it turns out if you sell goods on amazon, you may qualify to get a loan from amazon. program is called amazon lending. it launched late last year with the goal of helping sellers access a loan much faster than they may be able to access a loan from a traditional bank or a lender. it might be a smart business and way to leverage its users to make another revenue stream, but some are worried it's a sign amazon cannot make enough with its retail model. we're going to talk about this. stay with us on that. we'll take a short break and get into this amazon story. stay with us. those little things still get you. for you, life's about her. but your erectile dysfunction - that could be a question of blood flow. cialis tadalafil for daily use helps you be ready anytime the moment's right. you can be more confident in your ability to be ready. and the same cialis is the only daily ed tablet approved to treat ed and symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently or urgently. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medications, and ask if your heart is healthy enou

i wish trading amazon were such.he results, guidance stock performance today are exhibit "a" for stock market ridiculousness in a market that has systematically taken apart leaders for recent disappointment. the ibm and google to name a few. the current results make the stock uninvestable. now back to the trade. as anyone who follows us on twitter knows, i close the position for a 50% gain prior to earnings. if i were still long i would look to close out. xoxo, dan. mike, what do you think? >> i agree wholeheartedly. this stock hasn't made sense to me for a very long time. even if they grew their revenues four-fold they would still not justify the multiples they have here. they could maybe grow into the price over a decade. i hate this stock. >> if you follow me on twitter, you know this was this week's worst company in the world. i don't get it all. p/e of nearly 3,000. it's just -- it is uninvestable. dan is absolutely right. >> carter, it's amazing. we had two interesting earnings out yesterday, amazon and apple.

best buy now says they're going to match everything on amazon. is that a threat to amazon?lmart is doing it too. >> i think that is about amazon and walmart, not amazon and best buy. >> i agree. i don't think it's that big of an issue. holiday shoppers like to shop online. if you have a kindle, you can go right though their portal. >> is this one of the great battles of our day in is this burger king/mcdonald's again? are we there? >> no. >> why not? >> i think amazon has a much better offering. you can get everything you want from there. >> you say amazon won. >> yeah, sure. >> but you're in the betting on the kindle. >> i don't think they're going to win the tablet wars. if apple comes in with a $300 tablet, they're in a lot of trouble. >> walmart still brings in -- they just sold another $100 million. it's bigger. >> it's bigger, but i'm saying when we're talking about a tablet war, amazon's in trouble because there are a lot more entries than there were when it launched the original kindle fire. >> we're talking about retailers going after the whole amazon business mode

liz: another big name is amazon. we are keeping a close eye on amazon's revenue growth and profit margin especially when selling its kindle tablets, just about a cost though the kindle has been on fire. let me check as we look at these numbers. stock is moving lower. the last rate $222. right now the bid is $212. dave: a lot of these products being sold. they have to spend to grow. they have been doing this for quite a while. when you spend to grow obviously sometimes you take a hit and it appears they have taken that it today. it is trading midway in between that average. was as low as 166 conlan as high as 264 and is trading in the $260 range. consul energy forecaster kevin demand and focusing on one developing country to drive its business. the ceo will be telling us what that country is straight ahead. connell: the maker of those colorful resin clogs, some of the new law amend some of you hate them. a lot have them. they have a plan to boost demand. john joining us in a fox business exclusive straight ahead. no w

amazon is fabulous.eck can managers justify paying off for the stock through the end of the year when it's all trading 110 times next year's earnings? it does seem absurd, right? well, wait a second. the growth-oriented managers who own the stock are looking at what is known as the out-years, as i said earlier, at how much amazon can earn two, three, four years down the road. right now the consensus for amazon to earn in 2015 is $7.39. based on that number, the stock is only trading at 35 times 2015 earnings. and i think that estimate is going to prove to be low. that seems a lot less expensive when amazon is growing at 38.68% long-term. you got to look at the out-years because that's how the hedge funds are valuing them. that's why it doesn't seem absurd to these guys. how about the other big tech stock anointed for fourth quarter, google. you know my feelings on google. sultans of search. more than 66% of queries in the u.s. 75% of search advertising budgets. it's amazing. plus, the paid search busines

