charlie belier, the former chief said i want to get rid of bad apples but i can't because my hands are tied by thllective bargaining agreement. so making those kind of changes. >> so, you woknow, i d like to take a look at the types of e gressive policing we now, even durg these protests. in los angeles the was a recent example of a woman taseve there been reports of police vehicles driving into do you think this behavior by law enforcement is going leto to policy change right away? >> well, it is sad to say, but the police are making our argument for us. they're showing that these reforms have not worked. the implicit bias training, the forts of professionalization and community polihi partne. when push comes to shove we are seeing that police are by their nature vlence workers and that when we return problems over to the mapolice to ge there is going to be violence. if we don't wa that we need to try to figure out other ways of managing our problems. >> alex, th e are stro words. we are in a time of crisis and i have spoken to many who say the police should definitely not be defunded