>> pennsylvania is not only being called a swing state, it's actually acting like one. so, what now? "inside story" starts right now. ♪ good morning, everyone. i'm matt o'donnell. it's sunday, november 27, 2016. i hope you had your fill of turkey, because we've got a lot to talk about today this morning. let's meet our insiders of the week. ajay raju -- attorney. good morning, ajay. >> good morning. >> brian tierney -- marketing executive. hello, brian. >> good morning. >> rich negrin, attorney. welcome to panel, rich. >> thank you, matt. >> first time you're on with me. and jeff jubelirer -- communications executive. >> hey, matt. >> hello, everyone. all right, so, donald trump won pennsylvania for the first time for a republican since 1988 by less than 68,000 votes out of nearly 6 million cast. now, politicspa presented a really excellent analysis, and i know all of you have looked at it, and they go through several data points. but the one thing that they

concluded with this analysis is this -- republican women in pa were not as likely to abandon their party and vote for hillary clinton while democratic men were more likely to abandon their party and vote for donald trump. i'll give you the first crack at this, rich. what do you think? what does that tell you? >> you know, it's not just that there were some changes around the demographics in terms of voting patterns, but also the areas of the state, right? southwest pennsylvania came out huge in big ways with working-class whites. the democratic party has to learn how to reconnect with those voter if they're ever gonna win a presidential election again. >> what do you think, brian? >> i think there's a sense of passion around there. i mean, i think i saw one number that, you know, the democratic vote went from 46% of democrats voting to 42%. the republicans had a reverse five or six points up in terms of it. and i think the message of making american great again, which some looked at as kind of like a cartoon kind of a message, was a more affirming, positive message in the end than stronger together, which was

about how they should feel, and a lot of people aren't happy, you know, and fundamentally, they want something that's action-oriented, and that's what donald trump was talking about. >> you work a lot with messaging, jeff. >> [ chuckles ] >> i mean, it was his message all along. he actually patented it well before he even announced running for president. it worked. >> yeah, and i think if you look at one area of the state -- now southwest pennsylvania had been trending more in the republican column on the presidential election, not necessarily down ballot. so, mitt romney had won -- like, the collar counties around allegheny, which holds pittsburgh. so if you looked at scranton-wilkes-barre as the arbiter -- if you looked at it four years ago, mitt romney lost it in single digits to president obama. this time president-elect trump beat hillary clinton by double digits. >> i think it was about 12 percentage points -- if you look at luzerne county, scranton-wilkes-barre area -- these are democrats. this is where vice president joe biden, and hillary clinton, have familial connections and roots in. if you look at that area, i think that's a good point -- of where the democrats --

where bob casey's from, our senator... >> yeah. >> ...to where they need to reconnect, that would be it. >> mm-hmm. >> i think a more bruising primary on the democratic side would have helped hillary clinton, too. i think the fact that it was kind of a cakewalk, and there wasn't much of a fight, and people anointed her -- she didn't go through the rough and tumble of becoming a better candidate that donald trump had to go through. >> okay, let me give you a crack at this, ajay. so, a couple of names i'll throw out here -- josh shapiro -- he won statewide. he's a democrat. he avoided the trump wave. but at the same time, a republican otto voit who ran for state treasurer lost, and he was all in for trump. how do outliers like that happen? >> i think that all the assumptions we've made about identity politics were turned upside down, on its head. but i think one of the main reasons -- the takeaway from me from the election was that there was a resounding rejection of hillary clinton's expectation to be president, the idea that she waited her turn, the idea that she was cashing in a rain check

from 2008 was a turn-off for the voters. >> yeah, yeah. >> she was clearly the most qualified candidate to ever run for president, but she wasn't the candidate for the here and now, and what trump captured was a zeitgeist of the working class, the zeitgeist of all the identity politics that pundits said would flip the other way in favor of democrats. we're learning now that people are frustrated, and it was a fight against the status quo. then you have exceptions like shapiro and others... >> mm-hmm. >> ...where that was the deviance, right? it was really about hillary clinton not being the right candidate for this moment. it was less about -- i think in the long run -- about identity politics as we are debating today. >> i ran into mayor jim kenney, who has always been a critic of donald trump, talking about him winning the presidency. here's what he said. so, president trump is organizing his transition team, the president-elect trump... >> yep. >> ...and he's met with some rivals like mitt romney and other people. >> yep. >> and this is just a hypothetical situation -- if he were to invite all the big-city mayors to washington to

