lets bring back our panel of analysts, captain darby, clive and stephen wood.come back to all of you gentlemen. we've been talking about the search located in 128,000 jury mile area in the southern indian ocean. tom, is there any reason to definitively believe this is still the right search area. why can't it be the plane or debris might be spotted further north in that other trajectory? >> could be. fredricka, we are all, especially me, because this is not my area of expertise, we're all relying on what the experts have said is their best calculation. that's all we can do is hope they are right. >> this calculation, captain darby based on aviation authorities and boeing officials pinpointing where this plane may have been gone based on evidence they have been collaborating on. is that enough for you? do you think that's still a long shot? >> it's mostly the satellite ping they got. it establishes a ring. the ring can be anywhere along that ring. there's a lot of additional assumptions about the speed of the plane, altitude, how much gas it would burn. those ar

thank you for joining us, clive. have made a compelling point in your piece that you wrote today. you said that the plane didn't disappear. we just can't find it. why in this day and age with such large amounts of information and it can be streamed wirelessly and the plane carries the information on boxes that sink to the bottom of the ocean. >> i think that public amazement becomes a political force. the huge public reaction you have been recording shows how amazed people are that this is a primitive machine at work here. we are using a vcr technology in the age of netflix. and i was glad to see one of the spokesman for inmarsat said they were amazed -- that was the last line, inmarsat was the last line of connection we had with that plane. if it had not been for those pings we would be clueless. as is it the clues are not very strong. but the technology not only exists to send that -- transmit the same information in the flight data recorder, send it live in realtime, stream it to receiving centers on land and one

clive, i wonder if i could bring you in first. if we could talk about the system and failing of the step, how it contributed to the mystery of where it is. >> it's not giving us what we should get. it's not giving a complete and continuous picture of what's happening to this plane until the moment when whatever happened happened. acars is intermittent. also, it's not designed to describe the preamble to an emergency. it's designed to send, if you like, checks of the systems of the plane, engines, basic systems, health check. in that sense we're putting emphasis on what acars does and doesn't show. we have to look around the corner to see other things that are indicators, too. i've argued since air france 447 we badly need a system -- streaming system, live streaming what's going on in the plane. that can be done. >> we talked to analysts and experts about the cost, seemingly manageable cost. >> $1500 a month. bring that down per passengers it's cents. >> okay. certainly something to think. as we focus now if i could speak to the p

clive, talk a little bit about this plane, the boeing 777. obviously a plane with an excellent safety record. one that does not have a history of mechanical issues. you know, in your assessment, is this a plane that could theoretically have just simply broken up in the air for something other than intentional causes? >> no, it's a plane with a stellar safety record. it's been in operation for many years. it's evolved. and it's got a very promising future. so i think it's extremely -- of all the options available -- of course, there's a swamp of speculation here in this story which makes it very confusing for any lay person to really dig their way through it and find out and decide what they can believe and what they can't believe. but i would remove from this equation at the moment with quite a lot of confidence, any failure of the plane itself. >> clive, you've written about the 777, whether it disintegrated in the air of explosion or hit the water in one piece is highly significant. can you explain that? >> that makes a big difference in th

i don't know if clive is hearing me. clive, can you hear me?i can hear you. >> we're going to have to fix that audio. >> the key word as you know is "may." this story has become transcendent, and by that i mean it's moved from being a story about a presumed air disaster to a mystery story. where is the missing airplane. i think that's the aspect that's captivated people to this point. meanwhile also, it's been subject to all sorts of miscommunication i think right from the start. and the reasons for that you've got these different investigative entities halfway around the world at least for some of us. there are language issues and their message gets put into the media which, you know, filters it through. by the time we hear the latest news it may or may not be exactly what the people on the other end are saying. so things get garbled. we heard that the plane veered off course and now apparently that may not have been true. then you've got the very confusinging vernacular of commercial aviation and attempts to simplify terms like transponder an

joining me is clive irving and former 777 pilot mike weiss.lif, you've outlined this theory that's been out there for a while, that something happened, a mechanical catastrophe, that everybody on the plane is unconscious or dead. based on the new evidence, the altitude change, going up and down, have you changed your theory? >> we don't have any quality information to support it but it's a viable theory. i think the important thing here is to not get confused by terms. explosion, fire, those two things, decompression, no candidates for what might have overtaken this plane but there's also another one, which is gas, which is the kind of gas that was given off by the lithium ion batteries in the cargo hold at the time and these batteries behave in a very strange way in the case of a boeing 787 lithium batteries, boeing was very insistent on saying that they were not technically fires. they were not technically combustion. of the options possible here, which could have disabled the plane or at least disabled the pilots and knocked out the passeng

