with me, betsy mccoy. the president said this week that in the state of the union more than nine million have signed up for health insurance, private or medicaid. they were trying to take credit under obamacare. is any of it true? >> no. >> let's first say these are the know nothings. hillary knows nothing about benghazi. the president knows nothing about the irs and nancy knows nothing about the website. she doesn't want to go for it. >> she hadn't head it. >> and then the president in the state of the union speech uses these wees sell -- weasel words that 9 million recovered. in fact, they don't know and don't want to tell us how many have actually paid. now, you know when you shop on-line you don't own something until you have paid for it. you can pick out a thousand pairs of shoes, but if you don't pay for them, you don't own them. and as far as the six million on medicaid they will not tell you how many were already enrolled. so it is a trick. >> he is trying to make it sound like obamacare is really

with me, author of "beating obamacare," betsy mccoy. the number will be at least as high as before the law was enacted. how did this happen? >> we shouldn't be surprised because from the very beginning the democrats said they wanted to eliminate what they call job lock. >> what is job lock? >> they want people who are working who have health benefits to be able to quit their jobs and reduce their hours and have the taxpayer pay for their health plan instead. that's exactly what's happening here. nancy pelosi said last november, we want people to become writers and cameramen and entrepreneurs, retire early. why should they have to work to get health benefits? so, the agenda is, let's personal responsibility and more taxpayer dependence. and i say taxpayer dependence because government doesn't have money. it's coming out of your pocket and mine. >> the white house says a two-parent family on subsidized obamacare will work out better with one person working rather than two. they are creating a reliance on the government? >> more government

betsy mccoy with us, she has some disturbing obamacare headlines for us. first of all, welcome. delay new rules, new regulation will make it a crime to tell the truth? >> absolutely. issued by the u.s. treasury on monday and on page 125 it says for employers to be possible for the employer mandate, 50-99 full-time workers, sign a statement filed with the irs under penalty of perjury changes to their workforce hours cut, labor force numbers change are not the result of obamacare. so, in fact -- really. stuart: i am a midsize employer, have 7 70 employees. i have cut the number of full-time employees over the past year because of obamacare. but i can't say that. >> but you have to swear those cuts were not because of obamacare. that invites big brother in to examine your books. what was his business decision you made? were you justified in your number of employees? stuart: i can't say it, i have to lie. >> this forces you to lie. we saw during the first seven months 77% were part-time, there were stories and newspapers almost every day about employers, private sector, municipaliti