i love aig but netflix, the difference between them and amazon is that amazon has the bricks and mortarsready spent money on putting in the ground where as netflix costs keep going up and the head of time warner about a year ago said specifically netflix you're not going to get it as cheap as you used to and you have so many competing carriers of content versus amazon where the content comes off for free because you want all of this there. i just don't see it the same. i see netflix on the way down although i am not sure coming here but i don't really -- i see the risk. i don't see the reward there. >> it is easy to say. it is really think about the analogy i was making, the amazon ten years ago, the stock had gone from 400 to 12 and they were competing against walmart, et cetera, and they were competing in big box companies and losing money like crazy which netflix is not and they had a net debt position and netflix has a net cash position. it is not a perfect analogy. i see a very entrepreneurial company using technology to take an old product and deliver it in a new way to customers w

amazon is not. companies with platforms for ecommerce, that enables other businesses, and our position is california has taken too aggressive a step at asserting you have presence in california simply because you paid for an advertisement there. i'm gratified to see that california set a very, very reasonably high small seller exception, and they had to do a million a year in california and 10,000 a year through the partnerships and affiliates, and that level of small seller exception is insulating small companies from burdens they couldn't bear. >> mr. cross by, what's your group's position? >> guest: the retail industry leaders association represents retailers across the board, including the larger retailers in the country and in the world, and they're interested in seeing, after 20 years of discussion and debate, a level playing field created, as steve says, through congress. the congress ultimately has the authority to regulate interstate commerce, and we think it's appropriate, with some of the

amazon is fabulous, led by it's great banner and ceos.latest quarter, 28% rise in revenues, the company comes in much better than expected. all those buildings, all those warehouses, we don't normally worry about margins with am son. the fact that they beat wall street's -- the stock hasn't stopped climbing. how can the managers stop paying for the stocks this year. the growth oriented managers are -- how much amazon can earn two, three, four years down the road. right now the consensus for amazon to earn in 2013, 2014, is $7.30. that seems a lot less expensive when you think that amazon's trading at $13.08. you got to look at those out years, that's why they don't seem absurd to these guys. how about the other tech stock that's been anointed toward the fourth quarter. google. more than 66% of queries in the united states, 75% of search -- now of course we are seeing a big migration in all of my -- google owns mobile. here in america, more than half of the smart phones run on google's operating system. unlike so many other -- hey, hint, f

>> amazon is not. companies that have platforms for everyone customers that enabled other companies to get online as well. california has taken too aggressive a step at asserting you have presence in california simply because you paid for an advertisement there. i'm gratified to see that california set a very, very reasonably high small cellar exception. they have to do a million a year in california and $10,000 a year through the partnerships and affiliate. that level of small seller exception is a proper one from small firms that they couldn't afford to bear. >> joe crosby is with the retail leaders association. mr. crosby, what is your group's position on an internet sales tax. >> thank you, peter. we represent retailers across the board including some of the larger retailers in the country and in the world. they're interested in seeing after 20 years of discussion and debate a level playing field created, as steve says, through congress, that congress ultimately has the authority to regulate inters

what's new is that amazon began collecting a week ago in california, and amazon, as mr. horton said, is a big part of their expected revenue. so if, in fact, the fairness argument and the level playing field is really so important, well, i guess a week into it we'd expect a lot of of stores in california to see growing sales as customers flock into their stores instead of buying online. well, don't hold your breath. that's not likely to be the case. people buy online for convenience, for choice and for lower prices without even getting into the sales tax. >> host: is e bay, mr. delbianco in your view, an exception since it's often many used items? >> guest: well, i would say that less than half of e pay is used -- ebay is used items. ebay is a platform, like a classified ad, a platform for other sellers, and it's a fabulous platform for companies who would otherwise never reach that audience. and ebay is a california company. but with ebay was only looking out for the interests of small sellers from the united states who occasionally had california purchasers, right? sho

any disclosures to make on amazon or apple or microsoft? >> i own ame, i own microsoft, oy do not own amazon. >> susie: all right, thanks for that. david gate, gva research. >> reporter: i'm sylvia hall in washington, where developers are busy building thousands of new apartments. i'll show you what's driving the demand in one of the country's hottest rental markets. >> tom: ahead of those big apple results, investors were busy plowing through a host of earnings and some so-so economic reports. new claims for jobless benefits fell by 23,000 last week to 36 . >>> improvement in the labor market. on wall street, the dow rose 26 points, the nasdaq and the s&p both tacked on four. americans were back buying big ticket items last month. durable goods orders jumped almost 10% in september. durable goods are things designed to last more than three years, like washing machines, televisions and airplanes. the jump last month couldn't offset the 13% drop in the same kind of items in august. but what about smaller everyday items? well, one of the bigg

