>> i'm monica malpass. on "inside story," 44 days and counting until the presidential election, and both candidates desperately want to win the keystone state. let's get the inside story. ♪ good morning, and welcome. let's meet our insiders today. and they are harold jackson, journalist. good morning, sir. welcome so much to you. >> hello, monica. >> glad to have you. christine flowers, attorney and journalist. good morning. >> hey, monica. >> rich negrin, attorney. good morning, sir. >> good morning, monica. >> jeff jubelirer, communications executive. >> good morning, monica. >> thank you all for joining us today. a big tight finish here as we come into the last couple of months of the presidential race. the hillary clinton team has been in the philadelphia area alone a couple of times in the last month. donald trump ate a geno's steak last week and also stopped by delaware county. here was a big event that he hosted. so both of them really would like to win pennsylvania. we'll talk more about what a couple of polls show in just a moment. but what's your take on -- there's a difference, though,

harold, if they need to win or if they must win. what's your take on how they're gonna do here? >> well, i think pennsylvania is certainly a must-win state for donald trump. and hillary would like to win it, as well. but we know that there are -- pennsylvania is not monolithic. so both of them have, maybe, a shot at winning it. donald trump's certainly an outside chance, but if he can get those people in between the two big urban centers to vote for him, you know, who knows what will happen? >> right, traditionally. it's been a democratic-held state for a long time. 1988 the last time they went with a republican candidate for president, anyway. so it could flip. it's gonna be down to the wire, i know. let's look at a couple of polls and just show you what recently has been seen out there in the public when they do some polling of possible voters. hillary clinton leading donald trump 11.7% in one of the polls. that was a nate silver forecast. and also, a second poll showed a little bit tighter race, with her at 48% and donald trump at 37%. a margin of error of 3.4, so that would take into account her winning still, but not by as wide of a margin. still, all bets are off because there are key groups here

that are really flowing in a different direction than any have ever flowed before. young people not necessarily supporting hillary clinton as they did president obama. and, of course, white, educated women not necessarily supporting the republican candidate. so whole groups are shifting, and this is surprising, don't you think? >> it's exactly right, monica. the usual demographics are not falling into line as you would have expected them, especially the millennials who -- so many of them had plighted their troth to bernie sanders. and they have to be wooed by hillary clinton, which was what she was doing this week at the university of pennsylvania, when she was talking about student debt. also, you have the factor of the green party candidate and the libertarian. and most commentators have said that that helps donald trump, that any votes that are cast for those candidates would take away from hillary. so you really don't know at this point. there are no insurances, let's say, at this point. >> and there are other states that could be the tipping point, too, to give you the 270 electoral votes that a president

needs to win -- florida, michigan, ohio. also key states -- virginia -- there are a number of them that are unpredictable at this point. but they're gonna try down to the last minute, i'm sure. >> yeah, and if we look at pennsylvania's 20 electoral votes, it's really an arbiter of what might be happening in the rest of the country. so i don't think we can look at it in a vacuum. if pennsylvania goes donald trump, chances are ohio goes donald trump. there are a number of voters that might not be getting those phone calls from pollsters because they're not what we in the polling language are considered likely voters. so you have, as we talked about, the demographics being so different, you might have voters that are inclined to support donald trump who could also be registered democrats. so i think all bets are off the table. certainly i wouldn't bet against nate silver or terry madonna, our panelist here on "inside story." but i think we don't have a model to look at as to what may happen on november 8th. >> and it seems, as some of the polls, rich, are showing, that even after the conventions this summer that whatever gain they may have felt has really, apparently, been erased, and they're sort of back where they were pre-convention. >> yeah, you know, i think it's interesting. i think after the conventions,

this was gonna get closer no matter what. but the interesting thing about pennsylvania is, it's always sort of the rabbit, right? you're chasing that rabbit down the hole. it always goes democratic on a presidential side, it always looks close, pennsylvania's always on that battleground list -- you know, the battle state. but i think jeff is right. when you look at all those battleground states, pennsylvania is probably, out of all of them, whether it's florida or ohio or michigan, always the one that's probably more likely to be democratic. >> and, of course, the big debate tomorrow night -- the first of three that they're gonna have the next several weeks. and any quick answers? who do you think is gonna win, if you will? i'm sure all the commentators will say after who scored this point or that point, but donald trump says he's ready just by definition. he has been used to many debates, of course, 'cause he had so many -- 16 contenders that started the field -- but hillary clinton has been studying long and hard. who's gonna win it? >> [ chuckles ] i think it depends on which donald shows up at the debate. and i think hillary has the tougher job here because she has to prepare for four possible different donalds coming to the

