>> andrew weizmann is back with us, can you answer donald trump's question?is asking if you are innocent, why do you take the fifth amendment? >> so, i think it's very important to remember that the fifth amendment and the assertion of the fifth amendment is a constitutional right that we all enjoy, and it's cannot be used against you in a criminal case. meaning that we can't sit around and say oh the person must be guilty because they asserted the fifth amendment. that would be the case if we were all jurors and a criminal case. but we are not. we are public citizens, and in fact, in a civil case, the assertion of a fifth amendment can be used against you. and in fact, the very definition of a asserting the fifth amendment is that, it has to be the case that a truthful answer to the question would tend to incriminate you. that is the standard for assaulting the fifth amendment. so by definition, it is a sign of guilt. it's just that under the law, it cannot be used in a criminal case. so the president is right when he says that many people, i wouldn't say al

possibility number two, as andrew weizmann suggested, is that mr., and as i added, others perhaps could get indicted. i think if you are merrick garland, though, you have to sort of analyze this on two axes, two dimensions, essentially. you have to have a really, really serious crime, and you have to have very, very strong evidence. so, in other words, really good evidence of let's say, near and his handling, in my view, doesn't cut it. and a very serious crime like espionage is not something you could bring with four mediocre evidence. so the next step where prosecutors and agents to figure out what can be proof, and how strong is that proof? what elements of this statutes do we think we can convince a jury of, buy proof beyond reasonable doubt? that is harder than publishing it in the newspaper. by the way, i think the reporting has been great. i don't mean that as -- it's just a different standard. >> absolutely agree. i think that's actually a really useful way of thinking about it. really strong evidence of a serious crime, right? there are hig

and i think it's gotten some renewed life. >> andrew weizmann, let me give you two questions.new york one, is, in your experience, when someone like allen weisselberg seized donald trump being weekend every day with this federal investigation that is going on, does that make him, island muscle, brick any more likely to collaborate against donald trump in that state tax fraud case? and in georgia, what do you make of lindsey graham's attempt to not testify and fani willis is saying about the evidence she has about but lindsey graham did? >> so on weisselberg, which i find quite interesting, i think it certainly doesn't help that -- when he sees what's going on, but i think the more important thing is these are state cases. no one can hope that a republican president is going to come into office and pardon somebody. if he is convicted, that's going to stick, and it's gonna stick for good. he he could try to cooperate. the other thing that the manhattan district attorney's office can do is if he doesn't cooperate voluntarily after the trial, they can just immunize him and put him

joining us now is andrew weizmann, former fbi general counsel and former senior member of special counselently a professor at nyu law. andrew, thank you so much for being with us on this friday night. >> nice to be here, alex. >> so, this lindsey graham stand a chance here? or is this just running out the clock as long as he can? >> well, i think he does not stand a chance. and i don't think he is gonna be able to run out the clock anymore. you know, he lost twice this week. the district judge ruled against him earlier this week, and the decision today was her saying, i'm not granting a stay, bending appeal, because this is so frivolous. your claim that you have no information that will be unprotected by the speech and debate clause is laughable. the claim that he made that this is protected under sovereign immunity, meaning because he is a federal government official, he should not have to respond to a state grand jury. that is sort of an incredible claim for a sitting senator to make, and that was rightly rejected. i don't anticipate that the 11th circuit is gonna grant a stay here. >>

and as andrew weizmann was saying, that he authorized something like this.and it blows a whole, wide open trump's defense which is oh, i'm being treated unfairly. or something like. that the differential treatment. if any of this is differential treatment, the reason that he is getting, donald trump is being treated better, i mean if it was you are, i or hanging on to classified nuclear weapons information, the feds aren't going to, like be nice and send us a voluntary request, and wait two months before knocking down our door. they would act right away. for the best of reasons. so today i think is a really important illustration of, we've all got to wait for the facts, but right now these facts stink to high heaven, and andrews is exactly right, you are, right we have heard no explanation whatsoever. not a word from donald trump, on what he could possibly do, or be doing with nuclear information, or other signals intelligence information which the washington post has also reported. those electronic intercepts. what in the world is not doing in your home? >>

