but -- but there was an undercurrent of jealousy from abernathy, because he had been with dr. king all along. he had -- he had an amazing hold over audiences. he was a very comic and gifted teacher, but he presented dr. king's sophistication and he was kind of starved for status, as many black people were during that period, to the point that he made incidents and became a burden for dr. king to carry. even at the nobel peace prize ceremony, abernathy refused to get in the second limousine according to the protocol, and all of the nobel officials were lined up there and more vitally dr. king but a lot of the people with him. so there were conflicts there. this was a classical kind of ego conflict the ralf abernathy wanted to be as sophisticated as dr. king. so there's -- there's a don quixote-sancho panza quality there. c-span: and when he sat in that chair that might read before he died in this show, they were all angry with him -- of the civil-rights movement. why? >> guest: they were angry the cause he was one of the first people close to dr. king to acknowledge the fact th

goes if you go to that other church you're going to get white people's food but if you come here to abernathy you're going to get southern soul food so king -- king is smelling that food, and he loved to eat. and he's thinking, i really -- i'm supposed to go to this church i'm about to take over as pastor. you convinced me i'll tell them i'm delayed and they get involved in this chat about the new church, dexter church which has lots of alabama state professors and it was sort of a snooty church and they never shouted. and vernon johns says, you got to be careful because that's a big "n" word church. down home earthier vernacular backstage. it's not the metropolitan opera. but they were all part of king. and andrew young was described to me, you know, somebody who worked with king for a long time in the movement. king loved to crack jokes about crackers and his nickname for young, moments before king was killed he was looking for young and he would mock inpatience, just where have you been, this rep parte, ethnic -- you know, backstage with his buddies. king was a great mimic and a very funny

participants include maya angelou, bernice king, and juanita abernathy. live coverage is on c-span.on journal" live at 7:00. the atlantic council is hosting a forum this morning on the future of libya. live coverage is on our companion network, c-span2 at 9:30 eastern. >> tour mount vernonon slave quarters on american history tv. former deputy assistant to the president talks about the secret taping system in the white house. the civil war resulted in a tremendous loss of life, but also great advances in medicine. the life-saving lessons learned during four years of bloody conflict. throughout the year we will visit frankfurt, kentucky. get the latest on c- span.org/americanhistory. >> now from the aspen institute wikileaks and freedom of the press. this is a little more than an hour. >> wikileaks was dispursed so quickly. the u.s. has tried to determine the appropriate tradeoffs between transparancy and privacy. the disclosure of government information is not really new or unique. for example, how is this any different from he can pose sure of the pentagon papers many, many years a

[laughter] i told a annie before restarted abernathy complained he wrote dave billion book in the historyo some of the seven pages of this book who were the lyphomed end seenter, the in roswell? can you comment on that u connection? what about ufos and aliens? go for it too. [laughter] >> curious crowd. cen nobody wants to hear about s four and weapons with littleis green men.s but first, as a journalist i interviewed a lot of men for this book the largest number that have ever gone on record with area 51 and they all use their names. there is one exception that is the source that i write about in the last seven pages of my book. this source remains anonymous for reasons of security and that program that he discussed has not been to classified. m -- declassified is an interesting distinction as a journalist to be able to source your source this information up against the classified documents as i did for the first 367 pages of my book. national archives, lime -- library of congress, atomic energy commission and, i could go on and on. lot of late nights looking at documents. then there is

there was andrew young, reverend abernathy, j.t.e man said, aren't you martin luther king? that's what they used to call him. martin luther king. he said, well, i'm martin king. and he swung and slapped him. and knocked him down. well, they were trying to get him up. i was getting ready. [laughter] because my norn violence wasn't working yet. and i was going to take on this man. dr. king said, listen, you too little to whip anybody. so you got to be nonviolent. i said, well, dr. king, i might be little but i can kick him in the right place and get his attention. [applause] well, dr. king spent many hours trying to teach me how not to retaliate. love your enemies in spite of their actions. love those who do evil without having to love their deeds. the man practiced what he preached. he believed in it and practiced it every day. and when i come into rooms like this i think about another incident that will transform to you the reality of the real man we read about. there was a hotel in downtown atlanta where we -- where dr. king would