well is your relationship with arthur schlesinger junior like? mr. leuchtenburg: i first encountered him when i was on the national staff of americans for democratic action in washington. and then i was the massachusetts state director, and when -- a rocky mountain organizer for them. the first conference that was held in washington, in march 1947, i remember hubert humphrey, who is the 37-year-old young mayor of minneapolis on stage, and saying he wished his parents could see him because they would not have imagined he and eleanor roosevelt were on the same stage. afterwards, i talked to arthur schlesinger junior about a research project that, i as a graduate student was interested in, and that started a lifelong friendship. not many years later, i was appointed to the faculty at harvard, and we were colleagues together. in the years i was teaching at columbia, he was in the graduate center and the city university of new york so we saw one another. mr. brinkley: the late historian stephen ambrose once mentioned to me, we use as a test, abandon the c