host: you deal with clarence thomas, robert bork. what does history tell us about supreme court selections? guest: history teaches us a lot. one thing that democrats and republicans will always debate -- when did the institution start going down? was it bork, thomas, etc.? from my standpoint, what history teaches is what the authors of "how democracies die" really called forbearance. forbearance is important. so you do not nominate the most extreme conservatives you possibly can. you nominate people who can attract and generate broad support. i think the bork nomination was a mistake, and i think howard baker thought it was a mistake. he was chief of staff for the president then. i think clarence thomas was a mistake, even before the anita hill problem arose because he , was not all that qualified. host: considering what happened with neil gorsuch, what is next? guest: it is interesting. we have heard talk about retirements, and we do not know whether justice kennedy or anyone else will be retiring. but i think this is a place where

host: you deal with clarence thomas, robert bork. what does history tell us about supreme court selections? guest: history teaches us a lot. one thing that democrats and republicans will always debate -- when did the institution start going down? bork, thomas, etc.? standpoint, what history teaches is what the authors of how democracies die really called forbearance. important. is so you do not nominate the most extreme conservatives you probable -- possibly can. you nominate people who can attract and generate broad support. nomination wask a mistake, and i think how word baker thought asked howard baker thought it was a mistake. he was chief of staff for the president then. i think clarence thomas was a mistake, even before the anita hill revelation, because he was not all that qualified. happenedsidering what with neil gorsuch, what is next? guest: it is interesting. we have heard talk about retirements, and we do not know whether justice kennedy or anyone else will be retiring. but i think this is a place where the senate should

clarence thomas never talked. [laughter] bill clinton never attended class. [laughter] personalities are developed pretty early on. years later bill clinton asked me when he was elected president, and i told my class under no circumstances will i leave the class because i really felt i had an obligation to teach a class that fall, but bill clinton called and said i really need to have you come down here, i was just elected president. i said congratulations. he said i need you to come down here and run my economic transition team. i didn't know what an economic transition team was but i said okay and i apologize to the class, went down to washington and discovered it was much harder to do anything that i had run on then i assumed it would be. he had run on a platform of putting people first, investing in education and job training and infrastructure and research and development and the notion was if you made those public investments you could grow the economy. i still think that's right. it was very hard to do. wall street and the bond traders were very fright

host: the historical aspect and the book you deal with clarence thomas and robert bork. guest: history teaches us a lot. democrats andngs republicans will always debate when do the institution start going down? from my standpoint what history teaches is what the authors of how democracies die called forbearance. .orbearance is important you don't nominate the most extreme conservatives you possibly can. you not only people who can attract and generate broad support. i think the board's nomination was a mistake and i think howard baker thought it was a mistake. he was the chief of staff them. -- then. not seen asmas was qualified. host: the next supreme court justice sip -- considering what happened with neil gorsuch. whethere don't know justice kennedy or anyone else will be retiring. this is a place where the sun to test the senate to push back. if a number of senators who were republicans ran to the president and said we are only going to confirm a moderate conservative who can get 60 or 70 votes, that would make a difference. the president would say that he did not ne

clarence thomas never talked. [laughter] and bill clinton never attended class. so those, you know, personalities are developed very early on. but years later bill clinton asked me when he was elected president, i was then teached a kennedy school and i told my class that under no circumstances would i leave the class because i really felt obligation to teach a class that fall with bill clinton called he said i need you to come down here. i was just elected president he said. i said congratulations. had said about i needed you to run my economic transition team. i didn't know what economic transition team was but i said okay. fine. and i -- apologized to the class. went down to washington. and discovered that it was much harder to do anything that i and bill clinton had run on than i had assumed it would be. he had run on a platform of putting people first investing many education, and job training and infrastructure, and research basic research and development, and the notion was if you made those public investments you could grow the economy. i still thinks tha

he is very -- he is much closer let us say, to the position of clarence thomas than he is to -- on this question of race and racial remedies than he is to the position of any of jeb bush or any other major republican contender who might come to mind. he doesn't -- it's not as important in a way, for his own arguments as it is obviously for clarence thomas. but i think it is still quite remarkable. also, the kind of courage that more specifically that he represents is associated in a way with his reputation as a builder. if he calls himself a builder, he calls america a nation of builders. he -- i mean, he's many things besides that. he knows his way around a construction site, he also knows his way around a tv studio. his career has included things other than being a landlord or a builder. but, still, that is where he comes home. that is what -- that is how he chooses to present himself. and he associates himself, you might say, almost perhaps voluntarily with a certain kind of brazen, masculine assertive ethics that comes with that job, the job of a builder. he gets things done, he's i

