i'm jim vance. >> i'm doreen gentzler. a judge released evidence seen. a jury convicted her of first degree murder for throwing her granddaughter off a walk way. julie carey has more on the newly released tape. >> reporter: a video tape confession is the most powerful, critical piece of evidence. defense attorneys argue that carmella was insane and unable to control her actions that night. prosecutors used this video tape to show a cold, calculated killer bent on revenge. the evening of november 29th, the tyson's mall security cameras capture the most retune of family moments. they headed to the food court for dinner. she was in her grandfather's arms. her mother and carmella walk

beside. 90 minutes later, an unimaginable horror. the family leaves. this time, carmella carries the baby and carries out the plan to drop her off a walk way. a few hours later, with detective steve needles, he confesses she just lost it. >> are you saying i just lost it meaning, what did you lose? did you lose your purse? >> my mind. >> you lost your mind, okay. when you say you lost your mind, what do you mean by that? >> i did a terrible thing. >> reporter: as detectives probed her motive, she hashed her plan when her son-in-law called that night. she long resented james for getting her daughter pregnant before the couple married. she wanted to get revenge on james by hurting angela. >> james is connected to this person.

>> the baby? okay. so you are looking at your granddaughter, you are thinking about james based on that phone call? >> yes. >> when you picked her up what are you thinking? >> about james. >> all right. okay. so when you picked her up, were you picking her up to hold her or planning on doing something else? >> i did what i did. >> right. what i'm trying to get at, you picked her up. at that moment, did you know what you were going to do? >> was it conscience that i was going to do that? >> yeah. okay. >> reporter: anger wasn't the only emotion that fueled her terrible crime. he admits she was jealous of her

2-year-old granddaughter. >> yes, because everybody loves her. my husband, he loves her. >> reporter: that video tape interview lasts for about an hour. never once during that time did she ask about the injuries to the little baby. the toddler died about six hours after the interview was completed. the jury recommended a 35 year prison sentence. the judge will hand down the final sentence in january. >> thank you. the september jobs report was released yesterday. it shows that even though 103,000 jobs were created last month, the unemployment rate remains at over 9%. economists say that the problems behind the unemployment rate are slow growth in the economy and also crippled housing market. but, economists still find

reason for encouragement. steve handelsman is on capitol hill with more on this. >> reporter: on the hill, the jobs figures are focusing more attention on the obama jobs bills. the experts say the numbers indicate we are not in for a return to recession. the prediction had been for 60,000 u.s. jobs in september. today's hiring number, 103,000 left economists relieved. >> it's good news, we'll take it. it's better than a month ago. >> reporter: fear of a double dip is decreasing. >> the numbers suggest the recession risks are abbating. >> reporter: 100,000 new jobs when the population is growing means the unemployment rate stayed at 9.1%. >> again, the president believes we cannot sit out and do nothing. >> reporter: the white house says 9.1 proves congress needs

to pass the obama jobs bill. >> investments to put construction back to work, teachers and first respondsers back to would recollect. tax cuts for every american who gets a paycheck. >> reporter: higher taxes on the rich. >> has any of it worked? no. it's high time we trust the american people to liberate our economy from the shackles of this government. >> reporter: a showdown on the jobs bill approaches, there was a preview last night in the senate. >> not by trying to strangle everybody. >> reporter: republicans trying to force a vote on a version many don't support. >> there has to be an end to this. >> reporter: harry reed blocked it. >> who gets to decide who is wasting time around here? >> voters do. not for 13 months. both sides are charging the other party is more focused, too focused on winning votes, not

enough on creating jobs. i'm steve handelsman, news 4. jim, back to you. >> thanks. the jobs report helped stocks in early trading. wall street showed gains but ended lower. the dow was down more than 20 points to end at 11,103. nasdaq down 27 points to close at 2,479. the s&p was down ten points to end at 1,156. protests flying under the banner occupy wall street came to the district yesterday and they are still growing. more groups join the march. the focus stretched well i don't corporate greed and politics. demonstrators marched from freedom plaza up to the white house and on to the world bank. derrick ward is at freedom plaza now with more on the story. derrick? >> reporter: what's going on now is music. what is a protest or movement?

