truce. a short-term funding deal to end the government shutdown a >> in short while i will sign a bill to open our government for three weeks. >> democrats get what theynd de, talks without a wall. >> have i not been clear on a wall? okay. no, i have been very clear on the wall. >> no one should ever underestimate the speaker as donald trump has learned. mr. trump hints he may declare a national emergency to get what he wants. >> i will use the powers afforded to me under the laws and the constitution of the united states to address this emergency. >> but after 35 days what did president trump gain? plus, ourra b-new nbc news

"wall street journal" po affect did the shutdown have on president trump's approval ratings, and how do americans feel about where the country is headed right now? my guests this mortgage, kevin mccarthy, akeem jeffries and republican senatorarco rubio. also the russia investigation as seven-count indictment of long timely trump roger stone. details of the most direct connection yet between the trump campaign and wikileaks. >> i will lea not guilty to these charges. d believe this is a politically-motiva investigation. >> joining me for insight and analysis are nbc news seniores copondent tom brokaw, yamiche alcindor white house correspondent for the pbs news hour, hugh hewitt, and nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. well to sunday, it's "me the press. >> announcer: from nbc news washington, the longest running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with chuck

todd. good sunday morning. president trump now knows who the real leader of the democratic party is right n and he can't say nancy pelosi didn't warn him. remember this -- >> mr. president, please don't characterize t the strengtt i bring to this meeting as the leader of the house atdemo >> that was before she was officially speaker. this week the president learned all aboutng that st. first, when he backed down on giving the state of the union address this tuesday,n and t again on friday, when mr. trump gave speaker pelosi what she had demanded, a reopen government, talks, and no wall. at least for three weeks. that concession by president trump came hours after robert mueller drew a clear line between the a trump campaign wikileaks when he indicted mr. trump's long time associate rogertone on seven counts. it was in short a very bad week forhe president. we have a brand-new nbc news "wall street journal" poll completed beforefriday's events that indicates despite the drawn out shutdown the president's base, though has stuck with

him. mr. trump's approval rating stands at 43% with 54% disapproving. it's exaly where it was a month ago before the shutdown. obviously we know that polls have shown a notable drop in that time. but our poll also found a notable drop in another category, the right direcckon wrong tnumbers, they are the worst of mr. trump's presidency with just barely ar quarf the country, 28%, saying that we are headed in thh direction. and that's reflected in this word cloud of how people feel about the state of america right now withords like wrongtrack, disappointed and disaster dominang the responses. again, all of this was before friday's stone news and the end of the shutdown that was widely seen now as pointless. so after 35 days of pain,n frustratnd anger over that shntdown, what did the presi get that he could not have gotten on day one? >> i am very proud to announce today that we have reach a deal to end the shutdown. >> president trump spent 34 days

inn cysting the gover ent would stay closed until congress approved billions of dollars for ar wall. >> $5.7 billion for a physical barrier. >> $5.7 billion. >> h ns notegotiating with himself, he has said $5.7 billion. >> on day 35 with his numbers ir ging in some polls, traffic control stalling and some congressional republicans in revolt, he backed down, at least for >> president trump in retreat. >> unmistakably a surrender. >> the psident gave in. >> no one should ever underestimate the speaker as donald trump has learned. >> and some conservative allies are callingsihe predent a wimp. writing, trump blinks. >> he promised something for 18 months and he lied about. >> it's clear trump did not come out on top, i'm not going to spin it for you. >> thek. president fired bac concession no way a if no deal is done it's off to the that last reference, his threat to declare a national emergency negotiators don't get a deal in three weeks. >> obviously we're going to do

the emergency because that's what it is. it's a national emergency. nd>> on friday mr. trump's long time confidant was indicted and arrested. charged with seven counts of lying tocongress, witness tampering and obstruction. >> i will plead not guilty to these charges. i will defeat them incourt. >> stone's indictment revea the most direct link yet between the trump campaign and wikileaks, which distributed democratic e-mails that russian military intelligence stole from the dnc and the clinton campaign. the indictment includes this notable sentence "after wikileaks released stolen dncil e- on july 22nd, a senior trump campaign official was directed to contact stone about any additional releases and what other damaging information organization one, wikileaks, had on the clinton campaign." >> how many people could direct a senior campaign official. >> stone then communicated with

