>> another philadelphia politician is sitting in a jail cell. let's get the inside story. good morning, everyone. i'm matt o'donnell. it is sunday, july 2, 2017. let's get right in on "inside story" and meet our panelists for the week. larry platt joins us, the journalist. good morning, larry. >> good morning. >> christine flowers, attorney and journalist. >> hey, matt. >> good morning, christine. nelson diaz, former judge. >> good morning. happy independence day. >> why thank you. two days early, nonetheless. and now val digoirgio, chairman of the pennsylvania republican party. >> good morning, matt. >> good morning, val. let's talk about seth williams. now, the judge presiding over the trail of the former philadelphia district attorney was so concerned about taking taking the democrat on his word that he'd show up for sentencing that he sent him immediately to federal prison. now, williams will remain there until at least october when he's

sentenced for his guilty plea on a single corruption charge. however, he basically admitted he was guilty of all 29 charges where he took bribes while in office. williams resigned immediately and faces five years in jail. his deputy, assistant district attorney kathleen martin, who's basically been running the office ever since williams lost his law license, will continue to run the office until a new d.a. is sworn in. val, you went to school with seth williams, you know him very well. i'd like to start with you. why do you think seth williams put everyone through a long, arduous investigation, a trial that lasted the better part of a couple of weeks, and his relative absence at the d.a.'s office itself? why'd he put everyone through this? >> well, let me say i start off by saying it's a sad day for philadelphia. it's a sad day for people who knew seth. like, in high school, a great guy, a leader. i'm shocked by this. i've been shocked all along at why he went, why he did this. i mean, maybe he needed the money, he needed the salary at the d.a.'s office.

he's got $200 left in his bank account, he told the judge. it's really tragic. i think the voters of philadelphia really need to think about their leadership going forward. i mean, philadelphia is rife with corruption. a philadelphia inquirer editorial today talks about that. we in the republican party have been saying, "give us a chance." had four state reps go to jail in the last couple years or plead guilty to different charges, a state senator, and now your d.a. beth grossman is running for d.a. we need to really take a long, hard look at her as opposed to mary krasner, whose in the tank for -- not on the side of law enforcement. so but i would just say i'm sad for seth, i'm sad for his children, and i'm sad for the city of philadelphia, the people of the city of philadelphia for continuing to go through this. >> i'm not sad for seth. i'm angry. i'm angry that we live in a city that is really can be described as perp-walk city. i mean, we have an epidemic of political corruption in this city and in this state.

you have the last top law enforcement officer of the state a convicted felon, and now the top law enforcement officer of the city and -- >> whose lives were intertwined. >> whose lives were intertwined. >> ironically. >> that's right. and i think -- so when the mayor said yesterday that -- or on friday that... hopefully, we can move on, i don't want to move on. i think we need leaders like the mayor to say this is an epidemic. this is a culture that produced seth williams. and we need to spur outrage. >> let me tell you one of the things that i sort of feel terrible about in terms of what happened to seth is that seth was a foster care child, adopted by the williams family, gave him his name. they were, you know, day-workers, blue collar. and they made many sacrifices for him to go to the best school, including the quaker schools, which are very

expensive. they gave him a heck of an education, they tried to prepare him well. and then the allegations as you've heard, some of it was money that was taken from the nursing home from his mother. and all of the other allegations totally surprise the fact that here's a guy but for these people. so their work became in vain. and we want to see more kids out of foster care and being taken care of. and to see what happened here, gives the foster care and the adoption process sort of a bad name. >> so, christine, power just simply corrupts, no matter where you come from. >> you know, i... i'm not surprised, and i'm not sorry. and i know that this is probably the moment to be christian. but i have a really difficult time, particularly when i think about the way that seth misused his office and his power. we've talked about this many times at this table, the prosecution of monsignor lynn.