clive irving, we'll check back with you.y much for your insight. >>> exhausted, angry and unable to grieve without closure, the families of those aboard malaysia airline 370 are waiting day after day waiting definitive word on the fate of their loved one. we introduce you to the man emerging their voice and why the families can't bear to give up hope. >> reporter: the trauma of waiting. for weeks hundreds of family members of those on board flight 370 have been stuck in a hotel in beijing. the pressure cooker of grief and emotion. when they were told the plane went down, some via text message, it was overwhelming. then grief boiled over into anger. these families have banded together, and leaders like steve wong have emerged. without physical evidence he believes his mother could still be alive. but the wait is weighing on them all. >> well, it is a hard time and all of us are exhausted, both mental and physical. so it is really hard time. >> reporter: retired u.s. air force colonel gordon peters has deep experience helping

clive irving, thank you so much for talking with us.u have said that you think the air crew of flight 370 was trying to bring the plane to safety. why do you believe that and what evidence is there to prove your theory? >> i felt all along that the air crew were getting the short end of the stick here, that i had a feeling that they were almost being framed by the way that the discoveries were being cast, as though they had intervened. i think there's a very plausible scenario here and i think it's few days when we found out, for example, the acars was turned off after the last communication, not before and the change of course was -- came after the last communication and not before. everything that we know and we don't know enough to be totally sure of this, but everything we know points to the fact that wapd here w what happened here was some sort of emergency that the flight crew responded in a way that they would, to turn toward asia and to get down as season as possible. there could be a technical fault, which involved either smoke

. >> the man who made the claim is clive goodman, a familiar face in the long phone hacking saga. he admitted doing that at this very court in 2006. he went to prison. now he is accused of paying police officers at the royal palace for an phone directories. he denies it and today told the jury in 1992 directory came to him from a very different source . diana princess of wales. she said, "she wanted me to see the scale of her husband's staff and household compared to the scale of hers." she fell she was being swamped by the people close to him, and she was looking for an ally to take him on and show the kinds of forces ranged against her. she was, he said, in a very bitter situation. and it was a bitter time. the prince and princess was shortly to separate. showedic appearances, it . they divorced in 1996. a year later, she was killed in a speeding car in a paris under craft -- underpass. all of this was a huge story. the court heard that paper had access to a series of internal phone books since at least 1986. they were regularly used for checking stories. sometimes stories denie

clive, a whole new search area 700 miles away where they have been searching for more than a week now makes sense? >> yes, it does make sense. to me, what's fascinating to this in relation to what your previous discussion was, was the use of the word faster. i find that puzzling. if it flew faster, it would be flying higher and use less gas. how that reeltlates, i don't kn. the fact that the engines of this plane, the engines kept working perfectly throughout the whole of this flight, which meant the engines supplied power to the rest of the plane and they have to be fueled separately and managed by the flight management system so it doesn't unbalance the plane. all of those things worked perfectly. what wasn't working other than the engines in the systems? it is an idea where you have a completely empty vessel capable of working but nobody on board. >> one of the theories clive, is that there was a catastrophic mechanical failure. you are saying how is it that the engines were in such perfect condition for so long? >> yes. why weren't the engines taken out if there was a fire. that m

joining me now is clive irving. contributor for "the daily beast" and "conde naste."ed a number of things out of pieces you written. i want to hit you with them and expand. the data system and transponder quit after the pilot said all was okay. why? >> nothing sinister. i think they keep trying to make the pilots every action and background sinister when there is nothing here. trashing the pilots is unseemly. >> turning off the transponder is the first thing a hijacker would do. >> that's right. the transponder can be subject to a technical failure like any other part of the cockpit. >> the prime minister referenced deliberate action. seem to be throwing under the bus the pilots. part of the narrative that it was something nefarious. >> these pilots have families and they are in great agony and distress. >> why would a bad guy take out the acars system? let's assume there is intervention in the cockpit? >> it makes no sense. >> differ between the acars system. >> it is nothing anything in the cockpit. not like a cctv camera in the cockpit that they tape over to avoid

