactics

by both the nonviolent protesters as well as the government response. >> partly what is new, at least for me, i am young and this game, is massive uprising on the streets. we are singing the past three to five years record numbers of people in recent memory taking to the streets. we're seeing the police tactics, they massive, hundreds of people rounded up at a time. new policing weapons, long-range if you stick devices, sonic cannons, excessive amounts of tear gas being used. these are trends that are currently surfacing in multiple countries. >> anthony romero, talk about the u.s. >> normally when we think about protest, freedom of speech, we think that has been well- established and well respected. yet you point out the difficulties we've seen with the wto protesters, the protesters of the occupy movements and in particular, this case study we

highlighted in puerto rico where most americans don't think a puerto rico as the u.s., but it is. the constitution applies. close to 4 million american citizens live there. yet you have the second-largest police department in the nation, only second to new york police department, and the massive levels of oppression and shutdown, of arrests, tear gassing, beating of students of labor leaders of the level of impunity that lasted for years until the aclu filed the report, while bleed -- lobbied our justice department. they only stepped in recently to try to put the puerto rico police department under better control under the rule of law. >> this tactic of picking people asse and in holding them, supposedly while protest continued, basically pulling them out without any real charges just to get them off the street? >> that is how they dealt with the protests in new york i'm

especially after the conventions or during the conventions when they corralled record numbers of people, arrested them in record time in ways that were just toonishing, held them for 24 48 hours. i think one of the things we have to bear in mind, look, our government is shut down. people are frustrated. people may take to the streets as an important part of demonstrating their unhappiness with our government. so how we protect the rights of individuals to protest and to dissent is critically important, especially in our democracy that is so fundamentally broken down at the moment. the government doesn't respond to the people, people have to take the government back. >> to follow-up, what the police departments do, they don't mind having to deal with lawsuits later on. years later they end up paying the settlements to protesters who had their civil liberties

violated. but at the moment, they are effectively able to shutdown the dissent. i wonder how is a civil liberties lawyer, what ways can the courts be utilized to prevent these kinds of occurrences from repeating themselves? in casesf it, even where they infringe on civil liberties and freedom of streets and expression, you have to see that use that as a deterrent for further the leased apartments. -- freedom of speech and expression, you have to sue them to use that as a deterrent for further violations. we also have to make sure we don't allow the excessive use of less lethal force. one of the things we have seen in the reports a puerto rico in egypt and canada and argentina has been the increased use of certain weapons by police, certain tactics. which they say is less lethal,

but they end up in deaths. have deaths in argentina, puerto rico and certainly in places like egypt. we have to make sure we hold the police accountable for those actions. >> and the issue of surveillance? the undercover officer in the infamous west side highway videotape of the motorcycle gang and the guy with the suv, that one of these officers it turns out -- one of the motorcycle riders it turns out was an officer, undercover, and he was undercover in occupy wall street as well, picked up the grand central. >> it is not just what they do at the protest itself, but prior to the protest, the surveillance. the infiltration prior to the protest. --have those who brightly who brazenly brag about sending in cops to derail them or shake them in the ways they want. all of this, after 9/11 or any

activity that disagrees with the government often vehemently is seen as potential terrorist activity or potential terrorist plot, the powers of the government's use of surveillance and infiltration in the police tactics, they all have to be seen as one part of an effort to shut down and dispel dissent. we see it. we see there is a quell a public dissent. muslims are much less likely to express themselves. we hear that from our clients. it is a very pernicious part, very real and often not uncovered until we put out reports like this. >> the canadian example of the g 20 summit, what most surprised you in terms of -- as you were unearthing what happened there in the civil liberties violations? >> how high the police orders went. we thought this was a coordinated response. .e saw there was consistency

