director clapper. >> thank you, mr. vice chairman. and ctc probably said it best recently that while the ideological center of al qaeda movement i think still remains in the thought fata, the operational planning has dispersed. there are some five different franchises at least in 12 countries that this movement has morphed into a greasy chapters of it of course and emm, somali, syria, et cetera. many of these movements, while essentially locally focused, probably the most -- still the most prominent one that has an external focus on the homeland remains a qa p.e., i think was looking to need to view as the one that has the most -- poses the most immediate threat for potential attack on the homeland. the probability of attack now compared to 2001 at least for me is the very heart question to answer because principally because the very dispersion and diffusion of the threat, whereas we are very, very focused initially, particularly at nighttime. on al qaeda, al qaeda core, now we are facing a much more dispersed threat. what we spoke ab

well mr clapper is warning that syrian militant groups tied to al qaeda such as the al nasra front is aspiring to attack the united states he told the senate intelligence committee on wednesday that extremist groups in syria are conducting training camps to train people to go back to their countries and conduct more terrorist acts clapper says that some twenty six thousand rebel fighters battling the government of bashar al assad in syria are extremists and he also estimates that seven thousand of them are from fifty different countries including europe you know with all due respect to mr clapper this is not a huge revelation we've been reporting for months about how an influx of extremist groups in syria has turned the war torn country into a terrorist training center now the u.s. is currently feed in quite a conundrum because the al qaeda members fighting with the rebels may pose a greater threat to american interests than the syrian president washington wants removed from new york thank you very much indeed for that let's cross over to our studios in washington and brought back and

court and absolutely you know you may remember this exchange between senator ron wyden and james clapper who is the director of national intelligence take a look. does the n.s.a. collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of americans. no sir. it does not. not wittingly or. now since then activists and even legislators have been calling for action some type of action against james clapper for saying that they say that he blatantly lied to congress and the d.n.i. his lawyer actually shot back against the new york times for that saying that he blatantly lied to congress they said quote indeed it would have been irrational for mr clapper to lie at this hearing since every member of the committee was already aware of the program as mr clapper has explained he was surprised by the question and focused his mind on the collection of the content of americans communications in that context his answer was is accurate when we pointed out mr clapper is a mistake to him he was surprised and distressed what do you make of that surprised and distress this is hard to know becaus

to lie at this hearing since every member of the committee was already aware of the program as mr clapper has explained he was surprised by the question and focused his mind on the collection of the content of americans communications in that context his answer was is accurate when we pointed out mr clapper is a mistake to him he was surprised and distressed what do you make of that surprised and distressed state so this is hard to know because you sort of have different narratives coming from center wides office on the one hand and from which office the lawyer for the d.n.i. on the other hand so they both agree with with the basics which is that senator wyden office had presented the question advance and then in questioning mr clapper basically seemed to misrepresent the collection that was going on senator wyden said he got the question vance he had a he had an opportunity considerate to answer it correctly or at least to say he couldn't answer it in an unclassified setting and then when the mistake was pointed out to him he didn't take any opportunity to correct it by what on the other

i also don't assign bad motives to james clapper but he did break the law and he has exposed himself to five years in prison for perjury. so you can't have it both ways. you can't say we're going to throw the book at snowden and going to ignore perjury to congress by james clapper. i think they both, if you want to apply the law, it has to be applied equally. >> about what your colleagues, the chairs of the intelligence committees, namely mike rogers

i don't think james clapper is a bad person. i think he's a patriotic person who wants to stop terrorism. i don't think he was a bad person. by lying to congress he made us doubt and believe maybe the

senator ron wyden and director of national intelligence james clapper. >> what i wanted to see is if you could give me a yes-or-no answer to the question does the nsa collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of americans? >> no, sir. >> it does not? >> not wittingly. there are cases where they could -- >> again, when the facts finally came to light, we learned that statement by director clapper was not true, it was false. this time, with the latest allegation, we're still waiting for facts.