debate floor -- you know, the insulting donald, the calm and statesmanlike donald, who has, you know, recently appeared, the -- the petulant donald, so i think she has a more difficult time. we're -- and -- and -- and i believe that style is as important as substance, at least during this first debate. you know, when they're out of the gate, you want to see can he hold up against her? plus the threshold is a lot higher for her. even if he comes off as, you know, barely acceptable, he's gonna win the debate because people aren't expecting as much from him as they are from her. >> plus she's had a lot of experience debating over many years -- a lifetime of career politics. he's a new politician, if you will, even though he's been a successful businessman. what were you gonna say? i'm sorry. >> well, i was just gonna say unfortunately debates have become contests of one-liners. so, you know, that gives trump an advantage. so, i'm not sure who will win the debate. i think on substance certainly i expect her to win. but in terms of what public opinion will be, i don't know. >> and the numbers could be as big as a super bowl if you will because people really want to

see how they're gonna go together -- the sparks if that, or maybe substance as well, which would be nice, if that were -- >> i also think there's this unique dynamic with donald trump where he's being graded on a curve, right? >> right. >> you talked about it. if he's not graded on a curve and you sit there and you look at the substance and you look the -- the real quality of their answers, hillary's gonna win this debate outright. if -- if -- if he just doesn't throw up, some people are gonna call him a winner. >> it's a win, right. >> and that's bizarre and i think unfair. >> all right, well, we're gonna have some special coverage after the presidential debate and after action news, following that. it's a special version of "inside story" on monday night, live. so i hope you'll join us on monday at 11:30 p.m. for our special coverage of the presidential debate with a panel of people analyzing how they did and saying who the winners and losers are and what points they scored that evening. all right, let's move on and talk about several more key races coming up, of course, in just a few weeks. that pennsylvania senate race is hot and heavy. both candidates, obviously, are trying at the last final stretch here to get some heavy scoring

going. but it looks like pat toomey, according to a number of polls, is losing ground. it may be because of the donald trump factor. he's been, on the one hand, trying to not totally distance himself but certainly not courting the donald followers and not standing with him at events. so, is that going to end up being the catalyst that costs him the race? he is the incumbent, rich. >> yeah, you know, i saw -- some of his ads have been very effective, i thought, around -- i'm on the board of ceasefire, right? he has -- he actually has a decent record for -- for a republican on gun control and gun violence. but i was surprised to see an ad this week where he did a little bit of the name-calling thing, you know, trying to give katie a nickname, right? i think it was shady katie, and i hesitate to repeat that. but you're not gonna distinguish yourself from donald trump if you're acting like donald trump. and i know that wasn't his ad. that was a committee ad, but i think he has to be very careful in terms of the tone and the nature of the campaign and not to do any of that, right? this might be the year of the woman -- politically.

>> we'll have to see. you just can't tell at this point, but according to the polls, katie mcginty, in three different polls, is gonna win according to them. polls-plus, if you include economic and historical data, has her winning. polls, if you just look at them solely, has her winning. and if the race were that day that the poll was taken, she won there, as well. so it might be that democrats are doing less ticket splitting is the point of these polls and so perhaps that's gonna be the key. >> the southeast is different, in this respect -- southeast pennsylvania. you have a couple of incumbent congressmen -- congressmen meehan and costello -- who frankly are -- don't have very formidable opponents, at least that's what their numbers are showing. and they're likely going to win. that's a ticket split from a hillary. i also think -- i think that bodes well for someone like pat toomey. i think you're gonna see a lot of folks in the suburbs come out and look at the ballot and realize they've always been maybe pat meehan supporters or ryan costello supporters and they're gonna look at the toomey/mcginty race and i think there are -- there is gonna be some ticket splitting.

