welcomeo a bishop t.b. jakes. n you feel thatxp eience well. he is theter's house church texas, and the touch watched weekly by more lihan 3 mil v grammy-award winnifims, a s been preacher and teacher sp. welcome.toave you he

in wa to your new book "crushing." journey, when discovered your 13-year-old daughter was pregnant. this was many days ago. tell us about that day. >> it was a tough day. n wor noi am people sef, our emotions were devastat daughter much more than what people would have thought about being embarrassed. representation or anything l

child and if she wasay, and i ae it has prov t deeper understand to a place be the woman that she is today, the author and m ely crushingedn o open upk, to say thi justeo just a ref though it's a stro christians, and it'sfeng. christia christiananity, it'sk back to

relearn fundamentals of>>n the incurmotional pain, it's as traumatic physical pain and you that happen to you and shutdown on the side, and process, it takes time, bounce back immediately and be okay the rig a things that takes trust. yes. >>

that was a >> ogether it m alzheime a we we clos ndand she knew everythi haditae to many, many people go through that,th at on . ministry, andmvf: suffered a .

preaching around the world a writing books and doing talk shows and all this stuff, all of this was happening in the backdrop of that. >> for most of us, onerushing experience can level you. but when they come back-to-back, it can feel as though life is one, a doctor, depression. how do you wrestle the good out of the worst moments of your life? howof do you get life out hat you describe as the muddy places of life? >> so many times we look at people and we see the excel and we think they are excelling oecause they are motivated by where they are gg to, but sometimes it's motivation of where you are coming from. there are certain things that happen i your life that make

you relentless and increases your bounce back. if you didn't pull the aow back it wouldn't shoot forward. if you didn't crush the grape, you wouldn't have wine.rs undeanding so many tim in our lives you have a choice in that moment to get bitter or bet better, to either use it as fuel to prove to yourself and to your god and to your family we're stronger thanthis, or you can wallow in it. you make that choice. it's a decision. it's not a feeling. >> i want to talk to you about some of the issues we areacing right now in the country, a recent washington post poll found 8 out ofeo 10 ple believe the country is mainly or totally divided. what do you think it will take to pull people back together o again, t heal the nation? >> i don't think the nation will be healed by television or by

the white house, frankly. i think the nation will healed by coffee shops and people talking on buses, just ordinary people coming together and saying, wait a minute, we are better than this. we will not allow a few people toin def who we are as individuals. i am optimistic in spite of the corruption that seems to be rising to theforefront of the headlines every day that beneath all of that there are a lot of good people in this country who are concerned about this country, and where this country is going. i think they have to break their silence. those people who have issues with other people, we have to wlearn to talk to people differ with us. until we learn to have conversations outside of our tribe and oside of ourgroup, we will never enlarge the way we think and the way we resol issues. >> we live in aer time whe people are staring at their cell

phones and don't look at each other anymore, and we don't listen to one another and we are not talkinoto one er. how do we get back to that kind of community, sense of community? >> i think we have to demand it of each oth, and sometimes people are texting me and i say, call me. when my kids are sitting around the table and eonerybody is their cell phone, i think this is a cell phone-free zone. pulling people out so that wen caot lose the gift of communication, and so that we don't have misunderstandings. sometimes when we are o social m ia, our worst self appears and emerges, things we would ever say to a person face-to-face we attack them because they don't seem as real when we are tweeting them than ifwe are talking to them. we don't have to hear their rebuttal or understand where they are or see the pain in their eyes or realize that we are not that different.

it's a willfullindness that perpetuates itself, and before we can heal, weye e we met understand the sight is very important, andou connec beyond verbalders andtoo, it h contact. >> on the subje ofincidents violence ishaing on has been ri. what is the answer? goi to be a degree of always was and aays will

beneath the veneer correctness that always existed in the country, and the cforefro as of it or hasmf it, it's an important discussion for us to ny, the authenticity of thethat's good, because now politeness did noto u think it's of h marrie, wh anger and an always have a

always seem to be congenial, they live in idenial, and it challenge the nice and neat way country it does't take remind us we areb destroying d and cause us theis collegeon sc.

many bel and and those who don'? >> the gapha knots is wi i is wg losing middle class and middle thinking and we are justice. youas been said when consider things like money can sway the tables of destiny. we will need its a long as privilege -- white privilege exists in our country. we have to force ourselves to be fair.

