president zelenskyy is saying not for sure that bakmut has gone to russia.ing it has. why is it significant? >> propaganda, that's all that's going on here. this is the twilight point. there is nothing more to be gained. the city flattened fundamentally. it shows ukrainian resilience and russian military failure. they're trying to claim a victory that just isn't there. >> okay. so, also, a shift in the biden administration's views on f-16s. over the weekend. right? >> yep. >> at least green lighting joint training of f-16 pilots. >> yep. >> with our european allies. why is that significant? as you know, "wall street journal" editorial board critical that it's taken this long. they write, the obvious question is why this decision took 15 months zblchl yeah. a couple things. let's be clear. the f-16s are not game changing to the situation on the ground. it's not going to give air superiority to the military. there is a very long time before they're going to be impactful. i think it took that long because from a strategic perspective now, you're going to see uk

. >> the russians say they have taken bakmut. >> i think no.ut you have to transent there is nothing. they destroyed everything. there are no buildings. it's a tragedy. but for today, bakmut is only in our hearts. >> cnn's clair he is baestian joins us sebastian. he said bakmut is only in our hearts. he said it is in complete devastation. do we know is bakmut captured by the russians? >> yeah. it's really mercury. we have the ukrainian start of the story, russian side and in the mix, wagner. a lot of competing versions of events. what we know as of this morning from the russian side, russian-backed official in the region saying they started demining operations in the city, trying to make a show of some post liberation cleanup there. the wagner chief is sthag they are putting up defense lines on the western edge of the city. he is preparing to leave, he said, with his forces starting on thursday. perhaps that and other challenge to the russian ministry of defense. the infighting that we've seen in recent weeks. we've seen with the deputy ministe

please also comment on the situation in bakmut.opriate, after all, what do we observe that they had to drag some real weapons there? well, some kind of weapons from other parts of the front, uh, to the bahmut, did the russians have to do it, or can we do it objectively somehow, uh to say whether or not this did not happen. this is the first and the second. well, i have already heard such an opinion that the successful counteroffensive of ours under mahmut may be what will allow us to conduct some counteroffensive actions on a wider front . tied at first there near the bahmut a then in other places, what do you think about these two two things, well, in general, the entire war zone, and there is even such an effect, bakhmut , i call it yes, this is when a small town affects everything that happens throughout the war zone by tens of tens thousands of square kilometers , i.e. the russian occupiers, they are currently a russian command, it is not able to fully provide, for example, equipment or personnel, material and technical support

. >> when we talk about back moved -- bakmut, there are people that would suggest the city has littleic value for moscow. if it was to capture it, it would be a symbolic when. is that how you see it? >> yes, i completely agree. it will be a symbolic win. two days after they declare victory, we will havmoved on. the ukrainians will have moved on and the russians will be forgetting about it. the ukrainians have them right now at the horns of a military dilemma. the russians have got to defend a very long piece of terrain in eastern ukraine. the ukrainians are going to pick a place, the time, and launch an offense. the russians cannot be comfortable with trying to anticipate where that is going to take place. >> russia is trying, is it not, to ctrol a bigger swathe of the at at -- of the annexed region. bakhmut being one of four key areas they would like to control, therefore a significant win could help it. >> yes, it could. it is a significant win in the eyes of the beholder. to the russians, it is important. to the ukrainians, they have used bakhmut as a meatgrinder. the ukrainians ha

look at kyiv, take a look at what they have done in kherson, and what they are continuing to do in bakmute conditions they have asked for, the rate troops, they are capable of not only pushing the russians back across that 400 miles of disputed area, but they are also capable of taking crimea as well. the us federal reserve on wednesday raised interest rates to their highest level in 16 years. the fed lifted its benchmark interest—rate by a quarter—of—one percentage point, pushing its overnight interest rate range to five to 5.25%. during the press conference, chairman jerome powell signalled that they might be ready to take a pause on rate hikes. the committee will take into account the cumulative tightening of monetary policy, the lags with which monetary policy affects economic activity and inflation and economic and financial developments. we will make that determination meeting by meeting. earlier, i spoke to jason furman. he's the former chairman of the white house council of ecnomic advisors. jason, thanks forjoining us. are these rate hikes actually working to stabilise the econom

i thank him very much for joining us directly from the outskirts of bakmut.let's continue the conversation a little later, but for now . comment also on the situation in bakhmut . i think it's appropriate, but what do we observe that they had to drag some real weapons there? well, some weapons from other parts of the front . er, to hell with the russians, did they have to do it, or can we say it objectively somehow, er, or after all, no . this did not happen. this is the first and the second. well, i have already heard such an opinion that it was precisely our successful counteroffensive under mahmut can be something that will allow more on a broad front conduct counteroffensive actions. and here it is somehow interconnected. first there near bakhmut and then in other places. what do you think about these two things? it has long been influencing the combat zone. there is even such an effect . i call it bakhmut. and this is when it is small the town affects everything that happens throughout the war zone for tens of tens of thousands of square kilometers, that

yes, the total number of deaths under bakmut does not go away, you understand, because people died thereible you thought, january, one 10, then 3 months to 11. yes, and now 16. well, you can evaluate for yourself for 5 months. yes, we will average. uh, at 12.5 that's over sixty over 60,000 in 5 months. andrew is very short. yes, you know the pipe, you need to read it, of course, his statement. it is clear that they are very afraid of defeat. really. it is clear that you are asking for support yourself. how to say what is threatening. yes? in my opinion , he went there for blackmail. chaet is not something embarrassing in its own way pleases. they are literally here, and kiev was poached with a tendency, everything is poetic, as an ideology, after all, it’s more modern. poland, it is built on a specific anti-russian ethnic nationalism, such russophobia. this is the structure of the state in practice, that is , the victory of russia - it brings down this whole system not only there the issue of ukraine is bringing down this system. that's what it says about what the russians have always wo

