positions like you can't work with certain parts of china or iran, but i think a lot of the world hasecome more self-imposed in terms of what silicon valley wants to help with. the curious things about palantir is that it remains private. if not mistaken, your cofounder remains ceo of the company and set running a company like this would be difficult if it were public. do you think that is still the case? joe: i think a lot of these founders are very bright people that i learn a lot from an overestimate how hard it is to be public. a lot of people are very scared of becoming public and a lot of people who have made the transition, it's not as bad as you think. erik: do you think the time will come when palantir can go public? joe: i think so. wouldearly shareholder, i like to see it earlier and i understand why other people might want to delay it. trends inll the technology today, whether it is a big data, machine learning, ai or a taunus cars or anything else or that matter because the list goes on, what excites you the most? is how thexcites me big industries are going to change ove

. >> there are other positions like you can't work with certain parts of china or iran, but i think a of the world has become more self-imposed in terms of what silicon valley wants to help with. erik: one of the curious things about palantir is that it remains private. if not mistaken, your cofounder remains ceo of the company and said running a company like this would be difficult if it were public. do you think that is still the case? joe: i think a lot of these founders are very bright people that i learn a lot from an overestimate how hard it is to be public. a lot of people are very scared of becoming public and a lot of people who have made the transition, it's not as bad as people think. erik: do you think the time will come when palantir can go public? joe: i definitely believe so. erik: how long do you think it will take? joe: as an early shareholder, i would like to see it earlier and i understand why other people might want to delay it. erik: of all the trends in technology today, whether it is a big data, machine learning, ai or a taunus cars or anything else or that matt

. >> whether it's china or russia or iran or north korea, radical islam, all new president gets tested but all these countries are i lining up to test this new presiden. >> donald trump has been busy. keeping a rigorous schedule right now. eight more potential administration members will visit the president-elect at trump tower on monday. the transition team says they are considering many ofhe candidates for multiple positions. >>> and while trump is in the process now of assembling his administration, jill stein the green party candidate in the 2016 election wants a recount of the votes in at least three states. stein is getting the process going in wisconsin and she also wants a recount in michigan and pennsylvania. stein came in last in all three of those states losing by millions of votes but she claims she wants a recount to further democracy and the integrity of hillary clinton. some computer science experts prompted this recall effort when they claimed a hack core have influenced the outcome of the presidential election. >> we do not have a smoking gun that shows that there was

. >> whether it's china or russia, iran, north korea, radical islam, they -- all -- a new president alwayss tested but all these countries are lining up to test this new president. >> here is mr. trump's statement about the hire of k.t. mcfarland, quote i'm proud that k.t. has once again decided to serve our country and join my national security team. she has tremendous experience and innate talent that will complement the fantastic team which we are. crucial. nothing is more important than keeping our people safe. don mcgahn white house chief council. deep understanding of national law. play critical role in our administration and i'm grateful he is willing to serve our country at such a high level capacity. let's bring in our panel. lisa booth. karen mcnulty and syndicated columnist charles krauthammer. charles, comments on the picks today? >> kt as we all know is a superb choice. she goes all the way back to nixon and kissinger administration. reagan. she is very experienced. she is written. she is thought. and i they think she will be a really good balance to that team. mcgahanna i don

iran people. it is between other countries. some are closest allies. for us to pull out would then require us to start sanctioning or china or russia that were still abiding booing by the dea because from their perspective, iran had done what they're supposed to do. it becomes more difficult, i think to undo something that's working than undo something that's not working. and, when you are not responsible for it and i think when you are responsible for the deal then preventing iran from getting nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that's going to be true in other circumstances, for example, the paris agreement. there is been a lot of talks about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. you got 200 countries that have and, the good news is that what we have been able to show the last five-six or eight years it is possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it is not just a bunch of rules that we set up. you got utilities thatre in solar panels and creating jobs. you got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and are over ach