wikileaks through an intermediary. five days later --ru >> ssia, if you're listening. >> -- that same day, july 27th russian hackers tried for the first time to hack into servers in clinton's personal campaign office. on october 4th t stoned steve bannon, then the chief executive of mr. trump's campaign, that wikileaks had a serious security wncern, but would release a load everyk going forward. three days later, began selectively releasing clinton campaign chair john podesta's e-mails. >> the allegation that two campaign officials instructedore inquired of me about wikileaks is lse. >> and joining me now is the house republican leader, congressman kevin mccarthy of california. welcome back to "meet the press." >> thanks for having me back. >> all right.ne on day of the shutdown the president had a deal in front of him that was essentially ang contin resolution for three

weeks, no wall. that's the deal he agreed to on day 35. what was accomplished? >> well, nobody likes to go into a shutdown but the one i thing would see, especially if you're looking at winners and losers i dot know why someoould celebrate a status quo. i watched the president in every onof these meetings offer reasonable solution. i watched then leader pelspi d a new historical time on the floor of the house, eight hours, talking about daca.e we don't h the daca solution involved when we could have. we still have a problem at the border, we don't have that now we have three more weeks to go. i watched speaker pelosi sit there and nould nototiate with anything. i give president trump a lot of credit. he put the american people before politics. >> after 35 days. >> no, he did -- for 35 days, though, what did he get? >> well, i'm notti celeb getting something because what people are celebrating saying speaker pelosi is strong because she got status quo. that's w.h.o. the country wants. the country wants to find common ground. the president made four different offers, it was speaker

pelosi whoou said in't talk about anything. 35 days, 35 days of speaker pelosi n negotiati and the president finally said this is too much. if you say you will do something else i will open it up so the federal workers will be paid and let's see where you will go in three weeks. >> that was her stance, she will negotiate after you open up the gove hment. >> no stance was not one dollar for a wall, we are not going to do anything, that it's im and i don't believe that's where her members are as well. if you listen to her own chair of agriculture said give trump the money. her chairman of says walls work. even her numberwo says walls are not immoral. she is out of step with her own base. in three weeks the president is unlikely -- i mean,o you really believe you are going to get a grand compromise that somehow democrats will trade something temporary for something permanent? a permanent structure for temporary reief for sf these folks? do you believe that will happen in three weeks? >> well, if democrats have always in the past voted for some barrier and nowgo they are

nog to because it's being offered by president trump, that's politics. that means we would still have a crisis at our rder. if in three weeks they said before if you open it up thenwe l negotiate, they won't, they are the ones causing the problem. they have changed t course of what they voted for in the past. speaker pelosi had voted for a wall and brier. schumer voted for a wall and barrier but now they will not because it's president trump. >> the infamous gang of eight that you guys never brought to a vote did have extra if ensing in it, i believe it was 350 miles of extra fencing, had $46 bill n in bordersecurity. what's wrong with gang of eight being the beginningf the negotiations? >> last year i spent more than a month, every single day in my office with durbin, with stiny, with the chief of staff of the white house and we tried to come together on an immigration bill. it was one of thede h things ever to do, but when i see a crisis on the border, 500,000 people illegally enter our

untry -- when we are the most liberal bringing in a million people every year the way we should do it, i think this is an opportunit to not only solve a border crisis, but we've got kids here dealing with daca, they're both big issues, solve them right now. >> look, the only way to make it happen is if both sides are willing to buck their base. >> yeah. >> is the president actually willing to buck his base? he's never given an indication he is. he's threatening a national emergency. >> that is not true. the president is the only who has been reasonable in these negotiations. chuck, i've been in every single meeting so i watched it. th president is the one who offered -- this president is the one who at the state of union nt further on immigration than i have heard from a president clinton or even pre obama. so, no, that is unfair. it was only the democra would interject when the secretary of homeland tried to talk about the current they didn't want to hear it. they didn't want to negotiate. they said g. it was the president that offered four different plans. yeah, that moved further thaari

