andrew jackson?'s a good point, good point. >> he did the numbers. >> look, michelle, you do have to adjust for that era. but credit where credit is due. he was massacring people back when you had to do it with muskets and carrier pigeons. we'll never know what kind of records he could've set if he had had drones and google maps. >> look, we can throw around hypotheticals all day, but the bottom line is, andrew jackson wasn't an international player the way kissinger was. jackson only put up decent numbers at home. he wasn't strong on the road. >> ronny, just because you speak loudly doesn't make it more true, all right? look, look. i think we can all agree, no matter who the goat is, what is important to remember is, kissinger's passing really puts things into perspective. listen, everyone, if there's a war criminal in your life, tell them how you feel about them now. because you never know when they're going to unexpectedly die of being 100 years old. >> michelle: i couldn't agree more. michael kos

it's about andrew jackson coming in. so this in the southeast corner of alabama on the chattahoochee river bordering georgia and it's the southern tip of what's called the creek nation in the first part of the 19th century. and what we know of andrew jackson is as the guy who won the south for dispossession for white people to dispossess land and the trail of tears pushing native americans westward, in this case, andrew jackson went in sent his marshals and his troops in to remove white settlers greek land to like complete opposite of what you might think because he signed a treaty and he felt he needed to back it up for a while. so this place born literally as this town is being burned down by federal government because it is in violation of treaty with the muskogee creek. people very contrary to what might think. so what we see is the very birth of the place fighting for its freedom just take land from the creeks and against the federal government that comes in to threaten that freedom to take land and and land are alm

it's about andrew jackson coming in. so this in the southeast corner of alabama on the chattahoochee river bordering georgia and it's the southern tip of what's called the creek nation in the first part of the 19th century. and what we know of andrew jackson is as the guy who won the south for dispossession for white people to dispossess land and the trail of tears pushing native americans westward, in this case, andrew jackson went in sent his marshals and his troops in to remove white settlers greek land to like complete opposite of what you might think because he signed a treaty and he felt he needed to back it up for a while. so this place born literally as this town is being burned down by federal government because it is in violation of treaty with the muskogee creek. people very contrary to what might think. so what we see is the very birth of the place fighting for its freedom just take land from the creeks and against the federal government that comes in to threaten that freedom to take land and and land are alm

with the election of andrew jackson they wanted somebody they liked and somebody that was like them. voters were willing to look up to george washington, by the time jackson came along they wanted to be able to, at least in theory, to be able to look their president right in the eye. and in fact as you probably noted, the white house is considered the people's house. open door policy. just walk right into the white house and they used to do this. during the civil war. southern sympathizers all over washington. and lincoln, you can wonder in, is the president around? no, he is not here today. okay. any way, one of the things, this is in large part a consequence of political parties. political parties are really what is historically mobilized people and gotten out the vote. you ask the question sort of as when did the political parties work best. i will say this is partly a dodge but i will elaborate on it. best during wartimes. then politics as politics, politics as party politics and by party politics i mean the practice of people putting the interest of the party ahead of the interes

that was true for theodore roosevelt, certainly true for andrew jackson. i see trump as being subjected to many of the same institutional constraints that have been important for restraining presidents through u.s. history. the trump arrow has made me see the system in a new light. it helps you appreciate the two-term limit. i did not see how important that could be. it is a personalistic rule. the u.s. systems -- it seems to be uniquely well-designed. not only do you have all those pre-existing constraints that date all the way back to the foundry and their skepticism about unfettered democracy and the potential for populist demagoguery. it is building on comments in which the way we have democratized the system, when we might also add -- you might also add the two-term limit as another institutional protection that was layered on after the original constitution was established. >> thank you for that. kirk, would you see leaders like jackson, roosevelt -- those who are also charged with having demagogic ambitions but were restrained by the system? what is