that went on and on and on, after appeal and appeal and appeal. that case is emblematic of a lack of both compassion, and i think integrity, because-- >> you're making the connection given that seth williams was the d.a. at the time. >> the d.a. at the time. not the d.a. at the time -- he was the prosecuting, the avenging angel. he went back again and again and again. i know that when seth was -- he took the plea, and he asked judge diamond if he could remain free until sentencing in october, and he was crying. i thought back to his denial of bail for monsignor lynn, a 66-year-old ill priest. he did not -- not allow bail in that situation. >> does anyone think that williams ever had an opportunity, and we're in on any of the negotiations the prosecution may have had with the defense. but do you think he might have had a chance to save himself from going to jail? >> well, knowing about plea deals, it was... the only way he was gonna get

this low sentence -- there were 29 counts. he pled to one count and the other 28 essentially were kept at abeyance. so he was -- >> you're saying no. >> but he's gonna have to elocute to the facts at the sentencing. >> no, no, he did. >> he's gonna have to admit to committing those acts. >> but what i'm saying is there's only one count. so let's assume he violated parole or violated probation. it's only the one count that he can be found guilty of being violated for. so to some extent, it was a good deal that he probably would not have gotten if the judge had sentenced him. >> so this is better than what he would have been able to get before the trail began. >> and he's gonna lose his law license. >> yes. >> yeah, i believe so. >> he won't ever be able to work again, practice. >> no. >> there was no way he was avoiding jail on this. and he would have gotten more time if he had gone through the process. >> plus, you know, the irony of this-- >> he should have spared us all this, to tell you the truth, and the taxpayers this, and just pled guilty right from the start. >> the irony is he's doing things, he did things that he prosecuted other individuals for doing while he was in the

process of doing them. >> sure. >> violating campaign finance laws, and then that ridiculous story about how he used campaign funds to pay fees at the sporting club because he felt that he needed to be in great, buff condition in order to be re-elected. >> right, and that gets to my point about a culture. i think the culture of corruption in philadelphia is characterized by an absolute lack of shame. >> yes! >> and it is -- talk about chutzpah. to say that you need to spend taxpayer money on a sporting club because you're gonna run, because you have to get buff to run for office. where is the shame? >> well, you can val alluded to this. let me just read off a series of names here. former congressman chaka fattah, former state senator vince fumo, former city treasurer corey kemp, former state house speaker john perzel, former councilman rick mariano. these are all individuals who are philadelphia politicians within the last two decades have gone to jail. >> at the philadelphia citizen,

we printed up philadelphia all-star corruption playing cards, so people can trade them with their friends. and in that exercise, we found that it much worse now when you read what people have done. they're more inventive -- you think of vince fumo, who innovated in terms of using non-profits. >> sure, sure. >> and, you know, you actually pine for the days of buddy cianfrani. >> but this is nothing new. look what lee beloff did back in the day, look at abscam. i mean, i grew up in south philly, i say to my dad, "why do we keep voting for these people over and over again? the neighborhoods get worse and worse, crime gets worse, taxes get higher. people are leaving the neighborhood. you can't attend the public school, and our guys keep going to jail." you know, there's two councilmen and then buddy cianfrani, and vince fumo was an unindicted co-conspirator. and you go down the list. vince and myers. and this is nothing new. this is a culture of corruption in philadelphia. i think we need to give -- we need to have two-party rule again in philadelphia. >> let's tread lightly on this next topic. because as a coincidence, we have learned that wire taps were

revealed among some philadelphia officials. the philadelphia inquirer reported that fbi wire tapped union leader john dougherty and city council major lead bob henon for more than a year. neither faces any charges at this point. also reported that the fbi informed mayor jim kenney that his voice as captured during some of these conversations. they have to do that when people are captured in conversations. kenney and dougherty, as everyone knows, are political allies. so you have these wire taps. and then this seth williams thing is so fresh. and do you have this sense of dread of where this investigation is going to lead? >> a lot of people do. i had a -- you know, 'cause there's also been wire taps on, you know, rob mccord was -- was taking people and -- >> state level. >> and john estey as well. so, i had a -- a lobbyist who shall go unnamed tell me that every time he greets a politician, he now hugs him, so, feeling on the back to see if there's a wire -- that's how -- >> and he's not kidding.