talk, would you go? >> yeah, sure. >> what would you like to tell him? >> president of the united states -- i would like to tell him that, you know, much of our population, whether they're documented or undocumented, are contributing members of our society that run businesses, employ people, raise families, and they're human beings, and we need to treat them like human beings. >> so, there you have the sanctuary-city thing... >> mm-hmm. >> ...which is very important to mayor kenney. do you foresee trump being on a collision course with him and maybe a lot of the other big-city mayors, up in new york city for example, that are liberal? >> now, i'm not an expert on music, but was that band foreigner in the background? >> toto. >> toto, okay. [ laughter ] okay, good. i wasn't sure about that. >> good ear, jeff. good ear. >> but anyway -- look, he's the president, so if i was the mayor of a city, and i'd be a democrat, my first thing would be "this is not the guy i voted for," etcetera, but now i figure out "okay, how do i build a relationship with him, because i'm gonna get an extra whatever for my constituents by having a better relationship rather than take him on. i think the issue of sanctuary

cities is an interesting one, and i think it's a bit arrogant though, to some level, to say -- that a city's gonna say "no matter what the federal laws are, we're gonna do this differently here." so i think he is on a collision course, and if i was the mayor i'd be trying to find some way to be -- you know, have honest, reasonable disputes with the president, but also trying to figure out how to make sure that my city got a little bit extra than maybe chicago or other cities. >> former managing director right here for nutter. what would you be telling your boss? >> the big issue around sanctuary cities that concerns me is that we ask our police officers to do too much. they have one of the hardest jobs. we don't want to turn them into, you know, immigration officers. >> right. >> and that's the big issue -- while we're expecting professionalism and great conduct and really reforms from our police department, we can't expect them to do all of those things. we can't turn them into federal officers, and that's a huge risk, i think. and that's why it's important for us not to be in the immigration business, and why we need strong, comprehensive immigration reform that comes

from the federal government. >> that's -- go ahead. >> i'm just gonna say quickly -- i like the mayor's message at the beginning where he talked about "these are folks who create jobs. these are small businessmen and women." >> yeah. >> that's speaking trumpian, if you will, or that's speaking republican. in is tone, that's the way he needs to communicate. >> is that by accident? >> well, no. i think that's very purposeful, and, b, in saying -- i think we're seeing already in trump, sort of the transition-- "well, i said this during the campaign, but, actually, in thinking about it more -- meh, climate change might be real. i think it does have a human cause. yeah, we don't need necessarily the boarder wall. maybe a fence would do." it's very transactional, and where are the transactional opportunities for philadelphia to -- trump's a businessman. how do you barter with him? where can philadelphia win on that? >> he did go to school here. >> that's true. >> he did go to penn. let me talk about pennsylvania one more time here. the legislature rode the trump wave big time. the republicans have a 34-seat majority in the senate. this is one of the things, i

think, people didn't really talk about much. >> yeah. >> that's the largest majority in the state senate since 1950. they have the largest majority in the house since 1958. is governor wolf going "uh-oh" looking at the next two years, saying "i'm not gonna get anything done." >> i think -- look, you're in now to the campaign season, etcetera, etcetera. but governor wolf had a better second year than a first year when he realized... there's three branches of government. there's the executive, the legislative, and the judicial. so you can't just say "i was elected on this," 'cause every state rep says, "hey, i was elected on the opposite, so where do we find the compromise?" it seemed like governor wolf the second year was able to find those compromises. and i think he could ride that spirit of things. >> what do you think, ajay? >> well, i think he's well-intentioned and earnest, clearly, but he's had a difficult time wrangling with the republican legislature, even in the second year, and has a difficult time getting the public to rally behind his agenda. this sounds very familiar to the other tommy... >> [ laughs ] >> ...who was the governor around this time. >> tom corbett. >> you know, we have a history where governors, especially

incumbent governors, have almost a walk-in layup in a reelection, except that streak was broken. whether tom wolf will be the second one-time tommy, is the issue. and i think he's walking into a weaker than an a typical incumbent. >> you're talking about a $2 billion -- you're talking about a $2 billion deficit in pennsylvania going to next budget year, and this is the budget year where things have to get done, because if you look at '18 -- >> and that's out of what, $30 billion? >> true, in the big picture. >> it's significant though. >> it only can come from a few different places. if the republican legislature is not going to raise taxes, and that's a hard sell in a very dominated republican legislature, which has the votes to overturn his vetoes now. >> sure. >> it must come somewhere, and it's probably gonna come from cuts. we're gonna see a big rigmarole, i think, this upcoming 2017 budget cycle. but as we head into '18, when 1/3 of the senate is up, all the state reps are up -- obviously, it's a gubernatorial election. >> but you can't look at it and say, "we're not gonna be able to