think this has even looked. >> i want to play something from you. >> please. >> in november of 2016. >> i always love when i get -- >> i know you do. i think it's going beg the question of what the heck took you guys so long. take a listen. >> and i put together the teama ally with the speaker and others, our staff, working on legislation now so when we're sworn in not w waiting untiln the president is sworn in, but at the very first week of january how we are able to move the legislation needed to start building the wall. >> at the end of the day why should democrats bail outr y party that had two years to figure out a way forward here? yo said you were going to have legislation ready to go in 2017. what happened? >> we did. if you look at the appropriations, we are building the wall right now. a portion of h. e to go further. >> then why did he shut down the government? >> he did not shut down the go rnment. let's be very clear, we were in the house, in the majority, we moved a bil to the senate.

you know as well as everybody else in america it takes 60 votes. schumer is the one who said no. so you put itn -- >> it is daca for the wall is what the preside a backedy from. >> no, we passed this at the end of the last year. money for the wall, more mon cause we're already building it. we put another $5 billion in there, the senate had aff ent version and schumer said no so it got shut hawn. then whaened? the president stayed in washington, the speaker then went to hawaii, the president stayed there to nee. we brought meetings down, this he said they wouldn't talk about anything. we got intotd a sn that lasted longer than ever before. the president made four different offers that were reasonable. >> not until after he shut down the government. >> he didn't shut it dow o >> he's t that said he would be proud to own it. who else did it? he rejectedl the senate bo keep the government open. >> no, the house had a bill, the is that hit a bike. very other piece of legislation it takes 60 votes in the senate.on republicans have 60 in the senate. i think it would only be fair, chuck, to understand if i takes

60 votes in the senate there's probably blame on both sides. >> let's talk about this, in three weeks. >> yes. >> when g think yous pass something that keeps the government open, i'm guessing you guys don't have -wa you dont to go through another government shutdown. a bunch of senators want to basilly make it impossible to shut down the governmete, cr- senator warner has a bill, but all of them are basically never to cancel ack paycgain for a nonpolitical appointee. will you support something like that? >> yeah, but i will go further. do you want to know how you will never had a shutdown again, let's not pay the senate and congress. >> that's the mark warner bill. and all political staf t >> that's amendment i would offer. because this only harms otrs. but thibout this, the president offered four different reasonable texts, the speaker pelosi, then leader has a record for thest speech on the floor, more than eight hours. ne year ago next month about daca. he took two issues that are a problem and he wanted to solve it. today you're trying to celebrate and say speaker pelosi is some

type of winner in this. no, that means statu quo. that goes against everything we know and want for america. we want to find common ground and solutions. >> very quickly, you have not appointed all members of the house intelligence committee on the republican side. >> i will next omweek. >> people think you're trying -- it's helping to delay the transcripts that could get sent to muelle >> no, nothing of the sort. the reason why committees weren't already imported, the democrats were not organized. they waited until after the speaker raub, which rcans would never do, to give us the ratios. i have just now met -- >> intel is always the same ratio, in fairness. >> no, we had negotiations with the speaker changing. i just met with every single indivingal that i'm g to appoint on friday, so it will come out next week. >> all right. kevin mccarmy, republican f california, good to see you. thanks for coming on. >> thank you for having me. democrats have generally been careful not to taunt president tr the shutdown ended but they are making sure the public knows that they got what they wanted.

>> we asked the president to open up government so we would have time to have a debate on theest way to protect our border. democrats are committed to border security and we think we have some betr ideas about how to do so that protect our border, honor our values and are cost effective. joining me now is congressman akeem jeffries of new york. congressman, welcome to "meet the press." >> good morning. good to be here. >>rn okay. gont is open, president trump caved, democrats won this fight, y heard kevin mccarthy say i don't know what you won, you won status quo. in three weeks how are we not in the same ot? >> it's important to understand that the legislative branch are stewards managing public money, we can manage that money efficiently or waste taxpayer dollars. we concludedil spendingons on a medieval border wall that would be ineffective would be a waste of taxpayerdollars, that's a fifth century solution

