>> guns, on "inside story," next. ♪ good morning, everyone. i'm matt o'donnell. it is sunday, october 10, 2017. thanks for joining us here on "inside story." and let's meet our panelists here for the week. we have rich negrin, attorney. >> hey, matt. >> good morning, rich. >> good to see you. >> jeff jubelirer, communications executive. good morning, jeff. >> good morning, matt. >> and nia meeks, communications executive, as well. >> good morning. >> good morning, nia. and ed turzanski, foreign policy analyst. >> good morning, matt. >> hello, ed. of course, we're talking about las vegas. how could we not? democratic lawmakers in new jersey want to ban the sale and possession of so-called "bump stocks." they are gun accessories that allow weapons to fire bullets more rapidly like stephen paddock did in las vegas one week ago. they suspect that he was using one. they know he had one, at least one of the guns in the hotel room that they found. now, as it turns out, trenton

was ahead on this one, as the white house, congress, and the nra all now believe that they should be banned, but through an atf review, not through law. the thinking here is that they don't want some lawmakers who are pro-nra to have to go up and put up a vote in congress. but anyway, let me ask you this, jeff, to start off with, is it possible to legislate safety in america, or is it impossible to stop psychopaths from carrying out their evil like we saw this past week? >> that's a hobson's choice, matt. i think we can make it harder. i don't think you can totally stop what happened as a madman. but what we can do is make it a lot harder for them to get access, people to get access to things that they really should have no business being in america or being legal. and the good news, if there is good news, out of this particular -- when you talk about bump stocks -- is republicans report they are going to co-sponsor actual legislation. i don't think that the nra

should be concerned. it's republican strong, republican majority, and a president who's on their side that it's gonna take a slippery slope as they usually say. it's good to see the nra at least this time in this horrific tragedy say that that's something that they would be willing to go along with in terms of banning the sale of bump stocks. >> nia, rich, stopping psychopaths? >> it is no concession when you're thinking about bump stocks because part of the reason is that it's said to be a gun part. it's not a gun, so the nra says, "oh, yeah, well, we can let that go because it's really not necessary." can we legislate safety? i mean, that is one of those open questions. clearly in other forms we do. we legislate safety when it comes to drugs, when it comes to alcohol, when it comes to cars, when it comes to other types of things. the real point of it is, america is just steeped and inbred when it comes to guns. period. and we just have to face that reality. yes, we cry, yes, we say, "oh, our hearts and prayers, et cetera, et cetera." i mean, the onion has a standing headline. "oh, we can't imagine this type of tragedy happening," and they

run it every time this type of tragedy happens. the fact is, we have allowed ourselves as a nation to say, "you know what? we're gonna sacrifice some people every so often because owning guns unfettered, regardless of mental impairment even, is okay because, in essence, to have a gun without any kind of restriction is what it is to be an american." >> rich, with your law background, what do you think about this? >> well, you know, i have a personal background on this, too. my dad was murdered by an assault weapon that you can still buy on the internet today. there's no legitimate sportsman reason for the gun that killed my dad. you don't hunt deer with it. it's not for protection of your home. there's no legitimate purpose for it other than to kill large numbers of people. i'm glad we're having a conversation about bump stocks now that 58 people are dead and 500 are shot. but they've done this. in australia, they had two mass shootings six weeks apart, 35 people killed in the re. they allowed everyone from then on to have register their guns, and they

eliminated assault weapons. not automatic weapons -- all assault weapons. they have not had a mass shooting in australia in 15 years as a result of those laws. >> ed? >> i think it's consequential that the nra has stepped up to say that the bump stock has to go. i think that's a big deal, and for this reason. every time something like this happens, when there are calls for gun control, almost always whatever is proposed would not have had any material effect on what just happened. in the case of the bump stock, it would have. and this -- you got to be really careful. i mean, it's a legal maxim that bad situations make laws, right? people overreact emotionally. this one's gonna take a lot of study because this man had almost unlimited funds it