it has happened more in pennsylvania than in other states even though that hasn't been the national trend. >> right, the trend nationally is less spitting. >> i mean, i kind of -- jeff basically said it all, with the ticket splitting. i think the thing about pat toomey is -- and rich also sort of referenced that -- he is someone who appeals across the aisle. he appeals to those who normally would not vote for a republican. and he's also been very good with constituent services. katie mcginty, i mean you can say all the good things that you want about her public service, but she's not a known quantity when you're dealing one on one with her as an individual. plus, you were talking about name calling. some of her ads have been particularly -- i would call them juvenile or mean girl in a sense. and i'm not gonna go over some of the things that she said as well. but she consistently has called pat toomey "millionaire pat toomey." katie mcginty could match him dollar for dollar in terms of her net worth. so i think that they're -- in this particular case, i think that there will be

ticket splitting. >> all right. we're gonna have to wait and see. we do have special coverage of a debate between those two candidates coming up. jim gardner's going to be the moderator there of the pennsylvania senatorial debate. that's monday, october 24th, at 7:00 p.m., right here on 6abc. so you'll be able to listen to both candidates, make your own decision, and come to some kind of decision before the ballot is in place. time for the senate race discussion now. we have a couple of folks -- i'm sorry -- the attorney general's race. also very contested race here in pennsylvania. josh shapiro broke old records with his fundraising over the summer -- $1.7 million. fairly quiet race, but he certainly has the money lead and that does buy television ad time, which is key in some areas, especially in the southeast. but his opponent also -- john rafferty -- is putting in a good effort there, trying to see if he can win the race on the republican side. any guess on that one? >> well, before i mention that, let me just say one thing about the toomey/mcginty race. i think the fact that toomey is running really str-- trying to run strongly on his two votes --

pro-gun control votes three years ago -- indicated that he's in trouble. on the attorney general race, you know, you have two candidates which one, actually on the paper, is more qualified than the other -- john rafferty. but, you know, the amount of money that josh shapiro is raising indicates that he certainly has the inside track to a victory. i think he thinks so. >> so it's the size of the war chest for shapiro. it's also the connections that that represents. so he has a very good base in the state within the democratic party, but outside as well. >> yeah, and josh shapiro is everywhere. he must have a twin. i mean, and i say this, i like them both. i know them both. i want to disclose that, but he -- and he does cross when it comes to certain issues, whether it be medical malpractice reform or things like that. the other thing is what he's done in montgomery county in terms of executive leadership. and he has pinned his hopes, and i agree with harold in terms of experience, on looking to clean up the office, as does senator rafferty. but in terms of you need a strong manager, a strong executive and in this particular year, due to kathleen kane,

i think that resonates. >> plus, he doesn't come out as a partisan. he doesn't come off as being hyperpartisan, which is also gonna be helpful in this age. but coming after kathleen mccain -- kathleen mccain -- i'm thinking kathleen mcginty -- kathleen kane if anything will be an improvement. >> we also have special coverage of that. "inside story" will have a candidates' forum with both of the attorney generals candidates on sunday, october 16th, at 11:30, replacing "inside story" that day. josh shapiro and john rafferty will be in discussion on that particular panel. and we hope you'll join us to see how both men feel on the issues. all right, let's talk about another very serious and difficult week in the police and african-american male standoff in our country. charlotte, north carolina. tulsa, oklahoma. very difficult situations, and the reaction, of course, in charlotte caused the national guard to be sent out. so i don't even know where to begin to say to people we've got to stop the violence. clearly that's obvious in america that people want to resume some sense of normalcy.

but also there is depth behind this issue that we need to confront and figure out what do we do? rich, where do you start? >> so we have a directive here for the philadelphia police called directive 10. there are 18,000 police departments across the country and most of them don't have a uniform standard for the use of excessive force. when you watch that video in tulsa -- and i'm happy to say that that officer was charged with manslaughter, which is an incredibly important part of what we're trying to talk about in terms of building that gap of trust and holding officers accountable. but you're only allowed to use excessive force -- or i'm sorry -- fatal force, lethal force when it's objectively reasonable that you are in risk and threat of your life. and our officers are taught that. and one of the important things in tulsa is that a failure to obey commands doesn't, in and of itself, rise to that standard where you get shot for not listening to a police officer. and that's what it looks like happened in tulsa.