we then had confirmation that were orders all the way from the top. these were not random acts by individual commanders panicking under certain situations. these were decisions taken by very senior police leaders to violate not only the rights of citizens, but their own policies and procedures about how to deal with protest. and they were taking notes from an international theme or this it happened before. we had not seen this technique in canada. it was clear it had happened at previous 220, some it's. -- summits. >> fit this into the global context. >> egypt may be an extreme case. we have crossed the to mass killings. the trend in egypt fits with the trend identified by the

reporting, all of these case studies. see thementioned, we mass protests are not a new phenomenon, but they are taking new shapes. with the arab uprising, the protest in turkey and brazil, the anti-austerity, they will continue. we see the right to protest publicly and to defend as an essential part of democracy. there is an attempt on the other side by governments to reduce the democratic rights of individuals to being called in once every three years and then be sent home and leave the government's to the people that have been elected. the people refuse. they see in many countries the democratic institutions around the world are not working and

are not necessarily reflecting the will of the people. the people are going to continue to take their dands, yes, three channels like labor unions and the media and others, but they are going to go on the streets and protest publicly. states need to know they have a responsibility not just to protect this right, but even to enable people to express these rights. the only other alternative to the killings were seen in egypt are the killings that even started in syria as just of violence in the face of people protest and turn into civil wars. these are recipes for only pushing the situation into a very, very dangerous directions. the violent response only leads to even violent protests. >> much was made in egypt and during the arab spring of the impact of the social media and the use of the internet dissidents to mobilize, to communicate. in your report, did you dwell into the responses of government

officials in terms of how they responded to the change in tactics of the popular movements? >> absolutely. police do say they need new tactics because people can mobilize more quickly. insert going out on twitter and a large crowd forms. but the truth is, we knew exactly what was going to happen because it was on the internet. it was on social media. the protesters themselves i classify their protest in terms of levels of risk. -- i'mcap tickle skeptical of those claims they need new powers in order to police these new forms of protest. we knew what was going to happen during the g 20 protest. the police simply weren't prepared and violated rights. >> how should the state deal with violence? >> the state needs to respond to violence, but i say they over respond to violence,

particularly in protest. there may be one or two or even 30 people in a crowd of tens of thousands that commit property damage, commit violent acts. the state often takes that as an authority to abrogate the rights of every single person in the crowd. they need to protect the rights of all the other people in that crowd who are peacefully protesting in exercising their democratic rights. the role is to facilitate protests, not find excuses to shut it down. >> what about the u.s. cutting military aid to egypt? >> in egypt, especially after the massacres, our position was there should be investigations, an independent fact-finding and accountability. and until that takes place and until the government excepts responsibility -- accepts

responsibility for these killings, there should be a suspension of any provision of arms or tools from any other country, not just the u.s. military. and any resumption of the sale of weapons or tools of repression to the egyptian government must be conditioned on accepting the retraining provision of new tools. business should not continue just as usual when it c t t tomo egypt. especially from a like abby said, in all of these , thererations where seen is always a few protesters that are going to use violence. the trend we're seeing now is the government's use this to take the entire group -- dubbed the entire group of 20,000, 30,000 has violent. that leads to those who are

peaceful, lumped together with the others. and they are deprived of their rights as peaceful protesters. even those who do throw stones or other violence are robbed of all of their other rights, including their right to life. the states are just using this as an excuse -- sometimes through infiltration by provocateurs into these protests in order to just remove entire protest outside the realm of protection of law. >> let's get back to anthony romero. the obama administration finally doing something in egypt, cut off some of the military aid to the coup leaders, how is the obama administration dealt with the increasing repression by local police on public protesters? has there been any actions by the justice department to try to rein this and or are they basically supportive? >> they have basically been supportive.