this for you richard rand paul says that the director of national intelligence james clapper should be prosecuted for lying to congress about the n.s.a. surveillance program what do you think it was that i think that there is some issues that. as a democrat i think there is some issues with james clapper not telling the complete whole entire truth to under oath to the united states congress our representatives and should be something done about that whether it's prosecution i'm not sure i'm not a lawyer i can't speak to that but i definitely think that there somebody has to answer

the director of national intelligence james clapper appeared before the senate yesterday. what snowden has stolen and exposed has gone way way beyond his professed concerns. as a result, we have lost foreign sources including some shared with us by valued partners. >> in blistering testimony, he told the committee the snowden leaks pose a greater threat to national security than terrorists. it is evidence to me that most of the documents stolen by mr. snowden have nothing to do with the privatesy rights and civil liberties of american citizens. or even the nsa collection program. it is hard to verify the claims but it is clear the view from the intelligence agencies and the administration they serve, is that snowden harmed the country. the former contractor reportedly took nearly 2 million documents from the agency, it is the largest theft of classified information in u.s. history. since last summer, details of one program after another have surfaced by journalists snowden has given documents. only a fraction of what he has is believed disclosed. so the director of nationa

should james clapper be prosecuted? you just said the rule of law -- >> let me make my point, okay?st answer that question. answer that question. >> i don't need to answer that question because then we will get involved in a whole conversation about what the exact elements of perjury are. >> it's a total double standard. >> let's talk about edward snowden instead of calling people names and making accusations. the fact is that look at the ellsburg example. he wrote a very interesting column in the "washington post" saying that he agreed with snowden that snowden should have fled but what did he do? he came forward, he said he thought it was his responsibility as an american citizen, after actually he tried to get his information to the senate and have the senate reveal the information. when that whistleblowing didn't work, he took it to reporters, and so that's one big difference. the second big difference is he stuck around, came forward, said fine, go ahead and prosecute me. the prosecution failed because his rights had been violated but the system worked for him. edward snowden d

james clapper the director of u.s. national intelligence has issued a blistering condemnation of edward snowden calling his leaks to the press a perfect storm that would endanger american lives later today at the mosque and breaking the set pulls that issue apart. shortly after perjuring himself about how the u.s. government is not only spying on every american citizen national intelligence director james clapper appeared before a senate judiciary hearing to blow some more hot air according the transcript clapper called on snowden in his quote accomplices to return the remaining stolen documents pertaining to the n.s.a.'s global spying apparatus yes aside from painting snowden as a criminal clapper also seems to believe that the dozens of journalists who have simply reported on the league documents as his criminal accomplices proper stands on journalist simply doing their jobs sends a chilling message one echoed by the british parliament recently when it accused guardian journalists of aiding terrorists but equating jo

now the timing of these comments are quite interesting you have to understand them in context mr clapper is making these allegations as damascus has been successfully complying with the russia u.s. brokered deal to remove and destroy its arsenal of chemical weapons the agreement was brokered as a way to avert u.s. missile strikes that president obama was threatening in september to carry out now it looks as though the u.s. administration may have a new reason to revisit their military playbook mr clapper is warning that syrian militant groups tied to al qaeda such as the al nusra front is aspiring to attack the united states he told the senate intelligence committee on wednesday that extremist groups in syria are conducting training camps to train people to go back to their countries and conduct more terrorist acts clapper says that some twenty six thousand rebel fighters battling the government of bashar al assad in syria are extremists and he also estimates that seven thousand of them are from fifty different countries including europe we've been reporting for months about how an influ

so clapper is actually understating the seriousness, in my opinion. perhaps not as capable as the 9/11 attack here. but remember, they are in control where the radicals live. the attack on us was part of a broader strategy. >> when the president was talking about jv, he talked about whether or not there would be an attack on the homeland by the splinter groups. and clapper was talking about that, the homeland security, and said we couldn't tell if we were any safer now. do you believe right now -- you know, forget what either of these guys say. what do you believe in terms of the likelihood of the attack on the homeland today? >> well, i think it is higher than it was in several years because the accumulated mass of al-qaeda has been growing. but i think if anything they are now more concentrated on the region where they live. and they are succeeding in breaking states apart. libya, syria, yemen, somalia, that gives every prospect for base camps when we leave that will be a greater threat to us in the future. >>> on another page, the subject of iran,