is it accurate to call andrew jackson a small the democrat? te to college into jackson, like, a believer in democracy? right? i think it's a little tough to say it is. at least in our modern sense. which is the best sense. theodore roosevelt, on mount rushmore. what does theater roosevelt believed? he, writes in, says often, that the white race is there to rule over the other races. he found what becomes essentially the american empire. in the pacific, where we will rule over these people. they're not gonna get the vote. they're not gonna be citizens. they're not full equal. they are subject to authority, from on high, and they are forced to be under that authority, not that different way than the remote king back at the time. again, with all the examples i'm giving, there's people at the time who recognize this. one of the most pitched debate that happened in american history on the floor of the congress is about the trail of tears. where people come to the well to say, this is, they don't have the term of the time, ethnic cleansing. this is t

thomas jefferson, which would segue and be renamed into the democratic party with the election of andrew jackson. americans made very clear that they wanted somebody who they liked somebody who is like them. you could, voters were willing to look up to george washington. by the time jackson comes along, they want to be able at least in theory to look their president right in the eye. and in fact, you probably know this for a long time, the white house was considered the people's house and they had an open door policy. you could just walk right into the white house. and they used to do this disconcertingly during the civil war when there were southern sympathizers all over washington and lincoln and he just wander in and look around. hey, this president iran. no, no, no, he's not here today. ok. anyway, but one of the things, i mean, this is in large part, a consequence of political parties because political parties are really what historically have mobilized people and gotten out the vote. so you asked the question of sort of, when did political parties work best? i will say this is partly a dod

is it accurate to call andrew jackson like a believer in democracy, right?s a little tough to say it is, at least in our modern sense -- [laughter] theodore roosevelt's on mount rushmore. what does theodore roosevelt think? theodore roosevelt believes, says and rights often is that the white races that rule over the other races. he found this what essentially becomes the american empire, in the pacific, where we will roll over these people. they are not going to get the vote, not going to be citizens, not fully legal, they are subject to authority from our high, and they are forced to be under the authority, not different, in a way, then the remote king at the time. again, all of these examples i am getting, there are people at the time that recognize this. one of the most pitched debates that happened in american history on the floor of congress about the trail of tears, which people come to say, they did not have the term at the time, is ethnic on sick. this is totally unjust. we can't do this. these people have inalienable rights. at the same time, when w

this depicts clay and other notable whigs ridding the white house of democrats such as andrew jackson and martin van buren. who bailey clearly conveyed, had made a mess of the place as the whig nominee in 1844. clay has the honor of barring james k paul from entry a woman texas shown there on the left resembles the president's bride, julia, and she is dressed as she was in virtuous harry. she is being unceremoniously kicked out of the people's house, literally by henry wyse, who wants nothing to do with the debts that the united states would incur upon texas annexation in what is most significant for our purposes, however, is that julia again plays the central role in the political caricature the part of texas she wears a gown similar to the one she wore in the first family lithograph and the same wreath of flowers adorns her hair. but there are some differences. as the dress is rumpled, suggesting long use, long wear, her face is not quite as young and beautiful as it was in the previous lithograph, suggesting that as the annexation annexation issue aged and was revealed in better li

this depicts clay and other notable whigs ridding the white house of democrats such as andrew jackson and martin van buren. who bailey clearly conveyed, had made a mess of the place as the whig nominee in 1844. clay has the honor of barring james k paul from entry a woman texas shown there on the left resembles the president's bride, julia, and she is dressed as she was in virtuous harry. she is being unceremoniously kicked out of the people's house, literally by henry wyse, who wants nothing to do with the debts that the united states would incur upon texas annexation in what is most significant for our purposes, however, is that julia again plays the central role in the political caricature the part of texas she wears a gown similar to the one she wore in the first family lithograph and the same wreath of flowers adorns her hair. but there are some differences. as the dress is rumpled, suggesting long use, long wear, her face is not quite as young and beautiful as it was in the previous lithograph, suggesting that as the annexation annexation issue aged and was revealed in better li