appears. >> yeah. >> he spent a very long time assembling this. so even if you would put restrictions on how many you could buy at one time, it appears asf this for years. >> we know -- and you mentioned we should study this -- the centers for disease control is reluctant to even get into the issue for fear of overpoliticization, so you have that. and interjecting here, many over the years, when we talk about trying to find solutions, from the late senator patrick moynihan torocks suested that the federal government tax ammunition. the thought is that there's 300 million guns estimated in this country, almost one per person. you can't just all of a sudden make them go away. so, limiting the use of ammunition may have the same effect on, say, the enormous taxes that we have on cigarettes. and here in philadelphia, what we've seen with the impact of the soda tax. so, should we tax ammunition? >> how many bullets do you

really need, though? i mean, that gets down to the question. you can have as many guns as you want if you collect guns, if you feel good about guns, et cetera. but how many bullets do you really need? if you say, "i like to go shooting at a shooting range," get your bullets at the shooting range. leave them at the shooting range. >> and the proposal would be to not tax the bullets that you would get at the shooting range. >> absolutely. i mean, there are options that we can institute. the problem is, we cannot usually have a rational conversation. it always devolves into second amendment. "you're trying to take my guns away. you're trying to limit my rights. and we need to have an armed militia." we have a sheriff's department. we have police department. we have the national guard. and we have the u.s. military. i mean, how much -- how many guns do you really need? and when it gets down to it, these weapons that more often than not that we're talking about are not meant for anything except hunting people, yet we will say that we do not want to limit that at all. so even if we went to the bullet aspect, expect the same kind of argument. >> i want to talk about

accountability, though, too. and maybe this is a dream, but why can't there be -- and maybe it's cost and all that -- you know, somewhere where your fingerprints are identified once you touch the gun? why can't there be facial recognition technology? we live in -- [ chuckles ] we have these amazing advancements in technology. >> government registration. >> but what i want to talk about is you say the "t" word -- tax -- and all of a sudden, the conservatives and people anti-tax -- and it's democrats, too -- you know, run for the hills because they think it's gonna be all of us are gonna pay out of our pockets. but why can't we just make it more accountable to be able to track the weapons and the guns that are out there? >> we don't even want to do that. we don't want to track -- >> but we need to. >> the technology's there. >> there's got to be some country that's doing this. >> there's something called microstamping where they can stamp a gun that when it fires a bullet, they can tell where that bullet came from even when they don't have the gun. >> thank you. >> california passed that law a few years ago. we have the technology on this. taxing is not the answer. to me, the answer is we should not allow anyone -- and if you

look at the timeline, in 10 minutes to kill that many people from 400 yards away, it's just a remarkable activity that one individual who's disturbed, which we're never gonna fix. ed's right about that. that's always gonna happen. >> here's another thing maybe we can interject with right now. and staunch defenders of the second amendment will also say this. you look at some of the terrorist attacks we've had in europe, vans being used, knives. and so should we take those away, too, trying to, i guess, offer a contrarian view here? >> the scale and the scope, though. the scale and the scope. and then it goes back to tha yes, there have been van attacks. there have been knife attacks. there have been box cutter attacks as we know from 9/11. yet when you talk in the main for scale and scope, nothing beats a gun in these united states when you're talking about mowing down people. and it didn't matter when we mowed down 20 children. it did not move us towards saying, "you know what? people who are mentally

impaired, maybe they don't need to have a gun." and, in fact, when the obama administration finally got that legislation kind of in place for regulation, what's the first thing that president trump's administration did in february? he overturned it. people who are not able to fiscally take care of their finances are able to purchase a gun because we don't want to restrict their rights. >> in europe, the trucks that have been used have been large, and they've killed large numbers of people. they've killed dozens with trucks in one setting. so i don't take the point that the gun is the only -- and even in some cases, the most efficient way to do it. again, i just caution to be very careful. we're gonna have to do a very deep dive on this shooter, how he got in place. i'll say this much. i think the hotel is very nervous today because eir security, their legal team, and