hill gained national attention back in 1991 when she accused then supreme court nominee clarence thomasworked together at two federal agencies. thomas denied the charges. and was later confirmed to the high court. hill is currently a professor at brandeis university in massachusetts and chairs a commission on sexual harassment, and advancing equality in the workplace. her speech tonight, part of the barbara lee lecture series. that event begins at 7:00. it will be held at the oakland marriott center. organizers say people who did not rsvp can still show up at 6:30 and will be allowed in if there are seats available. >>> the white house says north korea's leader kim jong un must take quote concrete steps to denuclearize the country if he wants a face to face meeting with president trump. the president says a deal with north korea is in the works and if an agreement is reached, everyone will benefit. there is speculation that a face to face meeting could happen as soon as may but the u.s. says kim jong un must make the first move. >> let's be very clear. the united states has made zero co

against the all male senate judiciary meeting, proceeding ramming through the confirmation of clarence thomas slowed down a bit. he wasn't confirmed until a week later. they marched over to the senate and interrupted the senate lunch, their tuesday lunch. it was remarkable. they came right over. patsy mink was there. eleanor holmes norton and louise slaughter was just right there in the middle of all that. it was very brave. you tweeted a picture of her, a wonderful picture of louise slaughter. let's finish our conversation, then go to break on this wonderful picture of this great lady, louise slaughter. >> that's louise. >> a fighter to the end. we'll be right back. ♪ most people come to la with big dreams... we came with big appetites. with expedia one click gives you access to discounts on thousands of hotels, cars and things to do. like the avalon hotel beverly hills for 40% off. everything you need to go. ♪ expedia. and back pain made it hard to sleep and get up on time. then i found aleve pm. the only one to combine a safe sleep aid... ...plus the 12 hour pain relieving strength of alev

she gained national attention when she accused then supreme court nominee clarence thomas.igh bench, he denied the charges. hill chaired the commission on sexual harassment in the workplace. she is part of a lecture series. the event begins at 8:00 at the oakland marriott center. people who did not rsvp can show up at 6:30, which is past now, and will be allowed in if seats are still available for the event. >>> british military is being called in to investigate the mysterious poisoning of a former russian spy and his daughter from a deadly agent. more from london. >> reporter: the secretary of defense and many members of the intelligence community and others met today in london to discuss the investigation. meanwhile, in salisbury, about 90 miles southwest of london, troops trained to deal with and equipped to deal with chemical weapons were at a cemetery where the spy's wife and son were buried. that's because the father and daughter may have gone there to their graves to pay their respects and contaminated the site with a nerve agent they themselves were poisoned with. v

clarence thomas and steven breyer, the most liberal and conservative justice dissented.n breyer said they use these to train miller. i'm not a medical expert but i know who is and it's not the people the video gamers put out. you need to know more about the case. the data is so overwhelming. when i was a kid nobody buckled seat belt all just fine. the seat belt unbuckled died. but all the ones that died -- >> laura: kids have predispositions to this. >> yeah. >> laura: maybe they have a trigger inside of them, they steep themselves. >> one more ingredient to it great book inside the mind of a teen killer. the new factor in every single indicates, the new factor, the fact that violent crime is down is not true. >> laura: are they using these in army ranger training do they do simulation. >> we do it with law enforcement and video training. you don't see it in ranger school but integral part of our training make killing response part of training. we have to do it. healthy people have to be trained to do and the video games do the same things to the kids. >> laura: ben, wha

. >> host: you did know clarence thomas? >> we were law school students and lived in the same complex for married students. >> host: and most started back there in law school together, you're both somewhat controversial. did you ever talk about this? >> well, i think we joke about it from time to time. he traveled, i think, a farther philosophical journey in his time at the law school than i did, but because we were living in the same place and took many of the same classes together we used to talk all the time about, you know, whatever issue was in the newspapers or whatever cases we were studying in our classes. >> host: give me a quick scenario of what jobs you've had and let's go to the law firms, very quickly, so people can know how you got to be ambassador of the u.n. >> guest: after i was an associate at a large prominent washington firm and went back to covington as a partner during the mid 1970's. when reagan was elected in 1980 i thought this was a great opportunity to work in the government so i had various jobs f