with the election of andrew jackson. and americans made very clear that they wanted somebody who they liked, somebody who was like them. you could voters were willing to look up to george washington by the time jackson comes along, they want to be able, at least in theory, to look their president right in the eye. and, in fact, you probably know this for a long time. the white house was considered the people's house and they had an open door policy. you could just walk right into the white house. and they used to do this disconcerting only during the civil war when there were southern sympathizers all over washington and lincoln had this wander in and look around, hey, as president around. and i know he's not here today. okay. anyway, but one of the i mean, this is in large part a consequence of political because political parties are really what historically have mobile eyes people and gotten out the vote so you ask the question is sort of when did political parties work best. i will say this is partly a dodge, but i'll

i sang to someone like andrew jackson, the early american president, but what i, i think we have to ask is why donald trump was elected. and there, i think we have to tell a story about the history sense of world war 2. and the way in which both parties a band and a lot of people are 1st i think, you know, kind of called more pastor that evolved into a neo liberal set of policies that brought devastation. and donald trump kind of saw on opportunity and read the benefits you know, the american militarism did not take donald trump to discover. and the cold war made it a big fixture of international affairs. and yet americans didn't have the opportunity to end that confrontational posture when the cold war itself ended in 1989. and in that sense, i think we are seeing more of the same today with donald trump kind of version of it. or, you know, us, you know, so someone who we should in the 68 on to understand the continuity is and us history. yeah. trump support is watching this will say, actually trump main fact via counter a gainsville liberalism that you're describing this book because

it was president andrew jackson who persuaded states to take a different approach. it was his thinking that states should elect their judges in popular elections. what happened was that georgia was the first state to say yes, that's a good idea and they changed the popular election of judges. many other states followed suit. and we can talk more about that later, but it hasn't been a wonderful development over time. >> i refer back to the book you wrote in 2002 in preparation for our intro today, you talk about the work of art in the supreme court courtroom, called the majesty of the law and how has important symbolism for you. would you talk about that symbolism. >> it's just the symbolism that the supreme court itself has. as the court in our country that has whose opinions are binding on all of the lower courts, whether state or federal. of course, the supreme court is only responsible for deciding issues of federal law, whether it's statutory or constitutional. the court does not get involved in trying to interpret and apply state law. it's up to the states. but

i think to someone like andrew jackson, the early american president, but what i, i think we have to ask is why donald trump was elected. and there, i think we have to tell a story about history, sense of world war 2. and the way in which both parties of band and a lot of people are 1st i think, you know, kind of called more pastor that evolved into a neo liberal set of policies that brought devastation. and donald trump kind of saw on opportunity and read the benefits you know, the american militarism did not take donald trump to discover. and the cold war made it a big fixture of international affairs. and yet americans didn't have the opportunity to end that confrontational posture when the cold war itself ended in 1989. and in that sense, i think we are seeing more of the same today with donald trump kind of version of it. or, you know, us, you know, so someone who we should understand said on to understand the continuity is and us history. yeah. trump support is watching. this will say, actually trump may in fact be a counter, a gainsville liberalism that you're describing this

i think to someone like andrew jackson, the early american president, but what i, i think we have to ask is why donald trump was elected and they are, i think we have to tell a story about the history sense of world war 2. and the way in which both parties of band and a lot of people are 1st i think, you know, kind of called a more pastor that evolved into a neo liberal set of policies that brought devastation. and donald trump kind of saw on opportunity and read the benefits you know, the american militarism did not take donald trump to discover. and the cold war made it a big fixture of international affairs. and yet americans didn't have the opportunity to end that confrontational posture when the cold war itself ended in 1989. and in that sense, i think we are seeing more of the same today with donald trump kind of version of it. or, you know, us, you know, some of someone who we should understand said on to understand the continuity is and us history. yeah. trump support is watching this will say, actually drum may in fact be a counter, a gainsville liberalism that you describe