>> this is a make or break week for amazon. a lot of mutual fund investors -- what i want to do is buy the november. i did this when the stock was around the 2.40. i bought one for 7.70. i sold one at 2.70. $5 is my max risk. i can make up to a $15 between 225 and 210. i make the full $15 between 210. i think it is an important week for amazon. >> this is a high flying name i loved for a long time. i have been wrong on this stock more than once. when you are dealing with a stock with such a low margin you keep thinking one day people will come to their senses. will it be the walmart story or will it be like the netflix. we are not in a very optimistic market. you are spending 25% of the distance between the strikes. >> we have something we love to hate. >> i'm with mike. i'm dubious about the story that amazon has to tell. they continue to make excuses for the horrible margins. dan is right on this. he is spending very little money to get potential $15 upside. mike is right on the money. 25% of the width of the spread. i like t

is amazon the best way to go?under and ceo of merchant, helping companies expand op line. irk, thank you for being with us. i was blown away. tell us how it works and what's the motivation for amazon to lend? >> sure. well, in retail, of course, cash is king. it can be expensive and hard to come by, and that's true most of all during the holiday season, november through january, when most retailers generate more than half of the total annual sales. amazon launched this program, and effectively, it provides that retailer, third party sellers promoting and selling products through the amazon website, with access to incremental cash, of course, allowing them to buy and ultimately turn around and sell access invenn story. gerri: so, eric, is this amazon stepping into a vacuum left by banks who, you know, famous now for not lending to homeowners or small business? >> well, i think the old add general age, in banking, pocket are deep, arms are short, can be true in retail in particular. you know, retail is inherently --

amazon for the quarter. just coming out right now as we speak. the expectations for earnings actually calls for a loss of 8 cents a share. looking at the report and coming up with the e pps number. the revenue looks a little short. there you see the stock trading lower in the extended hours on the heels of these numbers. of course, the numbers literally just hitting the tape. so we've got a light situation here. it looks like. we bring in dan morgan who owns amazon stock. good to see you. you have the revenue number. $13.81 billion looks lying versus the expectation. what's your thought? >> initially, that revenue number is not good. we knew this would give us an idea of what to expect in terms of the overall health of retail spending and give us an indication of what might come down in terms of the upcoming holiday spending. i want to focus on those margins and see how those come out if we get more information. initially, it doesn't look good with that revenue number. >> you say amazon's numbers can give us

listen, amazon, the story with amazon obviously the high valuati valuation, but they're always pouring into money the next new products. so that's why i asked the question, i know people were concerned about that head count increase. so that story again. google went through this phase as well and they seemed to come out all right. so i think amazon around these levels, we'll see how it opens tomorrow might be something we want to get into. >> you thought beak was in a time out. >> typically he chimes in right off the bat. rendered mute. >> listen, i was like a spider sitting in my web, waiting to come by. >> in traffic, by the way. he's here now. nothing to look at here. move on. let's get back to the most highly anticipated earnings release of the quarter, and that is apple shares breaking below $600 after a big miss in the after hours session. larry haberty manages the multimillion-dollar trust which owns 50,000 shares of the tech giant. always good to have zblup hi, melissa. >> in terms of the weakness you've seen in the after-hours session, are you surprised that apple is guiding l

amazon is not going to 0. it could really take it on the chin if it reports badly. >> what is the bottom line? >> just look at cmg and chipotle. if this stock disappoints it doesn't have to do a lot to have this thing down 10% in my opinion. >> absolutely. you might be thinking, guys, if dan is so bearish why not just short the stock. answer is found by playing a little stocks versus options. shorting any stock carried unlimited risk, however, dan's put spread offers a four to one return and risks $500. interesting reward. guys, let's move on. prior to the selloff, the transports were flashing a big red warning sign by failure to rally with the dow. one of the biggest transports is set to report earnings next week. according to our next guest, the charts say watch out below. let's call to the charts with carter braxton worth. let's find out why. what name are we watching? >> u.p.s. one of the biggest transports around. i have three charts all same i have three charts all same time frame just drawing lines diff