i wanna bring in andrew weizmann to discuss, former fbi general counsel, and former senior member of mueller probe, he's now a law professor at nyu. andrew, i can tell you that since this news, broke my twitter feed is a flutter with people saying, we need weisman. so i'm just gonna sit back, give you the mic. walk us through what your takeaways are tonight. >> good evening, and good good morning. so a quick read of this, on the boring side but it's important for the judges, they really get the law, it's dead on as to why executive privilege didn't work, why there is no special master needed for the handful of attorney-client documents. all of that is sort of less important, i think, in terms of big picture. let's just turn to the key here, which is that the department got approval from the d.c. chief judge barrel howl, to reveal some grand jury information, and they do. they also go ahead and -- >> i don't know what that means. >> so, good to interrupt me. grand jury material is protected by a rule, that the government is not usually allowed to share grand jury material. for instance

i wanna bring in andrew weizmann, he previously served as the fbi general counsel, and was former seniorr of councillor robert mueller's investigation team. -- >> good evening, it's always good to follow katie benner. >> sheila lays it out very well. and allows me to ask you about your sort of top line reactions to everything we learned in the last 24, hours in the last 13 minutes. and what you think prompted this, the doj to execute and issue this search warrant. >> my intuition is that merrick garland was given information that there was national security information, of such importance and so sensitive, and that he could not troughs that donald trump will simply turn it back over to the government. they had to have information that is still extent in mar-a-lago. and considering the national security concerns, that's the kind of thing that i could see merrick garland and lisa monaco, and christopher wray, and frankly the entire intelligence community thinking is so important to the national security of the united states that it warrants this kind of step. that is my gut, but that is th

>> andrew weizmann, of course, lindsey graham shifted his goal from show us the warrant, to show us the affidavit. this affidavit makes actual legal case, in addition to the substance of what is in it. but mentioning that it involves possible, it does involve 68 information, what are they referring to there? >> so, the application by the government is they oppose turning over the affidavit in an incredibly well within, and i think pretty well reasoned brief and what they were saying is there is an ongoing criminal investigation that is active, and there is an ongoing national security investigation. the former, the ongoing criminal investigation, discovered by something called rule 6e. that is grand jury material. whatever happens in the grand jury is covered by federal rule of criminal procedure 6e, and that cannot be revealed without a court order. so, that filing made it clear that there is an ongoing investigation, and although, at times, they use different terms, it's pretty clear that it involve national security, and a criminal investigation, which i thought was quite telling, be

mark caputo, senior national political reporter for nbc news, andrew weizmann, former fbi general counsel. and former senior editor of the mueller probe, now is a law professor at nyu. frank for clues, a former fbi's assistant director for counter intelligence, and barbara mcquade. a veteran federal prosecutor, and former u.s. attorney for the eastern district of michigan. she worked with the doj during the biden transition, and as a professor at university of michigan's school of law. first, i want to thank all four of you. i know you are working around the clock. mark, you are our reporter on the ground in florida, walk us through exactly what went down today. >> well, we have limited amounts of information, the fbi doesn't like to show the stuff, and trump's team and trump's lawyers not sharing a copy of the search warrant that was received. but as you said in the intro, there are a number of fbi agents who were there for more than a few hours. they, apparently, had shown of him playing close at first. so, it didn't instantly trigger people looking around and saying, oh my god, we have

andrew weizmann, former fbi counsel, and former senior member of special counsel robert mueller's investigativeteam, always full of wisdom, and very educated guesses. thank you for your time tonight, andrew. >> nice to be here. >> way down the ballot, in florida's primary elections this week, we're races for school board. these elections, which are typically nonpartisan, home affairs, have turned into heated contest cycles, courtesy of republican governor, ron desantis. he endorsed 30 candidate for school board races, and stumped for some of them. his hand paid candidates pledged to align with desantis on the way that race, gender, and sexual orientation, are taught in public schools. 19 of desantis's handpicked, school board candidates, pick won their races. six more, with a chance to win runoffs in november. only five out of the 30 candidates is, at minimum, a 63% success rate. they're meddling with down ballot races, and getting results, but, he is not the only one. some incredible reporting on who else wants to try their hand and indoctrination, coming up next. up next. [school bells] when