andrew jackson yeah, so a little bit of andrew jackson what the vetoing of the right exactly got the vetoing of the means bill rhode sort of like some echoes of the bank we're here we see this come up and again in presidential history this idea that the president is like i've got the big picture idea. members of congress are just a little bit a little bit parochial and narrow in their vision but they also they have a tendency to come back and say maybe so. but this is what my constitu wants, want. and order to get a law passed. you need congress to vote on a president can't pass laws. and that's pretty much what happens with this water project. carter goes after it other democrats are mad and they end up cutting out about the projects. but it mostly, again, just kind of comes back on the administration that he's he's going these things that are important members of his own party and so he's legislating badly even as trying to do good government. this so i'm talking about inflation just kind of briefly here's a cover of time carter versus inflation. he's kind of taken on new new relev

andrew jackson yeah, so a little bit of andrew jackson what the vetoing of the right exactly got the vetoing of the means bill rhode sort of like some echoes of the bank we're here we see this come up and again in presidential history this idea that the president is like i've got the big picture idea. members of congress are just a little bit a little bit parochial and narrow in their vision but they also they have a tendency to come back and say maybe so. but this is what my constitu wants, want. and order to get a law passed. you need congress to vote on a president can't pass laws. and that's pretty much what happens with this water project. carter goes after it other democrats are mad and they end up cutting out about the projects. but it mostly, again, just kind of comes back on the administration that he's he's going these things that are important members of his own party and so he's legislating badly even as trying to do good government. th so i'm talking about inflation just kind of briefly here's a cover of time carr versus inflati. he's kind of taken on new new relevance a

it was president andrew jackson who persuaded states to take a different approach. it was his thinking that states should elect their judges in popular elections. what happened was that georgia was the first state to say yes, that's a good idea and they changed the popular election of judges. many other states followed suit. and we can talk more about that later, but it hasn't been a wonderful development over time. >> i refer back to the book you wrote in 2002 in preparation for our intro today, you talk about the work of art in the supreme court courtroom, called the majesty of the law and how has important symbolism for you. would you talk about that symbolism. >> it's just the symbolism that the supreme court itself has. as the court in our country that has whose opinions are binding on all of the lower courts, whether state or federal. of course, the supreme court is only responsible for deciding issues of federal law, whether it's statutory or constitutional. the court does not get involved in trying to interpret and apply state law. it's up to the states. but

president andrew jackson persuaded states to take a different approach. he was what we call a populist. it was his thinking states should elect judges in popular elections. what happened was, georgia was the first state to say, yes, that is a good idea. they changed the popular election of judges. many other states followed suit. followed suit. and we can talk more about that later, but it hasn't been a wonderful development over time. >> i refer back to the book you wrote in 2002 in preparation for our intro today, you talk about the work of art in the supreme court courtroom, called the majesty of the law and how has important symbolism for you. would you talk about that symbolism. >> it's just the symbolism that the supreme court itself has. as the court in our country that has whose opinions are binding on all of the lower courts, whether state or federal. of course, the supreme court is only responsible for deciding issues of federal law, whether it's statutory or constitutional. the court does not get involved in trying to interpret and apply state

this is andrew jackson, he was so calm that witnesses decided that dickinson missed the barrier of 400lative of this count, marya kamenskaya , assured that he killed at least 11 people in duels. pushkin was also preparing for a fight with him. this is fyodor tolstoy. fyodor tolstoy american. absolutely right. cathedral and churches 400. designed by this architect. after the great fire of london in 1666, st. dunstan's bell tower was rebuilt. in 1940, the bell tower was destroyed by german bombing. kiril, ren. christopher wren. right. that one is for 100. these copper coins were first minted a year before leva, in 1881. moreover, in england, stotinki, stotinka, absolutely true, a bulgarian small change, a year later silver levs were minted in russia. shakespeare in art for 400. this comedy is half a century ago was filmed by samson samsonov. benedict was played by konstantin raikin, and beatrice was played by galina loginova, mother of mily jovovich. comedy of errors, no. night, no, much ado about nothing, shakespeare in art over 200, the english artist william salter, in the mid-19th ce

