military in afghanistan. "mr.ortenson who for a time lived out of his car in berkeley, california has spoeng at dozen of military bases, seen his books on required reading lists for military commanders and had lunch with general david petraeus. he was recently in florida a centcom headquarters and met with the head of special operations command. his new book is "stones into schools, promoting peace with books not bombs in afghanistan and pakistan." here is our conversation with him, taped yesterday. a pleasure to meet you. very much so. for a man who tries to scale k-2 and find himself in a village of people who bring him back, so to speak and then -- pick up the story. >> 1993, went to k-2 -- i went there in honor of my sister krista who died from epilepsy, to honor her, i got within 600 meters of the summit, didn't quite make it to the top so i came off the mountain and i was very weak and emaciated and i walked five days and i stumbled into a little village called korfe where i was befriended by the people and

afghanistan before we have finished our job then the taliban would just return to afghanistan and create again a safe haven for international terrorism terrorists could easily spread from afghanistan through central asia and further afghanistan could once again serve as a launch pad for terrorist attacks against north america and europe. ok and i'm the eternal pessimist i'm afraid i mean the what the head of nato had to say right there is going to happen i believe because it's all over you know policy on afghanistan is not being made in kabul it's being made in washington and it's all about not foreign policy it's about politics ok obama's choices are very limited right now could we see the repeat of history. well yes i think so but i have to say i mean first on such of nato i mean nato is already leaving you i mean you have this again saying we we are in afghanistan what date what is it why do you know why do we still we now know what's that we can solve it you know what it is in afghanistan effectively as a coalition of the willing as usual mostly britain and america and britain by now

>> well, the honorable member know we arehere in afghanistan at the invitation of afghanistan and a united nations mandate. we are not seeking to conquer afghanistan. it clearly is impossible. you only have to fly over and look down at the deserts and mountain ranges to know in a moment that it is not possible to conquer afghanistan but it should be possible to provide necessary support for the government of afghanistan to be able to conduct its own security and provide for the future of its own people. and the honorable member is right that there is great public concern about this. i don't want to minimize the difficulties or imply that things are easier than they are. but i do believe that if these three things are pursued successfully together, the military strategy, the economic strategy, and a political process, then it is possible not to have a purely military success but to succeed in our objective of an afghanistan that can look after its own security. >> does the foreign secretary accept that what the public will now regard as a timetable for the withdrawal of british troops will

what works in afghanistan is what has worked in afghanistan. let the afghans pay the price and do their fighting. putting american boys in place is contrary to our national interest and will not lead to success. trying to put upon the afghan people, will not work. we need to strategy instead of putting our people into a meat grinder. the speaker pro tempore: the time of the gentleman has expired. who seeks recognition. the gentlelady from california is recognized. ms. lee: i would like to yield one minute to the congresswoman from maryland, donna edwards. the speaker pro tempore: the gentlelady is recognized. ms. edwards: i rise in support as a co-sponsor of this amendment and i thank congresswoman lee. this amendment requires that we act on evidence and we know that based on the evidence our afghanistan policy is a failure. numerous strategies and restated mission statements from president bush to prime minister gordon brown to prime minister blair to president obama, we -- restated mission statements continue to fall short. u.s. military repo

pakistan afghanistan relationship but where does that leave mr karzai and his agenda for afghanistan and the american one. i think first of all to go back to our tolls point you this is a missile alliance between the u.s. and pakistan countries really don't have friendships they have relationships and they have interests and their relationships are based on interests so we shouldn't really see this as a permanent relationship there will always be differences and the baggage of history of the u.s. pakistan rollercoaster relationship really impinges on current decisions and perceptions inside pakistan as far as afghanistan is concerned in my view pakistan could certainly live with karzai provided it sees a stable of an entity in which the bathrooms have a much greater say that's the kind of government that they could live with because they're supposed to and that are most contiguous to the area that's pakistan on the border and if the are unhappy that the northern alliance or other groups that are traditionally closer to india have greater say then pakistan will be unhappy some of the

what works in afghanistan is what has worked in afghanistan. let the afghans pay the price and do their fighting. putting american boys in place is contrary to our national interest and will not lead to success. trying to put upon the afghan people, will not wk. we need to strategy instead of putting our people into a meat grinder. the speaker pro tempore: the time of the gentleman has expired. who seeks recognition. the gentlelady from california is recognized. ms. lee: i wou like to yield one minute to the congresswoman from maryland, donna edwards. the speaker pro tempore: the gentlelady is recognized. ms. edwards: i rise in support as a co-sponsor of this amendment and i thank congresswoman lee. this amendment requires that we act on evidee and we know that based on the evidence our afghanistan policy is a failure. numerous strategies and restated mission statements from president bush to prime minister gordon brown to prime minister blair to president obama, we -- restated mission statements continue to fall srt. u.s. military reported tha

