michael cohen or alan weiselberg. >> i would place my money on alan weiselberg.hat's closest. >> thank you for being here. i appreciate it, richard. >> a pleasure. >> let's check in on your tweets and social media, from twitter, smerconish, whether or not the president knew about the trump tower meeting doesn't matter. nothing came from it. it's not a crime to listen to what people have to say. everyone is making a mountain out of a mole head. elaine, how do you know nothing came of it? we know the dnc server was hacked, right? we think we know, it's not been proven, we know from the indictments there was meddling according to mueller's articulation of the chronology. so how is it that you know there was no connection between the two? i don't know that. i don't know what mueller knows. i'm eager to find out and my view of this is going to follow the evidence, not the politics. i want to know what you think, go to the website today, smerconish.com, and answer this question. which will determine donald trump's longevity in office? >>> still to come, a school teach

. >> i've spoken to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up. >> funding? >> yes. and it's -- all the stuff, because here you never know that company -- >> --. >> correct. i'm all over that. i spoke to alan about it. when it comes time for the financing -- >> listen, what financing? >> well, i have to pay -- >> pay cash. >> no, no, no, i got -- no, no, no. >> so let's bring in now michael avenatti, stormy daniels attorney with reaction to our breaking news. listen, i've spoken to you about this case. i've spoken to you about meeting stormy daniels. i've spoken to you about the karen mcdougal case as well. for the questioning that i want to ask you about, i want to play what i think is the key part of this conversation and then you and i will discuss this, between michael cohen and donald trump. take a listen. >> i spoke to alan weiselberg about how to set this up. >> funding? >> yes. and it's all the stuff -- >> -- >> all the stuff. you never know -- >> nobody gets hit -- >> correct. i'm all over that. and i spoke to alan about it when it comes time for the financin

he's now a special envoy to the middle east and alan weiselberg who was the money man.t least two public incidents over the last year in which he structured payments to trump's paramours in order to quiet them down. those are two llcs in a company that has a universe of limited liability companies where they park debt and money comes in from the overseas. so to the extent the veil gets pierced because of the stormy daniels payment or the mcdougal payment, bob mueller and other investigators have a field trip around some of these things from an investigative standpoint. >> tim, when you say alan weiselberg knows everything about trump's finances, knees everything. you report he even was handseling his household bills even down to the nickel. >> and personal taxes. >> it's clear he could be more important figure in all of this than michael cohen. >> yes, no doubt. >> joyce vance, what's the significance of this reporting here? what does he mean to all of this? >> prosecutors love to say follow the money. this is literally the man who followed the money for decades. he can

. >> i spoke to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up with the funding -- yes. and it's all the stuff. because here you never know with that company. correct. so i'm all over that. i spoke to alan about it, when it comes time for the financing. >> what financing? >> we'll have to pay. >> pay cash? >> no, no, no. >> listen, i know you represent stormy daniels. so just as an attorney tell me what you're hearing? >> well, i'm hearing these two coconspirators trying to figure out how they're going to make this payment which appears to not be unusual, frankly, don. you know, i have kind of a different take than some of the people that i've heard comment on this. when michael cohen says financing, i don't think he's referring to financing in the form of they're going to go get a loan for this. i think he's just using that term to describe how are they going to make the payment to be clear. now, there's no question in my view that donald trump is the one that first raises this issue of cash. it has yet to be seen whether that's green backs or some other payment mechani