to a 21st century problem. what we wanto support over the next few weeks is 21st century bordersecurity. so we're willing to invest in additional infrastructure, particularly as it relates lo oual ports of entry which as you know, chuck, is the place where the majority of drugs come in. we're willing to invest in personnel, and in additional technology. >> do you think a fence is medieval? >> well, i think from the standpoint of building a concrete bare remember from sea -- >> he took that off the table. is that progress? >> that's progress and hopefully that positiont that he has taken. in the past we have supported, as you know, enhced fencing and i think that's something that's reasonable that should be on the table, but i don't want to get oute ahead of process because there's a process that has been put in place, we've appointed distinguished members of the appropriations committee and there's three types of members of congress, democrats, republicans and appropriators. i think the appropriators can get this done. >> it's harkening back to where we thought a bill would become a

law. let me ask you this, if that compromise is something that doesn'tave a majority of democrats but has a good chunk of them in the house, it can get through the senate a that's what happens, can you imagine tmocrats in the house allowing a bill on floor that a majority of democrats didn't suppt,ut could get some -- but could get through the senate and to the president's signature. >> well, the only thing i can imagine is making sure theha is a bill comes to the floor that's evidence-based in terms borders.ng our i think that has been our perspective from the very beginning, along with the principle that shutdowns are not legitimate negotiating tactics when there is a public policy eement between two branches of government. >> you just heard kevin mccarthy come out and essentially endorse a bill that would eliminate the ability to do shutdown, he basically said you wano do it make sure the legislative branch doesn't get paid, i think that's the mark westerner bill. is that bipartisan compromise?

is this something we could see happen at least the never have n shutact? >> kevin mccarty is a good man but that seems to me to be a gimmick. we never hold hostage har working -- >> do you want to legislate that, to make it so it can't be done am i more. >> i think we should take a long look to make sure we don't pursue shutdowns to extract leverage, whether that's a democratic or republica president. >> let me go back on what i was trying to get at. the republicansou infy had something called the hastert rule that referred to the former speaker of the house that if a majority of theor my party didn't support a bill they would never put it on the floor. do the mocrats, the new democratic majority, have that same -- is there going to be a versio an unofficial rule like that. >> we haven't takenhat position. we do want to work in a bipartisan way and want to d it behalf of our for the people agenda. we've said we are going to fight hard for lowerealthcare cost, increased pay for every day americans, strengthen the affordable care act, protect

people with preexisting conditions, enact a real infrastructure plan. we want to do that in a anpartisan way, trillion dollar infrastructure we think it will create 16 million good paying jobs, republicans, demoreats, even thedent has supported the notion that we've got to fix our broken infrastructure. >> you didn't quite answer the question. you haven't decided whether that will be a ruler not? >> we have not had that discussion in caudis but we have ussed proceeding in a strongly bipartisan way on issues of importance to the american people. >> i want to see if you will respond to something speaker pelosi said in rponse to the roger stone indictment. let me put it up on screen. she said in the fac 37 indictments the president continued actions to undermine the special counsel investigation, raise the questions what does putin on the president politically, personally or financially. she asked that question somewhat rhetorically. there's some democrats that are anxious to begin an impeachment inquiry today. what point do you think it's appropriate? it's not appropriate right now. we do have a constitutional responsibility to serve as a check and balance on an out of

contro executive branch we take that responsibility seriously, however, we are not going to overinvestigate, we're not going to overpoliticize, we'r not going tooverreach as it relates to that sledge constitutional responsibility. what we ar d going to is make sure we focus on the issues of importance to the american people. that's why elijah cummings is having a hearing thiseek on how we can lower the prescription costs. thathere ritchie niels is having a hearing on protesting people with preexisting conditions. >> congressman cummings is also starting an oversight investigation on security clearances that seem to have at least some connection to the mueller probe. >> we are going to take thatty responsibi seriously. i think the american people want to see checks and balances. we are separate and co-equal branch of government. we don't work for donald trump, with he wk for themerican people. >> let me ask you this, i'm going to put up a tweet of yours, you'vengefore refer to the president not as the president in your tweets, you refer to him as individual one. let me put up one here, for instance, from last week. for decades individual one made