at this stage, without music. it gets back to the civil rights era and the peace movement of the '60s. veterans of that era are taking part. some are in the middle of it. all of them are enjoying it. it is truly an occupation. they sleep and eat here. they also discuss and debate. a veteran of the '60s movement said this is what they were doing between run-ins with police dogs and fire hoss. >> we are at the contention of a mass political organization. they can maintain local issues. >> reporter: police nor the occupiers. the passion for their causes, it's here. >> this is what democracy looks like. >> it's a wonderful feeling to be out here today, to see the

young people picking up the helm again. things have to change. the youth are the ones that have to do it. we were young in the '60s and we changed the world. >> i'm glad to see this. >> reporter: this is the group that has a permit to be here in the park until sunday. it's going to overlap with a couple other e venns going on. taste of d.c. is sharing part of downtown as well as a race taking place. that will come part of the way downtown. they are going to peacefully co-exist. it will make interesting crowds down here. if you are not taking part in the events you might want to avoid it. lots of reasons to come down where ever you fall. we are live downtown, back to you. >> thanks. one of the top contenders for the nomination for president is here this evening. herman cain is here for the

voters summit. earlier, he was signing his book at the costco store in pentagon city. his popularity is rising. today, he spoke with voters who would have supported sarah palin. >> my message to sarah palin supporters is please take a look at herman cain. we have a lot in common. we share a lot of the same ideas. one of the biggest things i have in common with sarah palin is just like sarah, i'm not afraid to challenge the status quo. >> with palin not running, cain says voters can hear more about candidates in the race and determine the difference in messages. tonight, the man who once was president of a louden football league has been charged with stealing tens of thousands of dollars from the organization. his name is raymond j. taylor. he's 44 years old. he was arrested yesterday.

he embezzled $50,000 from the upper louden county youth football league. authorities say they learned of the possibility of theft in late september after the board members discovered irregularities. he's been charged with six counts of felony. a deadly hit and run in the district is being investigated as a homicide. police say it started yesterday when two groups of men began fighting on 14th street in northwest d.c. one turned loose a pit bull to attack the others. if man trying to get away from the dog ran into the street and was hit by an suv. he was 22 years old. he was killed. police believe the driver of the suv intentionally ran him down. a family member shedding new light on the suspicious death of an 11-month-old baby. some people told to quit selling medical marijuana or

they will be sent to jail. we'll introduce you to a crew that took on the task of cleaning the great wall of china. doug, what is ahead in the weather? >> that's a big wall. 70 degrees. plenty of sunshine. the weather for the weekend is looking good. when did the rain move back in? the complete forecast coming up in a few minutes. hakeem? coming up in sports, major drama in the playoffs. how the tigers tamed the yankees in game five. plus, on the ice, a

for the first time today, we are hearing dr. conrad murray's version of what happened the day michael jackson died. prosecutors played the lengthy police interview. >> conrad robert murray. >> reporter: in what could be the most important testimony of the trial, detective scott smith took the stand today to play an interview he recorded of dr. conrad murray two days of michael jackson's death. it's the first time the two-hour recording has been played in public and the first time we hear dr. murray giving his own mergs of events.

>> how long have you been the doctor in this case? >> at first, i attended to him in 2006. >> reporter: he was trying to wean jackson off the propofol. he also told police where they could find the propofol in jackson's house. the day began with the defense cross examining. they found propofol and a sedative throughout michael jackson's body including a small amount in his stomach. defense attorneys argue that jackson swallowed it himself repeatedly trying to suggest that the drugs couldn't have been in his stomach without oral ingestion. >> you cannot explain anything other than oral ingestion as a means of getting it into the stomach.

>> i can testify that i have personal experience that drug levels can be found in the stomachs of decedents from different drugs not taken orally. >> reporter: if convicted, he faces up to four years in prison and the loss of his medical license. >> there is no court on monday due to the columbus day holiday. the justice department wants a federal appeals court to block alabama's law. it went into effect this week. it requires teacher's to check student's birth certificates. states do not have the right to impose their own immigration laws. there's also concern that individual state laws will only force illegal immigrants into other states. the supreme court is expected to

take up the issue during the current session. there's a new push to regulate the sale of medical marijuana in california. federal prosecutors will shut down the dispen sors. letters are sent to landlords telling them to stop selling the drug within 45 days. if they don't, their property could be seized and go to prison. california was the first. it remains a federal crime to possess or sell it. >> doug is here with details on the weekend weather. we have hit the jackpot after weeks of crumby weather. now, we have a holiday weekend and beautiful weather. >> the jackpot is exactly what we hit. when the weather was nasty like we had, out west was fantastic. now our weather is nice and out west take a look at this. this is snow.