>>> i've spoken to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up with the way we are funding --d it's all the stuff -- all the stuff, because here you never know where that company, you never know where he's going to be. >> going to get hit by -- >> correct. i spoke to alan about it. when it comes time for the financing which will be -- >> listen, what financing? >> well, i have to pay -- >> the secret trump-cohen reporting introduced us to a new character in trump's new legal sagas, alan weiselberg discussed as a player -- i think i'm going to say in a play by --. the "wall street journal" braek being the news weiselberg has been subpoenaed to testify before a grand jury in a michael cohen criminal case. bad news for cohen and also for donald trump because of weiselberg's resume as described in the jushl as, quote, for decades, mr. weiselberg has served as executive vice-president and chief financial officer at the trump organization and was once described by a person close tote company as the most senior person in the organization that's not a trump. after mr. trump was electe

investigated and part of that -- the feds could be talking or in new york to investigators talking to alan weiselberg is really a new front in how much exposure trump's former business dealings could have. >> shepard: the president has indicated his business dealings were a red line. >> yeah. he does not want any investigation to go beyond the question of whether or not the russian government interfered in our election and/or if they can prove possible collusion. he continues to say there was no collusion. he did tell "the new york times" a year ago this summer that that would be a red line. he doesn't think any of his business dealings if found in what is a broad mandate of the special counsel on their hunt for evidence of collusion or russian interference, that they come across anything that could tie trump to the russia oligarchs on anyone in the invest combination through his past financial dealings. president trump has said that that is not appropriate. that's made people in the congress concerned that if it ventures into that area, he might want to stop the probe by firing deputy attorney gener

. >> i've spoken to alan weiselberg how to set the whole thing up with. >> so what are we going to do? >> funding -- yes. and it's all the stuff. >> thinking about that. >> all the stuff because you never know where he's going to. >> maybe he gets hit by. >> correct. i'm all over that. i spoke to allen about it. when it comes time for the financing. >> what financing? >> we'll have to pay -- >> cash? >> no, no, no, no. >> check? >> the audio given to cnn by lanny davis. nbc news has authenticated the recording with davis but we don't know if the original recording has been edited at all. as we've reported both sides dispute what's on the tape you just heard. cohen's attorney says trump brought up by paying in cash. president trump's attorney rudy giuliani flatly says the president can be heard saying don't pay with cash. according to president' lawyers, the payment was never made. earlier today trump refused to answer questions about the recording at the white house.ma. earlier today trump refused to answer questions about the recording at the white house. >> michael cohen's attorney,

in this tape, you hear them reference alan weiselberg. this guy is deep in the weeds. if this guy is now caught in the crosshairs of all of this, this could crack wide open, much wider than if you paid cash or check or if hope hicks lied. >> it could have consequences for the trump organization, not just some transaction between michael cohen and candidate trump. this was something that other people were aware of. it's going to come back to ken's point. if the federal government decides to make a case on election law and misuse of election law and paying people off without reporting it, then other players involved could be called to testify or could be in legal hot water. >> what's the punishment for something like this? in the tape, michael cohen talks about setting up a company to transfer it to our friend david. he's talking about david pecker, who runs american media, who owns the national enquirer, who paid miss mcdougal 150 grand. let's say there's campaign finance violations. what's the actual punishment? if we're sitting here saying, oh, my goodness, the presid

. >> and i've spoken to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up with -- funding -- yes. and it's all the stuff -- >> -- >> all the stuff. here you never know where that company -- >> gets hit by a -- >> correct. i'm all over that. i city of oakland alan about it. when it comes time for the financing -- >> listen, what financing? >> well, i have to pay -- >> pay cash? >> no, no, no, i got -- no, no, no. >> all right. still with us phil rucker from the washington post, frank figliuzzi, michael steele still out there somewhere beautiful with us. joyce vance former u.s. attorney washington post columnist. eugene. emily has been in contact by phone throughout all this. and ken dilanian national security reporter. joyce, i've now listen today that five or six times. i do not have any experience with the mafia. unlike rudy giuliani, i don't think it is at all clear that, that, that the information on this tape doesn't raise more questions about exactly how the trump campaign was using ami. i worked on campaigns. it was my job to put out to the press the annual financial disclos

i've spoken to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up with funding...e been thinking about that. all the stuff. it's all the stuff. because, you know, you never know where that company... maybe he gets hit by a truck. correct. so, i'm all over that. and i spoke to alan about it. when it comes time for the financing which will be... what is it? what financing? you won't have to pay. i won't have to pay in cash? no, no, no. i've got this. no, no, no... the president has hit back on twitter. "what kind of a lawyer would tape a client? is this a first, never heard of it before? why was the tape so abruptly terminated while i was presumably saying positive things?" well the last part of the conversation is of particular focus. the president can be heard saying "pay with cash." it's not clear if he's suggesting to do so, or not to do so. the president's current lawyer, rudy guiliani, has put out his own version of the transcript. he says mr trump says: "don't pay with cash." adding: "the president wanted to do it the right way. if you wanted to hide something