margaret van buren, andrew jackson, et cetera.ry, they have very different demographics, right? one has a lot of white working class voters and georgia, of course, a lot of college educated voters along the suburbs of atlanta and black voters as well. two very diverse states. you have to win one of them if you're a democrat in the fact that joe biden is trailing in both, historically speaking, there is not a roadmap for wind presidency if you're a democrat without winning at least one of the states. >> reporter: either the south or -- what about 2020? how does this moment, this picture compared what happened in 2020? >> reporter: we just talked about results. let's talk about pulling. michigan polls where trump lead biden. in michigan, the entire 2020 cycle, look at that. no polls. not a single poll where joe biden trailed donald trump. so far this election cycle we have already had to. of course, we're already in 2023. we have had the cnn ssris poll, there is also a new york times siena college poll. remember, donald trump traile

. >>> plus,-- >>> andrew jackson, famously said, americans are not a perfect people, but we are called to a perfect mission. like storming the beaches of normandy. like stepping foot on the moon. like taking out bin laden. here is another man on a mission. joe biden. his mission isn't to stop inflation, crime or migration. the mission is to stop trump. >> would you be running for president if trump wasn't running? >> i expect so. but he is running and i have to run. >> reporter: would you drop out if trump drops out? >> no. >> biden admitted he is too old for this. if the democratic bench wasn't so thin he would retire. plus, only joe biden knows how to use the fbi and cia during an collection. but later biden realized he made kamala harris look bad. so he changed his mind. >> reporter: do think there is any person that can be donald trump other than you? >> you do believe there are? >> i am not the only one. >> reporter: who else could beat donald trump for president? >> biden knows the only way to beat trump is if he doesn't campaign. that's how he beat him the last time. hideout and

of course, 1828 was when the democratic party was founded, martin van buren, andrew jackson, et cetera country. they have very different demographics, right? one is a lot of white working class voters, in georgia, of course, a lot of college educated voters around the suburbs of atlanta, and a lot of black voters as well. so they are two very diverse states. you have to win one of them if you're a democrat. in the fact that joe biden is trailing in both, historically speaking, there simply isn't a roadmap for winning the presidency if you're a democrat without winning at least one of these states. >> either the south, or the rust belt. what about 2020? how does this moment, this picture, compared to what happened in 2020? >> yeah, so, you know, we just talked about results, let's talk about pulling. michigan polls were trump led by, in michigan, the entire 2020 cycle, look at that. no pools, not a single pool where joe biden trailed donald trump. so far this election cycle, we've already had to. and of course, we're still in 2023. there is the cnn srs poll. there's also this sienna col

to, they believe that they believed in the principal lay down in 1840 by their near neighbor, andrew jacksonon was too sacred to be split up over the issue of slavery. so in 1862 when union troops occupied -- huntsville, alabama, hundreds and then thousands of alabama farm boys sneaking through the forest, often at night, went to huntsville and the other recruiting posts held by the yankees and joy and, voluntarily, into the union army. we will bat a surprising part of the story. but it's not the most surprising part, to me. these 2066 members of the first alabama cavalry so distinguish themselves as fighters and spies that general william t sherman personally selected them as his escort and bodyguard on the march to the sea. and in short order, his first hour alabama calgary cavalry became the point of sherman's march. they were there at the burning of atlanta, and then they lead the march to savannah and did so with just such distinction that general francis blair, the head of one of four, sherman's four corps, pick them as the place of honor in the parade, the victory parade through savan