apple versus amazon. apple reported a number extraordinary by any means, except by the means of wall street, where it was considered horribly disappointing, as if the company is a bunch of brainless, arrogant bozos who couldn't shine steve jobs' shoes. ipod, ipad, all below what the street was looking for. at one point, down 18 points, stunning. but it rebounded. first, the company has too many products. mostly with the wrong price points. not selling well. too much inventory and can't make enough and beat the estimates. doofuses. second, can't meet demand, not enough inventory, shortfalls, chowder heads. and apple ipad sold dramatically, a glut developing, and the ipad mini, which no one wants or needs doesn't help the cause. fourth, the current iphone is a bust and the samsung competitor is much better. and fifth, apple's $120 million in the bank is burning a hole in the company's pocket and another sign that apple doesn't know what it's doing. and sixth, tim cook is an empty suit. and we have seen the

the battle of the retail heavy weights, walmart versus amazon. how to play the new chapter in that war. >>> and shares fall about 5% in one week, hit correction territory yesterday. should we blame his management style? what is to blame? some answers when we come back. with the fidelity stock screener, you can try strategies from independent experts and see what criteria they use. such as a 5% yield on dividend-paying stocks. then you can customize the strategies and narrow down to exactly those stocks you want to follow. i'm mark allen of fidelity investments. the expert strategies feature is one more innovative reason serious investors are choosing fidelity. now get 200 free trades when you open an account. at the guaranteed's lowest price.attresses plus, pay no interest for 3 years on the best brand-name mattress sets. get your best rest ever from sleep train. ♪ your ticket to a better night's sleep ♪ >>> welcome back. move over google and apple, another big battle being waged o on the street, in a direct attack on amazon, walmart will now off

very similar thing to amazon. we saw amazon get to 205. then it got bid up.the lows as well. so apple and amazon got bid up yesterday. it should be interesting to see what happens today. another thing i can look at today, i can see the high of the day and see if it goes above the high of the day and that could be my stop as well. but i am playing apple to the short side. it's making higher lows and lower lows and i think the stock is heading lower to the 585 200-day moving average once again. a bearish tome coming from andrew keene of keeneonthemarket.com. thank you have a good friday. it's closing time for this friday. coming up next week-- how to break the smart phone addiction. from all of us at first business.. have a wonderful weekend. >>> we are live in san francisco where a man is fighting for his life after a shooting. we'll tell you what doctors found in his pocket that is essential to this investigation. >>> giants packed up overnight for their big trip to detroit. >>> they were embracing for the worse. how the demonstration turned. >>> good morning

apple versus amazon.le reported a number extraordinary by any means, except by the means of wall street, where it was considered horribly disappointing, as if the company is a bunch of brainless, arrogant bozos who couldn't shine steve jobs' shoes. ipod, ipad, all below what the street was looking for. at one point, down 18 points, stunning. but it rebounded. first, the company has too many products. mostly with the wrong price points. not selling well. too much inventory and can't make enough and beat the estimates. doofuses. second, can't make demand, not enough inventory, shortfalls, chowder heads. and apple ipad sold dramatically, a glut developing, and the ipad mini, which no one wants or needs doesn't help the cause. fourth, the current iphone is a bust and the samsung competitor is much better. and fifth, apple's $120 million in the bank is burning a hole in the company's pocket and another sign that apple doesn't know what it's doing. and sixth, tim cook is an empty suit. and we have seen the end

can we go back to the amazon? want to just talk about what was said about the bull case on gross margins. it's interesting. so one of the bull cases is that amazon gross margins are expanding and they have in the last two quarters. operating margins are not. so you have cyclicality in the margin that will come back. the reason they are expanding is because of third party. fulfillment stand alone. that requires investment in big fulfillment centers. you can't look at gross margin in isolation. same with amazon web services. all of the data centers that amazon invests in require operating expense. on the media content, you look at the content deals they're doing for amazon prime. that's a free service. they're giving that content to the customer. it's a subscription service in some ways because you pay for it with $79 in prime. we have seen with netflix that business is not necessarily an economic business in terms of returns. so i don't think -- i have sort of changed my mind on this. i don't think we can look at g