vi to galatians that go beyond title vi by creating liability for --parate impact -- that when clarence thomas was for civil rights, he did not interpret them that way. if that were at the regulations, it would create giant problems since a lot of what schools do has a disparate impact on some racial group. for example, do we need to place the basketball hoop so high up? disproportionally harder for asian americans, who on average are shorter to make the team. let me say this instead, because this is a slamdunk legal argument. if the regulations mean the obama administration said what they mean, then we are about the scope and hence no envoy. void -- null and void. the agency would not have the power to vastly expand statutes i declare you can't marry your second or third cousin either or anybody who grew up on the same street as you. not only would that go beyond the way the sketches allow, there is no argument that the regulation is aimed at ensuring the underlying statute enforcement. the kinds of things that would be permissible in that context would be a requirement that one present one b

1992, a record year of women elected to congress, sparked by anita hymn's testimony, accusing clarence thomasent. >> the visual that people saw was a black woman sitting alon in front of a panel, 20 white older men. many women saw that as a clear representation of their under representation in congress. >> reporter: in 2018, barzi flores braces for a challenging contest. this time it's about more than just sher. >> what is it like to return here at this place as a candidate in congress. >> i'd like to look at this and think about how far i've come an how important it is to fight for women who like that 17-year-old kid in the walk-in cooler need to be fought for and i think it gives me purpose. >> you see all these women kounding a new cnn poll shows when it comes to the mid-terms, democrats are losing an edge, 50% say they refer democrats, 64% republicans. a month ago, it was 16 points, does that surprise you? >> no, it doesn't, these groups say they have the energy on their side. another number in the poll, 51% of democrats say they're extremely enthusiastic. that's what they're looking at "

i will say that when clarence thomas was for civil rights, he did not interpret them that way. if that were at the regulations, it would create giant problems since a lot of what schools do has a disparate impact on some racial group. for example, do we need to place the basketball hoop so high up? it makes it disproportionally harder for asian americans, who on average are shorter to make the team. let me say this instead, because this is a slamdunk legal argument. if the regulations mean the obama administration said what they mean, then we are about the scope and hence null and void. the agency would not have the power to vastly expand statutes i declare you can't marry your second or third cousin either or anybody who grew up on the same street as you. not only would that go beyond the way the sketches allow, there is no argument that the regulation is aimed at ensuring the underlying statute enforcement. a case would be if you wanted to marry your cousin. the kinds of things that would be permissible in that context would be a requirement that one present one's birth certi

and i'm just thinking about where we are and where we've been and my reporting career spans the clarence thomas anita hill hearings where we thought we heard things that we could never get into our newspapers back in those days when certain words weren't allowed and we managed to report that in our newspaper and then went to impeachment and bill clinton and blue dresses and things that didn't seem fit for a family audience and got those into the newspapers and now here we have with a president and a porn star. and it is a kind of dreary trajectory of -- of the kind of modern politics and the -- the craziness of this moment. and just the sordid nature of what we're being dragged into writing about when there are actually serious problems facing the country and serious policy issues to be decided. and we're talking about porn stars and threats and presidential aliases. so just throwing up my hands here. >> i understand. david k. johnston, no one on this panel knows more about donald trump as a litigant than you. you've watched him both be a phony bluffer and as he was when he threatened to sue me

host: you deal with clarence thomas, robert bork.hat does history tell us about supreme court selections? guest: history teaches us a lot. one thing that democrats and republicans will always debate -- when did the institution start going down? bork, thomas, etc.? standpoint, what history teaches is what the authors of how democracies die really called forbearance. important. is so you do not nominate the most extreme conservatives you probable -- possibly can. you nominate people who can attract and generate broad support. nomination wask a mistake, and i think how word baker thought asked howard baker thought it was a mistake. he was chief of staff for the president then. i think clarence thomas was a mistake, even before the anita hill revelation, because he was not all that qualified. happenedsidering what with neil gorsuch, what is next? guest: it is interesting. we have heard talk about retirements, and we do not know whether justice kennedy or anyone else will be retiring. but i think this is a place where the senate should pu

in 2000, justice clarence thomas talk about the plessy muscles and what he had to say. >> people look at the court and in the current about mode our work is long-term work and has a much longer shelf life. if you look at the first justice he was the sole dissent in plessy and look how long his opinion shelf life was. his dissent, it has to be almost time. >> host: he argues that the court needs to take the long view in the court, what are your comments when you listen that frustrates me to have a couple directions. we don't love it if the spring court played the role of heroic defender and the rights or minorities but a supreme court that was so out of touch with the contemporary would be a supreme court that either destroyed itself or was overturned by constitutional amendment or what have the decisions ignored though the supreme court decided in favor of gay marriage in 2015 but if they tried to do that 30 or 40 years earlier no one would have paid any attention. if the supreme court had decided row versus wade struck down the death penalty is 20 years earlier they would decide that