the answer to the clapper question is, absolutely.ors believe that they can make a case under the perjury statute, which i know you know as well as i do, glen, which is a very difficult case to make that shows a knowing and material misrepresentation, fine, get. i don't ha many to think the federal law will get you where you want to go, but i take backseat to nobody in saying that i thought clapper's testimony was false and that he should be ashamed of it and it's totally intolerable. >>> second tear of state john kerry is on a peace mission in the middle east right now. he landed in israel today, ready to propose a framework between the israelis and palestinians. nic robertson joins us live from jerusalem. nic, what can you tell us? >> reporter: this is five months into what is supposed to be a nine-month process. he's here to ramp that process up. he had a two-hour meeting earlier today with benjamin netanyahu, before that a few comments both of them. not seem been to be in a conciliatory mood, instead made some very pointed comment

government is not only spying on every american citizen national intelligence director james clapper appeared before a senate judiciary hearing to blow some more hot air according to transcript clapper called on snowden in his quote accomplices to return the remaining stolen documents pertaining to the n.s.a.'s global spying apparatus yes aside from painting snowden as a criminal clapper also seems to believe that the dozens of journalists who have simply reported on the league documents as his criminal accomplices clapper stands on journalist simply doing their jobs sends a chilling message one echoed by the british parliament recently when it accused guardian journalists of aiding terrorists but quitting journalism with terrorism seems like a trend that's becoming more commonplace among government officials on the plus side it seems like a desperate attempt by the intelligence community to stay ahead of the mounting uproar against the ever more invasive and pervasive surveillance state which means us troublemaking journalists must be doing something right now let's break the set .

to launch biological weapons now speaking to the senate intelligence committee james clapper said that america's spy agencies believe that some elements of syria's biological warfare program might have advanced beyond the research and development stage and might be capable of limited production now the timing of these comments are quite interesting you have to understand them in context mr clapper is making these allegations as damascus has been successfully complying with the russia u.s. brokered deal to remove and destroy its arsenal of chemical weapons to agreement was brokered as a way to avert u.s. missile strikes that president obama was threatening in september to carry out now it looks as though the u.s. administration may have a new reason to revisit their military playbook mr clapper is warning that syrian militant groups tied to al qaeda such as the al nusra front is aspiring to attack the united states he told the senate intelligence committee on wednesday that extremist groups in syria are conducting church camps to train people to go back to their countries and conduct mo

clapper said al-qaeda is no less of a threat today than in 9/11. we'll have michael kay former adriser to the uk ministry of the defense and great to have you both here. >> james clapper went way off message, al-qaeda is just as big of a threat before it was on 9/11. and let me remind you what the president said on the campaign trail about al-qaeda. >> i said we refocus on the people who actually attack us on 9/11. and al-qaeda is on the run and osama bin laden is dead. al-qaeda is on the path to defeat and osama bin laden is dead. i kept that promise. >> and okay, kt, al-qaeda is on the path of defeat and on the run, or is it what james clapper said. >> even the president said al-qaeda. jv is the only thing. and we got rid of core al-qaeda. the problem is the mexed message. i worked on state of the union speeches for the defense parts in the presidents in the past. what it said in the speech is drives budget. oh, the president said they are on the run and on the ropes. i guess it is all finished and we don't need resources to look for al-qaeda. we

clapper's testimony and whether that is a crime or should be pursued as such.al court has now suggested that the revelations that edward snowden provided us show illegal government conduct. does that change the way we should look at snowden? >> i think both of these things are really important. the first, clapper's testimony. there's no question it was an untrue statement. he even admitted it later on. it teaches how imperfect our limited the post watergate system of congressional oversight is. in order to preserve the secrets of national security, what we have is an incredibly weak oversight system. for years, it allowed the nsa to build a program as we look at it now seems excessive, intuiti unconstitution unconstitutional, and illegal. it is one instance that teaches us how weak congressional oversight was and therefore how critical allowing whistle-blowers to blow the whistle is. >> to bring that out to goldie, that's the issue here. he took an oath and violated it and then ran away. they are angry at home. they feel he did something wrong. how does that ge

you know the fact that james clapper would ask us to give him credibility when he would lie bald faced lie under oath and not later said well what i said was clearly erroneous but you know don't why should we believe in this thing these threats remind me of the ones when bradley manning chelsea manning released all those terrible things going to happen in afghanistan and iraq terrible things where troops and so forth and finally carl levin said it's a bobby gates mr secretary please give us a paper and he gave in papers here will contrary to our or worse or worst fears nobody has been so much as spat upon it and said it exactly that way but the command said the same thing later gates said the charges that this was great damage were quote fairly significantly over russia and i think that phrase probably pertains with respect to snowden yes and james clapper today you had mentioned clapper and he brought up snowden today snowden was a was on that debate floor today some republicans as we've heard has gone as far to say that snowden works for russian intelligence clapper demanded that sno