amazon and apple reporting disappointing earnings. stocks aren't offering an opportunity to buy through the dip, though. amazon a little higher on the day. apple holding above 600. so what is the better value right now, amazon at 97 times earnings or appellate maybe a little over ten times earnings -- or apple maybe a little over ten times earnings? henry? >> apple did have a $100 dip leading into the earnings, so we are down. that apple's profit margin is threatened, into next year people are looking at that, they'relooking at the margin coming down. amazon is making huge investments now which are artificially depressing earnings. and that over the next few years, those will pay off. i don't know whether they will, but that's what -- >> i'm going to push back in two ways. first on apple. one, fund manager said it great last night. said it's the only stock he owns where their problem is they can't make products that people want fast comment on amazon, w you said, it will pay off down the road for the better part of a decade. >> it has

this is huge for amazon. they're making their own ecosystem the same way that apple did. >> i agree. that is what they will tell you. i think it is a bit of a stretch. it is almost as if they claim they will be google. i believe amazon is doing things, apple is encroaching nicely in terms of music and the cloud. it is a long way to go for a company that seems to be doing very well without needing to do that. >> right now all amazon needs to do is get people to buy two books on the e reader in terms to make up for the loss. the question is would buying a mobile chip unit reduce the amount of content that they have to sell to get back to the black on each sale otherwise it seems like a lot of money spent on i don't know what. >> i think they are getting into a space they know very little about. amazon is across the board the margins are terrible. the company barely makes money on each dollar of sales. i think they need to clean up the business they are in before they launch a new business. as far as texas instr

instead of buying it on amazon. they hurts themselves? >> amazon is hurting itself, maria. it's a negative for amazon. it's a negative for best buy. it's a negative for walmart because it will shift more shoppers to target. it's also a big negative, maria, for the apparel retailers from sears and k-mart to jcpenney. >> herb, what do you think about that? >> if you need a product, hard goods and electronics, whatever it is, and you need it now and you go to that store and you can showroom at that point, i think that's when that app will come in handy. you'll say, hey, if i can save $30, i'll order it at amazon. that's where the price matching must occur. >> is this the only way target can take on the online retailers, burt? do you think they'll have to make it year round? this is pretty competitive. >> maria, you and herb are completely correct. it's very competitive. they can go year round. it's still advantage target over walmart because target sells total store. so walmart's going to get hit on the margin. target

amazon's rivals taking aim with new policies and products. fox's tracy burns has more. >> reporter: ten dollars for same day shipping? it actually could be coming to a city near you, the latest attempt to compete with amazon this holiday season. wal-mart is testing same day service for oine orders. regardless of size the company will ship products from local stores eliminating time spent in a warehouse. it started last week in philadelphia and northern virginia. now wal-mart is expected to expand the program to more cities later this month and the goal? to compete with amazon in online sales during the busiest shopping season of the year and they're not the only ones. new rumors of apple's ipad mini could pose a new threat to the tablet market. >> if you look at the landscape, there is a lot of competition in terms of innovation. >> reporter: though late to the game, a lot is expected from apple's newest product. it takes direct aim at its rival's popular devices, amazon's kindle fire and google's nexus 7. while the kindle fire has seen succe

how about amazon.zon capital services part of the company's lending program which allows customers to obtain cash quicker than they would with a traditional bank loan. amazon not disclosing the number of merchants who qualify for this program, according to a company representative. however those who do qualify are characterized as heavy sellers of goods through amazon's websites. dagen: last night's presidential debate lit up social networks setting the record as the most tweeted about event in u.s. political history. exceeding both conventions. in just 90 minutes the debate generated a whopping 10.3 million tweets. sesame street was a twitter sensation last night as well for governor romney's i love big board but i'm going to basically -- [inaudible] -- that comment generated 70,000 tweets per minute that mentioned sesame street. can i add one thing? connell: only one. dagen: what's interesting at twitter though the spin doctors become less relevant because you can't spin the public. i love it. i was

not just apple, of course, but amazon also reporting and amazon falling ahead of that earnings reportamazon has been on a tare, of course, in 2012, surging over 32%. will the rally continue following tomorrow's big report? let's trade tomorrow. and let's trade amazon. >> well, it's actually been down sharply, $265 or so stock now trading on either side of $230. the great thing about last quarter, it all comes down to operating margins with amazon. they're razor thin. this is a tough one for me here at $230. i'd rather watch, see what they report, see what margins are before i foray into amazon. i know that's a coward's way out, but this could go $20 either way. >> margins -- >> yes, yes, yes. >> really? >> i'll tell you, if you want to trade this, that's what i'd do, i'd wait. you get it down to $216, $217, that's also the gap from back in april or may, that's not a bad place to try to enter a trading long here on amazon if you get weak earnings and gets priced in. >> this is priced to perfection. 100 times priced earnings. and, you know, the market is punishing any copies. >> under a

