brandi janssen: i think some. experience working with nutrition directors has come from implementing farm to school programs and sort of thinking about fresh foods in the lunch context. what i've learned in working with food service directors is just the enormous number of constraints that they face. most food service programs are separate from the general operating budgets of the districts, these sor their own businesses, and they often have to advocate for themselves for school districts at the school board level. there are lots of firms that could take over a school district's food service program and most food service directors who manage those would prefer for that not to happen, because they would like to keep their place of employment. they're often having to prove that ... their job is not to be profitable, but they also ... as pointed out, they also can't really show a loss, so i'm sympathetic that even in a relatively small deficit that they want to sort think that's kind of what our focus is today. cert