their insurance carriers are probably in very close discussions. they're going to have to answer questions about how he could import an arsenal... >> is that fair? >> ...and nobody paid attention. >> is that fair? and that's almost putting the onus on the hotel industry. all right, now you need to act like an airport. >> mm-hmm. >> is that fair? >> and it may not be fair, but it's exactly what is likely going to happen. >> is it effective? >> tourist locations are going to be looking at this. las vegas. what's gonna stop it from being disney tomorrow? i mean, any hotel you go to basically, you can go back and forth from your car to your room, your car to your room. people are not necessarily paying attention, and we do not at this time have metal detectors and such. i mean, ed is right to the degree that we do have to take a study, but i believe that we really need to have everyone at the table and having this discussion again in a rational fashion because this mass shooting type of thing, this type of violence is not going away. it's almost every year now, if not sometimes twice a year, that

we have these same kind of dialogue, the same sort of hand wringing, and we don't come up with any solutions. >> other countries in this world have high percentages of gun ownership. the u.s. is off the charts. but there are other countries -- canada, germany, france are examples. but their rate of n-related deaths are not even close. so what makes us different? is it the psyche, this paranoia that sometimes americans have over the span of many generations? what is it? >> we're fed fear. i mean, think about it. we're fed fear of crime, we're fed fear of the other, we're fed fear -- we look at the stocks of guns. what happens after mass shootings? gun sales do what? >> they do. >> they go up. every mass shooting that we've looked at in modern times, so what is it? people are afraid, "oh, my goodness. they're gonna take away my guns, so let me get as many of them as possible." >> chicago has a rash of gun deaths, and it's not mass

shootings. it's people usually with illegally acquired weapons. so first lesson is impose the laws all that you want. the people who will do bad things are going to find a way of getting a gun. >> unless they get the ammunition -- or they can't get the ammunition 'cause it's so expensive. >> they will find a way. >> yeah, but the difference in chicago is that's gang on gang crime. >> right. >> there's nobody in chicago walking into an elementary school. i take issue with this argument that people can kill people other ways with a knife or a truck that we shouldn't do everything we can to keep our kids safe. you can't drive a truck into an elementary school. it's not gonna happen. you can't drive a truck into a theater like aurora. we need to do what we can right now to keep our children safe. our children, my daughter, is doing active-shooter drills in her school. that's who we are as a country right now, and that needs to stop. >> this is a debate we'll continue to have. >> unfortunately. >> and resolutions, if they come soon, i think everyone would be

welcome to that. the pennsylvania budget hostage situation is now a full three months long and counting. governor wolf announced this week that he's had enough of the games. the democrat allowed the state budget to take effect by not signing it during the summer, but republicans didn't fully fund it. wolf threatens to borrow money from future state liquor store profits to fill last year's deficit and part of this year's. yes, it's a mess. republicans have proposed a hotel tax to go up from 5% to 11%, which, of course, the hotel industry is outraged. anyone, will they ever find the money to fill this budget? >> they'll find the money when they should have done something a long time ago, which is these folks, the governor, the governor's staff -- well, the governor doesn't take pay -- the legislators, they should not be getting paid. they get paid per diem when they work. there's not -- they need a literal, like, cat and mouse, cheese. >> a share of the pain. >> they have to have the pain. i mean, it sounds -- we laugh. we're laughing right now. it's true. they have to lose a paycheck to

realize that they have to get their you-know-what together to have things passed. at least wolf's come to the table finally, said, "i'm not gonna take it anymore," and he's taking off privatization of liquor by saying, "i'm gonna borrow against future liquor control board sales." but it's just -- it's just kick the can down the road. here we go again. there's a lot of blame to go around. take away their pay, and they'll get it done. sit in a room and get it done. >> but they have to pass a law to make that happen. >> i know. that's the problem. they have to govern themselves. >> there's always that small detail. but, you know, they're devoid of solid, good ideas, and i say that on both sides. i mean, there's no way that we're talking about borrowing from future sales of alcohol is gonna be a sustainable path. >> of course not. >> and then, of course, if we privatize it, that kid is gone anyway. >> also borrowing money. >> borrowing money is where we are to begin with. i mean, really if you look at the pension situation, that's where a lot of the gulf is, and they have to just man up, woman up, and go there and say, "hey, we have to tackle this because this is the beast that's gobbling everything." and debt service is gobbling

everything, and we're not handling the real issue. >> you mean they're supposed to govern? >> i'm so sorry. >> we got to go. "inside story" coming right back. >> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact.