raise taxes," so then they're gonna -- yeah, i guess they i guess they have to. >> but they haven't. >> because nobody wants to cut-- nobody wants their taxes raised, to be honest with you, 'cause i think we're feeling, like, "before you ask me for more money, how about you getting a little more efficient on your side? how about you doing some fundamental union reforms in terms of those sort of things?" >> you know who you sound like? >> [ laughs ] >> scott wagner. >> yeah. >> scott wagner has already said, "yes, i'm running for governor." you're gonna be hearing a lot from this individual. he's a member of the senate. he actually was the first write-in candidate to win a state senate seat in pennsylvania. he's a frequent wolf critic, he's a political newcomer serving his first term. he ran a waste-management business. so he's primarily a businessman. how do you see things working out right now, given that one of the biggest critics is gonna be running for governor? >> and he's got pockets full of trumpian cash, too. >> sure. >> he's a very wealthy individual. he's run against the grain. he ran a write-in candidate in the primary. >> right. >> let's be clear -- he beat the favored republican.

he doesn't owe anyone anything, he has also been the campaign chair the republican senate campaign committee, and he -- >> but he has to have the trump brand. i think there's a crowded field. you know, if trump was immediately, you know, "oh, trump. my god, the tv show." he doesn't have it. >> no. >> i don't' think he has the charm, frankly, that trump had when he wants to turn it on. >> i agree with that. >> i think of the candidates who are potentially the republican challengers, i think jim cawley probably has the charm. >> former lieutenant governor. >> he's a good, moderate leader, probably somebody who would govern on policy, less on populist demagoguery. >> it makes a difficult primary, unfortunately. >> and you hear names like rob wonderling, obviously who -- >> mike turzai, jake corman. >> it'll be a crowded field. >> it'll be a crowded field. >> and there's no trump brand. >> don't expect things to coalesce around a certain candidate. i mean, it's 2018 from -- >> i'll tell you one thing about wagner for a lot of republican-elected officials -- they view him as somebody that is not quite a trump kind of -- he doesn't have that brand. and also, not a very

collegial guy to work with, so it'll be interesting to see how that works out. >> but he has some interesting positions. he's been very good on opening anti-discrimination against the lgbt community. >> yes, he actually is moderate on some things. >> he's not this rock-rib conservative. you know, he's got some interesting positions. >> okay. let's talk about the electoral college. i don't know what the exact numbers are right now, 'cause they change by the day it seems. but hillary clinton seems to lead the popular vote by 1.5 million votes. there's one of the earlier maps. i know that donald trump's gonna get more than 300 electoral votes. but the elections where the winner lost the popular vote are as follows -- 1824, john quincy adams. 1876, rutherford b. hayes. 1888, benjamin harrison. 2000, george bush. 2016, donald trump. why did it happen twice in the last 16 years and then didn't happen in the entire 1900s? i mean, does anyone know? >> yeah, that's a great question. >> i mean, the electoral college is there, and we all know why. it's really there to give some of the smaller states, you know, to level the

playing field a little bit. but the problem is that your vote in montana is worth about four times what your vote is in pennsylvania, and that's the inherent injustice. and i think one of the things we're able to -- the popular vote can't be totally irrelevant. we have to figure out a way, whether it's reducing some of the numbers of the electoral college in other states and actually giving you a certain number of electoral college votes when you when the popular vote, whether it's 25 or 30 -- make it a real thing. make it count. >> well, we do have that formula. we do have that formula right now. i mean, i think part of the reason why the popular -- >> the popular vote doesn't count at all right now. >> well, in certain states like maine -- >> based on the percentage of -- >> and that's two districts in the entire country. >> oh, and by the way, the republicans run the white house, the congress -- you think they're gonna want to change it now? >> it's not gonna change, no. >> but here's the thing -- i mean, our founding fathers had a reason for it. they wanted to make sure that it wasn't just about one part of the country. >> if you change it, it'll be -- and as donald trump, i would have campaigned differently. >> right. >> it'll be new york, philadelphia, california.