the first snow of the season. some areas picking up three to six inches. the same storm made its way through the rockies where they picked up six to 12 inches of snow. there's more on the way to the west. as long as we are in the high end dry pattern, they will see more storms. there you go. a quick look at winter before we go back to our picture, a beautiful picture of fall out there. for the record, 75 degrees. that was the high temperature today. the warmest temperature so far this month. i think sunday will be warmer. monday, warmer, still. we have a couple nice, warm, fall days in store. 70 degrees out there now. clear skies. winds out of the east-southeast. the dew point is low. humidity is low. we are really looking at the best weather we have seen in about a month to month and a half. 71 in martinsburg. 69 in la play-doh. we are going to cool off fairly rapidly this evening.

because of that, we could see fog in some locations. the best chance closer to the mountains. leesburg through winchester and martinsburg, west virginia you could see fog. current temperature college park at 70. 66 in camp springs. gaithersburg not reporting, but the current temperature 75 degrees. the doppler radar showing no rain out there. we are not going to see rain over the next few days and probably into next week. not just no rain to talk about. we don't have clouds to talk about from pittsburgh to new york down through richmond and roanoke. there's not a cloud in the sky as we continue to be dominated by this area of high pressure. it's going to sit and continue to bring that sunshine and the very warm air. warmer tomorrow when we are still during the day sunday and monday, i think most areas should get into the low 80s. as you know, all good things

must come to an end. i have tried not to show this the entire week. we are four days out. this is a tropical system making its way on shore close to florida and georgia. eventually, work its way up to our area. it will give us a good chance of rain the middle of next week. it's a long way off. we have a fantastic weekend well before that. this evening, clear skies. a great evening. enjoy it. 64 to 68 degrees. you may need the jacket as you step outside. tomorrow morning, you will need the jacket if you are getting up and going for an early morning run. clear skies. a cool start. 41 to 52 degrees. tomorrow afternoon, sunny and nice. a great day. 73 to 78. the winds are going to be on the light side. sunday, i think better. we have talked about this before. a perfect day, 80. low humidity and sunshine. it's what we will get on sunday. monday looks great. tuesday 74 and of course this is

a three-day holiday weekend for a lot of you. the next three days look fantastic before the rain moves in next week. we'll talk more about that over the next couple days. for now, i'm done talking about it. >> really? all right. it looks great. thank you, doug. coming up, the nobel peace

today marks the tenth anniversary of the war in afghanistan. today began as several others with americans urnds attack. now, the question is when the war will end for u.s. troops. we have the report. >> reporter: it is america's longest war. today marks the tenth anniversary for when the first u.s. boots hit afghan soil. this morning, a dangerous reminder for soldiers in eastern afghanistan when their base was attacked by rockets. proof that the battle still rages in various parts of the country. >> i think they have made a point to keep us busy today. >> reporter: since 2001, nearly 2,000 u.s. lives have been lost.

over 14,000 have been wounded in nearly $4 billion has been spent on the war here. many americans are asking why america is still at war in afghanistan. >> i was in sixth grade when all this kicked off. it wasn't a big deal because i was ten years old. >> reporter: an afghan government that's been riddled with allegations of corruption and wrong doing. an insurgency that built up strength. we have to remember back in 2003 when america shifted the focus to iraq, afghanistan became known as the forgotten war. the situation deteriorated drastically. right now, the goal is to train the afghan security forces and the afghan government to take responsibility of the security and governornance of their country.

the question still remains, if the afghans will be ready for that. nbc news, kabul. people are celebrating this evening. security concerns prompted the army to seal off all the crossings in palestinian territories. soldiers prevented them from entering the city for cultural affairs. chickens waved over people's heads, their sins transferred to the bird. most men should not get one of the most common tests available to detect prostate cancer. most healthy men do not need the psa blood test that screens for

a prostate specific additive. it can detect cells that are not bad leading to harmful things. coming up on news 4, more on the suspicious death of a virginia infant as police try to figure out what happened to little nehemiah. we'll check out the first of its kind dog wash near the area. stay tuned. coming up in sports, find out who will start for the capitals when they open up their season tomorrow night at home. plus, a maryland matinee. our ♪ ♪

