>> "bbc newsnight" is presented by kcet, los angeles. funding for this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york, stowe, vermont, and honolulu. newman's own foundation. the john d. and catherine t. macarthur foundation. and union bank. >> union bank has put its

financial strength to work for a wide range of companies, from small businesses to major corporations. what can we do for you? >> we are a nation of explorers. we seek new ways of living, of thinking, and of expressing ourselves. we take risks. we learn from experience. and we keep moving forward. that is why we encourage and celebrate the explorer in all of us. >> and now "bbc newsnight." >> in 2010, the year the world divided east and west along religious lines. a threat to burn that iran and a

small american state to the banning of the perk up in -- a threat to burn the koran in a small american state and the banning of the burque in france. this mother believes that her child was kidnapped and forcibly concerned -- converted to islam. jesus christ gave me my daughter, he gave him to me. the modernization of muslims in a secular state. >> it is hard when they insult us on the road or on the blast. >> a leading muslim cleric, one of the new generations of radical islamic thinkers.

>> is the world dividing into the muslim middle east and anti- muslim europe? it was to blame for the increasing gulf and can we hear the divide before it develops into a monumental clash. we began with a reminder of some of the flash points. plans to build an islamic center in two blocks away from grant 0 on the site of the 9/11 attack. the forces of the project said they aim to build bridges between the states and find out that the constitution protect the right to religious freedom. a project at the ground zero mosques and it would be an insult to the memory of the people who died there. in europe, french lawmakers voted in favor of the bill banning the full islamic veil and public spaces this year.

supporters argue that this is an affront to the value of the french republic and argue that this lot liberates women who are oppressed and are forced to wear the veil by radical muslim men. france has one of the largest muslim populations in europe but only a around 2000 women wear full body veils. in november, a group linked to al qaeda claimed responsibility for a bomb that killed 60 christian workers in baghdad. in the same statement, the bombers professed that all christians are legitimate targets. a growing state of attacks and kidnappings has caused many christians to emigrate. a pakistani christian has been sentenced to death for allegedly blaspheming against islam. the only christian household in the village, her entire family

is targeted and on the run. she is an illiterate farm worker and is the first woman to be sentenced to hang under the blasphemy laws. on the 11th of december, an iraqi born british resident died in a suicide bomb attack in sweden. killed as a martyr, his analyst is punished sweden and the west -- his aim was to punish sweden and the west. the english defense league has withdrawn an invitation to a controversial american -- to speak at their event. terry jones drew criticism when he threatened to burn a copy of the koran on september 11th this year.

violent clashes between muslims and christians over the building of an authorized church has began highlighting the delicate balance between the two groups in egypt. one in 10 belong to the coptic orthodox church. the constitution guarantees equality for all but some christians believe that they are increasingly beleaguered and some christian women are being lured or kidnapped into forced marriages with christian men. -- with islamic men. >> christmas in cairo looks surprisingly like christmas in the west. this man does good business selling imported decorations to christians. they no longer have a tree at home. they cannot bear to. >> at christmas, she was the one

who used to decorate the tree. she used to get out of the presence. for her, this was a big thing. -- she used to give out presents. one night, she went out with friends and she never came home. the next thing she knew, she was married to an older muslim man. she is -- they think that she was forcibly converted. the state will not intervene. >> someone from state security said, once the issue is legitimize, you will be able to see your daughter. i asked him what he meant. he said, when she has a baby. what he meant was that once she has a child, she would not be able to leave, she would be trapped forever. >> look at me, i am dying

inside. jesus christ gave me my daughter. he gave for to me, not to them. in three years, they have seen their daughter just once. coptic christianity is a faith much older than islam but many of the followers of our feeling the increasingly beleaguered in an overwhelmingly -- are feeling increasingly beleaguered in an overwhelmingly islamic society. >> the government is to blame because education is the islamic. they forced children to memorize the koran. if a muslim man harasses a christian girl and she reports into the police, no action will be taken. the police will even harasser themselves.

