you know not to have an advertisement the military association of atheism freethinkers american humanist association the internationally missed an ethical union the american ethical union the society for humanistic judaism these are all organized groups that have come together and are trying to build communities communities of values to help people not only to know that how not only to know the facts and the values of humanism but also to live communities in an atheistic lifestyle even if they don't necessarily label themselves that humanism or agree with every single thing they can come together and say we only under you know we understand the world through the lens of science we care very much about humanity and the advancement of humanity and we are going to build these organizations not in a hierarchical dogmatic way but in a loving caring and compassionate way and those communities are out there so when you go out and look at the look for those communities you will find them if you if you just look around for human it's communities and even atheist communities meetup dot com or google or or any

and then there's the ethical culture society and the american humanist association and there are liberal baptist who are called modernists, or darwinists, rather-- evolutionist rather than literalists, rather than fundamentalist. and there's the liberal branch of hinduism and a liberal branch of buddhism. and there's an international association of religious liberals. so in this particular doctrinal dimension, the unitarian universalists don't really fit with the others that you put there. then i would also like to speak to that thing about whether we are conventional or non-conventional? >> fire away. >> we like to think of ourselves as dissidence. we like to say that we are governed by individual conscience. however, the sociologist robert bella recently did a survey of unitarian universalists and pointed out that we're quintessentially american. because most americans believe in individual conscience and most americans believe in independence. and our values are remarkably coherent and remarkably mainstream. they are straight from jefferson, emerson, tharoe and whitman. so, i just wan

. >> steve: we should point out that this national day of reason was created by the american humanist association about government threats to religious liberty and to up the profile of the nonreligious community. what is troubling to some, though, is that they would take the national day of prayer and then essentially co- opting it by saying okay, it's also a national day of reason. it looks like they're trying to get publicity to get us talk being it. >> they succeeded. here we are. but what a great opportunity to talk about the difference. john adams said that our constitution depended on a moral and religious people. by contrast, morality arrives at the muzzle of a gun, we must have faith in god in order to arrive at the very things they want to do. they want to contend for their beliefs and i support that. welcome to the argument. we think our ideas are better. >> steve: all right. she is the ceo and president of concerned women for america, penny nance, we thank you very much. >> thank you. >> steve: joining us on this national day of prayer. if they want to pray, go ahead. if they don't wan