clapper said terrorist groups have changed the way they communicate among each other. >>> u.s. ambassador caroline kennedy and cabinet minister have agreed to work closely together to resolve the issue of japanese nationals abducted by north korea. kennedy met with feud yeah on thursday. he is in of the abductions issues. she says it's a tragedy and important matter. feud yeah gave kennedy a blue ribbon saying it symbolizing japanese's determination to resolve the situation and the ribbon represents people's anger over the inductions as well as the desire of the victim's families to get the loved ones back home. >>> stimulus is winding down in the u.s. for more on the latest fed decision ron madison joins us. >> that's right. the fed has decided to continue with its tapering, all eyes on how it goes about this because there's concern about the impact this will be having on other economies, in particular the emerging economies. so investors and economists around the world really watching the markets now to track the impact of the latest decision by the u.s. federal reserve. poli

look, i don't think there's any doubt that clapper lied.t sure he should go to jail, but i really question, though, the way that we're going to go forward on this, and i certainly think as long as clapper is in his job, it's impossible for any normal american to feel confident the government's telling the truth about this. if peter king's right that the nsa surveillance saved the deaths, prevented the deaths of hundreds of people riding the subway in new york, that's a big deal. he should have to prove that argument or at least prove it to the satisfaction of a fair-minded blue trip commission or something. but, i mean, these issues, again, the media are celebrating this because it's the hot language, but the underlying issues are really serious. >> i'd be curious to know whats the rev haitian of -- revelation of what edward snowden said. no evidence of that. it's enlightening for the american public to know exactly how we're being spied upon by our government. jon: interesting, jim, that, you know, typically republicans don't like big gove

abiding clapper, lob americans -- law-abiding americans want to protect the privacy of their communications and i see a clear need to strengthen protections for information sent over the web or stored in the cloud. declassified court documents show that in 2011, the nsa

i understand the show is also comparing clapper to snowden. to me either he is totally uninformed or he is part of the hate america crap. in anyway, he doesn't deserve to be in the united states senate for spreading that miss perception and lies. >> i wish he could be more forceful, but whatever. if only members of congress could learn to cooperate like these two. >> go get it. go get your frisbie. go get it chase. go get it chase. >> go get it beptly. good boy. >> that is bipartisan ship. it gets the inexperience out of the way. i like to call him paul ranked and was he uninformed? >> king is right in the sense that rand paul was -- i think she grandstanding and playing to the crowd. i think he is being irresponsible. >> it is a fear of big government and i understand his concern that there is always a potential for misuse or abuse. but i think king then also over stepped by suggesting he is not serve which is an interesting comment. having spent 17 plus years behind a curtain i have enough information to not be parano id id -- paranoid about

before the senate intelligence committee, clapper called on snowden to return all stolen documents to the nsa after causing what he called major harm to u.s. security. clapper also suggested the journalist who published the .eaks are his accomplices >> snowden claims he has one and his missing is accomplished. his compasses to facilitate the return of the remaining stolen documents that have not yet been exposed to prevent even more damage to u.s. security. what i do want to speak to as a senior intelligence officer, is the profound damage his disclosures have caused and continue to cause. as a consequence, the nation is less safe and its people less secure. what snowden has exposed has gone way beyond his professed concerns with so-called domestic surveillance programs. edward snowden has repeatedly maintained his no longer in possession of any of the documents he took from the nsa, having passed them onto journalist to report at their discretion. clapper was appearing before the same panel he was caught lying to master but the deliberate collection of americans personal information.

would general clapper, would you, consulting with the department of justice, white house, ask for an expedited review by the supreme court of the united states to determine the constitutionality of these programs so that we do not continually shop for the legal opinion that we want to my either one side or the other. l discuss this with the attorney general. protocolup on what the is forsaking a reading by the supreme court. >> is there a sense of urgency within the administration to

clapper, the director much national intelligence told us oath and in front of the senate, we are not collecting any sort of data on hundreds of millions of americans. >> that was a lie and i think there is every reason to believe they are lying now. >> mr. elsberg, we appreciate your time. thanks for talking to us.

