>> good evening from los angeles. first up tonight, in conversation with evan bayh on his decision to retire from congress. he has cited the corrosive nature of politics in washington as his primary reason for stepping down. also, a preview of the health care summit in washington with sherrod brown. he sits on the committee that oversees health care. tomorrow, members of both parties will join president obama for a nationally televised conversation about health care reform. we are glad you have joined us. the senators are coming up right now. >> there are so many things that walmart is looking forward to doing, like helping people live better. mostly, we're looking forward to help building stronger

communities and relationships. the best is yet to come. >> nationwide insurance proudly supports tavis smiley. chavis and nationwide insurance, working to improve -- tavis and nationwide insurance, working to improve stability. >> and by contributions to your pbs stations by viewers like you. thank you. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] >> evan bayh recently announced his decision not to seek another term in the senate. he also served two terms as governor of indiana. he joins us tonight from capitol hill. it is always good to have you back on the program. >> good to be with you.

tavis: for those who did not see the "the new york times" piece you wrote last sunday, which went in depth into why you decided to not run for office from indiana in terms of the senate again, explain that, particularly against the backdrop of having a 20-point lead in the polls, $13 million in the bank, why step aside as a democrat when you are running everything in washington, why leave now? >> i am all about getting things done to help people make the most of their lives. i was privileged to do that for eight years as our governor, two years as secretary of state, and i have served in the senate. we have a lot of wonderful people here. i admire many of my colleagues. the institutional structure, the culture has led us to gridlock on many major issues. we are not getting enough done. i felt that in a different

capacity, i could serve my state and country, and perhaps make a bigger contribution in -- rather than continuing to serve in the senate. tavis: more about why you think washington is frozen. >> in some ways, it is the nature of our politics right now. we have got some people who are stridently partisan. they put political interests ahead of trying to get a consensus on what is right. we have some people who are good people. they believe strongly, but they put their ideology over practicality. if you can get half a loaf, that is better than none. we have the filibuster in the senate. so many things get brought to a stop because of the use of that. senators do not interact much anymore. they do not have the personal relationships they did in my father's day that allowed them to transcend ideological differences.

you put all of that together, and in some quarters, compromise is viewed as an act of the trail or heresy rather than a step forward. we put that together, it is a difficult time right now. these things are personal. i have no complaint with my colleagues running for election. these are intensely personal decisions. i just felt that helping a business grow by creating jobs, helping the university to educate children, perhaps leading a philanthropy, maybe that is not quite as an exalted state as the u.s. senate, but in an everyday, tangible way, i felt i could put my head on the pillow at night feeling i got something good done. tavis: i get the sense that what you laid out for me right now is a list of options, things that you could do but have not settled on what you will do. correct, or not? >> i have no idea what i will do.

my deal with my wife as i will tell her first. 4 give me -- forgive me for not telling you. my decision was all about the next six years of my life. i am not a committee chairman. i am not in leadership. we have the president of our country who i admire and respect. they will set the agenda more than someone in my position. i had to ask myself, what kind of contribution will you make there as opposed to the contribution you could make in other capacities? i have not closed the door to doing something else in public life that some point. this was about this year, this fall, and looking over the next few years, how could i make the biggest contribution in a tangible way? i concluded that making a change is right for me now. maybe it is only in washington or political circles, but the thought of perpetually running for public office is the only way you can help the country. i don't believe that to be the

case. tavis: to has been written about this. the country knows you were on the short list, the very short list, of possible running mates that and then-senator obama was looking at. he chose joe biden. does any of that factor into this decision that you were not the number two choice? >> none whatsoever. it was an honor to be included. i told my wife, i finished second in a contest where they don't give silver medals. that was a tremendous honor, to go through that can be thought of in that way by the president and his team. that has nothing to do with it. i have a good relationship, based upon mutual respect, with the president. i talked to him about this decision on a couple of occasions. i said to him, mr. president, if you had asked me to do almost

anything else, i would have said yes. i love serving my country. i included in this particular capacity after 12 years, it was time to make a change. tavis: in indiana, i know this because i have talked to my family, who still lives in indiana, there is talk -- you are beloved in indiana, but there is concern and there are questions about why this decision came so late in the primary process. >> well, two reasons for that. first, as you can imagine, this was a very difficult decision for me. i was conflicted about it until the end. i told my wife i was conflicted and i would be as i was making my statement. i still have mixed feelings. this is very hard. i was also asked by the president and others to run again, to reconsider the decision that had been forming in my mind for some time. it was only the presence of a

deadline to finally forced me to make a decision. i did. there was nothing more to it than that. it was a very hard decision. this has been my entire life and i was being asked to reconsider, to give it more time, and i did that. let me say this. i think the democratic party is going to have a very strong nominee. we have several good people looking at it and i intend to support weber that nominee is very vigorously. i think we have a good chance even in a difficult year to win that election. tavis: you believe that democrats have a good chance of winning in indiana. a lot of people see it differently. people believe the former republican serving from indiana might be the favorite to reclaim the seat. to your point about being conflicted, how bad would you feel on a wednesday in november