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the judge released a video tape confession from a grandmother in fairfax, virginia. a woman con vicked of killing her granddaughter. she told investigators she lost her mind when she threw the toddler from a walk way last fall. she said she was angry at the child's father. the jury recommended a 35 year jail sentence. she'll be sentenced in january. key testimony in the conrad murray trial.

after michael jackson's death, in that interview, he told police he was giving jackson propofol as a sleeping aid. a toxicologist testified a drug was found in jackson's stomach during the autopsy. the trial continues on tuesday. a march from freedom plaza to the white house and the world bank this morning. they are voicing frustration about social and hot button issues from housing to jobs to the economy. it is expected to last through the weekend. there are similar protests under the way all over the country. a child's mysterious death is the focus of a police investigation in vienna, virginia. >> an 11-month-old baby was rushed to the hospital unresponsive. the child died last night. pat collins spoke about the loss. >> reporter: the family identified the victim as 11-month-old nehemiah williams.

today i spoke by phone to one of his relatives who talked about the impact this has had on the family. >> it feels like a nightmare. it feels like a bad dream i'm waiting to wake up from. he was a playful little kid, you know, very sweet young baby. he loved to be surrounded by people who really loved him. >> reporter: police have been working this case now for more than two days. they spent most of yesterday searching this home on lakewood drive in vienna. police say wednesday the little boy was at this home. that the boy's caretaker took him from the house to his mother. that the boy was in an unresponsive state. he was taken to the children's hospital. thursday night, he was pronounced dead. how are you characterizing the

baby's death right now? >> it's a suspicious death. it's not normal for an 11-month-old child to pass away. we are going to be looking into it. you know, in depth. >> reporter: in addition to searching the house, police are interviewing the boy's caretaker, his mother and others trying to determine what happened. scott stewart, he lives across the street from that house. did you ever notice anything unusual going on at that house? >> just the lights on all night. >> reporter: did you ever hear any baby crying. >> never heard a baby there. >> reporter: screaming? >> nope. never. >> reporter: the news of this baby's death is -- >> i'm totally surprised. >> reporter: so far, no one has been charged with any wrong doing in this case. i'm pat collins, news 4, vienna. >> arrangements are being made for the child's funeral which

will be held next week. a shooting at a restaurant in prince george's county. it happened in the 2300 block of dallas drive. weapons were drawn inside the restaurant. one person was shot. two others stabbed. all three are expected to survive. two people were taken into custody. it's not clear what started the fight. we are learning more about the woman killed near the national zoo yesterday. an suv hit her on connecticut avenue northwest. she was a long time board member and former president of the alliance france a french cultural center. the current president says today would have been her 65th birthday. the driver in the crash stayed on the scene and police are still investigating what happened. an alert for drivers who plan to use i-295 over the weekend. the department of transportation is opening the new southbound

flyover ramp on 295 later tonight. it is the first major faze of completed work on the 11th street bridge projeblgt. the southbound lanes will be shifted to the flyover ramp starting at midnight tonight. in order to do that, crews have to stop traffic periodically. there will be significant delays. the delays continue through tomorrow afternoon. there's new business on georgia avenue northwest. it promises to make dog washing easier. it's a doggie washerette. it's described as the first self-serve dog wash. self-serve for you, not your dog. place your pup in the special self-contained unit, if he'll stay there. i don't think mine would stay there. turn the knob and you can wash, rinse and dry your dog. nice looking pup there. >> cooperative, too.

>> i think he likes the fan. >> the service is available seven days a week. no appointment needed. costs about 20 bucks. >> you do that and miss the part where you get the wet dog running and shaking all over the house. >> it's a good thing to miss. >> that's right. coming up on news 4, we meet the women honored with the nobel peace prize.