leading off our discussion tonight, andrew weizmann, former fbi general counsel and former chief of the criminal division in the eastern district of new york. he's a professor of practice at nyu law school, and neal katyal, former acting u.s. solicitor general. they are both msnbc legal analyst. also with us bradley moss, an attorney. andrew weissmann, let me begin with you and where the search warrant case stands this week. wyatt donald trump when apparently to shop for a judge other than the judge who's been handling the case to try to get a special master appointed to review these documents? what will develop this week as that judge has ordered so far? >> let me turn to what to expect because i think tomorrow could be a big day. we know from attorney general merrick garland that he has said that the department of justice has as its policy is going to speak through its filings. even in his press conference, we got very little information and we basically last friday, everyone in the press and the public that's following along were waiting for the redacted affidavit to be unsealed. tom

leading off our discussion tonight, andrew weizmann former fbi general counsel and former chief of thecriminal division of the eastern district of new york. he's a professor practice at nyu law school, and msnbc legal analyst bradley moss, national security attorney. andrew weissmann, i think you know that i just delivered all of the news in the new york times reporting tonight and as short a form as possible. that is the compressed version. that's how packed this is. what is your reading of this breaking news tonight? >> you know, i started by reading the filing, i was gonna say the press release, but it's actually a legal filing that donald trump made in florida today, and i thought that was going to be the lead story because it's such a crazy document in so many ways, it's incriminating of the former president. but it really does fit with the new york times story and as you and as rachel pointed out, the critical thing here is that you are looking for something that a punitive defendant did himself or herself. so the story about donald trump personally looking at things is exactly w

legal analyst pounced on that news, including senior prosecutor andrew weizmann who tweeted the rulingfor concern and maybe a harbinger of her placating or worse, merit-less trump request an acting precipitously without solid legal grounding. of course, none of us can prove she's doing this for trump's benefit. there's no evidence for that. people are speculating. there is a perception of bias. and that is the point. that is the problem. i would listen ember of times trump was openly demanded that his judicial appointments judges way. but the show is only an hour-long. look, judges in this country are kind of tainted. not just by being politically acquainted -- appointed, but in many cases by having to run elections. having to appeal to voters and not just the law politico is reporting 30 states or will hold state supreme court elections this year. and will be restricting abortions to -- leave it to the gop, say the quiet part out loud, quote, we are approaching these were racist or the mindset of how state supreme court will affect the re--- process for the next decade. that is not ho

i wanna bring in andrew weizmann to discuss, former fbi general counsel, and former senior member of now a law professor at nyu. andrew, i can tell you that since this news, broke my twitter feed is a flutter with people saying, we need weisman. so i'm just gonna sit back, give you the mic. walk us through what your takeaways are tonight. >> good evening, and good good morning. so a quick read of this, on the boring side but it's important for the judges, they really get the law, it's dead on as to why executive privilege didn't work, why there is no special master needed for the handful of attorney-client documents. all of that is sort of less important, i think, in terms of big picture. let's just turn to the key here, which is that the department got approval from the d. c. chief judge barrel howl, to reveal some grand jury information, and they do. they also go ahead and -- >> i don't know what that means. >> so, good to interrupt me. grand jury material is protected by a rule, that the government is not usually allowed to share grand jury material. for instance, a grand jury sub

counsel to the fbi andrew weizmann spent years was recently he served as a and the department of justice lead prosecutor robert mueller for working as an assistant u. s.'s special counsel investigation attorney to leading the fbi's into russia and the trump campaign investigation into amazon is also the author of where law ends and serving as general counsel inside the mueller investigation and he joins me now andrew to the fbi. apparently the only question that trump answer today most recently his serve as a was his name what are the implications of him taking the fifth since this lead prosecutor in robert is a civil case cannot then be used against him jordan the mueller's special counsel first thing i want to say is i think investigation into russia and it's really deplorable the trump campaign. for anyone in the government and certainly he is also the author of where a president to be that decrying and law and, inside the mueller denigrating the assertion of investigation, and he joins me the constitutional rights now. of everybody has a right to search the andrew, apparently the onl