a living stiffing his wkers andontractors and now he's doing it to 800,000 federal employees and contractors. we must end reckless trump shutdown and continue our fight for the people. you refer to him a individual one. you called him the grand wizard. it seems you are a member of leadership, what's that line in your mind, why should the president negotiate with you if you're going to name call him? i know he name calls, why should he negotiate with you? >> it's colorful language and i think that the president is going to have to own his pattern of behavior that hasen t place not year after year, but decade after decade. i do believe that we do nd to find a way together to move forward, democrats and reblicans, and, in fact, chuck, as you know i was able to work with the administration on criminal justice reform, democrats, republicans, progressives, conservatives, the left and the right. if we can d it on criminal justice reform i think we can find a way to move forward. >> do you regret your language? >> i don't regret the use of the language. america is a great country,

we've come a long way on the question of race, with he still have a long way to go. at the end of the day we are a nation of immigrants, some voluntary, othersntinvoy. i think it was dr. king who said all came on different ships but we are in the same boat right now. i think that's the way to proceed. >> all right. hakeem jeffries, good to see you on the show. when we come back, mitch mcconnell is fond of saying education in the second kick of a mule. what about the third? what has president trump learned after the first couple of kicks? the panel on that and a the stone indictment is next. ♪ ignition sequence starts. 10... 9... guidance is internal. 6... 5... 4... 3... 2... 1... ♪

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i am -- >>r pre -- >> i'm unqualified in terms o ing senior. >> i prefer grand puba as the official title for you. anyway, let me put up headlines some conservative ns organizations, trump lost the tr shutdownp caves, trump blinks. in usa today, this is the weakest mome of president ump's tenure in office. nan p nancy pelosi looks like the commander in chief of donald trump. hugh, you have been hearing frsu the base, i'. how bad is this for the presidt? >> not thabad. this is very premature. tom and i will remember that joe frazier won his first fight with ali and lost the next two. we will remember that they went 41 out of the scheduled 42 rounds. this is the first round of a 42-round fight. i point outes that the ent's approval rating is now r higher

thald reagan's was at this time in the presidency. i looked at your word cloud. it sasas, no compromise. what i heard from your guests is there the potential to go big and solve not just daca but everything. kristen, you are at the white house. is he -- >> he got so defensive saturday morning. no, no,no, no, it's not a cave. >> right. the white house is defiant, this was not a cave. knows his is, he base is not going to be happy unless he gets funding for the k ll. if you t allies they say, we don't see how this ends in any otherh way other a national emergency, because he can't shut down the government thagain. here ilesson i think for president trump. he went into this fight without any strategy, without any plan. every day the president, the white house, they were looki for off ramp, instead of

trying to execute something then d out very carefully. i think they are rht mnow trying to figure out how to do it better. >> you will recall, everybody that knew trump for a long me said he actually enjoys not having a plan. he goes into battle and plan b is damned. tom, a month ago we were asking leader tion, who is the of the democratic party. i want to put up some quotes from people that weren't alwrts so supe of nancy pelosi becoming speaker again. aoc, speaker pelosi doesn't mess around. yim ryan, who challenged her, she's definit up to the task. and grateful for our champion in washington, speaker pelos i think democrats have a leader. going into is that this last election -- i have known her a long time. she's a very smart man. i wondered whether she was the best image for the democratic party. a lot of peopl s said, knows how to run things on the hill. she demonstrated that this past

week. donald trump treated federal employees li poker chips. this time, his father wasn't around to bail him out. i think that hurt him more, by the way, tn people realize. that was a whole crowd of people out there who were probably voted for him, suddenly, what they do is get their job jerked out from under them. a spoke to a senator who said it creeped into agriculture, because this time of the year the farmers are dealing with government agencies to plan for next year's crop. there was no one home t do that. the damage was really more systemic than people realize. >> the one piece ofreement i'm getting from everybody this mornhig is, i they're going to eliminate the huown. the legislative -- he >>o >> this is the longest shutdown in history, 35 days. people were i think at a fever pitch. airports were starting to show signs of stss was the beginning of what we would have

seen. i was talking to a federal worker this weekend who sai monday, people might not have showed up to work. thousands move people would been, i cannot do this anymore. think about the fact we talk hout the president noting a plan. let's think about what he did for 35 days. he had a prime ti special. he went down to the border. he then was possibly disseminating misleading information about the fact that there were drugs pouring , our country was being invaded. after all of that, the president -- the pol show the president was the one being blamed. he was on video because of chuck schumer saying, i wi own the shutdown. >> is that the lesson for the president? bully pulpit is starting to no longer be useful? i hink that's the question. right? part of the strategy -- you heard leermccarthy speak to this. they will try to pick off democrats.wh e house candidate name any. he named a few. there's a lot of skepticism about that strategy actually working. look, he didn't deliver that prime time address until halfway