-- how bad will you feel on the day after election day if a republican takes the seat that all indications suggest you could have held on too, had you decided to stay in the race? >> i won't feel very good about that. i will do everything i can to help the nominee. to run for an election just to hold an office i do not think is good enough for the people of the state. i want to make a contribution to the extent that i can. i reached the conclusion i could do that in the capacity. to just run, i do not think that is really a straight forward and honorable thing to do. i will do everything i can to prevent that outcome. i hope it does not happen. we tend to be more republican than democrat. that is true. this is a year in which it will be a difficult environment. having said that, this election will be between two individuals. i think we will have an outstanding individual. at the end of the day, indiana

will make a comparison about who they want representing them in the senate, not a political party, not an atmosphere, but what individual. we will be able to make a good case that our nominee is the right and it will. tavis: you might write a book about this, but give me insights now as to what the challenge has been, what the journey has been like being a democrat, moderate democrat from a pretty republican state. give me the crib notes on what you will say about that in coming years. >> i do not know if i will write a book. if i do, i will not tell tales about anybody. i do not believe in that. u.s. neapolitan its of our state. there myths we need to dispel. democrats care about economic growth and job creation, not just redistributing wealth, but creating it in the first place. we have an agenda for growth and

job creation. that is number one. some people in the business community wonder. we have to reassure them. secondly, we can be fiscally responsible and good stewards of taxpayer money. that is what we care about coming effected government, not larger government, delivering the results people can expect. we read -- we measure outcomes, not just been put. we care about efficient government. the third thing during these difficult times, we can be effective on national security. we care about being respected in the world and all those kinds of things, but we also care about the physical security of our country and citizens. we will be vigorous, including where appropriate the use of force to defend our people and our country. if you approach -- approach people from that perspective, they know we have big heart. they know we are compassionate.

that is part of our dna. if we can reassure them on other things, we have more challenges in our home state. tavis: you suggested you think the democrats have a decent shot at retaining your seat in our state of indiana. how do you feel democrats will do across the country? i ask that because you are not the only democrat in the house or senate stepping aside in pretty safe seats. how was the democratic party -- what will president obama work with the day after election day in november? >> it looks like, between now and election is many months. and the politics, that can be an eternity. things can change. there can be events that nobody would predict would come along. people are kind of unhappy because the economy is not so good. they are unhappy about the deficit, particularly independent voters. there is kind of an unsettled

mood in the country and that works against incumbents. there'll be people going to the ballot box asking, who can be an effective change agent for me? you can change business as usual in washington and deliver enough of the ideology? who can deliver the results on the things that matter in my daily life? i think that is what people will be looking for coming independent, a democrat, republican, that is what they will look for. that is what the dynamic will be. you saw some of that and the massachusetts. tavis: have been friends and i know if i do not fit to interview you again on this program, i know we will spend some time together off air down the road. thank you for being willing to come on this program. we call upon you and i appreciate this opportunity to talk to you. >> it has been my pleasure. if you invite me back, i will come anytime.

their ideas are privatized. the make seniors pay more out of pocket. it is helping the drug and insurance companies. they do not have any ideas. they support many of the things they are working on. if they supported mandatory coverage. they supported some of the other things. if they now say they support insurance company reform. by and large, things they scored before they change their mind on. they have been objection as for a year. i hope they will change tomorrow. i do not expect. i hope they listen. tavis: in your mind comedy are obstructionists? >> here is why i think that. we voted on a bill in july. i think we started late may.

