>> forty years ago, the american auto industry was awash in prosperity. just about anything detroit turned out, the world would buy. that was when irma elder and her husband entered the business. times have definitely changed, but through all the car industry's ups and downs,

irma elder hastayed up. and her aying power is a testament to her latina entrepreneurship. >>he's got handfuls of dealerships in her home areas of michigan and florida, including the number 1 saab dealership in united states, and the number 1 jaguar dealership in north america. >> shooting commercials is hard work. believe me. that's the toughest thing in the world to do. >> irma has met popes as well as u.s. presidents, and has also reached elite status herself in the motor city, in an industry driven by white males. >> the automobile business is a wonderful business for a woman. >> irma's mily boarded a train from mexico for miami when she was a little girl. as an immigrant, she believes in focusing on assimilation for any hispanic from any country. >> my brothers and sisters and i were very fortunate in the sense that we were never taught discrimination.

scrimination was not part of our world. u know, our parents taught us to respect everybody. i saw the cuban population come from cubaithout a penny in theirocket, and they got up. they were a tremendous inspiration, because they were doctors and lawyers, and veryealthy women, who all of a sudden found themselves without anything. they did everything th could to survive. and i had a tremendous respect for them. i did not work. i was the typical housewife taking care of my house and e children. i married my husband in 1963, he was general manager of a dealership. and in 1967 we purchased what became "elder fd". in 1980, we went through everything. through the oil crisis... the interest rates were at 22, 23% and it was very very difficult. he had a cardiac arrest in september of '83 and passed ay

six weeks later. so iecided, out of necessity, to keep the dealership. i worked for a dealer fore i married my husband, i was his peonal secretary. every piece of paper went through my desk and i learned by observing that there were 5 different businesses in a dealership, that you had the used cars, the new cars, the body shop, service, and parts. and i absorbed everything. and we human beings are like sponges, and we learn much more than what we realize. all of a sudden, i'm an automobile dealer. all of a sudden, it's important for me to do sales. i learn that i am mpetitive. i love the business world. and i'm very comfortable in the business world. when somebody was trying to trap me and say "if you don't give me th, i'll quit", i would say "go right ahead". and when i'm negotiating is when i'm doing my best.

and i like it. when i first took over in 1984, being hispanic or being a woman was not considered a minority. you do not focus on the fact that you are a hispanic. i looked at myself as an automobile dealer. period. very tough business, but you can't dwell on that. you have to have a positive attitude. learn to laugh at yourself. i was in this business 8 months and i found that my controller was stealing from me. it was absolutely a shocker. i mean, i've made so many mistakes, i laugh. >> because she packs a big business and an even bigger heart into her tiny frame, many look up to irma elder and see her as a mighty role model for women and hispanics. >> you know what? i don't know if i'm a role model. i just want to tell them i survived. and i fell mantimes. i sometimes make it sound like it's so easy. manyimes.

i cannot tell you the amount of times that i went to bed at night and said: "i can't do this anymore". and got up in the morning and came to work and found a solution to the problem. >> she said you were so nice and gracious. >> well, she's our customer. >> yes! >> like what you're doing. you cannot be a success if you hate what you're doing. treat the people that you work with with respect, and have integrity and honesty when you deal with your customers. when much is given to you, you must also give back to the community. why not? there's nothing that gives you greater joy than to help somebody else. >> irma elder's success in the competitive car business puts her among the top ten latina entrepreneurs in hispanic business magazine's 500 most profitable corporations. and now this week's "sabes qué?" question: for three decades, the german-made volkswagen beetle was a fixture

on highways of america. but when the beetle went out of production in germany, in 1978, it continued for many more years in latin america. sabes qué?: when was the last original vw-beetle produced in mexico? we'll have that answer coming up. and so ahead: in a world where restaurants co and go with the seasons, this tucson landmark has weathered 90 plus years and is still going strong, thanks to a long line of latina propriets. [music]