into the shutdown. lot of his allies say, if he weeks arted off in the before really selling this, trying to make his case, that would have helped. the question iing to be about semantics with this potential compromise looking for. can they find a word or phrase that allows him to declare victory on the wall and democrats as well? >> this isn't a one story town. in the middle of this three s, we roger stone happens friday. let me put up -- the people in and around t trump campaign that have pleaded guilty or been indicted, it's a who is who of people around this president. manafort, gates, stone, cohen, flynn, papadopoulos. that doesn't help your bully pulpit abilities either. >> no. especily given list image whenever he goes on television. he has been deing in the kind of fringe of the republican party and making himself o i more than i watched him the other day.

i thought the perfect person to ay him is marty short in some kind of a stage play. >> they have steve martin it on snl last night. his partner in crime there. roger stone isone of these people that you are -- sometime u.s. think, dsometimes you think, did he insert himself? he knows stu about trump nobody else does. >> the supreme court takes judicial notice of what's haening. the trump campaign was taking judicial notice of what sto was saying that indictment does not support but does not preclude collusion. >> the campaiia off -- rick gates smells like one of them. he may be cooperating. >> itabsolutely. hips away at the white house argument thiss doesn't touch him. >> all right. pause this. on the other side, i wantlkto

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president trump is staking hi reputation with his base on immigration. he is hinting he could declare a national emergency if there's no deal for wall funding in three weeks. if thisek taught us anything, it's that the art of the deal presidentay need to adjust his expectations. the last time congress was close to an immigration deal was 2013a th of eight tried and failed to get it done. two republicans who we that gang still remain in the senate. lindsey graham, who said it nd would be the of the trump presidency if he doesn't get a wall built, and my next guest senator marco rubio of florida. welcome ck to "meet the press press." we went through 35 days. the president signed a deal that was the same deal available to him on day one, other than the end date offeuary 8 to february 15. what did this shutdown accomplish? >> well, hopefully iter teaches

ne that shutdowns are not good leverage in any negotiation. i think it's important to separate tactics from the policy aims. there's missed opportunities in we could have had an extension of tps, a huge issue for peopl here florida, the haitian community. we could have had a three-week extension for -- three-year extension. daca, three years of certainty. fo's better than right now, they are waitingr a court ruling and what the administration is going to do. hopefully, over the next three weeks, some of the elements can become part of what w do. most important of all, i truly believe that if the president can get strong border security thatis satisfies -- what he want, it unlocks the opportunity to do other things on immigration that we need, like figure out somethi reasonable with the people that are not crimin criminals. we have toocuthat. it begins with border security. that's one reason why it's sort imt that we figure out a

way to get something done that he is satisfied with so we can move on t the other issues that he has personally expressed a willingness to be involved in. >> the gang of eight said you need to lead with border tecurity. i want to up here, the 2013 bill had this. border ed the number of patrol agents, 350 miles of new fencing, universal e-verify ystem, new tracking system and the deal was, the border security mesh wouasures would g djimmediately, thetment to immigration status for various groups would be phased in. didn't you guys have the mod? is this deal worth taking off the shelf and making some mino adjustments? >> i think there's elements of it that we can --the problem was, it was done in one big piece of legislation. the more stuff you put in a bill, the more reasons someone can find toegainst it.