after 8 years of chris christie, is kim guadagno the change new jersey really needs? guadagno is christie's hand-picked successor.

says she's "proud to be part of the christie administration." guadagno was chris christie's right hand as our schools came under attack, critical services were underfunded, and our credit rating was downgraded...11 times. from the bridge to the beach, we've seen it all, and we've had enough. kim guadagno isn't the change we need. ♪ >> back with "inside story" here. we're talking about the endangered moderate republicans.

senator bob corker of tennessee, a senior republican who was able to work across the aisle at times, announced he will retire after his term expires in early 2019. corker, you might recall, is an occasional critic of president trump. now, this follows a decision by congressman charlie dent of the lehigh valley, who announced he will not seek reelection. dent is a frequent critic of the trump administration, head of the tuesday group, which is a caucus of moderate house republicans. so, ed, is the gop about to lean even more conservative? >> well, we've got to be really careful in the age of trump to talk about labels because donald trump crossed the aisle and gave a lot of his supporters heartburn when he embraced chuck schumer and nancy pelosi and said he wanted to do a deal with them. what does that make donald trump? and his supporters will say, "well, it makes him a smart businessman." >> deal maker. >> a deal maker. but i think we have to be careful because this does tend

to happen when parties are out of power. they behave differently when they're in power. some of their differences become more amplified. and if we're gonna talk about the endangered moderate republican, we should talk about the endangered pro-life democrat, because it may be even more rare. >> we have one in our state, though. >> who's that? >> bob casey. >> how many votes has he cast... >> it's becoming less. >> that's right. he's in the position where he's got to go along with his party, which is so strongly pro-choice that it will not tolerate any kind of restriction on abortion. so these things happen on both sides. it just depends on what the issue of the day is and who's in charge. you see this sort of like the waves. they come and go. >> nia, you want to chime in? >> the impact of it, though, if we don't have enough moderate republicans is that we have gerrymandered districts. and so once you have districts that will solidly be republican

from now on or solidly democrat from now on, if you do not have people who are gonna be flexible enough to work with the other party, then we're gonna have greater and greater ideological battles that are gonna be that much more ossified, that much more intensified, and that much more gridlocked. and unfortunately, that does not bring about solid policymaking. >> so let's agree on this. if there is one thing that could and should happen, we should get back to drawing districts in a way that approximate what the constitution called for, not have these lightning-struck amoeba kind of districts. >> hear, hear. >> because it makes it impossible for that incumbent to engage in this kind of back and forth because they're gonna be punished in the primary. >> we'll see what the supreme court does. >> yeah, there's hope. the supreme court is actually ruling on this. and kennedy -- watch kennedy. he's gonna be the deciding vote, it looks like. >> you know, the concern i have is, i think i'm seeing it on both sides of the aisle. if you look carefully, it's not just on the republican side in congressional districts. bernie sanders was not a democrat. >> no. >> bernie sanders is a self -- >> socialist.

>> socialist. right? we're seeing it on the left. we're seeing it on the right. as that starts to happen, it's why we're polarized. we're taking gridlock in congress to a whole, new level. >> [ laughs ] >> on both sides of the aisle. >> let's talk about the race for philadelphia district attorney. possibly seeing eye to eye between both candidates. democratic candidate larry krasner said last month that he would like to see supervised injection clinics so addicts in the city can safely use illegal drugs. republican candidate beth grossman went so far as to say that this could be a good idea as a pilot program with community input. but several residents, some contacted action news, are completely outraged about the idea of having a clinic in their neighborhood. rich, you ran in the primary season for district attorney. >> not very well. >> no. >> you're with us, which is good. first of all, you surprised to see the candidates -- grossman, for instant, not taking the opposite side on this issue? >> yeah, look, i think this is based on a program that came out of canada that was very successful up in toronto.