welcome back to "hispanics today". here's the answer to our "sabes qué?" question: when was theast original volkswagen beetle produced? sabes qué? the last original-design volkswagen beetle rolled off the assembly line in puebla, mexico on july 30, 2003. today, the second generation beetle is all that remai in current production, but in mexico, the old style beetles still liveong lives as taxi cabs and police cars. and now from mexican cars to mexican food! these days, you can find a mexin restaurant in even the smallest american town. but it was not always that way: a century ago, ameran entrepreneurship was still closed to most immigrants and women. against those long odds and in a frontier territory, a bold latina took a leap into the unknown. 90 plus yes later, her gamble has become america's oldest mexican restaurant and a culinary landmark inucson, arizona.

>> 1922: the union of costa rica, guatemala, honduras and el salvador is dissoed. president warren harding brings theirst radio into the white house. construction begins on yankee stadium. and in tucson, arizona, a tiny rtaurant named for the romantic horsemen known as "los charros of mexico" is opened by a widow named monica flin. >> she had no biological children and we were raised as her grandchildren. she was ahead of her time in business. she was a true entrepreneur. she was a wonderful cook. >> early on, mona's rule was: no service for less than 10 cents. she had very short term credit. >> she was a one woman show for manymany years. she virtually would go out and take your order. and she would tell, you know, whatever it is that you wanted. i know for a fact she always had american dishes on her menu. she just didn't have mexican food. so you would tell her what

you want, and she would run over next door to see her chinese grocer, and get the ingredients and come back, and make the food and go ahead and serve it. and she'd get the money, and go back into thchinese grocer and pay for her groceries. it had to be fun! [music] >> she w just very giving, very loving, and she always loved to entertain. and so every afternoon, she had women friends come over. she had a round table in the restaurant. she did not have a liquor license, so out would come a teapot with martinis and a cup for each of the six ladies who were playing cards, and there would be olives in the cups, and she would proceed to have an afteron of cards and martinis. it was a different world. i don't know if she would be successful today. >> she so branded "el charro" as the taste of tucson,

that new generations are into it. still, more than 30 years after monica's departure, many of her customers ep coming back. >> because we lo the fd. we love the atmohere. it's been here for so long it's just part of us. >> there is no book. no class. no way you can teach anyone about the nuances that go into a family business. >> and as much as you would like to say whenou go home at night what happened at business stays in the business, that's not true. it truly i't. it's so personal.

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this sunday, nine days left before election day, 2010. the final countdown and the final argument. will it be a gop wave or more of a split decision? both sides are fired up and fighting hard to get their voters to the polls. >> we need all of you fire ed f. we need all of you fired up. we need all of you ready to go. >> get ready to win! get ready to fire pelosi! get ready to take down harry reid! >> can republicans send majority leader harry reid back home and remove democrats from power in the house? how will their embrace of the tea party play out on election day and beyond? with us exclusively this morning, the man at the center of it all, the leader of the

republican party, chairman michael steele. plus, we'll look at theatest polls. who is up, who is down and who is pulling out all the stops? as the president spends the week, trying to rallyhe democratic base out west, the right declares war on public radio after the abrupt fighting of analyst jua williams. we look at it all with our expanded round table, former docratic congressman harold ford jr., msnbc's rachel maddow docratic congressman harold ford jr., msnbc's rachel maddow and cnbc's rick santelli. captions paid for by nbc-universal television good morning. here we are, final countdown to election day 2010. with us exclusively this morning, the chairman of the republican national coittee, michael steele. welcome back to "meet the press."