-- harass her themselves. >> it is believed that the government turns a blind eye as young girls are kidnapped and forced into muslim marriages. one woman said that it happened to hurt three years ago. >> -- her three years ago. >> on the 17th of august, declared me a muslim. they drew up a contract. i refused to sign. one of the men they're tied me up and -- >> she cannot bring herself to say that she was raped. >> they took me to a hospital because i was bleeding severely. >> the church has built new

lives. it is believed that these are victims of a shed we muslim group to bring the girls to islam. attempts to investigate are silenced or denials. victims say that they are afraid to confront the people who did this to them. some of them probably hide a shameful romance. all of the victims are trapped because regardless of why the christian would give up her face, the state makes it almost impossible for them to return. conversion to islam is easy but thousands of egyptians have converted to christianity or converted have refused to register as christians on their id cards where religion must be stated. that can ruin a life. >> i cannot go to any government office because my papers say

that i'm still a muslim. that means i cannot marry a christian like myself i cannot be allowed to register the marriage. if i have children, i would not be able to register them as christians see there. -- as christians either. >> rubbish is the stock and trade of many of the congregants. sorting it is overwhelmingly christian of peak -- occupation. very few questions have top drops. that is because of official discrimination, they say. -- very few christians have top jobs. the government cracked down hard on the muslim brotherhood. they are afraid of sectarian violence. the government seems unable or unwilling to fully protect the christian minority. the state denies any

discrimination and there is official connivance and forced marriage which is very rare and punished. the constitution guarantees that all citizens are equal and government supporters say that that is contradicted by another clause which makes sure rillettes the main source of law. >> over 90% of the population, this is an acknowledgement of the facts in this society. at the same time, as i mentioned again and again, it should not be seen as some sort of long discrimination against any particular faith. >> maybe the state itself will not initiate this but they confront the islamization trend.

>> last month, and the name of public order, police fired live ammunition to disperse christians at a protest. two were killed. the law makes it much harder to build a church that the mosque although the government says that that will eventually change. copts are fiercely patriotic. to the egyptians, this is -- >> the people of switzerland last year and the building of minarets on mosques. supporters say that this is a sign of islamization. opponents say that this is discrimination. the move has stirred hatred. >> with the alps, the lakes,

geneva it is one of the most comfortable locations in europe. the poor can be overlooked, they need help. they get it every monday at the islamic center, the model of integration. you don't have to be muslim to come here and half of the staff are christian. they are well-placed to observe the muslim population. there's news of a suicide bomber in sweden which is still fresh. >> -- they cannot understand the modern people. >> that is getting worse. >> yes. >> it has been a year since the swiss decided that there will be no more mosques like geneva. nearly 97% voted to ban minaret s, the towers that the muzzins

make the call to prayer. this has opened up some of the divisions. there is a question of political and religious freedom, nationalism, and intolerance, and western europe's attitude to and fear of islam. the swiss government was dismayed believing that this violated the right to religious worship. they have to live with what member called the tyranny of the majority. the man behind the referendum was -- of the right-wing people's party. he says that they have never been so popular since coming up with a tactic to oppose islam. >> we have a problem with islam. we don't understand how so many people would vote for this kind of ban if we did not have a problem with the islamization of civil society in europe. >> an online video game, she is

the mosques" appeared -- "shoot the mosques" appeared on his website. he finds it amusing. >> there's no need to build new churches. they have the problem to build the old ones. >> new churches are built. there are new churches built in switzerland. >> this is a faith which is compatible with our state of right, with our democracy. >> i have not noticed but in the christmas market in bern, this woman believes she is attracting stairs. brought up protestant, she now wears a hijab. with religious symbols band in the classroom, she has been

unable to complete her teaching degree. she says this is unfair. >> it is clear that this is a dress code a part of the religion. this is not a religious symbol. a religious symbol would be a cross. >> some other women don't wear of the hijab. >> probably they are not as faithful as others are or they practice it in another way. it is sad when people cannot accept muslim women to wear the hijab and only look scornful at her or insult her on the bus. >> as i happen to you? >> yes, that has happened to me. >> every muslim is appalled by the ban on minarets but they realize that those are playing on the fears of non muslims that already exists. many muslims themselves share those fears of fundamentalists

or immigrants from very conservative akron to come to switzerland and they have some very conservative ideas. this family is among the 4% of swiss citizens who are muslim. 2/3 of them are from the balkans and turkey. the product of an immigration wave over the last 30 years. attitudes such as the albanian views on forced marriage are forced by background and not religion. >> this is not make any difference if we're talking about a christian or a muslim family. >> because this is that of any in a culture? >> an albanian culture from the area. an albanian coming from an urban area would -- if they had a higher education level. >> they have said that we are terrorists. >> this man is going through the mail. it has been sent to his islamic center by people believe that

his organization would like sharia law. he said that muslims are the latest in a line of scapegoats. in the 70 posthumous was italians were the targets. >> -- in the 70's, italians were the targets. >> they are not learning our language, they are eating spaghetti and all of these things. >> it worked itself out in the end. >> now, they are saying at the same things. if you go further back to the 19th century, we see the same pattern with use. -- with jews. >> in switzerland, you see the middle ages christian flag with its cross almost everywhere. here it is, just across from a small mosque. a forlorn wooden prop marks where the minaret was supposed to be. its absence is a triumph for the

