"the times" frankly was being very cute in arthur salzburger's statement about the total compensation. apparently one has to surmise lumping in any bonus she might have gotten any stock. which of course are all dependent on what kind of year the newspaper is having. and so i know, for example, "the washington post" when manager's bonus was cut in half or didn't come at all because of lean years in the newspaper business. keller, her predecessor was in that office for a lot of lean years. so it's possible you could look at the figures and say her stock options eventually might have been worth more than his. but it's salary to salary. >> they're being too clever. >> yeah. >> when she has to go hire a lawyer, gene, i mean, she has to hire a lawyer to try to get equal pay for the position her male counterpart had. >> if you recall the way the firing was handled, you use the word brutality. and i'm afraid that's probably kind of right. last time arthur salzburger had to fire an executive editor, that was after the worst plagiarism scandal in the newspaper. one of the worst in the modern hi

it is clear arthur salzburger's statement was with the advice of a lawyer.der if we can call him pushy. that's what got jill called pushy. >> there are some who were calling her pushy before that. >> not the women in the newsroom. it turns out she was very much admired by the women in the newsroom. she would check in with them. she was open with them. she encouraged them. many report they found her to be a mentor. when mr. salzburger says, oh, they didn't like it, i would take it with an enormous grain of salt. >> the firing continues to lead to a broader discussion of gender issues. this is what maria shriver said this morning on "meet the press." does exist. it's like global warming. only a fringe few deny its existence. it particularly affects women in low income jobs, women of color, 57 cents on the dollar. it's one of the reasons 1 in 3 women in this country, working women, are on the brink of poverty. . >> we saw fast food workers protesting wages far lower than abramson's. how can attention being paid to this matter impact other working women? >> i th

arthur salzburger. >> it's not a limited thing. it's a societal problem we must confront. >> not one of the top ten newspapers around the country are run by women now. >> that's the thing. this is a systemic issue. look at the ceos of the fortune 500 companies. there's only five women who are governors in this country. it is just a systemic problem. but the issue about her pay. he can say she was let go for other reasons. but he can't explain the pay issue. i mean, from the numbers that were released, granted, it's a big salary. no question about it. but it's a systemic issue from the top to the bottom. she was earning $475,000. her predecessor was earning $559,000. she was earning $100,000 less when she was the bureau chief of the washington, d.c. office than her predecessor. what is going on, that systemically, even very high earners are earning significantly less? >> if one report is true, she hired a lawyer to make inquiries about that. and that created problems. >> yes. look, you know what i think we're actually talking about?

arthur salzburger, the more he talks, the more clear it becomes to me that, of course, she was treated differently. whatever the issues in the newsroom were, the dynamics about her departure would not have been the same for a man. >> i mean, not here to speak for the newspaper. i think jill is known as a truth teller, and i think she wa wanted -- people talk about her departure. i think she wanted it to be clear she was being fired. she didn't want the ceremonial -- >> there wasn't a single positive comment about her in her statement of departure, not thank you for your time, not thank you for a wonderful record of service to "the new york times," not a word. that is disrespect -- >> can i -- >> -- in the most public forum. >> i want to ask maria because when you and i were talking about this this weekend, i raised this as well. i have an 8-year-old daughter. fast forward to the point she's in her early 20s, the advice i might give her about getting into this business i know something about that can be pretty rough and tumble. what qualities would i want her to have? i want her to be t

this controversy has grown so much that "new york times" publisher arthur salzburger jr.as forced to output out a new statement on thursday. "i decided that jill could no longer remain as executive editor for reasons having nothing to do with pay or gender." he continues. "i heard repeatedly from her newsroom colleagues, women and men, about a series of issues, including arbitrary decision-making, a failure to consult and bring colleagues with her, inadequate communication, and the public mistreatment of colleagues." kooersin, are you persuaded? >> no, i'm not. they keep referring to that her pay package in her last year was 10% higher than her predecessor, so they're looking at the last year, and they're also saying package instead of actually talking about what's important, which is what her salary was and ken record it was substantially less than her predecessor. i also think she was complaining about a pattern of discrimination, if the reporting at the new yorker has been correct, that she was paid less in multiple jobs, including having a deputy managing editor, maki

so he went to see arthur salzburger last week and then complained about her saying she was difficult and those things all came together and formed a view that then arthur confronted jill supposedly last friday and said it's time for a change. >> it sounds like a woman went in to ask for equal pay and was fired for it. is that fair? >> i think it's broader than that. but i think it's one issue that helped tricker the larger issue. >> name any institution following up on what al hunt said earlier. in america, any politician that if they behaved in such a way wouldn't face a withering critique from "the new york times" for months. for months. any corporation, any politician. >> as i said in my blog post yesterday, "the times" always said we have a great relationship with jill, the ceo said. that's not true. if, in fact, a politician misled the public that way, it'd be page one in "the new york times." it's not page one in "the new york times." >> was there any issue with -- mr. thompson came from the bbc. is there any cultural issue coming from the bbc to "the new york times"? >> i think

so he happened to have dinner with arthur sulzberger the following wednesday, two days later, may 7. and at dinner with salzburger dean beckett did something very uncharacteristic-- he's a very gentle, thoughtful, very popular figure in the newsroom and a good journalist. but he blew up, and he told arthur it's unacceptable that this happened this way. and in fact, jill is very difficult to work with, i find. so arthur then was confronted, arthur sulzberger, with the question, this fed into that sense that this-- that jill was too difficult, and it wasn't a team that he felt comfortable with. so oned from, he asked jill to his office, and fired her. and she-- he said, "would you like to announce you're resigning to do other career activities" which is the normal. and she said, no, no, we're going to tell the truth. and she did. >> rose: don't expect me to come to the announcement, either, by the way. >> can i add one more thing, charlie, about the pay, which i think is really important. it doesn't matter whether you quibble over how many dollars difference there was in pay. and even if you assume the "times" is r