iran people. it is between other countries. some are closest allies. for us to pull out would then require us to start sanctioning or china or russia that were still abiding booing by the dea because from their perspective, iran had done what they're supposed to do. it becomes more difficult, i think to undo something that's working than undo something that's not working. and, when you are not responsible for it and you can call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for the deal then preventing iran from getting nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that's going to be true in other circumstances, for example, the paris agreement. there is been a lot of talks about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. you got 200 countries that have and, the good news is that what we have been able to show the last five-six or eight years it is possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it is not just a bunch of rules that we set up. you got in solar panels and creating jobs. you got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and are

china or russia. from their perspective, iran will do what it's supposed to do. it's difficult to undo something that is working than undo something that is not working. when you are not responsible for something, it's easy to call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for it, preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. there is talk about the possibility of undoing this agreement. you have 200 countries that signed up for this thing. the good news is that what we have been able to show over the last five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules we set up. you have got utilities that are pulting in solar panels and creating jobs and the big three who have seen record sales and are overachieving on the fuel efficiency standards we set. turns out people like not having to fill up as often and save money at the pump. eve

continue to cite -- continue to combat cyber attacks clearly, whether it is russia or china, or frankly, the country of iran, and other countries who are using cyber attacks, we have to address what they do. that means having the staffing capability within our armed services. that means making sure our armed services have the resources that they need and the technological background to do it. if someone takes a ste w address it in turn. we need to understand that unfortunately, when it comes to russia, this administration has not held russia accountable. that reset policy has been a failure. it is something secretary clinton pushed. we have not held them accountable for their invasion of ukraine, or looking at what they have done in violating the inf treaty. whether it is cyber attacks or strong in return, you are going to see them continuing to act badly. >> i have a follow-up. it is pretty much accepted that russia is trying to influence the direction of our election. you think they have been successful in doing that? sen. ayotte: i believe our top defense and intelligence officials will pursue and invest

iran but our closest allies. pull out would then require us to sart sanking those other countries in europe, china or russia, that were still abiding by the deal because from their perspective, iran has done what it supposed to do. becomes more difficult to undo something that's working than to undo something that isn't working. and when you're not responsible for it, i think you can call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for the deal preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. there has been a lot of talk about the possibility of undoing this international combreement. there are 200 countries that signed up for this thing. and the good news is that what we have been able to show over eight years , six, is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules we have set up, you've got utilities that are putting in solar panels and creating jobs. you got the big three auto makers who have seen rec

do you think iran is not putting iran's interest first or china not putting china's interest first.or the globalist to criticize the united states people who are rebelling against globalism or the elites saying they should always think we're right, always be advocates of globalism because globalism is so great with everybody. i think it's interesting that gutteres admits they have a problem and may have gotten worse. lou: the globalist elites trying to deny the middle class of this country, for example are being absolutely savaged by the policies loosely the rubric of globalization and resulted in their losses of jobs, their earning power. importantly their loss of purchasing power upon which this country's prosperity depends. now germany and china depend on our largesse, if you will, in a global economic system in which we support them, we-run deficits, as donald trump pointed out throughout the entire campaign. we cannot continue that madness and it's creating huge, huge fissures in the prospects for the return of prosperity. let me turn to two geopolitical threats that are extant

china or isis or whatever. there is some thought in the trump camp on cuba, iran, other areas -- go big early, shake the world up: there is no good reason, from the standpoint of a free-market republican or a liberal democrat, to go back and undo what has been done with respect to normalizing relations with cuba. we took a long time to get there. this is not an obama left wing thing. countless people, countless business people, fortune 500 ceos, wall street future will and free-market economists have argued that it is the best way to help the cuban people, to normalize the economy. mark: not the base of the republican party. john: let's try to rule on the merits. mark: that's my say, he is leaving his options open. be right back to talk about to reporters with donald trump's transition and the aide everyone is profiling, steve bannon. right after this. ♪ ♪ mark: welcome back. joining us from capitol hill, nbc news correspondent kelly o'donnell who is tracking every bit of the transition. we are talking about for five names of secretary of state, one of them is bob corker, who was considered for vice president ru