it's not alysinstinctive to be fair for any people. h is instinctive to win. consequently, wve a behavior that is perpetuating itself in this country that is win a all costs. i'm concerned about that. i think we have to put policies in place to protect justice and fairness and to make sure that we give each person an equal opportunity, particularly in education, because if wealth controls who gets the education, then only the wealth will be educated. the poor will get poorer and the rich w,ll get rich and that has been our story for sometime. >> what about the moral lesson it sends to young people? >> it's a huge moral lesson. we are not doing a very good job now moral lessons right with young people. we are not doing a very good job. it used to be you could allow your child t watch the 6:00 news and not worry about vulgarity and profanity, and now

it has become permissible to allow that to happen in all places when you start talking about the college admissions. the really bad thing it says not only to young people in general bu to the young person specifically, that as i parent i thought you were not good enough to get there on your own.erv wat you get the extraraining to becomed competiti. knowsth. >> andngay areirality over

other the the suicide rpant in the d i believe in t based on their you commit suicideth you don't wantome so -- become so cyni wal that youant to kill your future. the possibility of tomorrow, the chance that w thingsll get better, the optimism that another day might bring about another opportunity is something that made this country great. we have to get back to that

again. >> a lot of young feel they have a their parents >> well, they mil were education and you will got ald out with debt and middle range house something diminishing and it's becoming more ornd more difficult f them to get a running start. despair they feel at this poin we have tove correctseo stop minor things and start l than w home ownership and train down in the the benefit of being in the right the key tonggood, turning

saying what happened to a and the worst thing you ever matte we and that allthg that i live or whateveaty is i leate that. number two, would not gone through what i went through? start using that moving yourself f creates power,ic gen

further it shooome of most amazinga been able to meet in success, there's something in theirbackground, a horrible atro t that's something everyewer needs to look even in the situation. >> you wrote that at to talk go? >> didn't go didn't think i was a grea a sen thposition, and to be honest,ou it's so yill

ultimately know it's him and not ug, oh, my don't you ge one of t suited f ashes, and is that the story that out dispi i think that people have always been the most disadvantaged people becdisadva givethuge, then you don't get? t

you gave themverything but the work ethic, and we have to go back to not shieldingield them d transformation and how you your veryst, preacher. something that maybe you didn't happen. >>right.>> how did she feel abo writing this book and telling her story? >> i never spoke u about itil she did. i felt like it was her story to tell. the reason that i am nowab talkg ut it is, i am talking about it from a parents' perspective. we go through the same thing but

we go through it from a different point of view. i wrote it to all the parents who are tempted to give up right nowbecause they feel like i am not a very good parent or my son is in jail or my daughter didn't do what i wantedr her to do o they dropped out of school or they are in some rehab center, or whateverhat is t makes you think that their outcome is false, and i wrote it from the parents' perspective to say it's possible you have not given your child enough time to come out of the whirlwind they are in right now and to have the faith and tenacity to never gaveup. sarah became who she is because her mother, first of all, let me put her mother up front, and then ay, and i, never gave up on our child. i put her mother up front because her mother absolutely is an amazing person. oin the thick itro in the

in the most tphauz nanaui momen of it, her commitment of walking our daughter trough the process and the instinct of how to go through the process was impeccable. i think when you hear a father talk about it, you know, most of us, so many of us, particularly african-american communities ner heard a father talk, have never heard a father's perspective. either we didn't hav one or the one we had were silent or they were working all the time or for whatever retson, we don' often get to hear a male perspective, so both as a parent and a father to sawa that devastating for me, and she made it and she turned into this amazing person that i didn't even know was there, and i mean even before she went through what she went through by getting pregnant as a teenager, i never would have guessed that was there, and i

really believed some of th aroma of who she has become was made in the suffering, and if she had not suffered like that she would not be who she is today, and that's good news and hope for parents and grandparents who lay in bed at nighlike we did, worrying about if this is going to be okay. >> "crushing" is your 41st book? yes. >> what is next? >> i am doing things with lifetime i am excited about, and we ha films, working on "seven dead deadly sins." i am excited to get out of the bed every morning and know the sky is the limit to what you can be. don't allow people to put you in-boxes and compartmentalize you and define you by how they

describe you, and say, for ce instanyou are a preacher or just a journalist and put a period where god put a comma. u's endless where yo can be, and if you wake up thinking like that, you discoverng this like that defy age. >> bishop, what is the message of the resurrection and how relevant is the resurrection today, even to believers? >> the message of thee resurrection is the apit me of the whole thing, and you see jesus stumbling into the garden, and what i love about that message, it's openly transparent that resurrection does not come with crucifixion, and success did not happen without suffering. the reason i wrote the book

"crushing" is because life lifts up the cup in the last super, the grape has to be crushed in order to reach its most powerful state, and the one that held it had to be crushed to reach his most powerful state, and the persons listening to us today, at some point in your life you will go through physical, emotional andps hological stress, pressure, doesn't have to be something you can put your finger on, but the times themselves construct a certainl amount of pressure but when the pressureç5ñ is over,hen the pai recedes and the room clears, there's always a gift of purpose or power or tenacity that makes us stronger orr wiser o better than when were before. you may have scars left, and you may have wounds left but that doesn't mean you didn't resurrect. don't allow your scars talk you

into staying in your grave. >> thank you. >> it has been a pleasure. >> that's your news for this sunday. to watch our programs, log on to our website and click on "community." i am pat lawson muse.

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"news 4 today" starts now. >> breaking overnight, at least 100 people are dead after a series of easter sunday bombings at several churches and hotels in sri lanka. we're tracking the latest out of asia. >>