so much more than amazon.but so much competition in the space that is just one part of the story and i think you have to look at this, tough start saying how how has this analyst been, how's that analyst been? >> i kind of agree. to be fair, i mean, in your piece on cnbc.com, you actually make this point. this is what makes a market. you don't want all the duction li -- ducks lining up on one side. by having two points of view, you're sparking conversation. >> it just troubles me they're so far apart. they're looking at the same stuff, same competitive landscape, and they're way over here. >> if you own the stock. >> why would i own it? >> you want to look at the guy, look at the other guy's opinion. figure out, does he had having that makes you want to rethink your investment in the company? >> all i'm saying is if i'm thinking about buying netflix or i own it and i have a respected analyst saying amazon is not a threat and a respected analyst saying amazon is not a threat, i'm nervous. >> you need a third an

we can also take a look at a sam sung smart tv, best buy $1000, amazon, 998. you don't see a huge price difference and the customer may say it's worth it for me to go into the store and buy it right away. >> how do you prove it, just show your phone or something. >> you can print out the product page or show it on your phone. >> this has been done, i know at seres i used to do. i'd shop all over the place. and plus 10% the difference. >> that's a good deal. >> that is a good deal. >> i don't guarantee that best bye will do that. in fact they won't, but best buy hasn't been as forward as all the other retailers in price matching so this is huge. >> how about tips. >> let's look at shopping tips. if you are going to price match, you are going to want to do your research first. at home, print out that product page or book marc -- bookmark it on your phone. go to price grabber.com to see what what retailers are selling for. retail have the greatest profit margins on things like cables but do your research first. >> sometimes you can go to e ebay and get plugs for

making on that amazon product?s trying to devise a way to be somewhat neutral. they'll come to it. they'll figure out if they need to drop the price and not even have any shipping costs on it, they'll figure that out. they'll get there. >> joe, they always stress a few themes at this meeting. discipline on cost is something walmart stresses. what else struck you this morning in terms of the presentations? >> well, i think the enthusiasm around the walmart u.s. business, it was interesting the first note i wrote, bill simon who runs the walmart u.s. decision wrote "sounds a little peppy." he was in a good mood, confident and looking well for the holiday season. >> joe, in terms of how they are set up for the holiday season, what are you getting a sense in terms of inventory and how they're stocking up. some analysts get the idea walmart is goingor a higher price point, one example was the keurig brewer, at $229, traditionally a higher price point than what has traditionally been in the home goods category and additi

i think right now you continue to own walmart over amazon, amazon scares me.has the economy of scales right now. >> hey guys, the issue here is that best buy is already dealing with thin margins. this is just going to add costs and it's going to push off thor inable at some point so you have to own it because you believe it's going to be taken out but that is no reason alone to own stock. in terms of amazon, i think that barnes and noble has to worry more about it. the ecreate is out that wasn't a secret. they don't care about devices. >> scott, i think -- what, you get a flat screen delivered in 30 minutes or it's free? i don't see how this is -- i understand they have to try something, but of these names, i like walmart the best, because wloos their same-day delivery picks up traction this is still a company that plays right into the hands of what the american consumer wants and needs in the coming year, which is a continued focus on good prices, a continued convenience model where they can get everything done in one shot. >> josh, you still like walmart eve

amazon. >> amazon? >> no. let's first talk about amazon. i think stephanie's correct. the challenge is the margins. you have to believe margins have troughed. in terms of a pure price performance amazon continues to defy the fundamental challenges it has. apple is the name i trade. let me walk you there what i think will happen. it relates to an experience i had this time last year. i was taken out of apple on a stop below the 200-day moving average. i think potentially the same scenario sets up tonight. the 200-day moving average is at 586. everyone is going to be looking at it. on a flush below 586, contrary to what i did last year which was get out, that's when i'll get in again. it seems to me the market is gravitating toward that level. >> slim shady? >> i think joe is probably spot on with that if it does come down to test that level. the 586 level could cause a flush of selling. i'm looking at it from the other way. i'm long apple right now, michelle. i think the stock can get back above the 626, 627 100-day. that would get people coming into the name. if you lo