majority vote and a slight to the muslims. you have heard the term, "the tyranny of the majority." >> yes. i know this concept of democracy and i will fight. >> this man believes that this is disingenuous. she says that this minaret is a provocation. >> this is ok. >> i say if you want to talk problems, you had better talk about in a different set of way and look for solutions. >> banning minarets. >> i could live without this but this is discrimination. >> you would not church's steeples down as well? >> no. i think that both are beautiful and they should be allowed. >> muslim organizations are now starting a campaign to reverse the ban. those behind the ban said they

don't have a hope. >> i am joined by the former bishop of rochester, -- on the council of business, -- from the islamic research academy, and -- from the national secular society. there as an example of the marin of the attitude of one of the other. >> --mirroring the attitude of one or the other. >> there's an element of racism to this is not just that. this is like the burqa ban in france. what this does is express anxiety about religious symbols. what you have to remember is that for the men sitting around this table, they are not representative of the general population because most of us don't go to church, we don't go to the mosque, or the synagogue. we are indifferent to religion

and we don't like it to be forced onto west. >> the lack of understanding between the religions, this leads to fear. >> yes. this is also competition. there are states where islam is the main religion. states where christianity is the main religion and they don't want to leave their access to power. these are patriarchal power systems. >> women are the ones who came to be the victims and any expression on either side of the problems comes to the women. >> to the women began stop wearing the veil in egypt. this is really alarming when you go to egypt because there are almost no women who are wearing the veil. >> i don't believe that the two religions cannot live together despite one being in a power position. if you look at the history of

islam, christianity has had an existence in continuity. >> not in democracies but in dictatorships. under saddam hussein, christians feared -- >> if you look at jordan for instance, we were told that the parliament is designed to proportional representation. by virtue of the percentage of christians, they should have 8 seats but they actually have 16. >> otherwise they would not get -- >> all in history, all of totalitarianism has risen at a secular ideologies, not religion. look at the 20 century. you have national socialism, stalinism, mao, even fascism from saddam hussein. >> what i'm saying is that

secularity is a power system. it may or may not be patriarchal. on the whole, i think it has been. this is a power system and it should not be given a privilege system of neutrality. >> what about the idea is that the fear is with the men around this table because you are the leaders in your community. you should be the ones who are actually stepping up to the plate and doing more. >> i totally agree. i think we all failed here. what is important is to come back to our common element, our community. but the human beings want to do? my father says, look at that, he wants to share. human beings want to share things. we should share our differences. >> do you think that mauled biculturalism is a problem? >> i think that secularism is a problem. -- to you think that mauled biculturalism is a problem -- multicultural wisdom is a

problem? >> what we have seen increasingly are in areas of the netted kingdom, areas where communities do not interact and where this is entirely secular. >> we need good leadership. what we need to do or to get leaders who are in touch with humanity and can get in touch with human beings. we always talk about what we have in common, that will bring us together anyway. the differences are the things that are according to the fears. >> why are we, all-out this multi-cultural listen to exist for people are separated -- >> this has created the problem as segregation of the community, of people not talking to one another, of being inward looking.

>> -- >> we have all failed. the point is that in britain, particularly, this is the judeo- christian heritage, the bible which provides a way of locking people, of hospitality, and of treating the stranger as yourself. that should have been the basis of constructing an inclusive society. >> what is the next downward step? >> we need to begin to examine very very carefully how we are representing each other. there's the stereotyping of muslims, demonization. where is this going to end? i was out -- -- i was drawing parallels in the 1930's and you can see how communities were demonized to such a level that they were called rats in a sewer

and to be exterminated. that led to the holocaust. >> i would be strongly against any such attempt. i think the whole thing goes back to a firming people's fundamental freedoms. >> you have men who have benefited from all biculturalism -- multicultural wisdom and these people are turning themselves into victims. what about the women in their society or not allowed to learn english or do are forced into marriages against their will? >> i'm afraid on that point, we will have to leave it. thank you. that is all for this week. from all of us, goodbye. >> hello and welcome. >> see the news unfold. get the top stories from around

the globe and click to play video reports. go to bbc.com/news to experience the in-depth, expert reporting of "bbc world news" online. >> funding for this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york, stowe, vermont, and honolulu. newman's own foundation. the john d. and catherine t. macarthur foundation. and union bank. >> union bank has put its financial strength to work for a wide range of companies, from small businesses to major corporations. what can we do for you? >> "bbc newsnight" was presented by kcet, los angeles.