>> no, no, he's not kidding. >> i was doing some work for someone, um, and, uh, as we looked at some of the transcript, it was public officials, and the first question they ask is, "are you wired -- before i can talk to you?" i mean, it has become such a common problem -- >> i think that's a theme here with our discussion is, this is very sad. >> yes. >> and the city of philadelphia, which has such riches. >> yes. >> and time and time again, you see politicians being thrown in jail. >> city that has a lot to offer, great ports, great proximity to the jersey shore, to washington, to bal-- you know, washington, new york, et cetera -- we know all the great things about this city. the fifth-poorest big city in america being held back by a lack of leadership, a lack of good leadership -- >> and -- >> a lack of character and quality. you know, a lot of times they talk about "entrapment, entrapment," how horrible entrapment is, and abscam, with the old guys in south philly. and if we didn't have politicians who were so easily suggestible and easily corruptible, that wouldn't be a problem. i understand people get angry at

the feds for going in and trying to sow the seeds of discord. but they can't -- you can't create a crime unless you have willing participants, and philadelphia is filled with willing participants. >> we're not -- we're not -- we're not the golden -- you go over the river, you have the same problem -- eric kennedy and some of the others who have been -- you go to new jersey, and you go into illinois -- i mean, we're in the top three. >> we're -- we're -- [ laughs ] >> yeah, chicago, yeah. >> let's not let one group off the hook here, which is the citizens of philadelphia. when you -- we just celebrated a turnout of 17%. we were surprised -- >> the primary? >> in the primary -- that 17% of voters turned out. think about what that says. >> and that gets me into our next topic, and you mentioned this, val, already -- the philadelphia fraternal order of police is not pleased with the democratic nominee for district attorney. its members unanimously voted to support the republican, beth grossman, in the general election. typically they select the

democrat because that's the person that wins anyway, right? philadelphia is overwhelmingly democratic, although it's had republican d.a.s in the past, arlen specter one of them, ron castille another. so, will this endorsement, and will the seth williams plea deal, mean beth grossman has a chance in november? >> i think larry -- >> the republican? >> i think larry hit it on the nail, which is the turnout. if you have a low turnout, republicans are not going to have a shot. >> and she's not going to have the machine that the democrats have. so, you say no. >> no. she don't have a shot. but if you have a turnout, as larry indicated, a higher turnout, and there is outrage regarding to this, then you have an opportunity for grossman. >> do you think the rank-and-file police officers are going to do enough to help grossman? >> i think it's not as -- i mean, it's definitely, you want -- beth grossman is a good, solid candidate, and you want -- she's a positive -- but i think another factor is the negative

that larry krasner has -- has elicited from those who are worried about the type of campaign he ran. and what happened on campaign night when you had people, you know, saying "'blank' the cops, the pigs," you know? there's -- if you can get enough people who are more worried about larry krasner than they are about voting for a republican -- >> vote against, rather than for. >> just like with trump -- there were a lot of people who didn't like donald trump, but he was the alternative to hillary clinton. >> sure. >> i've gotten calls from fop, i've gotten calls from business leaders across the city, wanting to know what the republican party is going to do for this race, and, um... people are looking for someone to step up and lead on this. i think the republican party is going to have to step up and make the case that we support beth grossman. fop is willing to do what they need to do. on the last show i was on, i said i'd bet my house the fop was not going to endorse larry krasner, despite the fact that bob brady -- i won -- i won that bet. i wish somebody -- i'd have two houses now. but, uh, you know, we need to

step up. and that's the business community too -- if they care -- we cannot have philadelphia become chicago. and if police feel that they have a top law enforcement officer who does not back them up, are just as likely to take the word of the criminal as he is -- as he is the cops, it's going to be a problem. >> we have less than a minute left -- could this also cause larry krasner to refine his image and his rhetoric? >> well, that's the test. if he reaches out -- what he should do is, you know, announce that joe kahn, who he defeated, will run his office. uh, because -- because he has to -- this is a test of his political skills: can he bring together, can he be a uniter, can he be -- can he not be a divider? he -- he -- he used divisive rhetoric on the campaign trail. >> he's against -- he's also against the death penalty, which is something the fop has some problems with, because if you kill a cop, you know, we want the death penalty. >> all right, "inside story" will be right back.