>> i think amazon clearly wins.he large e retailers like walmart and target i think will do okay. it is interesting to note that walmart and target have stopped selling kindles all together because they figure the competitor tleft amazon. i think best buy is a clear loser in all of this. >> rocky, if we look at this, i've been going back and forth on twitter about this today. people are pointing out to me, then i point out to others, that fries which is a big california operation, a private company, actually advertises that they actually meet internet -- or beat internet prices. can you go to the store showroom, unless as paul says you are trying to buy a computer or hard drive or some hardware, they come in with the better price. how does that fit in to this? >> it does fit in a little bit but the people in the store are already intending to buy. if the price is vastly different they'd probably walk out anyway so you are capturing a sale you wouldn't otherwise have. >> bingo, which is what best buy's trying to do.

amazon came in and has a deal with netflix. think that's going to help around the world. >> we were just showing your feature film lineup for the rest of the year. if i can only go to one movie for the rest of the year, which one should i go to? >> it's hard to say. we think we have an award contender "the impossible," that comes out, that'll be a platform release in december and go wider. we think we have a chance to get awards there. "perks of a wall flower" which we'll be expanding october 12th, emma watson is fabulous in the movie and that movie was only on 100 some screens last weekend, did very well. i think you'd like that one. and i think that you'll end up, again, it's hard to pick a favorite child. >> good answer. michael, always good to see you. thanks for dropping by. >> thanks for having me. >> vice chairman of lionsgate. >> michael knows, we've been behind michael for years now on this show since it was a $6 stock now close to $16. and even at current prices, now all of a sudden the analysts are getting onboard, b

blow-up on amazon. i don't want to trade it here, i don't want to buy it. let's let the others make money if there is money to be made and i'm not so sure about that. darren in minnesota. >> caller: hey, appreciate the time. how are you doing? >> real good. how about you? >> caller: not too bad. i want to talk to you about a spec stock. it's an airline company, u.s. airways, they had some good earnings today. but more importantly, my speculation, i want to play this on the american airlines deal. do you think that's a smart way to spin the stock? >> i had said -- i had said on this show if i had to buy an airline stock i'd buy that one because i think they'll be able to steal amr, but oil has hit a couple of month low, i don't trust oil to stay lower, when it starts going back to $90, you're going to give up some of that gain. i say cha-ching cha-ching. doug in new york, doug? >> caller: jim, big buffalo boo-yah too ya, sir. >> what's going on? i got fitzpatrick. what's going on? >> my stock, it flat li

. >>> we are watching apple and amazon today. reports that apple is expected to unveil its highly anticipated miniipad at an october 23rd event. meanwhile, amazon's ceo says he's actually not making any money when he sells a kindle device. our tech reporter jon fortt in silicon valley with two very different business models for the tablets. jon? >> tyler, this october 23rd date for apple is interesting for a couple reasons. one, it is two days before apple earnings which will make it interesting for the stock. apple will have to include ipad mini in its fiscal q1 guidance possibly before pre-orders of the device have even started. gross margin guidance will be important with two high-volume laurnl launches under way. i'm told the apple mini will start shipping in november, couple weeks amazon launches the new, improved kindle fire. let's talk business models. of the kindle fire hd unveil, they're not making money on hardware. they make it when people use the device. they said apple's model of getting big margins on hardware puts

>> the funny thing about amazon, we always hear how bad amazon is, what's good for amazon has been bad for electronics retailers. but overall what's been good for amazon has been bad for the overall market and visa versa. amazon still has a ways to go before their report but a company with a real inverse correlation, isrg, a surgical. while the stock gapped down this morning, it has been up and down into positive and negative territory. so the finish is negative, that could be a slight offset to the ibm. but if it finishes negative, that's two big companies that reported in the last day that would have a omen for stocks going forward. >> paul, eric, thanks for joining us. >>> let's get a "market flash" now with sew ma mow ema mody. >> discount stores under pressure. street account is noting rumors that dollar tree at a deutsche bank field trip is suggesting a challenging environment for the holiday season and take a look at dollar tree. it is down about .9%. dollar general down 6.3%. family dollar down about $2. >> thanks, seema. >>> they just did it. nike firing lance armstrong. why d