divided, a week that began with the shooting of two african american men by police officers. >> i wanted everybody in the world to see what the police do. >> and this way. with the killing of five police officers at a black lives matter rally in dallas. >> the suspect stated he wanted to kill white people, especially white officers. >> and sparked protests across the country. >> black lives matter! black lives matter! >> from policing the politics, the season seems increasingly divided. i'll talk to the head of homeland security and two top senators, a republican and democrat, each a former mayor. plus a week of violence and the p

how can either of our decisive candidates heal the nation? joining me for insight and analysis, michael eric dyson of georgetown university and msnbc contributor and long-time republican strategists marry madeleine and washington post columnist michael gerson. welcome to sunday's "meet the press". >> this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. >> good early sunday morning. too early to make comparisons but we live through a week that will stand out in vent history. headlines in the recent newspapers tell the story of a nation divided and at times feeling as if we're at war with itself. the shooting of two african american men and the subsequent

protest, most peaceful but there were tense confrontations. last night in st. paul, minnesota protesters clashed with police injuring two of them as marchers pushed past state troopers and closed a freeway. all of it exposed racial divisions in the u.s. and comes at a time of growing political polarization of it all with americans becoming more table separated by region, income, culture and race and the two candidates who themself are divisive and uniquely unseated to heal the country's wounds. the images are burned into the consciousness of a nation deeply polarized about race and policing. alton sterling killed by police officers while selling cds outside a baton rouge convenience store. philando castile shot dead in his car by a police officer in minnesota. >> he's licensed. he's carrying. >> the aftermath broadcast live to facebook by her

4-year-old daughter in the backseat. 12 police officers shot and five killed at a peaceful protest in dallas. some shot in the back. >> all i know is that this, this must stop, this divisiveness between the police and citizens. >> not since the summer of the '60s and violence in detroit and chicago has the nation felt so hopelessly divided searching for leadership and scenical about the answers the leaders can provide. >> as painful as this week has been, i firmly believe that america is not as divided as some have suggested. >> almost eight years after barack obama's election as the nation's first black president, more than four in ten african americans are doubtful the country will ever achieve racial equality while some political leaders call for unity.

together as brothers and sisters, if not we will parish as fools. >> the blame game is also beginning. >> of all the protesters last night, they ran the other way expecting the men and women in blue to protect them, what hypocrites. >> at a time of widening political division, instead of presenting solutions to the national hopelessness, the presidential campaign is intensifying. the 2016 nominees both cancelled political events on friday, struck quieter tones and called for change. >> we know there is something wrong with our country. there is too much violence. too much hate. too much senseless killings. >> our children deserve a better future than what we're making them live through today. >> can either of these candidates among the least popular, the least trusted and most divisive in

a nation desperately searching for unity. joining me from new york city, homeland security jay johnson and police commissioner bill johnson. welcome back to "meet the press." >> good to be here. >> secretary johnson, let me start with you and i want to start with a very broad question and that is the concern many americans have about not just the state of race relations in the country. starting in march of '14, 17% said there was a great deal of worry about race relations two. years later in march of '16, the number doubled. there is definitely you can see a ferguson effect starting from there on this concern about race r relation. secretary johnson, how concerned are you? >> well, i am concerned, chuck, and i think at a time like this when tensions are high in the wake of events in dallas and baton rouge and minnesota and elsewhere, it's

shooter on thursday night was not reflective of the broader movement to bring about change in police practices, any police officer who engages in excessive force is not representative of the larger law enforcement community, which with increasing frequency reflects the community at large and it's important to emphasize that at a time like this, and this is why we're together this morning, that violence never solves anything and eye for an eye leaves everybody blind and at this point we need to stand with the law enforcement community, with the peace officers because they are there to serve and protect. >> let me ask you to tackle this another way. a lot of blame game about dallas. we had a milwaukee county sheriff said while the president didn't cause this, he fueled the anger behind the shooting and i want to play you this comment from the executive director from e

