is it arianna huffington, who says we need a whole-of-society approach, or is it susan estrich, who says kids will find a way around the safeguards? - yeah, so arianna is 100% right. we didn't know what the internet was gonna become back then. estrich's argument is logical. but, again, back then, we thought the internet was amazing, and "yeah, there's some bad neighborhoods, "and yeah, the kids need to learn, "but, you know, it's similar to the real world." what we're finding is that it's not similar to the real world. now i think it's clear that if there are no restrictions on where kids can go on the internet, other than the parents looking over their shoulder watching them all the time, then children are going to be on pornhub, they are gonna be able to buy drugs, they are gonna be able to do all sorts of things that will lead to incredible levels of suffering, death, sextortion, as we saw in those senate hearings. so, no, i think now it's clear huffington was exactly right. - you say this is a collective action problem, that we need a whole-of-society approach to work together to mak