brighter future and. >> host: dean said with a natural the natural resource defense council the brigham mccown joins us from dallas. he is the former acting director for the united transportation advisor. mr. mccown from within the pipeline infrastructure is there in the u.s.? what's traveling through some of those pipes? >> guest: we have almost 2.5 million miles of pipeline in our country and the vast majority of that transports natural gas from production sites through will because transmission lines, which be similar to your interstate highway system all the way down to our homes and our factories. but we also transport almost all of the oil that we get in the country via pipelines to the refineries then the toilet when it is turning to other products such as gasoline, diesel fuel, jet fuel kerosene, is transported back through the pipeline network out to distribution points where a truck or some other method will take it to a storage tank or write to your gas station. it's the most efficient way of transporting a large quantum of energy products we use and that's what it is transported th

p brigham mccown.uest: well, we transport -- there are 42 gallons in a barrel. 11.3 million barrels of oil around the country each year. on average, 32,000 barrels are lost still. you know, by hiking up type line accidents and fear mongering is not going to get places. we spill more gasoline at service stations. we clean up gasoline from highway accident that we spill on a pipeline. you know, the fact is that there is a certain level of risk in everything we do. and when we leave the studio and get in our cars, there is a risk that something may happen to us. and i agree with bob, america did not get to where it is today because we didn't risk it. america got to where we are today because we had the fortitude to be bold to be brave , and not hide in our homes. again, as a regulator, it is so frustrating when i hear people say, well, i don't like real. i don't like pipeline. we have to bring debate -- the debate back to reality. it is to be good stewards to the environment. we need to move these product

peter: brigham mccown, should stand it for these railroad cars be increased?uest: well, two points. number one, i completely disagree on the keystone pipeline. the fact is, the environmental lobby, they don't like rail. they say pipelines are safer but then they don't like pipelines. we have to deal with reality and depoliticize the situation. anytime you hear these emotional talking points about dirty oil or this or that, it is all a bunch of arc and we need to move beyond it. it doesn't help our safety, and undermines our safety blocking these type of projects. number two, years ago, i called for increased take car standards. the steps we have date back to the 1960's. they need to be updated. if you look at any industry in our country, we have got to serious technological revolutions, yet rail still kind of does what they have been doing for a very long time. we can do better, but the country is -- has been focused on how to make the package more robust. we ought to be asking the question, why can't the railroads keep the cars on the tracks echo because if w