the aclu doesn't take positions on foreign policy or u.s. aid to egypt, but we do look closely about how our government -- federal government works with state and local level government. and the collusion between the , andal agents, the fbi local police department has become very troubling. the way they track and the way they monitor into surveillance on muslims. one of the key cases we have is in new york city with the new york city police department, but it involves the federal government and the fbi. the immigration context. if you pull the camera back where you find the at the i'm the doj in the department of homeland security working with local sheriffs and police. >> you have a case against joe arpaio in arizona, the sheriff. >> who resist a federal order from a federal judge that monitors were any type of accountability. but he was created by the policies of janet napolitano. headen she was governor or

-- >> i would say more the department of homeland security. it is that type of collusion she that insisted federal government officials work with local law enforcement officials. sheriff arpaio has gone off the farm, but there are too many local police departments that are working with the federal government on things like surveillance and immigration and dissent and protest. so i think part of the responsibility does come from the federal government. >> this issue of surveillance. as a former repression. is the aclu representing ed snowden? >> we are in contact with edward snowden. i can't say too much about it publicly. he is someone we have known glenn greenwald for a number of years -- >> [indiscernible] >> we tried our best. we have a laptop with encryption. i think edward snowden has done this country service. i said it at the aspen security

form. i was on the panel. you would have thought i was an anarchist. i said regardless of whether or not what he did was legal or illegal, whether we think the espionage laws are being used to possibly prosecute snowden are too broad, the fact is, he is kick started what we did not have. this debate was needed. everyone was asleep at the switch. >> the obama administration absolutely denied to the point of clapper perjuring himself saying they were not spying on americans. it was not until the actual documents were presented -- so the obama administration encourages people to get the documents where they were forced to then back off. if this had occurred under the george bush administration, there would be such an outcry among your viewers, our members, the general public.

but because it is president obama and his done some very good things on gay rights and voting rights, give him credit for that, but because these policies and programs have been announced under his pregnant -- presidency, people are even more pernicious because as they get established into this presidency , the ability to track the phone calls of all people in america, inc., now going, how long your phone call, he received it from, who you call, metadata is very personal identifiable information. you can learn a lot about metadata. being able to track e-mails we send from here, overseas. who do we have as president in two years? if we have ted cruz or mitt romney, how are we to be secure that data, that trove of lawful american activity doesn't begin to be used in more pernicious ways? i think it is a real estate for us --

>> how do you know it isn't happening right now? snowdenevelations of and extensive -- the massive amount of surveillance not only within the u.s., but in other countries by the nsa. what is been impact in places like egypt of these revelations? >> there's been a huge spillover. you see it most prominently in places like brazil, of course, because it turns out some of you surveillance particularly targeted the president and some of her communication as well as businesses. but we also see it in the u.k. because of the revelation about the collaboration, the sharing of this information with israel. it has prompted multiple lawsuits that are seeking some clarity. it is also important to note it has pushed some of the

telecommunication and internet someders to have at least more transparency. they've all gone public. for instance, we know how many requests facebook and twitter received from the egyptian government in the last six months. how many of them were actually accepted. but we don't know which ones are which accounts were monitored in which information were provided to the egyptian government. beforemportant to note the snowden revelation, this is something we have all been concerned about. we all came together, the same can organizations -- the same can organizations that produce this report, came together for a lawsuit brought by the aclu against clapper on the nsa surveillance. we all work together on an amicus brief saying we are all

affected by the nsa program. we cannot do our work in egypt or canada or israel or kenya, we cannot communicate when we know our e-mails could be intercepted by the state security apparatus. unfortunately, the supreme court did not find our claim was compelling enough. but we hope precisely as anthony said, because of this huge outcry over the snowden revelation, that the u.s. judiciary is going to start looking differently at this issue. >> think you all for being with us. we want to thank abby deskman, hossam bahgat, and anthony romero. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. when we come back, we're going right to the capital where the government is shut down, at least partially. we will speak with the cochair of the congressional progressive