>> it's great to be back with you, david. >> let's get right to it. it's final argument time. the prident is on the campaig trail. he has been out west, was in the midwest and friday he leveled probably his most potent charge aginst republican leaders in washington, saying that they made a cold, political calculation when he came into office, basically not to work with the obama white house. let's listeno what he said. >> the republican leaders in washington, they made a different calculation. they looked around at the mess at they had made, at the mess that they had left me and they said, boy, th is a really big mess. and they said it's going to take a long time to fix. so, maybe if we just sit on the sidelines, say no to everything and then point our fingers at obama and say he's to blame, they figured that maybe y'a would forget that they caused

the mess in the first place, and they would be able to ride anger all thway to election me. >> chairman, what's your answer to that? your vision of what the story of the last two years has been? >> well, actually, it sounded more like a pity party than a rally. i can't believe the president is sitting there, with hindsight, saying we didn't cooperate, republican leaders did not cooperate with the president. i think from health care to the environment to the economy, republicans in the house and the senate had madeery clear this is what we would like to do. let's talk about health care reform that includes tort reform, doctor/patient relationship and not put government in the middle of that. let's talk about job creation by stimulating small businesses and ot the federal government. and so the ideas that were put on the table, a lot of them propounded by folks like mr. boehner, eric cantor and paul

ryan were summarily rejected. as you recall, david, republican leader particular members, couldn't get meetings with the president. they tried after sending letters and requests to go through the president's agenda, to see how we could help. we're hoping for a better relationship between the white house and republicans come january. >> let me a you about t landscape right now. what do you seeout there? what are we looking at on election day, a huge gop wave that takes the house and senate? what are your views at this poi point? >> david, there is a vibration out here that's unlike anything i've seen before. i've been on my fire pelosi bus since september 15th. we get off the bus on october 30th. in that time i've seen a consistent ground swell of exciteme and energy toward this election. the voters are tired of the fact that the federal government has not listened to them over the past two years, has moved in its own direction, at its own rhythm and they want to pull backn that. i think you're going to see a

wave, unprecedented wave on election day that's going to surprise a lot of peple. >> what does that mean? hat does that mean in terms -- >> and state legislatures. >> what does it mean to the house balance of power? >> we need to get to 39 seats to get control. but i think we're more than there. >> you say the houseill go to the republicans. what about the senate? >> the senate is a little bit tougher but i think we're going to be there. if this wave continues the way it's been going, and over the past few weeks especially, you'll see the senate as well go to republicans. >> tea party-backed candidates, sharron angle, speaking to latinos in nevada or ken buck's statement about ys on this program last week or christine o'donnell, who has gotten so much attention, except for the fact that she's so far behind in that senate race. she's had misstatements or gaffs

in her statements with chris coons. >> folks make mistakes, lord knows. i'm familiar with foot in mouth disease. i understand how that sometimes. you get in the heat of the battle and you have the passion and fire in your belly and you really want to get out there and speak to the issues, speak to the people. you say things that don't come out correctly. you create misperceptions. that happens a lot in campaigns on both sides. what really matters is how the voterseceive that, how voters look at those candidates. despite those flaws, if you will, othe misspoken word, people understand where their heart is. people understand these folks are going to go out there and fight for them. as i said a little bit earlier, david, this reality rig now for people is that we want a leadership that's going to listen to us. we want someone that's going to take the fight to congress and not fight against us. wheer it's christine o'donnell, sharron angle,

whoever it happens to be, who has thi ground swell of energy behind them, that's what matrs to the people right now. >> is she qualified to be a u.s. senat senat? would she be a good senator? >> i think she would be. i don't get to make that judgment. the people in her state get to make that judgment. they're the one whose vote for er. they're the ones who nominated her. for the establishment in washington or anyone else to sit back in judgment of her abilities to be a senator, to be fective on the senate is misplaced. all at matters is that the people have decided this is the standard bearer we want d the push now is in the genel election and broad population of voters in the state of delaware, florida, around the country, are gng to make the judgment about the standard bearers that we have and at the end of the day i think we'll do very well. >> let me ask you about a big area of debate. speaker nan pelosi appeared on