we accepted 160 republican amendments. i voted for 150 of them. if they approved the bill. the finance committee negotiated. two of the three republicans were basically saying we are stalling. they were. they really have not offered anything really positive. they say they had some ideas. they never really offer them before. you know, one thing they learned is the longer you can delay things, at the more the bad rumors start about the legislation. the more you can make things like euthanasia. it is very hard to pass it. that is why the country is fairly negative on this bill. if the start specific of consumer protections or with their parents' insurance, are

you for a plan to keep rates down by establishing a commission, all these things this of a plea they like but they -- all these things specifically they like they do not like the bill because it has been out there so long. tavis: would there be any value in your mind at all and a republican idea and this meeting tomorrow of a tearing of this bill and starting from scratch? >> that is they are talking plan. he will hear that 400 times tomorrow probably. no, of course not. starting over and tearing it up just means to kill it. you know it is too complicated. it is too big. i was talking to a friend of mine, a lawyer in cleveland. he was a staff that 40 years ago when congress passed

medicare. he said it was really hard. they have the same arguments, keep government out. it is socialized. it is putting the doctor between -- government between doctor and patient. the republicans mostly and a few conservative democrats opposed it. if we start again on this, it is dead. that is why centers like jim demint made clear that this is barack obama's waterloo. we just need health care. we destroyed him. that is the way they but i did. not all republicans. -- that is the way they viewed it. not all republicans. he is not trying to destroy the president like so many of them are. tavis: there is a process you know well called reconciliation. if the president and democrats

decided the republicans for not being cooperative enough and it did not want to waste any more time and they went to force this thing through, there is a process of reconciliation by which they can do that. tell me more about what the process means and whether you think strategically that would be a benefit to your party for getting it done or all hell would break loose about you guys forcing through something. >> all hell would rbreak loose. russia limbaugh and glenn beck would have an editorial page. it is not like it has never been done. republicans have done it 15 or 20 times in recent years. the tax cuts for the rich of this into this situation. it is not like we are going to meet in the middle of the night and we are going to pass this. it is still a majority vote in the senate.

we are the only major country in the world requires a supermajority to do anything. if you have to get 60 votes on anything, including appointing people the president has nominated for low-level positions, it makes government dysfunctional. what is wrong with the majority rule? we can do many of these things. we cannot do a bit complicated bill through reconciliation. we can take what the senate did. the house can pass it. we get some of the stuff out. we approve the bill. we take away the tax on employer benefits that too many employees have to pay. we do things like that. basically, reconciliation will fix what is wrong with people that we are doing. tavis: i am playing devil's advocate because i want to hear what your response would be. your point of the supermajority

--the argument for the 60 votes would be the 60 votes in the u.s. senate more often than not forces you into a bipartisanship position. is that not a good thing? >> you know at 60 votes does? it forces interest groups into the room and to the table to get their way. you have to give up something. it is not left and right. if you have to play ball with insurance companies. you have to play ball with the lobbyists to get 60 votes. republicans have shown if they do not want to do anything without their benefactors to. were the most important benefactors? the insurance companies and the energy companies. those are the people that have to be satisfied to get 60 votes. tavis: tell me why i should not

believe that the real winners here are not the american people, but the lobbyists? they are the real winners here. >> when it the things that happen in the last month is insurance co. stocks went up. they are the winners. they are always here. they are smart. they are nice people. there charismatic. they are convincing. they went too often. -- win too often. i have a lot of insurance companies in my state. i want them to profit. i do not want them to run the health-care system the way they do now. the business plan is to not and should be will let are really sick. if they get insurance and they get really sick, find a way to deny their claim. that is the business claim. we are the only country in the world with more private

insurance companies. we are not running the health care system the way that they could to serve people nearly as well as it could in this country. this bill will help correct that. tavis: i have 45 seconds left. i was in ohio in the buckeye state. i would think this is good news. the senate passed a jobs bill today that had 13 republicans come across the aisle to support it. is that the news? >> that is very good news. most republicans want to put people back to work. it is not every republican wants to see president obama fail. is this a few senators and congress. this bill is a good bill. it is really moving forward. it will help the private sector provide more jobs for people to work in transportation and highway construction. it will put people to work with small businesses getting credit

borrowing money and putting people to work the way the private sector is so good that. tavis: senator shared brown, it is good to have you as always. >> my pleasure. tavis: you can access our radio podcast @ pbs.org. until the next time, keep the faith. >> for more affirmation on today's show, visit us at pbs.org. >> join me next time for and this is a conversation with green jobs advocate the van jones. until next time, we will see them. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- there is so many things that walmart is looking forward to doing. we are hoping you build stronger communities and relationships. the best is yet to come. >> nationwide insurance proudly supports tavis smiley.

working to improve financial literacy and the economic empowerment that comes with it. >> nationwide is on your side. thank you. >> nationwide is on your side. thank you.