i'm brenda butne, this is bulls and bears. gary b. smith, jonas, and john layfield along with suzie welch and david mercer. welcome to everybody. john we've spent trillions on the war on poverty. is more spending really the answer? >> no it's not. in fact we spentd almost $12 trillion on the war on poverty and guess what's happened, changed? nothing. the poverty rate has stayed basically the same. you see dropout of minorities 50% in inner cities in north america. this is just simply not working. we have evidence of decades to show this isn't working. i set up a program to work with jat risk kids in bermuda. this is my passion and what i spend most of my time on working with inner city, jat risat-risk kids. the government has proven they're going to throw money at the situation so politicians can leave and forget about it just like the ninth ward in new orleans after katrina was an absolute disaster. that's what politicians have done and that has been an abysmal failure. >> david, is there a case to be made for spending more money? >>