i'm not sure that you're gonna be able to get a community in philadelphia to agree to clinics. but there's a proposal that i've seen out there around these mobile units where you can bring and move mobile units around from neighborhood to neighborhood that allow these mobile injection centers that they're starting to think about using. no one's really doing it yet. i think we should be first here in philadelphia. >> does it encourage addiction, which is another -- >> it's there, right? >> i am not qualified to answer that question. >> or maybe, rich, i mean, if you want to -- >> no, i mean, look, we have -- before we had an opioid epidemic, we've had a heroin epidemic in philadelphia for 30, 35 years. i've spent so much time in these communities like kensington. it's ground zero for the heroin trade. the folks who are addicted are there. and guess what? they're in the communities that are having trouble with clinics. so we need to do something for these folks. >> yeah, and i like the expansion of narcan, n-a-r-c-a-n, if i'm pronouncing it right -- excuse me. >> narcan. >> narcan training, providing not only authorities but regular citizens the ability to help

resuscitate those. and i think everyone can agree that we need to support that. >> mobile unit's a good compromise? >> i would pay for that. >> i don't know, but i do know that the problem is very widespread, and the low-hanging fruit are things like pain management and just having more efficient ways of dealing with pain management because that in many cases has been the gateway, especially in this opioid crisis. >> mobile units will also help take away some of the stigma, whether it's by neighborhoods or whether it's by communities, the people who are using. the fact remains that this epidemic crosses all cultural lines, all economic lines, or what have you. but typically when it comes to treatment sites, treatment sites often are dumped in certain types of neighborhoods, those that are the lower economic end, and then they end up being too close to the source of the product. so this is a way to even it out across the board. >> and by the way, we're gonna host a discussion with both candidates, so look for that coming forward here on 6 abc. inside stories coming up after

the break. ♪

>> "inside story" is presented by temple university. remarkable change isn't easy, but for those who take charge, it comes naturally. explore temple's impact. visit temple.edu/impact. >> inside stories of the week. we start with rich. >> oh, thanks, matt. you know, it's a time and place where we're kind of grieving as a country as a result of las vegas. there's a great organization if folks want to get involved that makes a big difference here in philadelphia called the center for grieving children. they're honoring me in november, and i'm speaking. but if you go to their website, grievingchildren.org, great organization to get involved in. their event and their gala is in november. they raise money to help children in our region overcome situations like i did as a kid where i lost a parent to violence. let's make a difference with the center for grieving children. >> congratulations, rich. jeff. >> i wore my pink tie. i wore my pink shirt. i have good news, and it has to do with cancer. it's breast cancer awareness month. we know 6 abc is really behind

the campaign to increase awareness of getting mammograms and getting support. the good news is, over the last 25 years, deaths attributed to breast cancer are down 40%. 320,000 lives have been averted. all of us at this table i guarantee have been impacted. my wife is a survivor. we've all been impacted. that's some good news. everyone out there, all the females, i can say it as a male, go get mammograms. get supported. it's good to see that good news. >> thanks, jeff. nia. >> we just wrapped up the pennsylvania conference for women, and now women actually have an opportunity to see whether they can actually flex some muscle. right now our congressional delegation has no women at all. there's a seat that's happening in chester county from the 2018 election that chrissy houlahan is looking to take over for ryan costello, and now with a new opening out in the pittsburgh area from tim murphy, there's another possibility. whether it's emily's list or the susan b. anthony list, there's an opportunity for women to step up. >> thanks, nia. ed. >> matt, the national security agency has a real problem with independent contractors. edward snowden, 2013, took very

sophisticated materials, went to china, went to russia. our security suffered as a result. now we find out in 2015 there was another contractor who took materials from the nsa home, put it on his computer where he had kaspersky antivirus. kaspersky is located in moscow. now we find out that the russians have hacked some of our most sophisticated offensive and defensive cyber capabilities. >> that's "inside story." see you later. >> i'm nydia han along with gray hall. >> coming up on "action news." nate came ashore as a category one sure -- hurricane. more than two weeks after hurricane maria devastated puerto rico how volunteers in our area are trying to make a difference. those stories and accuweather

forecast next on "action news." >> good afternoon it is sunday,

october 8. >> here's a look at some of the stories we're following on "action news." a look at how the now tropical