>> "inside story" is presented by temple university -- remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact -- visit temple.edu/impact. ♪

>> back with "inside story." there's more support for a wage-equity law across the country, including in our area. the laws are gaining popularity for those who are seeking to

bridge the wage gap between working men and women. philadelphia, as you know, already passed a law that prevents employers from asking about a job applicant's wage history, with the thought that stating a salary during an interview will perpetuate lower pay for women. the new jersey state senate passed a wage equity bill this week, while several groups gathered at philadelphia city hall to convince several companies to back off a lawsuit seeking to overturn the city's law. are you convinced -- we'll just go around -- are you convinced that such a wage equity law truly does help women? >> can i give you the statistics first? uh, when a woman graduates -- let's say it's an mba from wharton -- and goes into the workforce, she starts at 5% below any male. that continues to grow as the years go by, and makes millions of dollars less than any male. >> i think everyone understands and realizes that there is a gap, i mean, there is no question. >> i don't concur with that, no, i don't concur with that. i think that, when you're a

progressive, you know, when you have a hammer, you know, everything's a nail; when you're a progressive, everything's big government. the department of labor did a study in 2009, looked at 50 peer-reviewed studies and concluded that it's actually about six cents gap, and they -- the 70-cent -- the myth is that there's a 23-cents gap is largely explained by choices people make. so, women -- the top -- the lowest five professions in terms of salaries are dominated by women; the top five -- four or five of them -- are dominated by men -- 87, 97, 92 percent. when you take that into account, plus the choices that women make -- they're coming in and out of the workforce; men tend to take more dangerous jobs, and on and on -- there's actually a six-cents differential between men and women. so... and that can be explained by a number of factors. so, it's necessarily the case -- if it were the case that women were paid 23¢ on the dollar, people who are interested in making profits would just hire women, and the 23¢ would fall to the bottom line. it's a myth.

>> val makes a lot of sense, but i don't -- i just don't see why this law is necessary -- i don't see the nexus between not being able to discuss salaries at an interview and getting a lower salary. i don't know what the statistics are on that, but it's counterintuitive to say, well, you know, i made this salary in the last four jobs. and, okay, well, we're going to keep you at that level. i just don't see where the connection is. maybe larry can help me. >> well, no, i -- look, i have seen the studies that nelson talks about, and i do believe, based on that, that, especially starting jobs, women are vastly underpaid. but there is no evidence yet that wage equity laws ameliorate that. in fact, there's some anecdotal evidence that the lack of information can lead employers to further lowball women because it's just total guesswork. >> or they would invent some number in their head. >> right, right. 'cause you -- 'cause it's a lack of information for a starting point. so, i don't know.

now, it's going to take some time. massachusetts has done a wage equity law, new york city has done one, and in three years you'll get some data. >> all right let's move on to our next issue: body cam video limits in pennsylvania. governor wolf intends to sign a bill that would exempt police audio and video recordings from the state's public records law. this was -- this would include video taken from body cams, police dash cams. a court would still be able to order the release of such recordings, they just wouldn't be able to be released to the public on a request. now, supporters say, for one thing, it would protect the identity of the informants that might be captured on video. but others are upset about the possibility of a reduced level of transparency among police when you have more ways to see what is going on, and you have more of these body cams being used in police departments across the country. what do you think, christine? >> i think -- i actually do think that this would be helpful, because it does open up -- it gets rid of some of the obstacles that the police have concerns about in releasing certain information. so -- and as governor wolf said,