>> some argue the other way, senator. make the billbier and, yes, okay, there will be things you don't like, but that's the only way to get some thing u.hayou l. >>s the theory pitched to me as to why we need one comprehensive plan. it didn't work. one of the arguments was bordere security will happen but the legalization will. there's no doubt it's a tough issue. and e looked at it in 20 said, this is easy, we're going to do it this way are figuring out how difficult this. we have to deal with it. i believe that as you said, what the president wants is but a fraction of what that bill in 2013 did on border security. if we can get something done at satisfies it, i am confident the president is prepared to move forward on anc of other parts of immigration reform that people didn't normally associate with him or his white house. we have to do tha part firs >> you have said you are opposed to the national emergency option. in three eks, i know you have no appetite on either side of the aisle for another shutdown.

if that's the only way to keep the government funded, he goes national emergency, how defiant are you on this option? will youidight the prt on this or not? >> i don't think it's a good idea. i think it will be a terrible idea. i hope he doesn't >> would you fight him on it? >> sure. because i think it's importank -- i don't th will have to fight. i'm not sure they will do that. it's aokoption they l at. you are at the mercy of a district court and ultimately an appellate court. it may not withstand if you look at some of the other rulis venltrulings. it's not a good precedent to set. it doesn't mean i don't want border security. i do. i think that's the wrong way to achiev it doesn't provide certainty. you could wind up in a theatric victory at the front and not get it done. the best way to do it is to have a law that funds border security so we know it's going to happen. >> i want to turn to venezuela. ask you -- first of all, you have been -- it's interesting.

"the new york times" calls you rthe ous in chief today. let me read you one part of this and get you to. respo the administration has given no indication of a clear plan to protect the united statesd embassy s personnel against possible retaliation. while mr. rubio insists there are unspecified contingency options he will not reveal, analysts say the administration is not prepared with a plan b in case mr. maduro fights. do you want this administration to use military power if necessary to back up mr. guaido? >> number one, i'm not the ouster in chief or anything like it. the credit belongs to the venezuelan people. this is their movement. this is about them. they are courageous and facing imprisonme imprisonment. the decider here is the president, who has never needed

convincing on venezuela. i offer ideas? sure. he has a team around him. he has never needed convincing. he has raised it wit me, the issue of venezuela, more than i raised it with him. he caresabout this. as far as the analysts saying there's no plan b, how would they we wouldn't -- the government -- trump administration is not going to publi, a pl here is what we're going to do to keep our pho saffolks safe. i have been in touch with the people in charge of this, they have a plan. they have several con ten againagain -- con contue again says. no harm should come to the diplomats. if it does, there will be nsequences. as far as the military option, i don't know who is calling for that. i can tell you thihis applies to venezuela, anywhere in the world, the united states has always had the rht to defend its national security and the use interests wit of force if necessary. i'm not saying that's what's going to happen here. i'm not specifying -- that's not my decision to mam e. lling you, the preferred outcome here is that madurole

es and in 30 or 45 days they call an election and they elect someone democratically and venezuela returns to constitutional order. that's what i want. i want to ask you one kwesquic on on wikileaks. you stood alone among your party in 2016. let me play a f clipr you from october of 2016 where you pledged never to use anything that ce from wikileaks. take a listen. >> i personally will not be talking about any revelations that come about as a result of wikileaks. our intelligence officials who are not partisan people have told us this is the work of a foreign ielligence agency. what i would say to my republican congresses, today it's them, today it could. be >> if you work with wikileaks, are you working against erica? >>ok, i don't know if everybody had the same idea i did or had access to the same information i did when i said that.

itould be clear by now that wikileaks and others like that could have beeneitools of f intelligence used to divide america. i believe anyone cooperating with them is doing the work of a foreign intelligence agency to harm us. i know what you are getting at with roger stone and all hat. i c tell you -- frankly, i mean this in truth, not in a spirit nastiness, the media was unwittinthis, too. the media reported breathlessly on a lot of theel rions leaked that we know were the or product of theof russian intelligence. all of u.s need tore wi -- when we see this from a third party source that we don't know who it is, we have to be careful we are not doing the work of the russians or some other intelligence agency that is trying to underminue us. >> should it a crime working with wikileaks? >> that's a good question. if you are witnessi iparticipat work of a foreign intelligence agency. one of the keys they do is they

are -- it's not t likeey have a sign at the front door that iays, we're -- we are an instrument of ru intelligence or being used by russian intel gligence for thisy that's supported the special prosecutor. we will have all the facts and we can render judgment. it's a big mistake, trust me, to jump to any conclusions until mr. mueller's work is done. >> senato marco rubio, republican from florida, thanks for coming on and sharing your views. whethn we come back, as the democrateye 2020, they are likely to find themselves to navigate differences among their own voters. th are more divided than you think. the three paths for democratic candidates in 2020, that's next. ♪ not long ago, ronda started here. and then, more jobs began to appear. these techs in a lab. this builder in a hardhat... ...the welders and electricians who do all of that. the diner staffed up 'cause they all needed lunch.

