joining me now, avery sheffield, welcome back.here. >> rising rates aren't going to wreck the whole story. >> they won't wreck the whole story, no. there is a reason why rates are rising. rates are rising because the economy is fine. we saw with the payroll numbers, we saw with wage growth still at 3.9% year over year. we saw the small business opt index recently. data points are coming out and suggesting the economy can withstand higher rates. >> why are we reacting this way? >> valuations are very high in many areas of the economy. and, of course, higher rates over time, high enough rates, will slow the economy. but the question is, which companies actually can do well in a higher rate environment? and have reasonable enough valuations that there is real still asymmetric opportunity to the upside. >> so, you're not naive to the fact that rates are rising. not like you think everything is going to work. there are going to be winners and losers. >> absolutely. >> where are the winners? >> yes, i think that two areas that are most