that'll be it -- big cities, forget it. >> yep. >> right. >> fly-over states. >> fly-over states. right. >> how about making it proportional by state? you see what i mean? like, say pennsylvania you win 60% of the vote, you get 60% of the electoral votes? >> they do a variation of that, but it's not precise, and as you can see -- i think the latest number that i saw this morning was she was 2 million votes ahead. >> okay. >> when trump was against it... >> [ laughing ] right. yeah, of course. >> ...he will obviously -- for this to happen, to get rid of the electoral college, you need a constitutional amendment, which not happen. >> yep. >> number two -- you need the bully pulpit of the president. why would he be against the mechanism that gave the -- >> just put him in office. >> this is a delicate thing. our country's been around for quite a long time, so to change this is not a small thing. i mean, in the same way you've got two u.s. senators from every state no matter what the population, right? >> sure. >> so, you know, montana gets two, california gets two. >> the constitution was written so that we can avoid the situational logic and -- >> again, five times in our

history. >> yep, and twice in the last 16. >> but fake facebook news next. >> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact.

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>> let's talk about fake news. [ laughter ]

first of all, let's make you realize this is all real. >> right! >> all these people are here. it's not holograms or anything. >> let's keep it real. >> so, both facebook and google promise changes to their sites in response to the recent uproar over all this fake news spreading like wildfire leading up to the election. action news even presented a special report on the problem, and this is what one expert told me that i thought was pretty important. he said, "the internet is like a hammer. you can build a beautiful house with it. you can also bash someone's brains in," okay? >> [ laughs ] >> so it really is, you know, the user and it's the consumer that needs to be really responsible. ajay, do you think fake news swung the election? >> absolutely. we're all susceptible to confirmation bias. we go to news to either confirm a narrative that we already believe in, and these online communities like facebook or comment sections philly.com, etcetera, have become these gated communities where we find our tribe members, and then attack the other. they become the ghettos of grievance for us to sort of lash out against anybody we don't agree with. so when you go on to news, you're not really looking to

learn something new. you're looking to confirm to your own biases and fight against anything that challenges your own prejudice. so, did it swing the election? absolutely. >> so, message man -- i'm talking to you, jeff. >> sort of a tyranny. >> [ laughs ] >> well, yeah. >> that's what i learned from. >> well, you're the new guy. >> okay, thank you. >> newish. >> thank you. >> it's dangerous, and facebook knows this, 'cause they've originally said, "oh, it's not a problem. it's okay." it's dangerous for them to have to select what's fake and what's not. it's subjective, right? >> and facebook and zuckerberg has said "are we the media, or are we the technology?" >> mm-hmm. >> and i would argue that it's more the technology that we use as a platform. facebook is not putting out the news. now, let me be clear, there has to be an arbiter. i would argue that the best arbiter are the folks sitting around this table and our friends to counter the fake news. >> but i can tell you -- zuckerberg -- it was reported this past week, that in china they're talking about editing the news there. so you can't play the one-hat -- >> that scares me. >> that scares me a lot. and it reminds me of the quote

of vladimir lenin that "capitalists will sell us the rope that we use to hang them," is what he said back about 125 years ago. so in philly.com, when i publisher of the inquirer -- you know, on the one hand, you wan to have -- in letters to the editor, there's a curation process, etcetera. here you are very sensitive to not editing, and at the same time, you sometimes just say "rather than edit, we're just gonna shut down this whole comment section here today, 'cause some of it gets kind of ugly." but if you're conservative, you watch fox news, if you're a liberal, you watch msnbc, and it's a shame that people don't-- i mean, there was a time not that long ago when the trusted content was 6abc, the philadelphia inquirer, and you knew that there was an editor there, somebody -- >> still is! [ laughter ] >> ...versus just affirming your bias. >> i understand, but -- >> but go back to the technology. the algorithms are designed to give you more of what you already want. that's reconfirming the confirmation bias. >> mm-hmm. >> how about this, rich? >> you know what, news flash -- social media's not a fad.

>> yeah. >> for the first time ever, 62% of people get their news over social media. as managing director for the city of philadelphia, i get police reports on major incidents that occur across the city. i'm not kidding. i would hear about it on twitter first, before i heard from the police command. that's where we live today. so there's a huge responsibly, and i think you're right. we need great stations like 6abc, like you did with your special. we need the new york times, we need others. you are under so much pressure... >> oh, yeah. >> ...to be first, that the balance there around being right and being first needs to be stricken the right way. >> but we're up for it, man -- we are. >> you are. >> [ laughs ] >> we should put you on the panel, and say "how do you attract the next generation?" how do you attract the young viewers. and you're doing it through social media. >> how do you get journalists online? >> but we're all journalists. >> i read a column where it said this -- you know how you go and see a magic show? you know it's not real, but it's fun. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> and they compared fake news to that. it's entertainment for a lot of

