all the jobs that left baltimore, you know about that, about-- bethlehem steel. all of those, that's gone now-- >> the biggest steel manufacture is gone; jobs disappear. >> jobs disappear. >> baltimore is indicative of what's happening in many urban cities across the country right now. and when you go and you dig in, and you interview these people for your project, do you still see hope for the future? >> well, you know, i don't think that i am as-- i-- i don't know if i'm so infatuated with hope. unless you mean the ability to move in spite of what looks catastrophic. if that's what you mean by hope, i'm-- i'm very-- i'm a hope-a-holic. if what you really mean is optimism, which is kind of saying, "well, looks like it'll be better--" but i don't think we can talk about hope until we really look at what-- look deeply at the problem. that's kind of like saying, "well, i think you have cancer, but let's think about when you'll be well." and i'm very excited to be in the midst of people who want to change this because even if they fail, they will have discovered som