caucus, raul grijalva. stay with us. ♪ [music break] >> this is democracy now!,

democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. 10 days into the government shutdown, lawmakers are under increasing pressure to come to resolution. house speaker john boehner and majority leader eric cantor met for the first time in days on wednesday with house minority leader nancy pelosi. but no deal has been reached. reuters is reporting jobless claims rose by 66,000 in the latest week. the highest since march. >> we're joined by a lawmaker who is called the shutdown a charade. once a halt to oil and gas exploration on federal land until the public can also enter, and he's also found time to push for the passage of immigration reform that includes a path to citizenship. as thousands gathered on the national mall tuesday to rally support for an immigration bill, he joined seven other congress members, all democrats, in getting arrested after they linked arms and block a street. the national mall was closed at the time due to the government

shutdown, but the park service allow the rally is an expression of first amendment rights. he is joining us from the cannon rotunda of the capitol, welcome to democracy now! how much longer do you see this partial government shutdown going on and moving into the debt ceiling issue? there was a strategy to try to blend the two and create a real crisis in terms of extracting more concessions, more giveaways on the part of the democrats in the administration. i think that was a strategy. at the public outcry continues to get louder. every day incrementally the shutdown begins dad more and more pain to the american people . sixpiecemeal let's this little part -- fix this little part, whether it is head start are making sure the troops get paid, all of these issues

are not taking away from the fact this shutdown is contrived. we have seen this before. kind ofseen this extortion before. unfortunately, democrats give into sin. we have secret station as a result. -- we have sequestration as a result. we are ready have budget cuts. i think this is the same extraction. you don't hear them talking about getting rid of health reform. toy have moved on entitlement programs, social security, medicare. boehner, who john is the speaker of the house is ignore 30o control or to 40 extremists in his caucus any the tea party is beyond reasonable person trying to figure this out.

i'm glad democrats are standing firm. as we go forward with this, how long can they drag it out? i think the time is working against the shutdown. as the public continues to feel as one area piles on another, eventually, they're going to have to re-examine and pull away, allowing a clean cr. is that thean cr sequestration levels, the ryan budget level. it's not like there is a big game there. reasonable people say we need to keep us government open and we will fight that fight over the budget down the road. >> congressman, you got arrested this week over the issue of immigration reform. basically, the gridlock that has occurred on that issue as well. do you have real hopes you can still get immigration reform this year given the battles over

the budget and over the debt ceiling in the house of representatives? >> i think the fight over the debt ceiling in the budget is the harbinger of the fight over immigration. to 45 tea party extremists have done nothing but to try to block any effort with rates within their own caucus on immigration reform on a comprehensive immigration reform. it will be the same scenario. demanding that boehner allow a vote on the floor and let democracy work its will, that is going to be the goal. in my optimistic? -- and my optimistic? i am. the 25,000 people that were here the other day, the fact the urgency is still there and now i think it is up to us and community organizations throughout this country to ratchet up the pressure. if this congress is going to

respond, it is going to respond to pressure. don'tigent debate, facts seem to move this congress. it is going to have to be public pressure. those of us that got arrested, what a privilege to be part of that that day, and what a privilege to be alongside john lewis in my steamed colleagues to say, we are part of this urgency. we're not going allow you to put this on the back earner or ignore, which i believe is one prioritynot the domestic issue -- this country needs to deal with. the shutdown is attributed to the tea party, isn't as john boehner the speaker's shutdown? if you simply brought the issue of the shutdown to a vote, it is quite clear a number of republicans would join the democrats in ending the government shutdown. but he won't. can you explain why that is and

why he particularly this emphasis on the speaker himself is not more prominent? speaker the role of the has always been to bring legislation and try to reach compromise and try to move an agenda. boehner's agenda -- nobody has been able to define what his agenda is. at the beginning of the session, antor and ryan running the house. they have faded into the background a little bit. and now it is people like steve king and gomer and other inverse of the tea party faction that are running -- >> but boehner could call a vote, right? today, he has the power to do it. >> he has absolute power with regards to that. the fact he is prolonging this and the fact he is unwilling to even have a plan as to what he

wants to negotiate or how he wants to get out of this mess he and he, he has the power needs to exercise some courage and put the interests of this country ahead of whatever fears he might have. ofis a speakership full insecurity, and that is being played out on a huge stage -- securitybout social now being put on the table and president obama accepting it in order to negotiate an end to all of this. >> that is regrettable. regrettable when the president put it on the table. even the fact we are having a discussion about jcpi is unbelievable. 111 members of congress, if not more, wrote to the president and chainwe don't support cpi or any discussion about social security as part of any deficit reduction or debt ceiling.

