we've heard from john evers who is the former new york state assembly historian and also from beverly gage, history professor at yale university about the fdr/al smith relationship. landon he supported in 1936 and wendell willky in 1940, he supported over fdr. in fact, here is al smith on the radio talking about his support for wendell wilkin. >> i'd just like to make a little observation. i'd like to know what could be going through the mind of the 16 million men that are in the draft. i wonder if they're not saying to themselves, if this becomes serious, if it becomes necessary that we have to face an enemy, who would you soon to be behind, the third-term candidate or a wilke? in my opinion, we only hope for the people whose the election of wendell wilke who believes -- who believes in the constitution of the united states and the principles upon which it was founded. when he is chosen to guide this nation, then and then only will the stars and stripes again wave over the land of the free and the home of the brave. >> beverly gage, what's your reaction to hearing that? >> well, it's real

. >> beverly gage, what's your reaction to hearing that? >> well, it's really remarkable how quickly and how viciously al smith ends up going after the people who had once been his greatest supporters. i was trying to think if there has ever been another major party presidential candidate who, in less than a decade after he had run on his party's platform, is actually endorsing actively the candidates of the other party -- >> joe lieberman? >> joe lieberman, i guess so. he's sort of hard to read. was joe lieberman ever really a democrat? i don't know. but so going around and actually doing these endorsements in 1936, in 1940 and i think in this way that is incredibly outspoken. i mean, he makes this speech in 1936 where he's accusing the new deal and fdr themselves as i mentioned earlier of being communists, socialists. he picks up really the most vitriolic langlanguage. he calls roosevelt a tyrant and he's abusing the constitution and becomes one of the standard bearers of the liberty league which is basically a business-funded -- it's rea

beverly gage? >> one would like to be able to say yes. if al smith had been elected, none of the -- none of the depression ever would have happened. wall street would have -- i don't think that that's true. i don't think on economic issues by 1928, i mean, the 1920s turn out to be a relatively conservative decade on things like labor policy. smith himself is not running an anti-wall street campaign in 1928. and the real sort of progressive candidate had been four years earlier. that was bob la follette running in 1924 on a progressive party platform as the progressive candidate. and that had a much more sort of vocal anti-wall street sentiment. it had much more strict set of regulations and had a lot more focus on economic issues. so, unfortunately, i don't think that smith actually would have done a whole lot significantly different. and i'm not sure, to be honest, that any president was really in a position to foresee what was coming or really had the tools at that point to prevent it from happening. >> i think that -- that's kind of wh

beverly gage, when we asked you prior to the show some of the issues you thought were important to the 1928 election, one thing you mentioned was the role of the media in 128. why? >> i think particularly for al smith he had come of age as a media battler, particularly william randolph hurst was after him and after him, one of the most powerful newspaper tycoons in the country. smith i think had a certain amount of confidence by 1928 that he knew how to fend off these kind of press attacks, but ultimately in the election, one of the interesting things about the catholic issue is we now understand it to have been absolutely crucial to this election. smith openly acknowledged it. a lot of it was done and talked about through innuendo. john mentioned earlier the idea of a whispering campaign, that it wasn't something that was going to be said in the press, but at the same time the press was going to kind of feed into these images. so i think smith, from my reading of it anyway, was sort of behind from the first with the press in part because there was so much coded language being used. in

>> let's start with beverly gage. >> well, hearst is one of al smith's great critics. he's one of those towering figures at the moment. he turns into one of smith's great critics. he's sort of the man around which smith learns how to deal with the press in many ways. i know that you -- we were talking earlier. you said you had been writing about this in great detail about the milk issue and hearst's attacks on smith. >> this is a great question. i'm glad dave brought this up. william randolph hearst was probably one of the most controversial government figures or quasi government figures in new york history. he was a two-term congressman from new york city. he basically bought the seat. he went to tammany hall, says he wanted it. tried to get the nomination in 1904 for president of the united states and he lost that. he runs for governor in 1906 against charles evans hughes and loses. runs for new york city mayor and loses. but he has control of the two newspapers, "the evening journal" and "the new york american." and he turns out real -- the bases appeal to people. t

beverly gage, when we asked you prior to the show some of the issues you thought were important to the 1928 election, one thing you mentioned was the role of the media in 1928. why? >> i think particularly for al smith he had come of age as a media battler, particularly william randolph hurst was after him and after him, one of the most powerful newspaper tycoons in the country. smith i think had a certain amount of confidence by 1928 that he knew how to fend off these kind of press attacks, but ultimately in the election, one of the interesting things about the catholic issue is we now understand it to have been absolutely crucial to this election. so i think smith, from my reading of it anyway, was sort and the press had a feisty personality. we were often also quite contentious of it, and fed a public narrative that did not accord him the respect that he might have deserved. >> well, i think one of the things that is interesting about smith in the press, is he loved the press. he used to hold press conferences here in albany, and the press core got to be close to him, and he had a g

thank you very much. >> thank you, glenn, beverly gage you want to start? >> in terms of polls, you do not have the same polling mechanisms that we have today, so they were harder to gauge in the 1920s. you did not have polls that took what part of issues you cared about more, so it's tough for historians, and historians usually make grand claims. on the international aspect, it's interesting because yes there was a lot of attention paid to this. and it came in the wake of two trials as well that really raised these questions about america's national character. the first with the scopes trial in 1925 and the second, well the trial had happened earlier, but the second was the execution of sacco, and vance eddie. they were two anarchist that happened in the 1920s. so the immigration policy, and attitudes toward radicalism, all of these things were out there already by the time that smith became the candidate, so his candidacy on the world stage is another moment to ask those questions and call the questions. >> well, after the election, and he loses, he does

. >> yale history professor beverly gage, and mr. evers, thank you for being on "the contenders" and we thank everyone here for allowing us to broadcast live. we want to thank the studio audience and our cable partner up here in albany, time warner. we will leave you with a few of al smith's own words. >> i was elected to my first public office. i remained in the assembly for 12 years. then i was elected sheriff of new york county. and then i ran for office 22 times. i was elected 20 times. and defeated twice. i have worked for if county, i have worked for the city. i have worked for the state. and you will probably remember, that i tried to get a job down in washington, but something happened to me at that time. ♪ >> next sunday we continue our contender series, featuring wendell willkie, you can watch it each sunday at 8:30 a.m., threw labor day weekend. >> up next, at the organization of american historians meeting in milwaukee. new york university professor linda gordon discusses birth control in america. she argues that birth co

. >> yale university history professor beverly gage and john evers, former new york state assembly historian, thank you so much for being on "the contenders." and we also want to make sure to thank speaker sheldon silver and the people here at the new york state assembly for allowing us to broadcast live. we want to thank our studio audience and our cable partner up here in albany, time warner. we're going to leave you with a few of al smith's own words on his career and life. >> i was elected to my first public office in 1903. i remained in the assembly for 12 years. then i was elected sheriff of new york county. then i was elected president of the board of baltimore. in fact, i ran for office 22 times. i was elected 20 times and defeated twice. i worked for the county. i've worked for the city. i have worked for the state. and you will probably remember that i tried to get a job down in washington, but something happened to me at that time. ♪ ♪ >>> all summer on sundays, american history tv presents "the contenders." this 14-week series highlights key political figures who ran for presiden