you're also talking about one of the most polarizing if not the most polarizing figure since andrew jacksonunning on the other side, and that's donald trump. i haven't met and found that many people who voted against him who are going to goat for -- vote for him. trump has been on a losing streak. he lost by 8 million in 2020, 2022 was a disaster. you guys expected a red tsunami, it was more like a trickle. gillian: so, marc, i want to get you to respond to that. quickly, take a listen to governor chris sununu about trump on the ballot. >> if there was any validity, you'd see 48 other states trying to do the same thing. personally, i think this is very politically motivated by the maine sector tear of -- secretary of state. gillian: what do you say? >> i think it's very easy because as much as we talk about section three of the 14th amendment, section five of the 14th amendment says the congress has the power to enforce by legislation the, this article. well, that doesn't say secretary of state, that doesn't say the colorado supreme court. it says congress. and i think that's an easy out, a

volks was the senior partner and volks had trained under andrew jackson downing and it was very much a proponent of this picture, victorian style of, of architecture that was prescribed by john ruskin in the stones of venice. and so in a very short period of time we go from this picturesque gothic to the grand monumental classicism of winged and so that's how much architecture was shifting in this time period. d a lot of people actually think this is the original entrance, this is and this is wi b and this was added b theodore weston, who was really just a civil engineer. this is really the only building that he ever did. and this faces south towards where the city was. it's now part of the petrie sculpture gallery, which is wing y again, which was added in the nineties by kevin roach. i hope you're keeping track of all these wings. they'll there'll be a test afterwards. and this is an archival shot of that. and so that's the old image. and just to get your bearings on the far left, you can see cleopatra's needle, the obelisk that was installed when central park was completed in 1880

about whether he did or did not read a book in 2017, he told fox news he was reading a book about andrew jacksonher interview, he claimed jackson could have stopped the civil war. but when he tried to explain what he meant by that, he made it clear he did not know what he was talking about. >> people don't realize, you know, the civil war -- >> yeah. >> if you think about it, why? people don't ask that question but why was there the civil war? >> seth: yeah. [ laughter ] why was there the civil war? [ laughter ] i mean, we all remember those famous paintings of civil war battles where soldiers from the north and south stood in the middle of the woods shrugging their shoulders and saying, "why are we doing this? we're like brothers. [ light laughter ] so, trump now insists he hasn't read "mein kampf." first of all, if you're echoing hitler, it doesn't really matter whether you're ripping him off or you got there on your own you're still echoing hitler. in fact, this wouldn't even be the first time trump has echoed hitler during his first term, he reportedly praised hitler to his aides, including

host: you have written several books about american history including about american president andrew jackson. why lincoln and why now? guest: why lincoln is something people who studied the 19th century grapple with. he seems to have his fingers on every part of the 19th century, at least in the united states and to some extent, around the world. i had written to previous books about the 19th century and each time lincoln was a minor character, which brought me more and more contact with this guy that i had been fascinated with ever since i was growing up in indiana where he spent the majority of his youth. i finally got to the point where i felt i might have something fresh and to say in spite of the thousands of books written. i got to the point where i felt like it fit the news i was covering as a journalist. this is a story about the past. i am not trying to do some analogy or metaphor about the present. lincoln was living in a republic, the basic rules of which we still have today, even some of the buildings were people govern are the same as they were in the 1800s. that would be really

reminded of what newt gingrich told me in 2016, he said, look, donald trump's going to to be a third andrew jackson teddy roosevelt and a third barnum and bailey. president trump spending a lot of time just shining a flashlight and letting that left national media chase the flashlight a lot. i wouldn't overreact to every word he says, but he's going to be the president on national security, secure the border, make the economy strong. his enemies will fear us and rut us. maria: -- respect us. maria: kansas senator roger marshall, we so appreciate your time. >> thank you, maria. maria: up next, four years after covid-19 claimed more than a million american lives and china tried to cover it up, president biden has yet to hold china accountable over the originningses of the deadly virus or the cover-up. now we talk to a truth-teller, kentucky senator rand paul is here on why the president has not made it a priority amidst the potential of another one potentially coming. stay with us, rand paul is coming up. ♪ (adventurous music) ♪ ♪ ♪ be ready for any market with a liquid etf. get in and out with dia.