>> right, and yet on the other hand, harold -- i'm trying to weigh both sides here and be fair to everyone -- we had the situation just a week and nine days ago in philadelphia where a female police officer, sitting in her cruiser, shot 18 times -- an african-american female police officer, as it turned out -- and the suspect later was killed after killing several other people -- or injuring and killing people. so there's a heightened fear by suspects and by police. it's just everybody's afraid of each other. how do you cut the fear? >> yeah, in each one of these cases, you have to look at individually and rule whether or not the police officer or the suspect or the person involved was in error. what people need to realize, though, is this goes much farther than policing. this is not about policing. when you see the number of people on the streets of charlotte as you have the last two or three nights, those frustrations are not just about someone being shot. they're about frustrations in these communities where they're impoverished, where they don't have jobs, where they see a police presence that's so strong that it seems like an occupation. all these factors are in there. and until we get a president who has an urban policy that

actually deals with some of these other issues, you will continue to see these reactions when something goes wrong, like a police shooting. >> right, and, you know, harold, you're absolutely right. first of all, you have to look at each situation separately. the whole idea of having a national policy i think is problematic because you're looking at the tulsa situation was different from the charlotte situation, which was different from ferguson, which was different from dallas, which was different from so many of the other -- baltimore -- so many of the other crisis situations that we've seen. harold's also right, too, that it goes deeper than just the interaction between young african-american youth and police officers. it has to do with poverty. it has to do with lack of employment. but i will say one thing about charlotte, and also what happened in baltimore -- my hometown -- there is no justification for what is happening in those streets that is looting, that is rioting, that is criminal activity, that is not legitimate protest, and i know everybody agrees with that, but there have still been excuses made based on

desperation of people in those communities. they are terrorizing their own communities. and that has to be said. that has to be established. that's not legitimate protesting. >> that's why it was so good to see what happened in charlotte last night. it was a peaceful protest throughout the evening. police officers were walking and talking to protesters, and i hope that's what we have repeats in other cities. >> and the churches were involved, too. >> yes, we'll have to take a break. "inside story" continues right after this. >> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact.

for senate, katie mcginty will stand up to the big oil polluters. she'll work to protect our air and water and make us a leader in clean energy jobs. and millionaire pat toomey? he's for the big oil polluters. toomey voted to protect twenty-four billion dollars in tax breaks for oil companies. and they've given toomey seven hundred thousand dollars

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♪ >> welcome back. we're gonna talk about the bridgegate trial that's currently under way. two former associates of governor christie are on trial for allegedly causing the traffic jam on the george washington bridge, of course, that disrupted traffic for four days in northern new jersey. it is illegal, by the way, causing that kind of intentional disruption. they both say, or at least one of the witnesses in the trial has said, that governor christie knew about it and two of his staffers told him at a 9/11 commemorative in manhattan about it, even though he has denied vehemently for a couple years now knowing anything about it. do you think that he should be subpoenaed? do you think he should be indicted? >> [ scoffs ] well, the facts will determine that in the court of law. i mean, we -- some people are gonna believe yes, some people

are gonna believe no, but one thing is for sure -- his support is in the toilet. >> yeah. >> he's got basically less than 1 in 3 new jerseyans who think he's doing a good job. he's tied his wagon to -- excuse me -- tied his hitch to the trump wagon. his credibility has been shot. if trump loses, i guess he'll go to the private sector and make real money. but it's hard to believe that he didn't have some sense or his office didn't have some sense of what was going on. this is very damaging to his legacy. >> yeah, i think federal prosecutors said that they did not have enough to indict him, but that they felt that he did know of what had occurred and who was doing what. i think, as someone who lives in new jersey, that chris christie at this point has decided that his political career is over, and he's not even caring about what the public thinks. he's making some decisions that have to do with taxes and spending and casinos that indicate that, you know, he's doing whatever chris christie wants to do. >> you know, monica, i mean, i think the one thing that makes me feel really good about our leaders in philadelphia is new jersey. [ laughter ]

so i don't know if it's -- if he should be indicted. i don't know whether he should resign as governor. but i do know that it should disqualify him for a major role in any kind of presidency, right? and i think he's been lobbying and pushing for probably the attorney general position, and we can't have an attorney general of the united states that may have known about this illegal activity and didn't do something about it. >> all right, let's talk about another -- i'm sorry. go ahead. >> no, i'm just saying, he's damaged goods, and, you know, i've been at this table for years and we've had situations where he's been the, you know -- the fair-haired son and the bright star. and i mean, how far has he fallen from a pr perspective? >> right. all right, let's talk about state representative leslie acosta. the governor has asked her to resign her position. she did secretly plead guilty to felony charges of corruption and money laundering. some people say it's not just what she has admitted to doing -- and that she's gonna be sentenced in january by the way -- but that she blindsided the party. that the bigwigs within the democratic party didn't know that she was being investigated,