"countdown with keith olbermann" this week. she, as the president, describes it as a threat to the nation's democracy. >> this election is about our nation's democracy. if ty win, which i fully intend to stop them from doing. if they win, we are now an oligarthy, whatever leads to wealthy, secret, unlimited sources of money are can control our entire agenda. >> our investigative corrpondent, mike izikopf has said not since watergate have we seen this special interest money washi into an election cycle. are you worried about this? >> no. i don't know what they're talking about. no one has produced one shred of evidence that any of that is happening. you know, when the president, then candidate obama was asked to disclose some of his donors because therwas suspicion of there being foreign source of

money into this campaign, ty refused to do it. don't give me this high and mighty, holier than thou attitude of special interest flooding the political marketplace. the democrats have been dabbling in those areas. if you think that there's somethingut there, disclose it, nancy. disclose it, anyone else who has that evidence. don't just make the charge, sit back and say, see. give the evidence. put it out there and then we'll havthe discussion. >> are you denying there's special interest moey, outside money that's coming into the campaign that is not being disclosed, we don't know who the individuals are in some of these groups? >> how would i know that? i don't run those organizations, number one. i'm prohibited, by law, by engaging in such activity, number two. so, i know we don't tke it and i suspect that those organizations out there, those 527s and others know what the law is and are complying with the law. if you have evidence to the contrary, produce it. otherwise, put up or shut up.

that's it. put up or shutup. >> chairman, i'm putting up with this question, which is are you concerned? as you know, there are laws that you do not have to disclose. that's the question. is that a problem in our politics when you can put a great deal of money into the campaign without disclosing your agenda or who you are? >> that's a fair question. >> you said put up or shut up. >> then the put up party the congress would be to change the law, but the law is what it is right now and everyby is complying with the law. if the law does not require disclosure of certain individuals -- >> i'm asking you, is that a problem? >> i don'tnow that it is so far. i hav't seen any evidence that it is. why are you saying it's a problem? >> i'm asking whether you think -- certainly candidates who are running, who are republicans, think there should be more transparency. ken buck says you should say where the money is coming from in a campaign. >> absolutely. at the end of the day i'm absolutely all for transparency.

it's the appropriate part of the system and instills trust that people have in the syem and avoids questions like this, because that infmation is out there and it absolutely will avoid the allegations and chars just thrown out there in the middle of a discussion about health care and the economy. so, i agree, the transparency suld be there. the law is what the law is right now. if people are that bothered by it, then congress needs to change it. >> let me ask you about the firing ofuan williams, analyst at npr and fo news channel. it's become a point of debate in the course of the campaign. >> yeah. >> eric cantor, the republic whip, issued a statement on friday, overreaching political correctness is chipping away at the fuamental american freedoms of speech a expression. npr's decision to fire juan williams not only dermines that, it shows an ignorance of the fact that radical islam and the terrorists who murder in its name scare people of all faiths, religious and beliefs.

in height light of their rash decision, we will include termination of federal fundng for npr as an option in the youcut program so that americans can let it be known whether they wantheir dollars going to that organization. >> i think what npr did was overreaching, it was an overreaction to his comments. he was expressing a personal perfect expectativ i the more appropriate thing would have been, as we've seen in othercases, when outlandish comments were made about,you know, strom thurman or others getting aids, you take them aside and say, wam, that's a line you don't need to cross. immediately firing juan over this was an overreaction. you've seen the reaction not just by republicans but a whole

lot of folks out there around the country as they -- really? this is not the appropriate way to really handle this. and i think that, you know, npr s paying a little bit of a price for it. >> should federal funding for npr be cut? >> that's not my decision. i'm sure members of congress who have raised that as a concern will address that at the prescript time. but i think right now my focus, and the focus of those of us who are on theolitical side of this equation are much more interested to getting to the election on november 2nd so we can win and put in place a new congress to look at questions like that. >> let's end witha couple of points about politics. whatdoes the mid-term result, in your mind, say about 2012? >> good question. i think it's a transitional pattern. it puts us all in a point where, you know, you kind of lok down the road to 2012 and say for the republicans, what kind of leader is going to emerge to deal more