the sun going down out there now on what has been a fantastic friday. still, a beautiful evening. outside right now, 70 degrees. plenty of sunshine earlier. the sun going down in the next two to three minutes. winds out of the southeast at 10 miles per hour. around the region, it will be a cool night. take the jacket if you are thinking of heading out. 43 in leesburg. 42 in martinsburg, west virginia. annapolis, a temperature of 50 overnight tonight. tomorrow, temperatures will climb into the 70s and close to 80. 80 in fredericksburg. 78 in washington. 76 in leesburg. this weekend is a perfect

weekend to get out and about in the city of washington. you have a taste of d.c. going on along pennsylvania avenue. temperatures this afternoon, saturday, sunday and monday all close to 80 degrees. should be good to get out and enjoy the good food. >> thank you, doug. a wounded warrior and his wife say they have been given their lives back because of the generosity of local home buildsers. >> this is the kitchen. one of the great reasons about this kitchen that's great is how you are able to roll up your wheelchair and get under the island. >> reporter: he shows off his new home adapted for this army sergeant who lost both legs after being wounded in iraq. >> any room is accessible in my wheelchair. it's great. >> they have given us our lives back as a normal married couple. the worries, the daily worries

of leaving and was he able to reach this or could he do that, that's no longer there. >> reporter: the fredericksburg house was built by homes for our troops using local labor to create a stress-free environment. now, i'm able, when i'm in my wheelchair to go into the closet. it's a huge, roll-in closet. i can turn around in here. >> reporter: in the bathroom, a special shower and state of the art amenities. small, but important details to help them take care of themselves. >> you don't feel limited. you don't feel limited to your physical situation that you are in. you are able to adapt that to you. >> reporter: atlantic builders coordinated the construction and volunteers who worked for four weeks. other area businesses got involved through fund-raisers.

>> it hannan eye opener for me. it's given me more motivation to see how our company can participate more. >> reporter: they say they plan to participate, too. >> we want to work as hard as we can to get the rest of these soldiers homes like this. >> reporter: in order to help keep the home fires burning for returning wounded troops, homes for our troops plans to builds 100 more of these specialty adapted homes. at least one built here in fredericksburg. jane watrel, news 4. on october 24th, a fund-raiser will be held for our charity. you can find the information on www.nbcwashington.com. one of the biggest banks in america says their website is back to normal now after experiencing slowdowns. for the past six days, customers of bank of america have had trouble assessing -- accessing, that is, their website accounts. problems began a day after the

company said it would start charging a $5 debit card fee. there were rumors that hackers were to blame for the slowdown. bank of america says it's because of system upgrades and heavier than usual traffic. friends of john wayne got a chance to get their hands on highly prized memorabilia, that good stuff. old stuff today. the screen legend's family auctioned off his personal belongings to fans at a hotel in los angeles. somebody paid $150,000 to buy john wayne's famous green beret from the movie, green beret. the money raised will go to several charities including the john wayne cancer foundation. with the baseball playoffs in full swing, "money ball" is one of the hottest movies on the ticket. we'll be on press pass with

david gregory at 11:30 right after "meet the press." >> hakeem has high school football. >> reporter: i'm here for the high school football game. a suitland player has a huge day. we'll tell you about that, plus we'll tell you about that, plus how the boys from mo town took

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hakeem at the high school for some game of the week stuff out there. hakeem? >> yep. >> what a nice night to be outside. >> reporter: a beautiful night, you are right. the spectators have gone home. duvall hosting suitland. they had a huge day. first, we start with the major league playoffs. tonight, winner of the season is over. win or you go home. in philadelphia tonight, the cardinals against the phillies. in milwaukee, the arizona diamonds taking on the milwaukee brewers. decisive game five. it's under way at miller park. we pick it up in the bottom of

the first inning. no score. arizona's ace on the mount, kennedy won 21 games the regular season. he struck out prince fielder to end the inning. pitching to justin upton. up, up and away. gets ahold of this one. solo shot to right. diamondbacks up, 1-0. right now, it's 1-1 in the fifth inning. we'll have more on that at 11:00. in the bronx, a game five against detroit. kelly moved up to second in the lineup because he was swinging the bat well. good move by manager leelands. tigers up on top. their next pitch is up in the zone. it's out to left. young hammers it. tigers up, 2-0 on back-to-back pitches. he lasted two innings.

bottom of seventh, 3-2 tigers. bases loaded. yankees left 11 men on base. bottom nine, jose vel verde to close it out. he wins the battle. strike three for the final out. rodriguez was 2 for 18 in the series. 51 for 51 in save opportunities. the tigers beat the yankees, 3-2. advancing to the alcs. the game is saturday night in texas. harper wears number 34 because it adds up to number 7, his favorite player, mickey mantle. he said i love my nationals but if i'm going to root for a team, i'm rooting for the yanks. some people are not happy about that. they feed on harper voicing his support for the yankees while he's a member of the nationals.