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all lost here. cloud.t this word the state of america today, wrong track the biggest word. i joked on friday that if we have broken michael bennett, the mild mannered democratic senator from colorado, then everybody in the united states senate needs to ask how they are conducting themselves. michael bennett basically had his samuel l. jackson snakes on a plane moment on the floor of the u.s. senate. take a listen. >> it had $46 billion in border security in it. 46! not $5 billion for his rinky dink wall he is talking about building. >> i think that's an incredible moment. it also is an example f how people were feeling i think all over the country. there were so many stories ofll families r trying to cobble together their last penny. you had this increasi feeling

that the people that were part of the administration, including billionaire cabinet members, they didn't understand what were going on. wilbur ross' snts that he didn't understand why federal workers would go to food pantries i think really took the air out of a lot of people's lungs. there's been a growing gap between the rich and the poor in this country for a long time. it was really on display in that moment. i think himosing iton the senate floor was really a lotof americans saying, we can't take this anymore. >> i think it speaks to the fact that no one wins in a government shutdown. yes, everyone is saying the analysis is that the president ved and pelosi showed how strong she was. that's the politics. then'american people feel that way. they are scratching their heads. they are wondering what all oth pain was for and frankly how it can be prevented. that's why i think it'san signifthat leader mccarthy and congressman jeffries indicated willingness to support legislation to pvent this happening again.

>> i didn't think you could widen the gap more until this happened. now it is completely gone. i told youer that i talked to the westerners who began by e saying, trump, like his policy. then they said, wish he would stop tweeting all of time. last time i talked to them, he is a clown, i can't stand him. but it's still the policies that we believe in. anywhere i go, democrat, independent, why can't they find common ground? every community in america finds a way to build a school or to do something about downtown. here we can't do it because we breathe the same air and it's toxic toxic and how seriously people take their positions on something. >> sad no compromise, the word cloud. go big and solve this. jared kushner leading it. it's more important to shut down e maduro government than our

government. donald trump is winning because of bolton and pompeo are winning. that's going to happen. that's going to bring us together. >> that isoing to bring us together? getting involved in a latin american politics? >> absolutely. russia is against that. >> i understand. >> that will help. that will help. >> i think because there's going to be this committee of bipartisan leaders, there are what you aee -- you will people trying to talk about facts and maybe try to get on the same page. part of what that speech was about wa this rinky dink wall is what he called it. i interviewed the mayor of mccallen texas. he said we don't need a wall. a wall is not goingr to solve issues. there's an issue here with people not understanding that cts aren't being agreed upon. >> the problem is in wyoming and south dakota, they think they need awall. in texas and arizona, they don't. >> i know. >> right? ab a lot of this we don't want to talk t.

the fact is on the republican side, a lot of people see the rise of an extraordinary important newue consty, hispanics, what will come here and be democrats. i hear wh i push people harder, i don't know whether i want brown grand babies. that what's going on. i happen to believe that the hispanics should workt harder a assimilation. i've been saying for a long time that they out not to b codified in their community but make sure that all of their kids learning to speak english and they feel comfortable in the communities. that's going to takeoutreach on both sides. >> congressman peter king in a conversation that thi had w him spoke to sort of this remarkable moment in which we find ourselves. he says what has to happen, both sides need to ignore t fringes. you have the far rit and the far left screaming, yelling the loudest. to some extent, preventing compromise. s> there will be no compromise

unless there's i double layer fence 700 miles long. that's the mryimum neces in exchange for that, regularization for 10 millionpe le, not just daca, there's a big deal to be had. the extremists should be condemned. the fringe should be ignored. the base can get together. >> ieould say we to adjust what we think of as america. grew up in miami where people speak spanish but se kidsak english. we think america can only speak english as if spanish wasn't part ofngmerica is troub >> we will leave it there. all spanish and all english. that's all we have for today. thank you for watching. we will be back next week because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press."

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