27 said, if you put it on, we will vote no. i think that sentiment reason i -- remains. i think the white house and the democratic leadership better pay attention to that sentiment because it is real. it is our base. it is something we fought for. and all of the sudden, to make a throwaway issue in this discussion is something that support for that initiative, that is not, rise. that is what has happened for the last four years, three years under republican leadership in the house. we capitulate and then call it a compromise. chained cpi could not and should not and many of us are prepared to vote against any package that includes that. >> we just have about a minute. your response to this absurdity with the shutdown the national parks are closed to the public but private companies can continue to work in them, to exploit the resources there? >> those are public resources.

the interior department sometime seems like a real estate department giving out drilling an exclamation -- excavation permits right and left. are closed.res people cannot use the business services or scenery of our great national parks. they are locked out. the workers are locked out of their jobs. and gas goes on extraction goes on and mineral extrtion goes on. it is hypocrisy. on thehurt is to be public and the workers that are locked out, then those people are making a profit off public lands of which the paper little for that resource, they need to be shut down as well. ,> congressmember raul grijalva has the insurance website in arizona started to work yet? >> it did.

we're going to get some numbers today. we worked particularly hard in the poorer areas of my district, of which i have too many. >> we have five seconds. >> yes, it is working. not having a bilingual, assurances that will be corrected. >> we want to thank you very much for being with us, commerce member raul grijalva. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. tonight, a conversation with musician jimmy carter, one of the founding members of the great gospel group, the blind boys of alabama. they first came together back in 1939. that amounts to more than seven decades touring and performing, a remarkable achievement for any music group. they have just released a new cd called "i'll find a way." we are glad you have joined us. a conversation with jimmy carter of the blind boys of alabama, coming up right now. ♪

♪ ♪ >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ tavis: jimmy carter is a founding member of the blind boys of alabama and the only one

of the original group to still tour regularly. over the course of seven decades, performing and recording, they have won five grammy awards. they just released a new cd called "i'll find a way." let's ta a look at a clip of the group and guest artists performing the title cut. fool ♪ll play the ♪ just for a day i'll find a way ♪ to carry it all ♪ ♪ to carry it all good to have you back on the program, sir. >> good to be here. tavis: congratulations on the

new project. >> thank you. tavis: my heart was broken when i discovered and realized that our good brother clarence can no longer tour. clarence fountain. >> clarence has some health issues now. every now and then, he might come out to help with an album, but touring, he doesn't do that anymore. tavis: how many years would you guess that you and clarence to this together on the road? about eight years. tavis: that is a long time. how have you made the adjustment to not having him on the stage? >> when he passed me the torch, he said, this is your group now. he gave me some advice, of course. tavis: right. fun. said, you got to be you're not. [laughter]

tavis: you've got to be firm with them because they will walk on you. you are a founding member. they can't walk on a founding member. you never know. these youngsters trying to walk on the fountain. speaking of youngsters, when you first joined the group, you were so young, in fact, that while you were part of the group, your mama wouldn't actually let you two are -- you tour. is that true? inwhen they left schooling 1944, they came to my house to pick me up, and my mom said, no, you can't have him. he's too young. he is not going. i had to catch up with them later on. tavis: how later was later on? >> it was late. [laughter] tavis: how did you process the fact that you were a part of this group? i know why your momma did it, but i also know what it feels a to be young and hav