clive joins us now. thank you, clive, for joining us. >> you're welcome. >> i was so compelled to have you on after reading some of the things you had out yesterday, but you are asking this question that continues today, as well, which is, we have no firm facts. you heard tom costello's report just in the last few minutes here. >> yes, i agree with his assessme assessment that introducing the psychological element is a huge distraction when we should be focusing on other things. there are only so many options of what might have happened and as the list gets reduced, if terrorism is out of the picture and hijacking is out of the picture, the list comes down to very few things which you then have to look at more closely. i have to admit at the beginning of this, i discounted the idea of some kind of structural failure because it seems so unlikely the safety record of boeing 777 is very impressive. but when you stop to look at the short list of possibilities, i took a look again of something which is called

. >>> joining me now, clive irving. clive, the sad news today coming about the beyond reasonable doubt, based on the satellite calculations, it comports with something you have been talking about from the beginning which is work backwards from the end. >> right. >> what's your reaction to today's news? >> well, as a journalist, i'd love to get my arms around one stable salient fact in this story. it's very difficult to do that. in this condition, everything we say by the absence of stable salient facts. my method was to work back from the starting point, the end and not the beginning. now i think we do know the important thing that happened today is we know the end. where roughly where the end is. and that supports the southern arc theory, not the northern. i was always extremely doubtful of the northern arc nearly because it would have taken the plane through busy ways. >> the southern theory, the key finding there, again, there's so little we know. if, in fact, this satellite data is correct, if, in fact, it went down

. >> clive doyle is a branch davidian survivor, and to this day a believer in david koresh. >> david was constantly talking to god. god told me to do this. god told me to do that. we accepted that. >> god speaks to me. i have a message to present. >> to outsiders koresh soon transformed the davidian church into a cult. >> the most important element of the cult is the leader. and they always describe the same way as being charismatic. >> i mean, there are some things that god has concealed in his written word that are to be brought to do right before the end of time. >> koresh preached end of day philosophies to his followers, a belief that was centered around a battle between evil armies led by a messianic leader who was the second coming. >> his role was to open the seven seals that are mentioned in the book of revelation. >> in revelation the seven seals represent the apocalypse. the biblical end of days. in the bible only the lamb of god can open the seals. koresh preached that he had that power. by january 1992 disturbing rumors about the self-styled prophet had surfaced. the loc

clive, let's begin with you.ked what it might be. take us through if you can what might float and ma wwhat might float. >> the plane is not designed to float so what happens to it is very dependent on the dynamics of the angle at which it hits the ocean and the speed at which it hits the only. the only thing we have to go on that's any guide is what happened to air france 447. when it sank into the south atlantic, and in that case what it happened was that the plane hit the water almost as though it was landing at an airport, relatively stable latitude so the rear of the aircraft hit the water first and the nose sank and there was a huge what's called a vertical impact and the impact was so huge it went up through the cargohold into the cabin, compressed the seats in the cabin and compressed the spinal cords of the passengers on that flight. we know this from the examinations done afterwards so the dynamics are very complic e complicat complicated, how the airframe itself breaks up. most likely thing is the wings

. >> aviation reporter clive irving says we shouldn't have to wait that long.ontributor to "the daily beast" and conde nast traveler. you say this is antiquated. why? what other means to locate if not the ping device. >> this is a very serious accident with large loss of life. i think it's amazing today we still rely on a principle and system devised in the 1960s when there was no alternative to it. it's simple, crucial evidence to the play and you go out and try to find black box flight recorder. we all live in digital world now. we have numerous devices we use every day. technically it's a relatively simple thing to have live realtime transmissions from the plane. the plane in the air monitoring its systems, like a person monitoring their own heartbeat and systems, all that information is being collected as it is flying of the problem is it's not getting from the plane to anywhere else. my argument is it should now be necessary to end this very difficult situation we face with the crash. if that information were being transmitted the whole time the plane was