of course that's in afghanistan. so getting the right and effective mechanisms of development and diplomacy in afghanistan really is par of that goal. and we have to get it right. but i'm beginning to wonder if we are. at a recent hearing, this subcommittee held -- i think it was with the special inspector general for afghanistan reconstruction. i was really quite shocked at some of the amazing, damning incidents of corruption which i think our -- well, we are aware of and even contributing to as we continue to increase our military footprint in afghanistan. for example, i there was a recent "new york times" report citing afghan and nato officials contending that security contractorompanies, including those connected with president karzai's family and affiliates, charged with defending united states and nato interests, have actually funneled money directly to the taliban, not to attack convoys or other targets, and in at least one case there is suspicion of a contractor compelling the taliban to attack nato forces in

we have to go after the afghanistan government. some of that money needs to come back to main street. guest: i think that is the point of some of these remarks in the report. we have security interests and the way we have to look aheait is, if the surity concern is terrorism, or we prosecuting that the best we can? and i do not think so. i think there is a more cost- effective way to do it. wee table. the speaker pro tempore: the house will come to order. the house will come to order. members in conversation, if they'll take their conversations to the cloakroom. for what purpose does the gentleman from massachusetts rise? >> madam speaker, i send to the desk a privilege red port from the committee on rules for filing under the rule. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title. the clerk: report to accompany house resolution 1500, resolution providing for consideration of the senate amendments to the bill h.r. 4899, making emergency supplemental appropriations for disaster relief and summer jobs for the fiscal year endi

non-military aid that have was supposed to come to afghanistan i think the government of afghanistan and the leadership in upon us on the take the lead but also the nation as a whole should be besieged and should be encouraged to participate in fighting corruption because corruption alone by the government cannot be stopped alone but i think the participation of the population and the participation of the internet. community is also an important factor in fighting corruption now washington originally spoke of a troop withdrawal but that time since been replaced by drawdown and now nato is saying it will stay until the mission is complete so do you think that will ever actually see international forces leave the country. if i remember correctly mr obama's statement regarding this issue was tailored very carefully he mentioned he said that they will begin. withdrawal a drawdown that would begin two thousand and eleven which means that there is an open issue of whether the situation is prepared for it where the security forces of the afghan national army and police are ready for it and

and in afghanistan. is this pacific command structure -- how do you sort of bridge that -- i would argue in some cases it's an artificial gap between your responsibilities and other spanders' responsibilities? >> to ensure there are no gaps. i spoke with admal willard yesterday in preparation for this hearing. and if you confirm me, we agreed to work very closely together. wecannot do something on one side of a combatant commander's boundary that complicated the other. we're committed to working together and it will be the closest collaboration between pacific command and central command if you confirm me. what we don't want to do is ignore the reality that it's a regional problem, that pakistan has had a very difficult history with india. india has shown great forbearance under some enormous pressure. at the same time,fghanistan and pakistan have got to be able to work together. and so it is complicated, but it's the normal -- the normal state of things in the world. we can overcome any little boundary

and no the whole region afghanistan pakistan and i guess x. or viewed. states are likely to fall on the taliban or other forms of extremism was not take a look at the wider context if you well you know and in context of the global fight against terror how will as you said the failing of americans in afghanistan impact the situation actual americans have failed in nation building in afghanistan and the major problem you know general mcchrystal has now gone to the new commander of american troops and international troops in afghanistan they try to apply neutral solutions yes because they're a military man but you know you can apply the solution only two minutes a problem the problem in afghanistan the problem of the biggest are not military and those are social economic and political problems smallest of all corruption drug abuse and actually the basic problem the failed nation building let's see the basic problem of those countries and of course we can make no plans for to enter for two years is just a complete fantastic. political expert from

the leadership deficit in afghanistan is a very serious one. from the perspective of the people of afghanistan. >> lehrer: you think the key to it is just corruption? just simple corruption? or is it more complex than that? >> it is more than that. it's also the system of governance. i think president karzai insisted through the new constitution to create a super presidency and an extremely centralized government structure which he has not been able to deliver. he has failed. i think this is inappropriate system of governance for a multiethnic society such as afghanistan. i think he has not been able to also come up with any offer for the taliban to be... to negotiate over. he wants to negotiate but he hasn't said what he is going to offer them to negotiate for or over. and he needs to articulate what that might be. i think through decentralization government structure in afghanistan which would be far more appropriate for the country, taliban might have an incentive to negotiate with the government, that is, to be able to run their own local c