here it is, commissioner. >> it's a war on cops. and the obama administration is the chamberlain at the war. >> commissioner bratton, what do you say to that? >> the two individuals you mentioned have been outspoken with opinions and as i look at it, policing has always had issues of concern relative to officer safety and something we spent a lot of time on attempting to equip them and train them and attempting to develop collaboration with the community. policing in america, policing in democracy is a shared responsibility where we have to see each other, hear each other and learn from each other and moving forward as we attempt to do here the last several years since the murder of two our two officers in december of '14 is to try to increase the dialogue, bridge the gap and close the gap. everyone's opinion and voice needs to be heard but having done that and

need to try to find common ground. the secretary and i are committed to the national level and here in america's largest sit tcity to find common ground get to the same set of issues and understandings and move forward. >> do you agree with governor dayton in minnesota said if philando castile was white he would be alive today? >> i want to resist labels like that that may be premature. i think we ought to let the investigation play itself out. there ought to be something that is fairly swift, transparent and if necessary, accountability. >> commissioner bratton, i want to play something mayor rudy giuliani said about the black

your reaction. >> i think the reason there is a target on police officers' backs is because of groups like black lives matter that make it seem like all police are against blacks. they are not. they are the ones saving black lives. [ laughter ] >> black lives matter is not saving any black lives. it's the police officers that are doing it. >> i want you both to tackle this question. rudy giuliani is a well-respected voice on the right. black lives matter has become an important voice to many african americans in this country. is there any way of bridging that divide and view, obviously mayor giuliani has a hardened view about this. commissioner bratton you first and then secretary johnson. >> the reality of the black lives matter movement is significantly focused primarily focused on police and their efforts to portray police and the police profession in a very negative way, which is

police profession 800,000 of us, that we have racist brutal people and criminals, cops who shouldn't be here but do not represent the vast majority of american police who every day as exhibited in dallas the other evening put their lives on the line for blacks, for whites, for everybody. so in terms of some of the comments made by the mayor, appropriate in the sense of the intent and goal of black lives matter, every life matters to american police and the issue of racism, it's historic and the wound that has not yet healed and hopefully through all these challenges we're now facing, we'll find ways to not only heal but move forward. >> chuck, i know rudy giuliani well. he hired me as a federal prosecutor in 1988. i think it's time that we dial back the over heated rhetoric and we come together. which is why commissioner brat to a

loss of these police officers in dallas, these brave heroes to heal, to build bridges and let's all dial back the over heated political rhetoric and work on building and rebuilding our community and public safety. >> commissioner bratton, can you clear up this donald trump situation from friday? he asked you to address the role call. what was the actually request? >> very specifically one of his security personnel, former nypd personnel reached out to the department about the potential for the mr. trump to address a roll call. we don't allow the department to have poll liticized and as much he's engaged in the political campaign that would be a politicizing of the department. i had a conversation with mr. trump and mrs. clinton later in the day that day at their request, both of them called me to discuss new york specifically as well

very productive conversations. it's been over played in some respects in the media. we don't allow the department to be used, if you will, as a backdrop for those types of campaigns. >> secretary johnson, before i let you go, i know you have a son. have you ever had the talk that many african american fathers say they have to have with their sons? >> yes, and i think i'll leave it there. yes. >> fair enough. >> i don't have to leave it there. i've had conversations with my son who is now 45 about as a police officer, about the importance of compliance. the wonderful article today in the new york post by the head of my guardians association, my black officers association about the difficulty of being a black officer and a black father and the idea of compliance, whether white or black, when a police officer confronts you, compliance is the best way to deal with that situation. the shared

officer enforcing the law, the citizen responding to the officer in appropriate fashion. >> all right. mr. bratton, secretary johnson, i'll leave it there. tough week, thanks for coming on. >> thanks, chuck. in 2014 in the wake of ferguson and killing of michael brown president obama created a task force with the goal how police interact with the communities. co-chair is former philadelphia police commissioner charles ramsey that joins us now. chief ramsey, welcome back to "meet the press". >> thank you. >> let me start with the task force you are heading up in the wake of what we saw in baton rouge and in st. paul, a lot of people are wondering have we made any progress? is this a case of two steps forward one step back or two steps back and no steps forward? >> well, i mean, it just seems like sometimes it is two steps forward and one back but we have