clive irving. thank you very much. >> you're welcome. >>> joining me now, msnbc national security analyst, don borelli. former special agent in charge of the new york joint terrorism task force. it's striking to me you have a manifest of 239 passengers on this flight, i believe. you immediately had information about two stolen passports. that was identified and flagged immediately. but in ten days, as far as i can tell, nothing more forthcoming that would lead investigators or anyone in the widening circles of inquiry to suggest that there was some kind of motive for whatever might have happened if it were the case the plane were taken off course deliberately. >> exactly. and, you know, whether or not you accept the malaysian version of the timeline or you think that it might be suspect, you've got so many possibilities here. you've got almost no clues to go on other than the technical data from the radar and the other, you know, information systems. so you have to look at every plausible thing. on

i want to go to clive irving. joining me from london. the senior consulting editor.there a legitimate reason why this transponder would be shut off, and how troubling is this to you to hear that information? >> it's just another piece of very troubling information, very confusing information in this fog of people trying to imagine what happened, because we are imagining it. we're trying to imagine it. i think it's a bridge too far to talk about the plane landing somewhere. that's a bit too james bond-ish in my idea. there's several things here. this transponder thing. but the most important thing of all is this left turn. and then, that it proceeded for quite a distance in that new direction. and why only now do we know this from the radar? and then again, the issue of what the ground controllers would do during the time, which is reminiscent of what happened in the case of air france 447, which disappeared over the south atlantic. there was a lot of fumbling and inattention going on, because it was people saying it was 2:00 in the morning, but i think that's ridicul

clive irving is also joining us, the former ntsb investigator is here in washington with me.een so many conflicting reports over the past six days. do you think these pings that we're learning about today are pointing in the right direction? why are we just getting this information now? >> i think it's very significant that the navy is moving those assets into the indian ocean. i don't think they would be doing that just by being asked to do by the malaysians but without some kind of sense that it is worth the expense and attrition of moving such incredible equipment out there into what is -- i don't think this has ever happened before, that searchers had to go out into the big void. this is an area which is not covered by radar. it's not -- it's very difficult to tell whether there's any satellite coverage of it. there's nothing basically to be watched. satellites can, of course, be moved into position from where they are. they can be moved into a different orbit if there's a purpose for moving them. but if there's no satellite watching this area of the indian ocean, then th

clive davis for one is a legend in the music business but his inte

i want to bring in clive irving in new york via skype.why wasn't this plane in your opinion, safe for long flights, given that this is a half billion dollar plane? one of the most sophisticated planes flying? >> yes, i'm actually not saying that. i'm saying it had to prove it was safe. it was designed from the beginning to prove something at the time, in the early 1990s. it was a very unorthodox idea i amongst aviation experts, which is that you could take a very large plane, holding 300 or more people, and fly it over long distances, over the ocean, and on only two engines. and the critical thing here is, how far away would that plane be from the nearest landing strip if one of the engines went out? so the regulations gag by sbega saying no further than 60 minutes away and it's now up to over five hours. it's gone up to that level because the 777 has really been the proving point that it was dependable. one instance where a 777 took off from new zealand, lost one engine on the way to los angeles, and had to make a diversion to hawaii. on

clive bixby. what a sexy surprise. - quick question-- - mm-hmm? when you fell from heaven? because you... fell... i'm gonna come in again. we are watching baby joe on valentine's day so my dad and gloria can... - make love. - ew. don't. - oh. - the point is, we are celebrating a day early. so they can finally be intimate. you've more than made that point. i'm just saying it's a long wait after giving birth. - six weeks. - ugh. i couldn't keep my hands off this one for that long. (both chuckle) i can only imagine what jay's going through. i should check on the kids. haley took 'em to a movie. she's not even gonna answer. i know, but, sweetie, i have a good reason to worry. luke had that nasty nosebleed this morning, and alex, as usual, fainted. she's fine, and dunphy men get nosebleeds. i told you this when we got married. it was in my vows.

what can we do together to clive up the costs to putin. >> we're just getting some pictures from thiseeting. there's some still photo there is in london. but to the point, ambassador bunbun burns, how critical is angela merkel? >> she's a central player.bun burns, how critical is angela merkel? >> she's a central player.un burns, how critical is angela merkel? >> she's a central player.n burns, how critical is angela merkel? >> she's a central player. burns, how critical is angela merkel? >> she's a central player. she gave a speech yesterday which was quite strong in warning putin because of these mobilizations of russian's forces on ukraine's border not to go forward with incur gents into eastern ukraine. if putin went beyond crimea and sent troops in to other city, then i think we're being look at fairly substantial sanctions. >> let me ask you both quickly then a couple of other points that we touched on. am babassador burn, we mentione may toe forc nato forces conducting trainings. anything that particularly concerns you you? >> i think nato is doing what it should do. nato has n