it mean for there are things iran could do a response to that, that span variety of scenarios, including split us, playe, us against europe, or cut ideals russia and china so it's not as easy as with a stroke of a dead,e iran deal is iran's nuclear program starts again. i think that's true of a lot of has saids that trump about foreign policy on the campaign trail. implementation, they're more complicated than he said they were and we don't know he'll followthrough on and if he tries, whether he'll be able to and how it will play out. we've almost never seen ambiguity like this on foreign policy. pete: things happen that he'll have to respond to. i'm wondering about syria. he have to make big decisions about what we'll do there? michael: sure, but that's an example about american engagement around the world. beingot interested in us a party in the syrian civil war. he does not share the obama weinistration's view that need a change of regime in vera. syria. he will probably stop our program of arming syrian rebel fighters. do is knock out isis and he says he'll partner with russia to do it but i think we'll bethat increasingly engaged in a covert trying

pull out would then require us to countries in europe or china or russia that were still abiding by the deal because from their perspective iran had done what it was supposed to do. so it becomes more difficult, i think, to undo something that's working than undo something that isn't working and when you're not responsible for it i think you can call i when you are responsible for the deal and preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon you are more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. there has been a lot of talk about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. thing and the good news is that what we've been able to show over the last five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules that we've set up. you've putting in solar panels and creating jobs, you've got the big three auto makers who have seen record sales and are overachieving on the fuel efficiency standards that we've set. turns out that people like not having to fil

iran people. it is between other countries. some are closest allies. for us to pull out would then require us to start sanctioning or china or russia that were still abiding ing by the deal because from their perspective, iran had done what they're supposed to do. it becomes more difficult, i think to undo something that's working than undo something that's not working. and, when you are not responsible for it and i thi you can call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for the deal then preventing iran from getting nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that's going to be true in other circumstances, for example, the paris agreement. there is been a lot of talks about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. you got 200 countries that have and, the good news is that what we have been able to show the last five-six or eight years it is possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it is not just a bunch of rules that we set up. you got in solar panels and creating jobs. you got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and

so whether it is the nationstate challenges posed by the likes of russia, china, north korea, and iran or transnational concerns like counterterrorism, like proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, which is personally a growing concern for me. the challenges posed in the cyber dimension. we have to, and our approach has been to try to maintain a balance so that we can protect and to address the full range of threats. so i am hesitant to try to pick one and say -- this is the one that is going to confront us or say this will be the worst in the next 5-10 years. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i am pleased to hear that things are better at centcom. i served on that investigation and clearly we have concerns about what went on in 2050. -- in 2015. i know that has been addressed to some degree. what are the root causes in your opinion of the unacceptable command climate that was existing at centcom at the time? >> this is something that secretary carter and i have discussed. we want to know what happened and why it happened. we have been looking to director clapper and the unde

they want a reference point and don't want it to be russia, iran or china. want america back as the reference point. donald trump is going to make america that international load stone of the system that has to be rebalanced. remember, we have 65 million refugees in the world today. a record that is in part the result of the disastrous obama foreign policy, that's going to change now, trish. trish: a lot can change. we've been talking all about it. dr. gorka, thank you so much. we're going to take a quick break. we're continuing to watch these protests unfolding across the country all in major metropolitan areas on the coast except for chicago. except for chicago. it's obama's territory there. whythen get worse?nks taste chalky? introducing protein shots from 5-hour energy. protein shots from 5-hour energy are smooth and tasty, and still deliver 21 grams of protein with 100 calories. they're great for workouts, no matter how you work out... whether you're going for reps... or laps... or distance. you gotta try it... period. protein shots from 5-hour energy.