should james clapper be prosecuted? >> lying to congress is a felony. i don't think we can pick and choose the law. you have people like james clapper and others beating the table saying we want to put edward snowden in jail for life, yet they don't want the law applied to themselves. the law has to be applied equally. that's one of the tenets of american jurisprudence. apply the law equally. i think it would be enlightening for james clapper and edward snowden to share a prison cell. maybe we'd all learn a little bit from that. >> do you distinguish between the data mining of phone records which would be who i call, how long i spent on the phone and the phone number of the number i called versus some of the bodies? the actual conversations we have had and maybe even the same going for e-mails? not only who i e-mail but what i'm saying in the e-mail. >> i think this is something we have to figure out and the courts have to decide. i'm worried about meta data. people saying that doesn't mean anything. for example, my visa bill, some would call that meta

. >> what rand paul is comparing general clapper to snowden saying clapper belongs in jail with snowdenistened to, rather than using intelligent arguments as people could well do, he's resulting to fear and the lowest common denominator. >> the paranoia to when he is referring rand paul's suggestion that james clapper should face punishment for telling congress that the nsa collects no bulk data on millions of americans. >> i frankly think it would be somewhat enlightening for clapper and snowden to share a prison cell and maybe we would all learn from that. >> it is peter king, not rand paul, who is on the fringes of modern gop. yesterday senator minority leader mitch mcconnell released a brand-new ad for his 2014 re-election bid, featuring the scare mongering senator from kentucky. >> what he has done and allows him to be the most powerful republican up there is that he can pull people together united on obama care, united for a balanced budget amendment. >> joining me now is anchor of bbc world news america katy kay and eugene robinson. mitch mcconnell hearts rand paul, at least duri

well, clapper, james clapper just spoke. the director of national intelligence. he said look, we know that americans need more transparency, if we give them more transparency they will be more accepting of what we need to do and talked about the fact that even though he wants to move forward with stronger measures, they may have to ease back a little bit. >> we are thus faced with collectively and by collectively i mean this committee, the congress at large, the executive branch and most acutely all of us is the inescapable imperative to accept more risk. but the dealing with reduced capacities is when we need to ensure the face and confidence of the american people then we will work as hard as we can to meet the expectations before us. >> so basically a warning from clapper saying that with more transparency comes more risk and with budget cuts, is questiontration we also encounter more risks. something that we will to have deal with. >> and in fairness of equal time you were on capitol hill late last night with the state of the union and miles to go before you

. >> on that note i want to remind everyone what james clapper testified in front of congress when he collecting data. we have that exchange to play for us. >> does the nsa collect any type of data on millions or hundreds of millions of americans? >> no, sir. >> it does not? >> not wittingly. there are cases where they coul but not wittingly. >> and so now we have more information about that it. did what the president said today go a long way guy, toward restoring the public's faith in the program if >> i don't know if it went a long way. the fact of the matter is, james clapper is still in office, and no consequences for him clearly misleading and if not openly lies in front of congress. that answer was not true. the president gave another speech on this whole issue eight months ago and then all of the revelations came out from edward snowden. and clearly the previous speech didn't get the job done. and there is a new speech. the speech was good and a tough balance he tried to strike and i think he did a good job of it. but i think there is a point of diminishing return on the speech

i don't think james clapper is a bad person. i think he's a patriotic person who wants to stop terrorism. i don't think he was a bad person. by lying to congress he made us doubt and believe maybe the government could be listening to our phone calls, even though they tell us they're not. >> your opposition to obamacare has been no secret, but i understand now that the issue has also become personal for you, is it true you had trouble signing up for obamacare and you're not sure your family is covered? >> at this point i'm unsure. the other day i tried to get my son signed up through the kentucky exchange. i have here my son's medicaid card. we didn't try to get him medicaid. i'm trying to pay for his insurance. they automatically enrolled him in medicaid. for a month they wouldn't talk to us because they weren't sure he existed. he had to go down to welfare office, prove his existence. next thing we know we get a medicaid card. i'm trying to pay for insurance and can't pay for it and i'm uncertain now whether i'm enrolled d.c. a