big stars moving to the television screen and cinemax is putting on something by soderbergh starring clive about a turn of the century hospital. i this this is a model we'll see more and more going forward. >> if you could put up the beer can stick figures. christopher you know what i'm talking about. seems we're headed for resolution based on five characters, maybe symbolized by the way in which matthew mcconaughey was making those stick figures out of beer cans. give me a prediction. >> well, i think that those five figures who have recurred in several shots throughout the show, it seems that they are part of some kind of diabolical right that involves the -- the rape and perhaps murder of women, or young children, and we've seen a few scenes where there are five scary figures circled around someone lying helpless on the ground, and i think we're likely to see that resolved tomorrow night. >> and nick pizaloto, the genius behind "true detective," you've writ an great analysis. doesn't seem like he's headed for a twist. he doesn't like it when audiences are fooled the entire season. he sa

clive irving at the daily baste pointed out that there's a european union registry of airlines not allowed to fly into the european union. it's hundreds of airlines. every country now must have their own airline, they're in business with a 757. you realize later after this they don't have the adequate infrastructure, safety and surveillance that we take for granted when we fly american or united. >> the mistakes and the false alarms, as i call them, they tend to vanish into the ether. there's all this that focuses on the passengers that have two passports. just picking out a couple, bloomberg suspected aircraft tail found floating in the gulf of thailand and it turned out to be a bunch of logs. these big oil slix off the coast of vietnam reported to be not from an airplane. just the other day cnn was rothing lithium batteries exploding could be responsible for a crash. we don't know what is right or wrong. cnn is well equipped to cover this kind of story because of its big international story, but at the same time, cnn is covering almost nothing else. i think that has opened the door for a

as "the daily beast's" clive irving asked, have the malaysians finally stopped trashing the pilots? they were going through precisely the steps they were in an emergency. nbc's keir simmons has been following the plight of the families from kuala lumpur, malaysia. >> reporter: hey, joy. the search for that debris off the coast of australia has been suspended today, so another day wasted. families as furious as they have ever been, particularly in beijing, with a group marched to the malaysian embassy to protest. incredibly emotional scene, following the emotional scenes yesterday in beijing, after the families were told about the news that the malaysians believe that the evidence shows that the plane ended over the ocean. now, the families say that they don't believe it, they want to know where the debris is, they want to see that there is evidence that that debris does belong to flight 370. meanwhile, the australians telling the malaysians, according to the malaysians, they will not issue visas for families to go there until that positive identification of debris from the flight is

let's say you were barry gordy or you're ed sullivan -- >> clive davis. >> wow. can i be clive davis? the coolest man in the room. i want to know are there more hits. when you sit with zelnick who understands the hit business at take-two and you recognize how well he's done and the valuation is one times sales i question whether this company has that second hit. >> although activision and electronic arts i believe trade at revenue multiples that may be a bit higher than this may go out at, we'll see where it actually opens today, where it's been priced. you know, what's the difference, then, when you look at a company like this which at least is trying to develop new games, of course, new hits. and more established names such as electronic arts which to be fair relies on hits as well and new franchises or refreshing the old franchises. >> we knew that zynga had to keep buying, they were overpaying once they got the money. you are making a bet on the gentleman we're going to interview. you're making a bet that they have dna which allows them to be able to come up

clive davis joined the celebration. so did denzel washington.est birthday present would be a record deal for her son and granddaughter. something tells me she could make that happen. it is her 72nd birthday tomorrow. >> queen of soul. >> that's right. >> welcome back to "cbs this morning." coming up in this half hour new details from bob simon's 60 minute report on the pink panthers. learn how some of the world's top jewel thieves are mastering the art of the prison break. >> what will your eulogy say about you. a question arianna huffington should be asking. she's in studio 57 with her new mission to redefine success. that's ahead. >> right now, time to show you some of this morning's headlines from around the globe. usa today looks at a new report on veterans college graduation rates. the student veterans finds over half of veterans who sought higher education between 2012 and 2013 under the gi bill received their diploma. about one in three earned a bachelor's degree or higher. >>> the himalayan times said officials in nepal plan to ease clim