they want a reference point and don't want it to be russia, iran or china.hey want america back as the reference point. donald trump is going to make america that international load stone of the system that has to be rebalanced. remember, we have 65 million refugees in the world today. a record that is in part the result of the disastrous obama foreign policy, that's going to change now, trish. trish: a lot can change. we've been talking all about it. dr. gorka, thank you so much. we're going to take a quick break. we're continuing to watch these protests unfolding across the country all in major metropolitan areas on the coast except for chicago. it's obama's territory there. we'll be right back after this. i'd like to send 50 pizzas to france. oh hey! i'm just keeping the seat warm. but not for the president. for you! you can be president of whatever you want. like president of your own salon... i look good. or your kid's little league team...foul ball! or president of whatever this is! get the domains, websites, and 24/7 personal support to be awesome onl

china or tested by isis or whatever. there's some thought within the trump camp of, on cuba, on iran, maybe some other areas, go big early shake the world up. >> there is no good reason, from the standpoint of a free market republican or from the standpoint of a liberal democrat to go back and undo what has been done with respect to normalizing relations with cuba. we took a long time to get there. it's not a obama left-wing there. countless business people, fortune 500 ceos, wall street people and free market economists have been arguing for it as the best way to help the cuban people, to normalize or liberalize the economy -- >> but the republican base don't agree with you. >> i understand that, but donald trump is supposed to be the businessman president. let's try to rule on the merits. >> that's why he's leaving his option open. >> let's rule on the merits and stick wit. we'll be right back to talk with two reporters about donald trump's transition and the aide that everyone is currently profiling, that would be steve bannon, right after this. ♪ ♪ i want a hippopotamus for christmas ♪ ♪ only a hippopotamus will do a

china or isis, whatever. there is some thought in the trump camp on cuba, iran, other areas -- go big early, shake the world up: there is no good reason from the standpoint of a free-market republican or a liberal democrat, to go back and undo what has been done with respect to normalizing relations with cuba. we took a long time to get there. this is not an obama left wing thing. countless people, countless business people, fortune 500 ceo's, was three people, free market economists have been arguing for it as the best way to normalize the economy -- mark: not the base of the republican party. i agree with you. [bell rings] on theet's try to rule merits. i want to say rule on the merits. we will be right back to talk with two reporters on donald trump's transition and the aide everyone is profiling, steve bannon. right after this. ♪ ♪ welcome back. joining us from capitol hill, abc news correspondent kelly o'donnell, those tracking the transition. we're talking four or five numbers -- names for several state. one of them, bob corker, who was considered for the running mate for a time. why is he on a list with

or two of four countries. you are talking about china, russia, iran and north korea. i have grave concerns in terms of the readiness of our forces to deal with that in a timely manner. >> weapons uncovered. >> what do you make of iran's challenges to our ships in the persian gulf, the russian buzzing of our vessels, the buildup in the south china sea? it seems like these are provocative actions. sg >> the iranian buzzing and the small boats, the russian low y flyover and things, unprofessional. two. unsafe. we hope we can deconflict. it's not going to keep us from doing everything we need to do to fulfill our mission. >> former democrat governor of mississippi has been secretary of the navy since 2009. >> the rise of russia, the rise of china and particularly in the south china sea, isis, things that you don't, can't know what's going to happen. >> he notes the navy has been ramping up ship building. another sign of increased military response, since 2014, the obama administration has been returning troops to iraq. officially in advisory and support roles. how many mo

so whether it is the nationstate challenges posed by the likes of russia, china, north korea, and iran or transnational concerns like counterterrorism, like proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, which is personally a growing concern for me. the challenges posed in the cyber dimension. we have to, and our approach has been to try to maintain a balance so that we can protect and to address the full range of threats. so i am hesitant to try to pick one and say -- this is the one that is going to confront us or say this will be the worst in the next 5-10 years. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i am pleased to hear that things are better at centcom. i served on that investigation and clearly we have concerns about what went on in 2050. -- born in 2015. i know that has been addressed to some degree. what are the root causes in your opinion of the unacceptable command climate that was existing at centcom at the time? >> this is something that secretary carter and i have discussed. we want to know what happened and why it happened. we have been looking to director clapper and the

pull out would then require us to countries in europe or china or russia that were still abiding by the deal because from their perspective iran had done what it was supposed to do. so it becomes more difficult, i think, to undo something that's working than undo something that isn't working and when you're not responsible for it i think you n when you are responsible for the deal and preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon you are more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. there has been a lot of talk about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. thing and the good news is that what we've been able to show over the last five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules that we've set up. you've putting in solar panels and creating jobs, you've got the big three auto makers who have seen record sales and are overachieving on the fuel efficiency standards that we've set. turns out that people like not having to fill up as o