is there progress? absolutely. i think the report is a good road map for the future. but we cannot expect that there won't be some stumbling blocks along the way. we are going to have issues that will arise but we have to keep pushing forward if we really want to see the kind of change we need to bring these two sides together. >> you know, statistically, the washington post did a big expo where we are this year when it comes to police. and interactions and deaths caused by police officers and deaths of police officers. essentially more people have been shot and killed by police this year so far than last year at this same point in time and more police officers have been killed in the line of duty this year than last year at this point in time. so it feels as if this feels a bit overwhelming, i think, to people. >> well, yeah, but i think you have to keep everything in context. we do have some rising crime rates and let's face it, we have on average 13,000

united states every year. these are not shootings by police. these are people killing people. there is a disproportionate amount of it going on in the challenged communities. who do you think goes after the people? the cops. we encounter dangerous people out there on the street. so we can look at numbers in a variety of ways but i think we need to keep it in context that police officers have a very challenging and often dangerous job. now that's not to say that we should not be mindful of the fact that we have some officers that use excessive force. we got to really address that and hold them accountable but not a reflection of the department and policing at large. >> director comey in the news this week said a couple of times that he is concerned that there have been an impact on police officers, that they are somehow more hesitant. he is worried and has no data to prove it but worried the

somehow related. are you at all concerned about that? >> yeah, i'm concerned about it. i mean, i don't know and there is no data right now as the director said to really show it but police officers are human beings and i mean, when you're being attacked like that or perceived of being attacked, it does create issues and problems but i think that we all need to recognize that there are some changes that need to be made. i mean, we can't look at it from a defensive post toure. how do we move forward and create an environment on the same page? there is one issue creating safe neighborhoods but also those neighborhoods where people have a sense and feeling of justice and fairness as the law is being applied and i think that's really what people are asking for. so does it have an impact? yeah, i think it does. but we've got to move forward. >> is there a different challenge, by the way, between what we're seeing and the way big city police departmen i

proactive in making the changes necessary but suburban police departments where frankly we've seen a lot of these negative interactions between police and african americans have actually taken place in smaller suburban departments. is there a discrepancy between training? is there a discrepancy between resources here, between smaller police departments and larger ones? >> well, i mean, you raise a great issue. there are approximately 18,000 departments in the united states. in my opinion far too many and we need to look at a long-term goal. better training, more consistency and policy and procedures. in your larger cities where you have a lot of diversity, obviously you have offices that are very accustomed to dealing with a variety of people. we still have parts in our country where that's not the case. we need to bring people together but we need more consistency in terms of the training that's providedhe

hiring of individuals, all those kinds of things need to happen but in my opinion, we have too many police departments. i would try to cut the number in half in the next ten years or so because you're always going to have these kinds of issues as long as you have this many departments with different policies, procedures, training and the like. >> earlier interview this week you said the issue of the fact that all of this now gets many people videotaped, these interactions, you called it a powder keg that we're sitting on a powder keg. explain. >> we are sitting on a powder keg. you can call it a powder keg or saying we're handling nitroglycer nitroglycerin. when you look at what is going on, we're in a very, very critical point in the history of this country and two conventions coming up that will be very, very challenging to handle and i don't think they will go without some incident taking place. unfortunate but that's what i personally

you got too many people with the extreme rhetoric and that's just not good for anybody. we need to come together. we need thoughtful people to sit down and engage in dialogue but actually come up with solutions, not just finger pointing and playing the blame game. that's not helpful to anybody at all but it is a very, very volatile time that we're in right now. >> chief ramsey, appreciate you coming on. been a tough week. >> thank you. >> so i appreciate you sharing your views. on friday, president obama ordered flags to be lowered at half staff. this is the 67th time that president obama has made such an order. it's more than you can fly across welcome town in minutes16, or across the globe in under an hour. whole communities are living on mars and solar satellites provide earth with unlimited clean power. in less than a century, boeing took the world from seaplanes