didn't know that she had pled guilty, and were surprised to hear about it and embarrassed, frankly. is that enough to have derailed her? >> it should have been. i mean, she is the epitome of what everything that has gone wrong in pennsylvania, whether it be judges or kathleen kane or chaka fattah. she may be the top of the cake. she fooled her constituents. she fooled her colleagues. she fooled taxpayers. >> she fooled bob brady. >> and it's an absolute disgrace that she's still in office. this is the best thing for republicans that could possibly happen if she tries to fight and stay in office because it's just -- it's just a horrible representation of what has been going on locally in philadelphia. >> and that's a question mark. will she come to the next session in january in harrisburg and try to get seated? they're trying to work their way around that. the governor's now asked her to resign. bob brady, the congressman, has said, "please get out of office." and she legally has said, "i'm not sentenced yet, and i have every right to be there," even though nine days later, in

january, she's going to be sentenced. >> i mean, she's gonna have the democrats supporting the gop in preventing her from being seated, because this is -- this is outrageous. governor wolf, and i agree with him wholeheartedly, said that people who have been convicted of felonies should not be in public office. she pled guilty. that's a legal conviction. she hasn't been sentenced yet, and so they're trying to split the hairs here, and her attorney is saying, you know, she hasn't been sentenced yet and under regulation, she still could be seated and what have you. but i mean, this is -- this is an abomination and an obscenity. and i'm sorry. it is -- it is -- representative acosta is saying to her constituents, "i'm more important than you are. i matter more than you do." and it's really outrageous. >> all right, we'll have to keep our eye on that. we're gonna take a break. inside stories of the week, coming your way next. stick with us. ♪ approve this message.

i'd look her right in that fat ugly face of hers. she's a slob. she ate like a pig. a person who's flat chested is very hard to be a 10. does she have a good body? no. does she have a fat [expletive]? absolutely. do you treat women with respect?

i can't say that either. >> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact.

>> time for inside stories of the week. and let's start with jeff. >> well, i want to give a shout-out across the street here to my colleague harold jackson at "philadelphia enquirer," "philadelphia daily news". they have exposed some things in the last few weeks that if not for the investigative prowess of their journalists, we would not have know. we just spoke about representative acosta, but how about ppa? philadelphia parking authority's vince fenerty who was accused and admitted to sexual harassment and still is retaining his job, and the outrage that that has caused so far and action that may -- that hasn't been taken, but that could still be taken. watchdog roles still matters, and newspapers do, too. >> harold. >> i wanted to just take a second, my inside story is about protest voting or voting in anger. we all need to remember that who we vote for is private, but the impact is not. who we vote for impacts 300 million other americans. so rather than going to the polls and voting for someone because you don't like the others, vote for who can actually do the job, who has the attitude, aptitude, and has experience and background to do

the job that's required. >> all right, christine. >> you know, monica, a lot of people have been criticizing colin kaepernick and malcolm jenkins and a lot of the other athletes who have either taken a knee or put their fists in the air in protest for what's happening to young african-americans and police violence. and they've been criticized and i've criticized them. but in the wake of what happened in charlotte this week and seeing the riots and the violence, i have to rethink my opposition. i think that that peaceful protest and the symbolic protest is by far the better way to show your feelings. >> all right, and, rich. >> you know, we're having a national conversation -- we started it today -- around race and unconscious bias and diversity, which i think is incredibly important. the aba this past week issued a resolution 113 stating specifically that the legal profession is the least diverse profession in the country. if we're gonna increase faith in our justice system, if we're gonna increase faith in our legal system, a big part of it is having a legal profession

that reflects our country. really important for all of us to work on diversity in the legal profession. two lawyers here -- diverse lawyers here today. really just the beginning of an important conversation. >> all right, the aba is the american bar association, of course. all right, thank you all for your inside stories and for your input this week. and thank you so much for watching. and we want to remind you, of course, we have a special "inside story" live coverage tomorrow night of the presidential debate and the outcome and who's on top. we'll see you tomorrow night. i'm monica malpass. have a great week ahead. >> i'm nydia han be breaking news, miami similar -- marlins jose fernandez was killed in a boating accident. hillary clinton and donald trump are preparing for the their first debate as the new poll shows the race tightening. those stories and the exclusive accuweather seven-day forecast

next on "action news."

>> good afternoon, it is sunday, september 25. here's some of the stories worry worry -- we're following on "action news." the search is for answers continues today in wilmington after the tragic death of two firefighters we're live. a boating