or two of four countries. you are talking about china, russia, iran and north korea. i have grave concerns in terms of the readiness of our forces to deal with that in a timely manner. >> weapons uncovered. >> what do you make of iran's challenges to our ships in the persian gulf, the russian buzzing of our vessels, the buildup in the south china sea? it seems like these are provocative actions. sg >> the iranian buzzing and the small boats, the russian low y flyover and things, unprofessional. two. unsafe. we hope we can deconflict. it's not going to keep us from doing everything we need to do to fulfill our mission. >> former democrat governor of mississippi has been secretary of the navy since 2009. >> the rise of russia, the rise of china and particularly in the south china sea, isis, things that you don't, can't know what's going to happen. >> he notes the navy has been ramping up ship building. another sign of increased military response, since 2014, the obama administration has been returning troops to iraq. officially in advisory and support roles. how many mo

require us to start sanctioning those other countries in europe, or china or russia still abiding by the deal, because from their perspective, iran had done what it was supposed to do. so it becomes more difficult i think to undo something that is working than undo something that isn't working. when you're not responsible for it, call it a terrible deal and when you are responsible for the deal, then preventing iran from getting nuclear weapons, you're more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances, for example, the, there has been a lot of talk about possibility of undoing this international agreement. you have 200 countries that signed up to this thing and, the good news is. the good news what we've been able to show over the last five, six, eight years. that it is possible to grow the economy really fast and, possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it is not just a bunch of rules that we set up. you've got utilities that are putting in solar panels and creating jobs. you have got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and are overachieving on the fuel efficiency standard

start sanctioning those other countries in europe, china or russia that were still abiding by the deal, because from their perspecti perspective, iran had done what it was supposed to do. it becomes more difficult, i think, to undo something that's working than undo. when you're not responsible for it, i think call it a terrible deal, and you are then responsible for the deal and preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon, you are more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. there's been a lot of talk about possibly trying to undo this agreement. now, you've got 230 countries who signed up for this thing. the good news is that what we've been able to show over the last -- five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the sme and really keep it that day. >>. you've got utilities that are put in solar panels and creating more jobs. you have the record sales and are overachieving on the fuel efficiency standards that we set. turns out that people many. you've got straits like lindsay lohan tlal. a clean nrs agenda, separate and apart from any federal regu

china, russia, north korea, iran. we're deal with multinational information for sale to the highest bidder. hackers are motivated by different things whether political, financial or harassment. we still consider the cyber terrorist perspective. arenow that terrorists highly proficient at using the internet for recruiting, propaganda and executing attacks. we know they aspired to gain access to our systems. we know is they are not there yet or we do not think they are there but it is a concern. how do these groups operated? increasingly complex attacks combining multiple techniques and insight knowledge. using social generic to target us and develop human vectors to get into your system. they are using social media to target employees. i would be remiss if i did not mention the insider threat. not just limited to hackers on the outside but insider threat is a significant problem, disgruntled employees, employees who are targeted and employees willing to sell to the highest bidder. what are they after? pretty much anything and everything from information first active. access, economic, political or ideological. today, where not so much concerned about the loss of d

so whether it is the nationstate challenges posed by the likes of russia, china, north korea, and iran or transnational concerns like counterterrorism, like proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, which is personally a growing concern for me. the challenges posed in the cyber dimension. we have to, and our approach has been to try to maintain a balance so that we can protect and to address the full range of threats. so i am hesitant to try to pick one and say -- this is the one that is going to confront us or say this will be the worst in the next 5-10 years. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i am pleased to hear that things are better at centcom. i served on that investigation and clearly we have concerns about what went on in 2050. -- born in 2015. i know that has been addressed to some degree. what are the root causes in your opinion of the unacceptable command climate that was existing at centcom at the time? >> this is something that secretary carter and i have discussed. we want to know what happened and why it happened. we have been looking to director clapper and the