precisely with the economy, with our relations overseas, with, you know, those concerns that people have about jobs here in the country. i think it may be a harbin gec ger campaign in 2012. yowould still have the additional house seats that would be out there as well as some state leglative races. and governors' races. this election cycle in 2010 really lays an interesting foundation for how we go forward. you're looking at two vry different philosophical views of the country. >> do you think president obama is a one-term president? >> i don't know that. again, you know, my job is to make sure he is. but, you know -- because we philosophically disagree wh the direction the psident is going. the spending, the debt, the deficit, the burden that's been

placed on the backs of future generations is unsustainable. we see th the administration, along with nancy pelosi and harry reid, are whistling past that graveyard, ignoring the hard facts that we cannot sustain n afford the continued spending policies of this administration. and there are other concerns out there as well with respect to, again, our relationships with israel, our relationships with north korea. all of these concerns need to be addressed. and i think have pretty much not been effectively by the administration. you'll see over the next two years, i think, the president try to step up his game a little bit. but we'll be there, step for ep on all of these issues, clearly delineating the difference between a government that wants to take and redistribute wealth and a free people who are there to create that wealth and save it for the ture. >> finally, chairman, let me ask you about your own leadership. you say y will be judged on whether the party wins this fall

or you can raismoney. hard truth is that the rnc has fallen down in terms of raising money. the committee is in debt. you've been outraged by the democrats and yet this is such a positive environment for republicans d the criticism has been harshed. it's been summed up by fred barnes in an op-ed piece. mr. steele and the relative rnc, manyongressional republicans and governors no longer trust mr. steele as their spokesman they tend to work around the rnc rather than engage mr.steele. are you irrelevant? >> no, i'm not irrelevant. and god bless fred barnes. if he only called me and talked with me, i would have shared withim some very interesting infortion. it's easy t write that without knowledge and, clearly, he is without knowledge here. the fact of the matter is, number one, we have been outraged recently, recently by the democra, because they have the white house, the congress and the senate. we don't. yet in 2009, we out-raised the democrats in seven out of eleven months. we're keeping pace with the

democrats right now. i really appreciate the question. i've said from the very beginning, i would be a different kind of chairman, because this is a different time for us, for our party. i wanted us to play on all 50 states. i wanted us to be out in the communities. i wanted a grassroots, bottom-up party that was focused on what the people want out there. we put in place around this country a network now that you're going to see unleashed on november 2nd. >> so you'll run for re-ection? >> so, i don't know if i'll- we'll worry about my re-election after we get through this re-election. we have smashed the records in fund-raising for a party out of power, not having those white house, congress and senat to date we've raised over $75 million in this cycle, 34% more than the democrats did in a very similar cycle in 2006. and, furthermore, we have also -- just to be clear about this -- exceeded the amount that was raised by the rnc in 1994in

today's dollars. so, we have kept pace and we have 360 victory centers arnd the country. we have made 35 million voter contacts since january this year because of the work that the rnc has done early. we spent the money early. we didn't stockpile the money, david, as the old rnc's wou do so they could have a good cash on hand at the end of the month. we wanted the money in the state. that's where it i and come november 2nd you'll see the effect of that planning. >> chairman steele, we'll leave it there. hank you very much as always. >> you got it, friend. take care. a look at all the very latest polls and all the big races. the 2010 landscape as we head into the finalweek of campaigning. can democrats turn out their voters? what role will the te party play? our round table putt is all in perspective, david brooks, e.j.

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we are back. we want to go to some of the latest polls that are out this week in some of the most high-profile senate races, the seats currently held by democrats.

in krasz, this california, this information from "the l.a. times," barbara boxer is now 50% over thehallenger carly fiorina. boxer, 50%, that's a big deal. in colorado, a new poll out also this morning from "the denver post." you saw them debate right here last sunday, the senate race between mike bennet and ken buck. it is now a dead heat, 47-47. chris dodd retiring there, democrats coming home a bit, dick blumenthal against linda mcmahon, he is up 57 over 39%, widening spread there. president obama's senate seat in illinois, the candidates both debated here, that race between mark kirk and democrat alexi giannoulias, mark kirk has a slight edge over giannoulias.