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for the 5 million americans living with alzheimer's, and millions more who feel its effects. let's walk together to make an even bigger impact and end alzheimer's for good. find your walk near you at alz.org/walk. welcome back. our panel is here. michael gerston, michael eric dyson of georgetown university and contributor and long-time strategiest mary madeleine and eugene robinson, columnist for "the washington post." got all your accolades out. michael, you perhaps wrote the most provocative piece of the week not to say everybody is not

provocative in their own way and yours was addressed to thete community as a whole about this week. explain. >> well, my point is that look, i understand why brothers and sisters wrote me back saying you can't characterize us. it's an approach and understanding but imagine what we feel when we are addressed as black america. i was pleading, really, with white brothers and sisters to understand the difficulty, the circumstances that we confront. the extraordinary assault upon black live. the repudiation of any sense of actions between police forces that regard with respect and authority but whose authority has spilled over into terrorizing impulses and impacts among african american culture and i want to talk about the vulnerability. when you were interviewing chief bratton a remarkable man but wanted to draw a false equivalence talking to his son

and jay johnson speaking to his. jay johnson hesitant do so. there is not an equivalence of chief bratton speaking to his son and i wanted to express myself to that very america i teach. >> i want to throw something out here on red state. leon wolf writes this, the most important safety valve to preve prevent violence in dallas is when officers go off the rails the legal system will punish them accordingly. if communities believe that the resort to reprisal killings will be non-exist tablet orless frequent. >> i saw that piece on red state after my jaw came off the floor. i was actually encouraged. i was encouraged by that. i was also encouraged by somewhat lukewarm statement that came from the national rifle

association about the minnesota shooting, which questioned whether philando castile was killed for exercising the second amendment right to bear arms and there are conservatives getting it or understanding this idea of equal protection but i have to say as michael said. this is personal. i am the father of two sons, right? they are often guilty, young black men often guilty of driving while black, standing while black, walking while black so this is a very personal concern. >> you don't like to be lumped together conservatives don't like to be lumped together and a lot of conservatives do, particular those who live in the minority majorities cities and i'm all about leon wolf. he's my go-to guy and consistent in saying you read the whole column. the problem here is coming to

the truth. it is -- the truth is not all not all cops are always right. the truth is your former panelist said and the statistics show is somewhere in between. that's what leon is saying and people of good faith belief and if you live in new orleans or any city like that, we have faced this and we have reformed and corrected it but i want to go to your point, too. it is true that children -- i'm, what, 63. okay, i'm older than all of you guys. i was raised to respect police officers. black friends of mine whose parents were raised in the same era were taught to fear them because that was the legacy of police brutality and jim crow. >> absolutely. >> so we have to understand that but in turn, and here is what we've done in new orleans, black people, our african american brothers and sisters understand the first line of protection in the neighborhoods are the

police. >> absolutely. >> nobody understands that more than people -- >> respect -- >> look at philando castile. his girlfriend is announcing look, i have a gun. let me tell you what i have, as far as we know and this is the case and he's still by obeying the law, mary, lost his life. this is the polarizing viability we feel that we're trying to express to white americans who love and appreciate justice. >> professor, do you think i understand the fear, i understand the legacy, but do you honestly belief out of the 3 million interactions of police with people of all colors there is one cop for every 266 humans that every one of these instances that police go out and say i'm going to brutalize a black man? >> of course not. >> okay. >> the consequence and you're making my point for me better. >> thank you. >> it is an unconscious, if you will, inclination to see that

black person differently through a different prism t line feels the kind of intensity that he does not feel. let me give you an example. on the internet right now is a white go going ham, crazy, beating up, striking out with a machete and the white police allow him to leave the door of the establishment and these are two cops that could have killed him. do you think an african american person welding a machete -- >> we're struggling more broadly and the biggest need at this moment is empathy across our deepest divisions. that's what allows a diverse country and multi ethnic country to be peaceful and unified and empathy is most powerful, most effective when you apply it to your own, when you apply it to your own community. so it's powerful when black lives mothers emphasizes with the role of police officers and powerful when people in the

white community understand that minoie justice system different than we do and in ways that we would not tolerate. and so i think that that's the biggest need right now. >> and the coolest irony of last week is that that sort of empathy was happening in dallas, right? >> of all police departments. >> of all the police departments, david brown has done a fabulous job in dallas. excessive violence complaints on the part of officers are down by two-thirds since he took over in 2010. police shootings went down from 23 in 2012 to one, one this year. it's -- so it can be done and you saw the ease with which the protesters, the black lives matter protesters and police co-existed and told this lunatic -- >> and the right of the african american people. i spoke with the black police league and those people are remarkable but understand, let me tell you something you don't