in afghanistan. u.s. and isaf forces need to focus their resources and energy on this effort. there is a significant shortfall of trainers and of mentors. building capacity of the afghan security forces to provide security is not simply what we seek. it is what the afghan people seek. that is what we were told by 100 elders at a shura in southern afghanistan last year. when we ask them what they wanted us to do, they told us that we should train and equip the afghan army to provide for their country's security, and then we should depart. the 1600 delegates to the afghanistan consultant it -- consultative peace jirga at the beginning of this month adopted a resolution calling on the international community to expedite the training and equipping of the afghan security forces so that they can gain the capacity to provide security for their own country and people. i remain deeply concerned by reports that relatively few afghan army troops are in the lead in operations in the south, where fighting is heav

troop commitment in afghanistan. they raised new questions about pakistan's reliability, about afghan corruption and about civilian deaths. but mr. obama said today all those things already have been taken into account. >> that's why we have substantially increased our commitment there, insisted upon greater accountability from our partners in afghanistan and pakistan. developed a new strategy that can work and put in place a team including one of our finest generals to execute that plan. now we have to see that strategy through. >> reporter: the president won support on that point from republican senator john mccain at the confirmation hear inghearings. >> the wick i cakileaks leak is part of the concerted history and that's why we need to make changes to our strategy in afghanistan, to increase our commitment of troops and resources and to bring new and better leadership to the mission. >> reporter: meanwhile, john kerry, chairman of the senate foreign relations hearing, cautioned against overreacting to wikileaks.

to help tackle the problems in afghanistan. and the shanghai organisation of corporation is also assisting. the context group and with the upcoming meeting of for instance of russian afghanistan and pakistan and to extend and started this year in helping and one of the factors of creating good neighborhood relationships after the international stabilization efforts here is called to restore it's a new trial audio is going to sign a trailer status of against and we hope this will be supported by the afghans. and the presidents of russia united states are willing to support it in their mutual statement taken in twentieth of june in washington and we believe that today's conference so will help maintain our efforts and support afghanistan to build a prosperous and stable state thank you. listening to russia's foreign minister sergey lavrov addressing the international conference taking place in kabul at the moment on the issues that are taking center stage are security issues drug trafficking and other measures that. need to be ta

policy in afghanistan. there is substantial concern about our course in afghanistan, in part because of the recent disruption in our military leadership, but also because gains in governance, development, military training, and other areas have not occurred at a pace that loose confidence in president obama's original timetable. some security improvements have been achieved and more are likely to follow, but they have been hard-won. and in six months, the president expects a review by his commanders on the status of our efforts in afghanistan. this review presumably would determine the shape of an unexpected transition of responsibilities to afghan security forces in july of 2011. but absent a major realignment on the ground, it is unrealistic to expect that a significant downsizing of u.s. forces could occur at that time without security consequence. this conclusion is reinforced by recent gao and inspector general reports that have raised deep concerns over the viability and the quality of training for th

i believe our goal is to help afghanistan prevent a takeover again of afghanistan by the taliban, who provide safety, solace, and support to the al qaeda terrorist group, which is global tax, already, including 9/11. that should be our goal. i believe our mission should be to strengthen the afghan security forces so that they can take on that tell the taliban. the army is well-respected by the people of afghanistan and the taliban is feared by the people of afghanistan but detested by the people of afghanistan. and so the building blocks of an afghan policy and mission are that you have an army and that is respected and an opponent that is detested by the afghan people. and so, for me, whether or not we have progress or not will depend on whether or not we have successfully taken some steps to build up the afghan army, particularly, with other security forces in afghanistan as well. the evidence we have made progress, in terms of putting the army in a position where they can be the principal provider of security for the afghan people, some of those steps have been at the following. fi

locals make the link with afghanistan clear. >> for as long as the native forces remain in afghanistan there will be people like him. what happens in afghanistan has a direct effect on people's thinking here. >> the afghan and pakistani taliban make great use of the uncontrolled tribal area along the border. the british gave them almost complete autonomy in the days of the raj. this is where al qaeda and other groups operate. osama bin laden might be here somewhere. in a mansion that has scarcely changed since the days of the raj, the governor has started to take over the tribal areas where the extremists operate. >> one measure of our success has been the fact that over the past two years you look at the local people in the province over here. they were favorably inclined toward them, but have turned against them. >> at the moment when pakistan is successfully cracking down on its own telephone group it stands accused of helping the afghan taliban. >> they were able to show their strength. the authorities started looking at the taliban as one of the future options to support in afghan