the president's benefactor in at race. joe sestak in pennsylvania has surprised a lot of pollsters. on the right, sestak has an edge nd on the left, toomey has the edge. russ feingold in an unexctedly tough ride, in danger of losing his seat to republican ron johnson with the edge, 49-47%. and some recent polling in republican-held seats now. the contest in alaska, a wild run, lisa murkowski is waging a write-in campaign against joe miller, who defeated her in the primary. the two of them in a dead heat at 37%. you have scott mcadams at 23%. in florida another three-way contest. marco rubio leading charlie

crist and kendrick meek. rub at 41%, cristt 26% and meek at 20%. and finally in kentucky, rand paul, close and increasingly nasty race against jack conway. rand paul at 48%, five-point spead over jack conway. so, those are some of the latest polls. let's talk, overall, about the landsca landscape. i'll do it with my round table ere, as i make my way over to them. joining me to break it all down, e.j. dionne of "the washington post," "new york times" david brooks, msnbc's rachel maddow, cnbc's rick santelli and harold ford jr. that was a mouthful. david brook, again, a snapshot

of where we are, what's the big picture landscape of what's going on here? >> sort of two big pictures. if you ask generically on the national level, republicans are still doing quite well, huge leads among independents, a 59-31% lead. if you look at those numbers nationall republicans are still building momentum. in these individual races you're seeing a bit of a mixture, a lot of tightening. i'm a little dbious about that l.a. times poll that showed her so far down. if you average them, she's down like 2%. mostaces in opposite directions, pennsylvania got a lot more tight in the democratic direction, illinois moving a ttle republican. but basically i think you have a situation where it's candidate-driven, people are disgusted by the candidates in both parties and they're basically flipping a coin. >> rachel maow, look at the national overhang here, a new poll out this week. he's still upside down, disapproval at 49%, approval at

47%. senate stays wth the democrats. you heard michael steele say the house will go to t republicans, in his view, and key governor races showing some tightening and good news for democrats. what do we see? >> initial diagnosis that democrats don't care and weren't going to be able to turn out, get off their hands and get out to the polls this year has turned out to be a little bit of -- a little bit wrong. high democratic numbers in terms of early voting, for example. but it was less than two years ago that this couny turned out and elected barack obama by seven points, by 10 million votes and for the second straight election, elected a hugely greater number of democrats to congress and the senate than they did republicans and that was less than two years ago. i don't think the country has changed that uch. that time in 2008 we saw people screami about the president's birth certificate and imaging everybody was a muslim and fainting at the sight of sarah palin. those people existed in 2008 as well, but they lost.

the narrative has been exciting on the republican side but i don't think the country has changed thatuch since 2008. >> the president has been out there, campaigning and campaigning hard. he has made statements that's certainly gotten some attention. fund-raising dinner, some of the reason our politics seem so tough right now and facts and science and argument does not seem be winning the day all the time, is because we're hardwired not to always think clearly when we're scared and the country is scare and they have good reason to be. >> i think that comment is overrated with regard to the politicians being afraid. if you look at the fear faor, the anomaly was the last election cycle, there was fear. there was fear over the credit crisis. there was fear over the big hiccup in globalization. there is a certain amount of level-headed thinking that's coming back into the electorate and they'll vote out the

incumbent. the fear cycle was the last election. the fear cycle at this point is in the politicians trying to hold o to what w the anomaly of a changing regime in the '08 cycle. >> bill clinton has been all over the country, another stop planned. there's been reporting he has been baffled, that there isn't a tighter messageon the democratic side about jobs, j jobs, jobs. the president talked about bo. ehner, karl rove and clear thinking not winning out. is is the right way to campaign? >> a lot of democrats are struck by the fact that there was not a cle, overriding message from the beginning, whereas the republicans have had this list. it doesn't really answer any problems but they talk about taxes, unemployment and the like. joe sestak in pennsylvania is a good example. i was up there yesterday. the ones saying, yes, i voted forhe stimulus and here is why. here is the good itdid.

