and now on about books software salesman bill whiteside wrote his first book while working on a research project about a deadly world war two naval incident. and while he's still hoping that that research project will be the subject of his second book. he joined us to talk about his self-published work titled everyone knows a salesman can't write a book. though. whiteside when did you go from research and wanting to write a historical book to actually deciding you were going to write this book? it was a gradual process. when i started, i was a salesman, software salesman. i did that for 30 years and this all started as something to occupy my time and occupy my mind while i was flying or spending a lot of time on trains. i was reading about history and a lot about winston churchill in particular. and as i dug into this one story, i just became fascinated and did more research and more research and reached the point where if i wanted to share the story with other people and if i didn't write a book, i knew i would have regretted it. and then i was working on what i think of as my my real b