>> because he's on a golf course. if he were in the dug out or on the field or something like that, yeah, he's got to be talking nats. they are gone and out, why not. >> rookies ought to keep a lower profile. >> reporter: i agree with you on this. if you are getting paid by the washington nationals, keep that idea to yourself. >> you are getting paid. you are getting paid while you are on the field. you get paid for what you do on the field. they can't pay you to say who you like. >> maybe do that after he's done more stuff on the field. he hasn't done a whole lot, yet. >> hasn't done hardly anything. >> i hear your argument. i'll take the argument. i respect your argument. try to keep it to yourself. that's what i think. >> it's america. this is america. what's wrong with you. you can say what you want. that would be like me rooting

for the success of another television station when i'm getting paid by nbc 4. i can't do that. >> no it wouldn't. you are on air here. when you are on air, you have to do your job. when you are done, you know it's all over, say what you want to say. nobody is going to hold it against you except your bosses who are going to fire you. >> reporter: that's true. i hear you. freedom of speech, let it be known. at the same time, i think he ought to keep his temper. we have to move to hockey. the caps open tomorrow. the big news youngster will start instead of a veteran. washington hoping another youngster helps them out this season as well. 23-year-old center matthew perot. he was a bright spot during the preseason leading with three goals. he played in 35 games last year. he was sent to hershey in february and finished the

season. he has chance to stick with the big club if he's consistent. they are confident that perot can contribute. >> he's here because he was the best player. i mean, camp is over now. you know? so let's see where he continues to go. we are hoping he can, you know, raise his level of play even more. if he does, he's going to be a good addition. >> my first three years as a smart guy, i put on some good weights this summer. i felt stronger on the ice. i have to work every day. it's hard to stay up here. i don't know if i'm going to be playing the next game. i have to come to give everything i can. >> high school football game of the week, suitland taking on 4-1 duval. a big game in prince george's county. we pick it up in the second quarter. this was a ball game, folks.

suitland up 12-0. duval, well, they had something to say about it, too. they are pumped for the game. we are going to start in the second quarter. suitland up 6-0 on fourth and goal. a senior, washington, keeps it himself. rumbles in. rams take a 12-0 lead. suitland looking good at this point. later in the second, duval driving. ford has been solid all season. makes a mistake here looking for his receiver. it's picked off by jacobs. he's a playmate. think of pick six. look at him fly. suitland goes up, 20-0 at this point. on the kick off, duval strikes back. henry back to field it from the end zone. check out the move by stanley henry. wow!

that's pretty good. stanley henry goes 100 yards for the touchdown. 20-7 at the half. duval with a big time play there to get them going in. suitland they go on to win big, 46-7. they improve to 6-0. suitland, the high school game of the week. more coming up at 11:00. >> the clean up crew is waiting for you to get out of there to go home. >> exactly. >> thanks. >> they are only 18 years old,

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a university of maryland law professor has a strong connection. larry gibson serves as the senior adviser of liberian president. he says he is, in his words bursting with pride that she has been awarded the nobel. two other women will share the prize. they each have an extraordinary story. we have the report. >> reporter: of the 97 people awarded the nobel peace prize, only 12 have been women. once before has the award been split three ways. then, these are extraordinary winners. in 2005, ellen johnson sirleaf

was africa's first democratly nominated woman. the 72-year-old grandmother has been dubbed liberia's iron lady for her determination. >> african women are holding positions in every area of society. >> reporter: it is doubtful that she could have achieved what she has without her fellow winner, a liberian peace activist who faced down the war lords and encouraged other women to join her. a 72-year-old joins the winners. she heads the human rights group. women play a powerful roll, few more prominent than her. the noble prize judges say today's announcement is a very important signal to women all over the world.

>> one more check on the weather, doug? >> the weather is fantastic. 78 on saturday. 81 on sunday. 83 monday. 74 on tuesday. the next four days look good. should i go to the extended? >> no, forget it. we'll worry about that later. thanks, doug. at least 53,000 people visit the great wall of china every day. they leave a lot of trash behind. you have to wonder why. the clean up crew stays busy. the service profiled a married couple working together on a section of a wall for ten years. they work ten hours a day picking up other people's trash. sometimes they repel off the side of the wall to get garbage that some fool tossed over the side. the territory is more than 2600 feet long at a 70 degree grade. they say they really feel it at the e