yes, i voted for health care. here is why and here is what good it did. democrats wuld be better served by embracing what they've done, explaining it and even bragging about it a little bit. but on the overall race, i walked into a sestak headquarters in harrisburg and this lovely man at a call center was making calls for sestak and he said what we democrats are procrastin attachment. ors we engage late. the best hope that they have for closing these gaps is that that gentleman is right. that's the fight right now. >> harold, the big driver, the big change election of 2006, 1994, is whether people think the country is headedin the right or the wrong direction. people feeling the country is on the wrong track. 61% and 55% respectively in terms of being on the wrong track. where are we today? new polling out this week october 2010, 59% of americans think the country is on the

wrong track. >> the number doesn't bode well. the question iswhether people believe democrats or republicans can lead us in a different or better direction. i think one of the things the president has been able to achieve is get out and remind democrats why they elected him, what he represents and that he's still presidentnd he needs help of democrats, not those tea partiers or way out of the mainstream. there's a chance we absolutely could. the likelihood is that we won't but the chance is we could. the president and democrats will have to take a very different approach than they have up to this point. they'll have to be willing for more reconciliation. they'll have to be more focused on growth and jobs and there might even have to be some admissions about mistakes that are made. one thing is clear. even if we hold, the approach has not been the right approach over the last two years. goals have been laudible, and

the right ones, but the approach needs some tinkering if not major reshaping. >> chairman steele seemed to be dismissive of this as a problem, real factor in the race. he ss he's for transparency butoesn't see a problem that you've had such big donations coming from outside groups where we don't know where they're coming fr and who they are. mike isikoff, who i referenced in that interview, has done some reporting on this and s talked to us about what his reporting shows him. take a look. >> not sinc the days of watergate have we seen special interest money pouring into political campaigns with no transparency, no disclosure about where the money is coming from. you've got groups being set up around the country with names thatoters have never heard of bombarding the airwaves with campaign ads and what this is doing is con fusing vots more than enlightning them.

they have no idea who is behind these ads or what the agenda is of the people who are running them. >> you wrote, david, this week, this isn't a big deal. you think it's more hype than real. >> does it affect the electorate? first, it's important to remember that outside money is only 10% of the total money. most money is still candidate driven and it's party dren. the second thi is the money is flowing in on both sides. naa $40 million. there's a ton of money. >> you do know where they're coming from? >> that'sexactly right. untransparent money is a genuine problem. the third and final thing, doe it affect voters? we have $3.5 billion being spent on this election. karl rove, american crossroads, they're spending $20 million. the democrat and t republican in colorado, each are throwing 5,000 ads at each other, do we really think if one candidate throws 7,000 as opposed it to ,000 it will make a difference?

>> you do? >> i don't think so. >> karl rove's group is speing a lot more, by their own account. >> that's not true. >> secret conservative groups are going to spend about $200, $220 million, according to the current estimate. m money matters and secret money is corrupting secret money is dangerous. secret money, as mike isikoff sai leads to scandal. a lot of big pieces of the watergate scandal was secret money. to say this money doesn't matter is to say that karl rove, who really care ace lot about politics, is wasti his time, trying to raise all this money and gillespie, who knows a lot about politics, is wasting his time. voters -- people will know about this money. the congressmen will know who helped them get elected. only voters will be kept in the dark. >> the rove money -- i don't know where you're getting the $12 million number. they're bragging on raising and spending $52 million. they said that was their initial

goal and now they say they will blow past that and spend significantly more. one of the issues is that they're not disclosed. 72% of people in the last nbc/wall street journal poll said it concerns them that th do not know who is funding these political ads. individual people, the owner of the chicago cubs could legally contribute $2,400 sharron angle, who doesn't live in nevada, but is spending $6,000 personally for sharron angle. that's a concern. >> this is the law of the land. now, is there a political will and democrats are in control to actually change the l -- michael steele was right. th is the law. you want to change all of this, democrats and republicans have to agree to change the law, because this is what the supme court has said. >> the peulum of money swings both ways and depending on the year, state of the incouple bm s