want to hear. when i'm out of uniform, i have fear. when i'm not involved directly and people can't identify me, i have fear. look at the young woman, jones, the facebook posting, we have to continue front. >> professor, we got that point and i want to speak to mike's point. >> justice -- >> getting it is understanding it. >> empathy starts with empathy and justice is more frequently done than we're discussing. let's talk about the aftermath of baton rouge. both my daughters are there. james, my husband's family are there. that city came together, black and white holding vigils and praying and singing and not erupting. that's where the rhetoric departs from the empathy that's lived on the ground. >> i want to pause the conversation. we'll continue it. we have more time to continue it. let me pause it because i got to sneak in a commercial break. whether we come back, can a divided washington heal a divided nation? i will speak to two former

mayors th

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welcome back. the country's divisions are reflected where we live, whether we worship, and how we vote. and they are reflected in washington where democrats and republicans find it increasingly difficult to agree on just about anything. joining me are two senators, both of whom were mayors, cory booker of new jersey and republican senator bob corker of tennessee, who was once the mayor of chattanooga and in a small sign of unity, it's the first time in nearly two years we got a democratic and republican senator to agree to appear together. senator corker and booker, i'm not surprised you are the two to agree to do this, so thank you to both of you. >> absolutely. >> senator, corker, let me start with you, you tweeted this on friday, our country has been shaken by senseless violence this week and i am horrified by the tragedy that unfolded overnight in dallas. obviously, the sentiment a lot of people share, how much outrage needs to be expressed before we start feeling as if we

can do something abouts? >> well, look, i -- we are doing something about it. i mean, i thought the response in dallas was the kind of response that needs to take place. this is mostly a local issue and individual mayors and police chiefs and others respond in an appropriate way as mayor, one of the things i knew and i'm sure corey knew when the moral at a police department is low and people don't feel supported in police departments, folks are being hurt unnecessarily, so look, it's the number one responsibility that we have is to keep our citizens safe and secure to make sure that they are professionalized but the fact is that it's a break down in society when things like what happened in dallas where this moral depravity of this individual took the lives of people protecting folks, who were demonstrating peacefully.

that is soin should cry out about and show support for these men and women in uniform that do what they do on a daily basis, mostly supported but in so many cases feeling like that are under assault by the general public and again, when one of their officers, when someone acts out inappropriately, it hurts them, too. they want to make sure the legal process works when that breaks down but the fact is mostly these are selfless people protecting our citizens, causing kids to be able to go to school and people to be able to go to work and that's what we ought to be talking about today is their greatness. there are flaws that exist but their greatness, what they do on our behalf. >> senator booker, you heard obviously senator corker there and said this is a local issue. do you think there is a federal role, when you were mayor, the federal government.

you had a very challenging police department that had a challenges history to it in newark. what role did you want the federal government to play then and what should they be playing now? >> first of all, we have 18,000 police departments in our country and many of them are significantly under resourced. there is few groups i've ever seen in america that show the daily courage especially urban police officers where there is a lot of gun violence. we have officers dying every single year on duty. and we should be doing a lot more to support the officers and programs in the past supported local officers and now at a time when we know that there is ways not only to protect our officers that we need to be doing more of in affirming the fact they are doing very dangerous jobs that when officers leave their families those families fear for their safety and pray for their return. we also know that there is a challenge with america where we have invested unfortunately is in a war on drugs.