this can be honed, this can be amended, this can be changed in the future. but he thinks that this is a good first step. and it -- it's sort of, like -- it balances the two tensions between the public's right to know and security issues for the police department. i think -- i think it's a good law. >> i disagree. i really believe that it helps destroy suspicions that people may have within the community. and so, if you can release something, you can avoid a lot of disturbances, a lot of issues that people raise. and it really hurts the transparency issue. >> should we have cameras in the courtroom then in all... >> i would -- i would agree. it would be a very boring show, but i would agree that they -- >> not courtroom -- not your courtroom. >> larry? val? >> i -- i -- i'm with nelson on this. i feel like some -- sunshine -- sunlight is the greatest disinfectant, and particularly now, as someone who supports the police, and when they're under fire, let everything out.

now, with certain exemptions where safety is concerned. let everything out. and i think it has the potential to make people more sympathetic to what police have to go through. >> that's what... >> anything that increases the use of body cams, i think, is a good thing. i think this will increase the use of body cams. i think the exemptions are reasonable. let's see if time will tell as to whether they are or aren't. but i think if this puts more body cams on cops, i think that's a good thing. >> i think we've got about 30 seconds -- one more topic: the pennsylvania state senate wants to allow people to bring guns into schools as long as they have a concealed permit. anyone think this is a good idea? >> well, for law enforcement it's not an issue for me. but for teachers to be carrying guns and to be dealing with kids, and a kid pulling a gun out of the back of a teacher over a misbehavior issue, i don't think it's advisable. >> you say it's too dangerous. >> i think it's a tough issue. the law has some really good restrictions in it as far as the training that's needed, psychological tests. i think that school district by school district, the answer on this is the way to go. >> i -- yeah, we had a statement from the newtown -- um, the people, the teachers of newtown, and they said no, and i go with

what they say. >> i go with what they say, and i go with what police chiefs say, and, overwhelmingly, they say that more guns creates more danger. >> inside stories of the week are coming up. stay with us. ♪

>> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact. >> inside stories of the week. we start with larry. >> matt, pro-soda tax protestors were shouting "this is our house" at city hall before a bipartisan state committee looking at the economic impact of the soda tax. that's bad politics, because we're gonna have to go to harrisburg for money for the schools, and moderate republicans there might just tell us "that's your house." >> thanks, larry. christine? >> matt, i'm a conservative, i'm a registered republican, and i am not a fan of

hillary clinton at all. and yet, we need -- we conservatives and conservative women in particular, need to come out and say to our president, "keep your mouth shut. stop tweeting. break his fingers. do something." because the comments that the president made with respect to mika brzezinski this week on msnbc are unacceptable. and until conservatives start coming out and agreeing that it's unacceptable and untenable for a president to do that, i don't know where we are. >> i got local problems, you know? and that is the opioid problem is killing a lot of our people in the city and throughout the state and new jersey. and this week, there's a new center being opened up in the 2400 block of north 5th street -- a major, large, very fancy center in terms of providing behavioral work and behavioral physicians to be able to help those opioid addicts. >> thanks, nelson. val?

>> well, matt, another liberal-progressive myth going down in flames in seattle where they increased the minimal wage to $15. a study commissioned by the city and performed by the university of washington showed that it's actually hurting the workers it was supposed to help by two to three to one -- $125 a week loss for people it's supposed to help. >> thanks for our panelists. thanks to you for watching. happy 4th of july, everyone. i'm matt o'donnell. we'll see you monday morning on "action news." ♪ >> i'm nydia han coming up next on "action news," a 28-year-old delaware county man is charged with murder in the road rage killing of 18-year-old bianca roberson. plus, president trump honors veterans on his first 4th of july as commander-in-chief. it's a busy day along the jersey shore as thousands joy a long holiday weekend. those stories and more.

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