possible that -- what i do think christopher clark goes too far. he argued in his extremely well-written book last year that, arm, serbia was effectively a rogue state and arizona that the russians were come miss sit in the assassination -- complicit in the assassination plot. >> you in your -- [inaudible] >> the fir draft of my book, i would show it to the british historian i regard as the most distinguished living historian. he said when he read the first draft of the book, he said you're not writing book reviews of everyone else's book and persuaded me i cut out all direct reverends to chris clark or the rest of them because in the end, all one can do it offer one0s own take. the sort-thing that makes things difficult for historians is that, for instance, we know that whereas in 19 45, after the allied victory, there were the allies in berlin, or -- and the americans were able to ship off to washington. most of the german archives. by contrast, 1918, the germans were still running things in berlin and soon as the question of war became an issue,

[laughter] so darlene clark hine, i should mention, is a past president of the organization of american historians. the next speaker that i want to mention is christophered. christopher reed also earned his ph.d. from kent state. he is the author, again, of a series of books, three of which i will mention; the chicago naacp and the rise of black professional leadership, black chicago's first century, metro history students have kind of dog eared a number of copies here because if you want to write about early black chicago history, black chicago history of the 19th century, you have to start with this book. and it will lead you to all the original sources beyond it. so a wonderful book. and then the rise of chicago's black me metropolis which i bele is dr. reed's most recent book, although it's hard to keep up. "the rise of chicago's black metropolis" traces the period of the 1920s and leads us to the birth of the chicago black renaissance. he claims to have retired in 2009, but i suspect that, like me, chris reed -- chris reed's retirement is more alleged than actual. [laughter] and then finally, final hi, the youngest of the people on this panel, and