which has been profoundly painful to our nation with a 500% increase in incarceration in our country, disproportionately affecting poor and disproportionately affecting minorities. african americans are 3.7 times more likely to be arrested. we now know local police officers with the right training could address issues like deescalation, can address issues like racial bias but even people like the head of the fbi director comey talked passionately about the need for this country to address racial bias. we need to invest in the local departments, do a lot of things some progressive deputies are doing to deescalate and lower police-involved shootings and addressing the racial bias. >> let me go to the larger issue that i'm concerned about which is do we have a -- is this presidential campaign and are these two presidential candidates suited to meet the moment that's necessary? senator corker, the rhetoric is

heated and divisive. the country believes both candidates are polarizing for various reasons and different reasons. i'll start with you. senator corker, what's your advice? how does donald trump make the case he can unify this country and heal these wounds, and i'll ask senator booker to make the case on the other side. >> look, i think both of the candidates, their challenge over the coming weeks is to show that they can do that. i think there is going to be a sincere effort within the trump campaign to do so. my guess is the same thing will be happening in the clinton campaign. there is no question put this campaign aside. look, the conversation in america has been way divisional. it's not been appropriate. it's been that way for some time. and it adds to this but let's get back to it again. you know, the mayor of a city is

where most of this occurs and i'm not in any way criticizing what happened in dallas, but local efforts bring people together. no doubt the discourse and videos that people can see. no doubt those things affect things throughout our country but look, i hope that both of these candidates candidly will rise to the occasion and on this particular issue bring people together, millennials in our country today probably are more embracing of the diversity than any generation we've had and that's my hope again after this tremendous crisis that occurred, this tragedy our country will focus more on unity and not division and i hope both campaigns will take advantage. >> let me ask about hillary clinton, can she be a president that helps with racial reconciliation in a better way than president obama? >> so let me just say this, we have to all understand we have a country with deep reservoirs of love.

we are good people. we are well intentioned people an occasion. this is such an occasion and i'm going to be very blunt. i've watched in pain when i see a presidential candidate all of our words matter whether citizen of presidential candidate words matter and this is a time we need courageous empathy and undeterred love. when i hear donald trump demeaning women, demeaning muslims, demeaning latinos when we need reconciliation, we need people that bind our wounds and build bridges across to see someone so callously stoking hate and fear, and inflaming divide. this is not person to be president of the united states ever but definitely not at a time we need a healer, reconciler and remind us as a

nation differences matter but our down -- made the case against mr. trump but who is hillary clinton almost as polarizing and divisive, how does she make the case she's the candidate for reconciliation? >> i patently disagree with you on issues of race and religious issues that she's polarizing. if anything, i've watched her in black communities and white communities put forth the spirit of america and our founders said this is a time we need to mutely pledge our sacred honor and she's manifested that on race, religion, of gender diversity, she's someone that can build our bridges and far more than the alternative. someone who is injecting more divisiveness through the affiliation and refusal to denounce patent racists. >> thank you both for coming on together.

hopefully we can make this a habit again on "meet the press". >> thank you. coming up, how will this week impact the presidential race and is this the week we'll learn who donald trump's running mate will be? we'll be right back. the beginng of the 21st century, the earth needed to find a new way to keep up with the data from over 30 billion connected devices. just 30 billion? so, a bold group of researchers and computer scientists in silicon valley had a breakthrough they called... the machine. the machine. it changed the basic architecture of computing... putting a massive pool of memory at the center of everything. and by doing so... it changed the world.

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learn more at hpv.com. welcome back. hillary clinton had this to say to my colleague lester holt after a grim week of shootings. >> here is what i believe. i believe we need a national conversation and we start showing respect toward one another, seeing each other walking in each other's shoes. >> we thought the call for a conversation about race sounded familiar and we looked at old video and found democrats have been talking about this for a long time starting with president obama after ferguson. >> what we need is a sustained conversation in which each region of the country people talk about this honestly and can move forward in a constructive fashion. >> over the coming year i want to lead the american people in a great and unprecedented conversation about race. >> ask yourself when was the

last time you had a conversation about race with someone of provocative of all of them and the most important way to say it. there is a lot of talk about talking but a lot of us are wondering what more has been done. we'll get to that. we'll talk about what all of this means for this 2016 campaign.