us to start sanctioning those other countries in europe or china or russia that were still abiding by the deal because from their perspective iran had done what it was supposed to do. so it becomes more difficult i think to undo something that's working than undo something that isn't working. and when you're not responsible for it, i think you can call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for the deal preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon you're more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the the paris agreement. there's been a lot of talk about the possibility of undoing this international agreement. now, you got 200 countries that have signed up for this thing and the good news is that what we've been able to show over the last five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules that we've set up. you've got utilities that are putting in solar panels and creating jobs. you've got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and are overachieving

to start sanctioning those other countries, in europe or china or russia, that were still abiding by the deal because from their perspective iran had done what it was supposed to do. so it becomes more difficult, i think, to undo something that's working than undo something that isn't working. and when you're not responsible for it, i think you can call it a terrible deal. when you are responsible for the deal, then preventing iran from getting a nuclear weapon, you're more likely to look at the facts. that is going to be true in other circumstances. for example, the paris agreement. i think there's been a lot of talk about the possibility of undoing thisnternational agreement. now, you've got 200 countries that have signed up for this thing. and the good news is that what we've been able to show over the last five, six, eight years is that it's possible to grow the economy really fast and possible to bring down carbon emissions as well. it's not just a bunch of rules that we've set up. you've got utilities that are putting in solar panels and creating jobs. you've got the big three automakers who have seen record sales and are

china should be, how he would change relationships with russia. he talked about what he thinks should be done on cancelling the iran deal, that it can be cancelled by this president or renegotiated. it was stunning to people, democrats as well as republicans that his entire speech was devoted for all intensive purposes to showing his chops, very detailed, specifics, numbers, the defense budget. he was clearly showing his grasp of what i'm sure donald trump is very impressed with, his ability to be secretary of state. he made it clear that is the job he wants. he said he does not want to be attorney. others are suggesting hutcheson for attorney general. >> the names are starting to come out for different jobs. i heard reef for education. i heard the trump team reached out to bernanke but want everyone to know they are serious about treasury. let's turn to the trump children who have been intrinsic really important part of his fairly small, by comparison, inner circle. the question went out could we get them top secret clearance? they have all said publicly as recently as last night they will stay behind in new york to run the family business. it would be conflict wit

we need a secretary of state who can renegotiate an iran deal or who can step up and be a strong voice is china gets we need somebody who is the most qualified person for the job. he can defy the media's portrayal of him putting people in positions. >> do you see that happening? >> i agree with dan. i think we don't know yet. whoever wins out between mitt romney and rudy giuliani will tell us a lot about the direction this administration is going to go. but i think it's too soon to tell. he has not named that much staff so far. i covered president obama's transition and at this point, things were much further along, you had a much clearer vision and the rollout was clear in that you understood where the president-elect wanted to go in terms of policies and the vision that he had for his presidency. we just have not seen that yet. >> and dan, i want to talk about relations with the press. which have been testy sometimes. what will it donald trump at the white house? >> i think it will be a huge challenge. a bigger challenge than we have ever had, certainly in my lifetime in dealing with somebody

china and iran have had a pretty nice ride. they have gotten whatever they wanted and there has been no consequence or penalties.e putting a shot across the bow saying we expect this to continue. the second thing we talked about, the russians' phone call. they didn't put a shot across the bow. >> china is more dependent on u.s. consumers than russia is. they want to be kind to their best customer and don't want to discourage consumers. hough you have got to be careful with your banker. they are not our banker anymore. they have been unloading our stuff for a long time now. the fact is we have an immense investment in china that we can sacrifice and replace rather quickly. i know apple doesn't like to hear this, but rather quickly. >> they hold less than 10% of all treasury debt outstanding. lou: the real issue is national security. when we decoupled human rights from national security interests 5 years ago with china, in particular, that was one of the dumbest things we could have done. there is a transfer of wealth and a knowledge-based china from which we are still trying to recover. >> when he talks about a p