and they feel they need a counter against india in afghanistan, so it is pakistan and southern afghanistan, roughly speaking and india, perhaps, having influence in the north. and the afghan taliban, the pastan's proxies. >> rose: general petraeus, is he going to change anything about the mcchrystal strategy? >> i think what is going to happen is general petraeus is obviously doing an assessment of all aspects of the policy on the ground to see where things may be tweaked. i don't think you are going to see any major changes at this point. i think in terms of candle hear there will be a continued and renewed focus on some kind of political settlement within the city itself and working with the various factions to try and do that outside of the city i think you are going to see perhaps accelerated efforts by the military outside to try and cut down some of the taliban networks, and i think specifically some of the -- some of the commando operations that have been going on very quietly but very efficiently, ruthlessly efficiently in going after taliban leadership and these are the special op

we do afghanistan. today, we are here to talk about one aspect of the afghanistan issue, a very important one. we have 3 ph these and a professor -- ph.d.'s and a professor and a former attorney general, as well as the drugs are, and a representative from richard holbrooke's office. this is a great crowd, a well- informed crowd. understanding the importance of this issue and the drug components of afghanistan. the institute of peace, and the center of international corp. have done a couple of these reports -- cooperation have been a couple of these reports. one of these reports was written by to people that are here. one of these reports has already had an effect on the policy of this administration, moving from the medication, which had been the policy before, the one of the focus -- a focus on the movement. we will have an opportunity today to listen to this new report being presented. in the words of the preface to this report, it is even more radical than the first one. it is very timely today, in t

guest: in afghanistan? host: in afghanistan. guest: well, i think we should have kept our eye on the ball following our action in 2003. instead we invaded iraq, and most of our brain cells and resources moved on to iraq. in hindsight, senator bob graham, who opposed the action in iraq, was right. he said this will distract attention from afghanistan, which is our real target. and to the caller who said, why don't we ever get over 9/11? i don't think we're ever going to get over 9/11. i'd like us to learn the correct lesson, which is not that we should have a military footprint around the world forever, but which are that we live in a world where there are a lot of people who can be taught not to like us, and we have to project our values and win the argument with these people to prove that we are a good global citizen and that we care about human rights development of the world. host: representative harman is the subcommittee chair of homeland security intelligence and terrorism, as we talk about afghanistan and the situation in

guest: in afghanistan? host: in afghanistan.uest: well, i think we should have kept our eye on the ball following our action in 2003. instead we invaded iraq, and most of our brain cells and resources moved on to iraq. in hindsight, senator bob graham, who opposed the action in iraq, was right. he said this will distract attention from afghanistan, which is our real target. and to the caller who said, why don't we ever get over 9/11? i don't think we're ever going to get over 9/11. i'd like us to learn the correct lesson, which is not that we should have a military footprint around the world forever, but which are that we live in a world where there are a lot of people who can be taught not to like us, and we have to project our values and win the argument with these people to prove that we are a good global citizen and that we care about human rights development of the world. host: representative harman is the subcommittee chair of homeland security intelligence and terrorism, as we talk about afghanistan and the situation in i

standards of living here in afghanistan as well as the state regulations and human rights issue is also being discussed and it looks like russia is increasing its involvement in have helping the country in all those years. we're committed to supporting you in efforts on stabilizing afghanistan we will continue to allow transit of international cargo and personnel to afghanistan through our territory we're working on additional measures to keep afghan forces together with our partners we're also helping restore the afghan economy this year russia wrote off the remainder of ghana stands didn't it hundred ninety one million u.s. dollars we will continue to provide humanitarian assistance but also recently russia has said it's willing to sell over twenty am i seventeen helicopters to nature meant for the afghan army no those helicopters were designed especially to fly over the mountain so as the country's chief of staff has said himself they would be perfect for the afghan army russia has also said that it's willing to give some of them for free in order to help the country in each of them

to afghanistan. that's our basic conclusion and basic advice is to stop as much as we can or at least do less of what we're doing that is harmful. if we want to break the momentum of the taliban, well, a good place to start would be to not fill their coffers. that's our story and we're sticking to it and now to tell you the actual truth is phil heymann. >> as he comes up, you can see with this study, that was supposed to be the good news. this is also why we have him here to present a view from the administration as well as others and they will have their opportunity here very shortly to give their thoughts on this. but before that, professor heymann. >> i am about 10% as good an economist as any of the three and that worries me a little bit about giving my thoughts. but on the other hand, economists led us to the economy that we now have and sometimes they are wrong. indeed, often they are wrong. and the question that i want to put to you and to them is how sure we are of what part of their conclusi