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from a dry mouth. back now with the panel. i want to pivot the conversation

and michael you had a provocative column this week, too, on the fact essentially we're in this moment with two nominees that may be uniquely unfit to meet at the moment. >> you would think political parties want to pick popular candidates. there are elements in our politics, not these two people necessarily that may be one. elements are politics that want to feed just enough anger, just enough resentment but not over into violence. that's the most dangerous game. we have a republican nominee who rose to prominence but criticizing the other creating fear of the other. we have a conservative media in part right now that has a white identity message. that -- all of this is deeply destructive. it's not the kind of leadership

we need. >> >> what he said about trump but also, you know, it -- the situation, as you said, is that half the country just tunes out when hillary clinton speaks. you know the other half out country tunes out when donald trump speaks, maybe more than half and so that's not conducive to a national conversation about race but frankly, i've always maintained this is how we have our national conversation about race. not the way we're sitting at this table but something happens, we yell and scream and argue. that's the way we do it. >> wait. stop, stop, stop. everything isn't about race or everything is about the economy, which affects every race, every gender, every orientation the same. donald trump is -- did not come out of the head, the party

created him by being unresponsive to thear midterms that wanted to have some reform repeal of obamacare, wanted to reduce the over reach of government, wanted a more robust economic recovery and wanted cessation. that's what is going on in every community out there and donald trump is just riding that wave and you're not wrong about there being -- but their rhetoric of both of them is detached. that's now how people live. >> the whole political strategy giving out the white vote is morally problematic and dangerous and that's where our politics is headed. >> hold on. it is about race. when you say hold on it's not about race, it's also about whiteness and we don't have a conversation with race and whiteness. whiteness is at steak. donald trump has i think in a way seduced many working class white people into believing he will be their defender when

indeed he is not and on top of that, hillary clinton when we cosmetics put forth consistently public policy recommendations that will speak to the vicious under current of racism in the country but bring together various constituencies along the continuing of the race in the country. >> here -- it goes back to, see, i think it's what cory booker was trying to get at, which is he says while she's doing all of these things, the country is going to tune her out, right? half of the country -- the point of unity is can you get 10% of the other side to listen? >> frankly, we'll have to see. lessons are choices, right? we'll have presumably these two candidates, unless something crazy happens in cleveland will have hillary clinton and donald trump and people will then be making choices and choose who to listen to and there will be occasions when people basically don't have a choice. turn off the tv but the two will be standing there debating. i do believe that there's a very good chance that hillary

clinton's message will indeed trump's. >> very quickly, well, michael eric dyson, president obama said he'll go to dallas. is that the only place he should go this week? >> not at all. he's got to go to louisiana and he's got to go to minnesota. >> all three stops. >> you got to do all three stops because all three people are aggrieved, hurt, pained and he's the president of everybody. he doesn't have to wait for a delta flight. thank god. he's up to it and will do it. >> back in 45 seconds, we'll talk a bit about what this week will be about which is one candidate naming the running mate. we'll be right back.

coming up "meet the press end game" brought t - want to hear something dirty? up to 90% of the energy used for washing clothes goes to heat the water. use the cold setting instead. it cuts back on your energy bills and is just as effective.

the more you know. down to the election. >> as voter what would please us more is not a person but pronouncement and victim to constitutional principles. i like the idea of the outsider thing. the insiders will come inside because they want to stay inside. i think newt would hate it it's a thankless job that's not his

scene and pence may or may not but policies are not the policies. the donald is not shown courage of convictions in issues like that that drive the voters. >> interesting on newt, he did a facebook live with van jones and sort of -- >> measured and thoughtful. >> and said something that you don't hear often from white politicians, which is it's different to be black in america. >> it's different to be black in america. newt gingrich -- >> important to say it. he would be board to tears. >> civil war -- >> secretary -- [ laughter ] >> he really does have a lot of ideas -- >> we have to see the fact he said something brave and courageous in the midst of the heat of the battle and should be acknowledged because important people only people that listen to newt gingrich will hear and important for him to say that.

that's a form of unity, a to acknowledge a particular privilege and sort of perspective and say the only way we can come together is to acknowledge that. >> i only have a few seconds left so i want to thank you guys. i was spirited and more importantly friendly. that's a good moment. [ laughter ] >> that's all for today. >> i can kiss you but -- >> no. a little unity and levity in a rough week like this is necessary. we'll be back next week from the republican national convention a week from tomorrow, the republican convention begins in cleveland. if it's sunday and it's the

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