all the steps of why that interpretation of those regulations is wrong, i'll just say that when clarence thomas was assistant secretary for civil rights, he didn't interpret them that way. and, if that were the right way continue to interpret those regulation, it would create giant problems. since a lot of what schools do has a dispret impact on some racial group, it's not always the same group. for example, do we really need to place the basketball hoop so high up? it makes it disproportionately hard for asian americans who on average are shorter to make the team, you know. but let me say this instead because i think this is a slam dunk legal argument. if the regulations mean what the obama administration said they mean, then they're clearly beyond the scope of the agency authority and, hence, null and void. let me give you a silly example to i will stralt because i'm a law professor and law professor love silly hype threat kals cals. shos a let slate ture makes it illegal to marry one's first cousin and gives the marriage agency the power to effectuate that staut. agency would not have the po

justice clarence thomas talked about the plessy decision. >> people look at the court in times of a current events mode. our work is long-term work and has to have a much longer shelf life. if you look at the first justice the solee was dissenter in plessy v. ferguson. 'sok how long his opinion shelflife was. the court needs to take the long view. what are your comments when you listen to that? michael: i have a couple of different reactions. -- itpreme court played was a supreme court that was so out of touch with the contemporary mores, it would be a supreme court that either destroyed itself or was overturned by constitutional amendment or would have its decisions ignored. the supreme court decided in favor of gay marriage in 2015 but if they tried to do that 30 or 40 years earlier, no one would have paid any attention. if the supreme court had decided roe versus wade or struct on the death penalty 20 years earlier and they decided those cases from the 1970's, the country would not have been prepared to accept that. that is true about run. the naacp did not bring a challenge to grade sch

he was a liberal, but before there was ed mees, before there was robert bjorc, or clarence thomas, neilorsuch, all of whom say they're textualists, the original originalist was black. he always carried a constitution with him. he comes from the bible belt, a fundamentalist part of the country where they take their sacred texts seriously, in a protestant tradition of reading their bible. a critic would say, gee, you're stretching things because the right of counsel at the founding meant a right of retained counsel, counsel for someone who could afford it. and that's what a critic would say. one response is, as i said, yeah, but when -- even if you couldn't afford an attorney, the judge at the founding was supposed to actually help you defend yourself. but over time it became clear that you can't be an umpire and a coach in effect at the same time. >> and i would say, i don't think gideon is justice black's most textual or originalist opinion. it's an opinion that's pretty concise, and relies more on the logical extension of the court's other cases, principally the johnson case you refere

was a liberal but before bork, whorobert taught me constitutional law or antonin scalia you or clarence thomas or no gorsuch, all of whom say that they are textualists, he always carried a copy of the constitution with him. he comes from the bible held, the fundamentalist part of the country where they take their sacred text seriously. the protestant tradition of reading their bible. a critic with say, g, you are stretching things. a critic would say, g you are stretching things. that is what a critic would say. one response is, yes but if you cannot afford an attorney, the judge is supposed to help you defend yourself but over time, it became clear that you cannot be an umpire and a coach at the same time. >> i would say, i don't think that gideon is just black chekov most textual or originalist of union. it really relies more on the logical extension of the courts ? other cases principally, the that you case referenced about giving the right to counsel in the federal system. >> another thing that the court really relies on, that we have not discussed. the scots borrow case -- scots tsboro ca

resist brown and would've made it harder for critics of that footnote, including justice clarence -- .larence thomas the purpose and intent of segregation is to degrade and therefore plessy is overturned. >> michigan, good evening. i want to congratulate you and the center and the rosen -- and mr. rosen there for his theories. to my questions. is, did thestion framers believed that segregation was in violation of equal protection of the laws given the fact that the nation's capital is segregated? with this in mind, could the brown decision could've been made using a different interpretation? and when the fifth amendment was passed it did not have an equal protection clause. versus sharkg case, could that be used using that interpretation? jeffrey: read at michael article.'s it is in the virginia law review and it -- and it is the best attempt to create a defense for brown. here's the bottom line. ,here were those in congress john bingham among them, who thought that basic civil rights had to be available to all. commissionsurter his law clerk to write a study, and it is clear that the people in 1868