it's been for about 20 years that the americans are interfering in afghanistan. >> reporter: afghanistan'she only issue iran's confronting with the international community. its alleged attempt to build a nuclear bomb has drawn new sanctions. let me ask you about sanctions, if i may. does it concern you that the people of iran may be feeling the effects now of sanctions that result from iran's nuclear policies? >> translator: i think the policies by europeans and americans are ridiculous. they think they're going to influence the life of the iranian society. if fact, they're imposing sanctions against themselves. iran is a great nation with a great population. we have vast and rich resources and it's very much easy for us to overcome all problems. >> reporter: one unsolved problem is the 31 year freeze in relations with america. five years into your presidency, i sense that you feel an opportunity was missed for a reconciliation and accommodation with america. but you clearly don't feel that you missed the opportunity. >> translator: please pay attention. i sent the letter to bush and that

has not had enough troops in afghanistan. resulting in this record of a remote outpost calling for help as they are nearly overrun. we are taking casualties. enemy in the wild. the afghan government has been corrupt and inefficient. according to this document, "the general view of the afghans is that the current government is worse than the taliban." american air strikes and commando raids have killed too many civilians. this report describes a raid that was intended to take out a high-ranking al qaeda operative and ended up killing children instead. the pentagon says it will take days if not weeks to determine the damage done by the massive leak of classified material. bruce rideal who directed a review of the afghan war at the start of the obama administration says the sight of so many secret documents on the web is likely to discourage afghans from risking their lives to help the u.s. for fear of winding up on the internet and becoming targets. >> the intelligence collection in afghanistan has been hard from the get-go. to

war in afghanistan and pakistan. in my own view is pakistan's the more important of the two in the long run. that's a nuclear weapons states and afghanistan will always have its problem and pakistan is a more serious problem and we're bi-polar disorder with the agencies dealing with pakistan and india for example. i don't think we have a regional approach to the reege. . we don't have an integrated approach. >> woodruff: do yothink the wikileaked documents in the last few days, what's they're bearing on that? >> i think they're irrelevant but they'll drive policymakers to stop putting things on paper and harder to establish a record of what was done. anytime the government has the leaks it closes and there will be more verbal communication rather than writte written communication. >> woodruff: how do you see the leaks? >> i think they add noise and confusion to the dialog and despite the best efforts of policymakers in the u.s. and pakistan to stay committed to the current parts which is that of collaboration and coo

operations in afghanistan. they called them irresponsible and said it would put the lives of americans at risk. first, an update on what is happening on capitol hill. house democrats are hoping to see the final week of business before the start of the break. a staff writer called the briefing room. what must think it done before lawmakers leave town? >> they are hoping to pass legislation. it is a series of bills to bring some jobs back. they have been shipped overseas. the chair will entertain requests for one-minute speeches. the gentleman will suspend. for what purpose does the gentleman from new mexico rise? >> mr. speaker, i send to the desk a concurrent resolution and ask for its immediate consideration. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title. the clerk: house con current resolution 304. directing the clerk of the house of representatives to correct the enrollment of h.r. 725. the speaker pro tempore: is there objection? without objection, the clerk will report the title of the concurren

the heroin trade begins in afghanistan. the crop is 7,000 tons, valued at 2.4 billion euros, exploited to arm taliban fighters. but the drug trade is not fully of their making. >> my work sets out to show that even though the taliban may profit, in fact it is the government and regional leaders who profit the most. so why would the taliban have a benefit? it's far more widely dispersed. but they need profits from the drug economy. local authorities can offer protetion from smugglers, or make sure poppy crops escape raids. amid karzai installed leaders into key positions. and he is now powerless to stop them using their offices for illegal purposes. >> the black market is closely tied. that means drug production and smuggling. president karzai needs support of these rulers, so he is unable to control their activities. >> while the international community pressures karzai to take action against the opium industry, complex relationships bar progress. >> that was evident last year during the election process. there was systemat

afghanistan expert. on the way shortly the secrets of a very very long life this georgian woman she and thirty years old still enjoyed life so rounded by had great great grandchildren ten data. the un's a warning that if the world's richest countries cause their spending on aids research the recent progress in fighting the disease we put in serious jeopardy well it says sounding the alarm of the international aids conference in vienna where activists are demanding universal treatment and we'll be talking to our correspondent who's in austria for us a little later in the program. now president obama is urging the u.s. senate to extend welfare benefits for unemployed americans and it's proving to be an opportunity to weigh into republicans for denying vital help for millions of people. after years of championing policies that turned a record surplus into a massive deficit the same people who didn't have any problems spending hundreds of billions of dollars on tax breaks for the wealthiest americans are now