. >> and i've spoken to alan weiselberg about how to set the whole thing up with -- >> so what are weoing to -- >> with funding. yes. and it's all the stuff. all the stuff because, you know, you never know where that company -- you never know where he's going to be. >> maybe he gets hit by a truck. >> correct. so i'm all over that. i spoke to alan about it. when it comes time for the financing, which will be -- >> what financing? >> we'll have to pay -- >> don't pay with cash. >> no, no, no. >> i got -- no, no, no. >> a check? >> there's a big dispute about is the president or then citizen donald trump telling his lawyer, pay cash, and cohen is saying, no, no, no and then trump says pay with a check, or what the president trump legal team says is that he says, don't pay by cash, and pay by check. now, this is all happening in realtime, and alan futterfuss, a lawyer with the trump organization sent a response. whoever is telling lanny davis that cash in the conversation refers to green currency is lying to him. there's no transaction done in currency. it doesn't happen. the whole deal

a man named alan weiselberg is mentioned. he is donald trump's book keeper since the 1970s. if you think michael cohen knows secrets about donald trump. if this man gets in the crosshairs of federal prosecutors, who knows where this thing can go, ali. >> we will continue to follow the fallout in this tape. thanks to you, ken dilanian and danny cevallos. >>> now to a potentially huge development in a lawsuit involving trump's businesses. a federal judge has just an hour ago rejected the president's efforts to stop a lawsuit which alleges that he violated the constitution by continuing business with foreign governments. this involves the emoluments clause which reads no person holding any office of profit or trust under them shall without the consent of congress accept of any present emallment office or title are any kind whatever, from any king, prince or foreign state. now, "the washington post" reports the plaintiffs want to interview trump organization employees and search company records to determine which countries have spent money at trump's hotel in downtown washington

but with this guy, if alan weiselberg has been subpoenaed, if this report in the journal is right, that honestly has way bigger implications than just the case against michael cohen. allen weisselberg is not a household name but he is in the trump household. he's in his 70s. he's worked for the trump family his entire adult life. he started off working for the president's father i believe in the 1970s. he has been at the trump organization apparently since its inception. he's known to be not only a very trusted very senior figure in the trump organization, he's also been directly involved in a number of financial dealings related to the president and his business that have since come under legal scrutiny. for example, he is said to have been personally involved in the payments to women who alleged that they had affairs with president trump according to "the wall street journal," allen weisselberg was close enough to the president and his family he was is the one who happened their household spend expenditures. personal expenditures and purchases for mr. trump and his family including mr

. >> and spoken to alan weiselberg how to set the whole thing up with -- >> what are we going to do? >> -- funding. yes. and it's all the stuff -- >> thinking about that. >> all the stuff. you never know where that company, where he's going to be. >> maybe he gets hit by a truck? >> correct. so i'm all over that. spoke to alan about it. comes time for financing -- >> listen what financing. >> we'll have to pay. >> pay cash? >> no. no, no, no, no, no. >> all right. we're goingthrough exactly what you heard. exclusive rights to mcdougal's story, purchased never published by the parent company american media and chairman, ally of the president, may be the man cohen is referring to when he mentions "our friend david." trump and mcdougal met in the "playboy" mansion 2006, three months after melania gave birth to trump's youngest son and continued to see trump several months after that, according to mcdougal and he allegedly offered her money. promised regular columns on aging and wellness and prominently feature her on two of the company's magazine covers. when the "wall street journal re