seattle seahawks marshawn lynch spoke exus clively to -- exclusively to ktvu about the great highs andin his life. growing up in north oakland, he saw friends get killed starting at the age of 5. he's helping kids with his nonprofit. >> i just hope i can give them hope. somebody to believe in. something to have faith in. >> lynch tolds a football camp every july. his goals include expanding his foundation and finishing with a degree. >>> big news involving those bright lights on the bay bridge. the big announcement expected today and how it could mean the lights will stay on for another decade. >>> and b.a.r.t. service slowly coming back to normal this morning. but a lot of frustration for b.a.r.t. commuters. we'll tell you how this will affect your morning commute -- coming up. >>> good morning. right now, traffic is going to be moving along relatively well in some areas but still slow in others. northbound 101 is improved in san jose. we'll tell you more about the south bay. >>> clouds are here. where is the rain? it's up north. will it make it this far south? yes. but maybe later th

former royal reporter clive goodman testifying during britain's ongoing phone hacking trial, that princesspalace's confidential contact numbers. >> she was fighting for her life. she was frightened she would lose the children. so no trick was too dirty. >> reporter: in his explosive evidence, goodman denied illegally paying for palace documents. claiming the princess gave him a top-secret buckingham palace phone book packed with royal contacts and household information to, quote, take on her estranged husband prince charles in 1992. >> diana spilled secrets every day. it was the war of the waleses. i don't think diana would care if someone thought she had taken the buckingham palace phone directory. it's not like she's taken the crown jewels. >> reporter: after all, charles and diana's relationship was on the rocks. they separated soon after this event. goodman alleges that, quote, she felt she was in a very bitter position at the time. she felt she was being swamped by the people close to him and she was looking for an ally to take him on to show the kind of forces ranged against her. he

clive goodman says diana handed over information about prince charles, including a phone journal. >>> security efforts he says, quote, we imagine we're protecting you against criminals, not our own government. zuckerberg said he made his concerns clear in a recent phone call with the president. >>> the graco child car seat recall is expanding. the company is adding 403,000 seats to its recall because the buckles can get clogged with food or drinks. they were made since 2006 in various models. last month they recalled 4 million seats and the government says even more should be recalled because of the buckles. >>> it's not how much is that doggy in the window but how much we are spending on him? a trade group says almost $60 billion a year. most of that is spent on dogs and cats. the biggest increase is in services like veterinary care and grooming but also pet insurance. the biggest category is food estimated at nearly $23 million a year. >> i'm thinking of getting a dog so i better dig deep into the wallet. >> start saving. >>> while we're dealing with animals, here's an up close look

clive cook, the close-mindedness of these proposed men of science is spruce u surprising to meevme stink ever intellectual corruption is overpowering. and ipcc prominent physicist resigns. climategate was fraud on a scale never seen before. dr. phillip lloyd calls out the ipcc as a fraud. the result is not scientific. "newsweek," "once celebrated climate researchers feel like the used car salesman." some of the ipcc's most quoted data, recommendations were taken straight out of unchecked activist brochures. i'm quoting right now. this was in "newsweek." and george montanavoy an economist on the other side of this issue, "it is no use pretending that this isn't a major blow. the e-mails extracted by a hark from the climate unit at the university of east anglia could scarcely be more damaging. i am deeply dismayed at them. i was too trusting of some who provided the evidence i championed. i would have been a better journalist if i had investigated their claims more closely." now, we have the other problem there and that is that instead of increasing, we're -- we've gone through now some co

clive cook, that's the financial times, the closed mindedness of these supposed men of science is surprising even to me. the stink of intellectual corruption is overpowering. that's from the financial times. we're all familiar with that publication here. a prominent ipcc physicist said climate-gate was a fraud on a scale i've never seen. a u.n. scientist dr. phillip lloyd said the result is not scientific. "newsweek" said once celebrated climate researchers feel like used car salesmen. none of the ipcc's most quoted data and recommendations were taken straight out of the unchecked activist brochures. that's "newsweek" magazine. george mornboith -- he said -- quote -- "it is no use pretending that this isn't a major blow. the e-mails extracted by a hacker from the climate unit at the east -- at the university of east anglea could scarcely be more damaging. i'm dismayed and i deeply am shaken by them. i was too trusting of some of those who provided evidence of championed. i would have been better -- i would have been a better journalist if i had investigated more closely. that's one of the st