people. it's titillating. >> yeah. >> so, is it all wrong? i mean, when you have one side of an election blaming -- >> when we were younger -- i mean, i'm showing my age here, but... [ laughter ] ...the inquirer, or whatever that thing was that -- >> that crap piece of paper? >> the fact that michael jackson came from mars was not a story that we believed and ran with. >> the national enquirer. >> the national enquirer. >> that's all i'm saying -- people like to read -- >> boy, i'm glad -- >> today if similar news on facebook -- not only does it get shares, the more shares there are, the more believable the story becomes. that's the dangerous aspect of it. >> i want to get to get porngate real quick. the report was released, and it was like, "eh, there's nothing to see here, nothing to see here." pennsylvania attorney general bruce beemer finally released the results. it cost $385,000 to commission. former ag kathleen kane actually was the one who commissioned it. these are about pornographic e-mails that were sent around. beemer released it, and he redacted all the names. brian, do you have a problem with that? >> i don't, because this was a

political vendetta, a personal vendetta from kathleen kane who tragically has destroyed at least this era of her life. i hope she, when she gets out of jail, can kind of move on with things. they were "pornographic" e-mails, which was a catholic talking about he ate a hot dog for lent, okay? that wasn't pornographic. or it was women, "pornographic" e-mails, talking about breast cancer month, etcetera, etcetera. >> but there were others that you know were maybe across the line. >> yeah, well, then -- okay, so far the bills are almost $400,000. there's a thought that the final bill's gonna be over $1 million. we could keep going out about this on and on and on. i think it's just -- it's time to move on here, you know? >> release the names? anyone? >> look, i think we're all tired of talking about porngate. i think's salacious, and everybody wants to kind of flutter it around. i think the missing story that is in there is the ex parte communications, which is attorneys talking to judges over e-mail about cases and arguments when they shouldn't in violation of ethical rules. >> we got to go. >> they said that wasn't in the report. they didn't catch any of that. >> inside stories of the week

coming up.

>> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact. >> inside stories of the week. we start with ajay. >> matt, four weeks before the outbreak of world war ii, gandhi wrote a letter, seven-sentence letter, to hitler urging him to not reduce humanity to a savage state. that letter is now illuminated on a screen of mist by the artist jitish kallat in an exhibit called the "covering letter" at the perelman center -- very powerful and meditative piece that triggers the gandhi and the hitler in all of us. a must-see. thanks, ajay. brian. >> first of all, thanks. first grandchild -- yay, bayard. okay, that's what i'm thankful for. thank you very much. inside story of the week -- this time last year, the pennsylvania society was about to kick off, it'll kick off next week again, and a controversial move was by rob gleason, the republican

state chairman who had the temerity to invite donald trump to speak at their big luncheon. a lot of people didn't show up, protestors showed up. rob gleason's looking like a very smart, savvy guy for identifying him way in advance. >> thank you, brian. rich? >> matt, just a few days ago, "after orlando" was a show that was played here in philadelphia by the philadelphia theater company honoring and supporting the victims of the families of the pulse nightclub in orlando. it's been almost 200 days since that incident occurred, the worst mass shooting in america, and we still don't have gun reform in america. after this election, that just became harder, so we've got to work a lot harder, all of us. >> thanks, rich. jeff. >> after elections, win or lose, you look at the next cycle, and democrats are certainly looking in the mirror, but then also be looking at their bench. who is the next obama? and if you look at pennsylvania, while republicans carried it in the presidential election, it went red, the raw offices went straight blue. you have josh shapiro, whom we talked about earlier, you have eugene depasquale reelected

as auditor general, and joe torsella -- many of us around the table know -- former head of the national constitution center who won for treasurer. these are the democrats to watch out for as we move into 2017-2018, because the democrats and legislature are really hamstrung, given their strong minority position. >> post thanksgiving -- you guys want to give a shout-out what you're thankful for, like in one word, maybe? >> family. >> family? >> family and bayard. >> sofie, ali, tracy, cutch. >> a more peaceful philadelphia. >> the action news viewers. you're the best. see you later. >> i'm nydia han along with gray hall. >> coming up next on knack, mixed recreation is coming in from around the world after the death of former cuban president, fedel castro. plus, a rush is on to get back home topping off one of the busiest travel weekends in nearly ten years. one lucky powerball ticket is worth $400 million. those stories and more next on

"action news." >> good afternoon it is sunday,

november 27 i'm nydia han along with gray hall. >> here's some of the stories we're following on "action news." some herald him as a