here mark miley said that the battle for bakmut is the success of ukraine , they absolutely do not caret is important to force ukrainians to fight further. the ukrainian people remain steadfast and their spirit is unshakable. the battle of zabakhmut is just one example of this over the course of nine months. ukraine led a very successful defense, all thanks to your ukrainians and their tactical and operational skills. well , ukrainians should not be mistaken and doubt anything, because they are completely deluded. well here's one to the american the general is afraid to admit the obvious, the city, artyomovsk, which the ukrainians call bakhmut , undermined the forces of the armed forces, and they lost not only the city, but also tens of thousands of soldiers. what do you think based on your personal sources? was bakhmut worth it back in december for falsely saying that from a military point of view it makes no sense to continue to hold bakhmut, because they have already strengthened their other positions in the west, it would be quite reasonable for ukraine to retreat. and that's why, b

night , some of the commanders say that they are almost 5 km away, but they say they went through bakmutre to be found, but this suspicion is something about the flank they say, but they specifically say we walked five kilometers in buckmouth. and why is this? video no confirmation? no , he sits in some kind of dark, shelter, and something is broadcasting there. well i would i would strongly i yes, i also saw this video. i understand that he is you say, but i would strongly distrust this statement. and i'll even give you a specific example. why because, for example, by radio interception, but we had such information that for people in training centers that are now being trained on the territory of ukraine and for them instructors. and a week ago they said that now they are in bakhmut. we've only just secured the center. well, in the sense of our divisions. that's it, there they are, well, they have very strong distortions. they distort the information very much in order to prevent the loss of the final loss the final loss of morale among their units. here before the holidays. we actively

uh, 95% of bakmut is already confidently controlled. at the same time , there is some activity of the enemy on the flanks of the bank. right now he is conducting reconnaissance in force, probing our defenses, but not ours. uh, also the defense in the area of ​​​​solidarity is felt. to the north of solidar, that is, these are the northern flanks, bakhmut turns out, that's all. this suggests that, most likely, in the near future the enemy will try to undertake more serious and large-scale counteroffensives in this direction. that is, while he is only probing for forgiveness, where, where, he can try to make the enemy’s activation evident in the artyomovsk direction, and above all, this is activation on the northern and southern flanks. yes, i understand our groups. it is rather northwest north northwest and southwest. so, well, that is, where actually hmm is an attempt, as they say, to encircle our group, she is putting it mildly. well, not really, that's all. no, until the encirclement of our group. it's even close there. no, of course,

in moscow, it doesn’t work out that bakmut is almost completely liberated in a straight line , about left before entering the city , wagner fighters report this morning to russian forces. it was possible to clean up the quarter next to the educational and scientific vocational pedagogical institute to come close to the last krebron of artyomovsky, the so-called nest word at night russian fighters hit the ukrainian nest with incendiary rockets the footage on your screens is also trying to cut the road of life or death and the network of roads along which the ukrainian group is supplied. in flames , firebombs were firebombed by russian stormtroopers on friday and circulated by the ukrainian leadership. the ukrainian side claims that russia dropped highly toxic phosphorus bombs, but experts are sure that the video shows ml5 in that such bombs ignite on contact with oxygen and inflict enormous lessons. a rare pause in this long and bloody battle. but only a few hundred meters away, the russians are still waiting for the stele. still trying to encircle the city of bahmud, which is located

host: looking at horrific views in the news of disruption of the city of bock mood -- bakmut in ukrainerussians claiming that the city has fallen. what do you see at the trajectory of the future of u.s. to ukraine? guest: just like any war, i've looked at past battles and wars that we fought in the united states. it always comes down to it is going to work until we decide it is not going to work. when there's conflicts we do very well. when it is gone, we seen it with vietnam, with afghanistan. i'm very worried that over time, people lose the stomach for war. that's why it is important to bring into a rapid conclusion as fast as possible. in ukraine, i understand the budapest accord, i understand the obligation to a country to give up its arms, the third-largest nuclear power in the world and they gave them up with the understanding that the united kingdom and ostend russia would protect them. ironically, russia. understand that the universally decided to support that. and to help the alliance grow. and to watch us all stand up against a russian invasion of europe. so we are doing exact

russian mercenary wagner, which is involved in some of the heaviest fighting in the ukrainian city of bakmutally highlights the tactics russia is employing. they really do, and it depicts tangibly the awfulness of conflict. i mean, this is horrible. and again, this is going to last last for a century. you mentioned the somme. the french are still clearing unexploded ordinance out of the fields of france and belgium. it's incredible, the long—term payment that is going to go along with what russia has done in the ukraine. people are going to feel it literally for multiple generations. when you look at those images, it's pretty vulgar, isn't it, that tomorrow, they'll be celebrating victory day, a day that harks back to the second world war and the atrocities that nazi germany carried out in russia, blind to what is being carried out in ukraine. you know, it is sad. you think that the russian people... russia suffered an extraordinary number of casualties. by some counts in excess of 20 million dead, during world war ii. a great part of western russia and ukraine was literally devastated, and