this is not an antiscience. i like science. love reading science books, you know, one of the great pleasure of retirement. i finally got to from my university gave -- gig was able to read it. books about psychs that the history of science who knows if the theory is true. it's an antiempire call kind of theory. it's for me a delightful story. and i think one of the things that sort of -- that science as a community but certainly the science aidologist don't understand they are telling a story too. certainly the idea that everything is -- that there is no such thing as nature there is an ecosystem. everything is systematized. that's a story. and the problem i think becomes when a culture begins to believe that story. but science is such it has been the presence of mind what -- what is his name? somebody. [laughter] >> i'm the happiest when it's overturning. >> right. >> and that's much the science's credit. science gets most excited when it turns over what it already established in new. that's much to science's credit. i think th