counter and director of camera and villages, season eminence and we see intelligence analyst, also andrew weizmann, fbi general counsel and former chief of the criminal division of the eastern district of new york. is a professor of the new york why law school. and now an msnbc legal analyst. andrew weissmann, as a former federal prosecutor let me begin with you. i want to begin with the kevin mccarthy statement. if you are in the justice department and in the attorney general's inner circle, what would you be saying to the attorney general tonight after reading kevin mccarthy statement which i will read now read and fall in which kevin mccarthy says -- i've seen enough. the department of justice is reaching a tolerable state of weaponized politicized and. when republicans take back the house, we will conduct immediate oversight of this department, follow facts and leave no stone unturned. attorney general garland, preserving documents and clear your calendar. andrew weissmann, what would you say to the attorney general about that? >> you keep your head down and keep doing the right thing. that is

andrew weizmann spent years and the department of justice for working as an assistant u.s.ey to leading the fbi's investigation into amazon and serving as general counsel to the fbi. most recently his serve as a lead prosecutor in robert mueller's special counsel investigation into russia and the trump campaign. he is also the author of where law and, inside the mueller investigation, and he joins me now. andrew, apparently the only question that trump answer today was his name. what are the implications of his taking the fifth? since this is the civil case, can that then be used against him? >> sure. so the person i want to say is. i think it's really deplorable for anybody in the government and certainly the president to be decrying and denigrating the assertion of a constitutional right. everybody has a right to assert the fifth amendment if they believe in truthful answer which intend to incriminate them. and i don't think anyone should be vilified for that. whether it's the former president or anyone else. it's a constitutional right. and that's what it means. in a cri

andrew weizmann, former prosecutor and senior member of robert mueller's team is our guest. but tonight, we begin with the story. the man waiting in the wings. while donald trump is finding a torrent of investigations, there is one person who has been ready to take the mic, should the former president go bankrupt, be caught in jail, or fall into a classified box. that man is florida republican governor ron desantis. the first term governor has catapulted to celebrity status among republicans thanks to his abrasive style and his relentless desire to weigh into the culture wars on behalf of the far-right. with his sights clearly set on 2024 run, governor desantis is now taking his show on the road. he is headlining rallies for k gop candidates all across the usa. just last week, he visited arizona to stop on behalf of the far-right election deniers running for governor and senate in that state. there, he was praised as the beast from the east, and the best governor we have in this country. gubernatorial candidate kari lake was downright giddy when saying that she had been desc

in that sense, andrew weizmann wrote the same thing in the new york times today, it's a righteous case. it's a case that at least many in society, in american society ought to be able to accept as a fair reason, to be prosecuting him because it is so brazen, so dangerous, and so completely indifferent to the national security interests, and the actual interest of people who could be killed because of this cavalier handling of national security information. >> we so we know the government recovered 184 box documents. wouldn't you think that donald trump likes to pretend to be part of the party of law and order? and i was wondering if these new revelations complicate that selling up that message? it was already pretty complicated, it seems additionally complicated in light of what we learned this week. >> alicia, i think there's a lot of republicans following silent based on what we learned. because what we know is that donald trump has engaged in a culmination of ignorance, arrogance, and malfeasance. we know that, the malfeasance's possession itself. but i think we could be in an envir

andrew weizmann, former prosecutor and senior member of robert mueller's team is our guest.

andrew weizmann, i think, among others, has come to this conclusion. and we should be watching that very carefully because donald, certainly has exposure about his corrupt actions and not paying taxes, and lying on insurance applications and loan applications. and of course, famously for decades, refusing to pay people he owed money to. >>, david, good to see you as always. thank you, there's always so much information that you have the rest of us don't. we can follow you, and we can read your stuff, and we can be proportional -- >> have a good week, ali. >> thanks, buddy. david cay johnston. coming up, mitch mcconnell has concerns when it comes to the republican senate candidates. mandela barnes was working on the seat of one of trump's strongest backers in the senate, he joins me next. only two things are forever: love and liberty mutual customizing your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. if anyone objects to this marriage... (emu squawks) kevin, no! not today. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ new ast