you liberal or conservative. a tagline that the most effective tagline, by the way, in the last 40 years has been make america great again, and it liberals will acknowledge that because so that tagline separated trump 2016 from everybody else out. you want that tagline. and we had a well-known of out of virginia george allen he said you do the crime you do the time, some kind of a tune you can whistle. there. reagan 1980, are you off now than you were four years ago? and so you went that that tune people can whistle that's in a tagline mr. do you have to use have you found it effective to use strong language against your opponents at ak you know negative ads work well on tv even though everybody says they hate them. the it's not necessarily words. i read something for the umpteenth time recently about truman. the people you say, give him hell, harry. he says, i don't give them hell. i just tell him the truth and they think it's hell. so i think it's just important. differentiate yourself from your your competitio

no, conservative 2019 voters are anyone who cast their vote for the conservative party in 2019. there a difference in the red wall? not especially. the conservative 2019 voters are especially concerned. so that obviously encompasses a lot of people who did vote conservative in the red wall for the first time, but it's not exclusive to voters in the red wall. conservative voters all over the country care quite strongly about it. i suppose, in that context, because we were talking to robert about the rwanda plan, it's whether the government, in pursuing the rwanda plan and then the conversation that's going on within the conservative party about how you make it work and what kind of flavour of the rwanda plan you should have, is whether kind of pursuing it and trying to make it work addresses the concerns of those 2019 conservative voters, or rather highlights the kind of failure to deal with the problem as they would see it around the whole question of illegal migration. yeah, i mean, ithought_ robert jenrick actually made some pretty compelling arguments. if you take this issue

the conservatives just aren't conservatives just aren't conservative enough.rm are coming in. >> no, i think i think to finish what i was saying, i think it's partly that we're not telling this story as a, as a, as a whole narrative. if we hadn't, if we hadn't had the furlough, if we hadn't had the furlough, if kept the economy if we hadn't kept the economy afloat, wouldn't growing afloat, we wouldn't be growing faster germany. faster than france or germany. after pandemic. that after the pandemic. that wouldn't us to wouldn't have allowed us to spend 78 billion. after the russian of ukraine, russian invasion of ukraine, when prices went up. and sometimes think that , um, sometimes i think that, um, politicians, especially when a party been for party has been in office for a while, they forget that they have tell a whole story. it's have to tell a whole story. it's not delivery . that's not just about delivery. that's what ocado does. it's about the vision have for the country . vision we have for the country. we believe in a in a smaller state, we believe in

her to become leader of the conservative party at some point would prefer her to renew the conservativesition, because i can't stress enough that is the assumption of every conservative mp that they're headed for a opposition rather than become prime minister for a few months before what they assume is a defeat. but why, if people haven't been following every twist and turn of this in westminster, you say she put a real line in the sand down today saying she has nothing to do with this. and that's important because many people in westminster do point a finger at her. she would say that's unfair. she said any real friend of hers would never indulge in that kind of stuff because they care about her. but what was interesting, though, actually just after the programme, somebody, a senior...a colleague of hers messaged me to say that the key line was when at the beginning she said, "we need more hope and optimism". yeah, well, we've discussed this on this podcast. but that is although henry says she wasn't having a go at rishi sunak, she was very firmly behind him. she did, though, give that

after the conservatives' defeat in the 1964 general election, she became the conservatives' spokesperson on housing and land use. in this position, she defended the policy of the conservatives, which allowed tenants to buy out municipal buildings. she caused a stir at the 1966 conservative party conference when she delivered a scathing critique of the labor government's high tax policy. if you compare all the budgets in the race for high tax rates, i'm happy to... report that the conservative budgets won't take any of the top four spots, the top prize for raising taxes would go to hugh gaitkel in '51. callaghan would receive the second prize for raising taxes in '66. the third the award would go to callaghan in '65. callaghan also won the fourth award. the conservative party under the leadership of edward geeth won the parliamentary elections in 1970 . thatcher was appointed secretary of state for education and science. in her first months in office, she drew public attention to the administration's efforts to cut spending. she prioritized the academic needs of schools and introduced cut

there would be no conservative movement worthy of the name. when i did my pioneering work. >> have you always been a conservative even when you were growing up? >> i grew up in pasadena texas and had kids in the neighborhood playing cops and robbers 11, 12, 13-years-old. i would tell people don't worry i'm not shooting robbers and shootinger commies. i have no recollection of conversations but i came in knowing they are bad people and i'm dedicated to fighting them, opposing them. i'm second-generation conservative, bill buckley, barry goldwater et cetera. 100%, phyllis schlafly, jerry falwell, myself. before we were conservatives, first we wereth anti-communists. emthat was the glue that held te conservative movement together in those days. >> what was that moment for you when it came to direct mail and you are visiting the review office. >> i was fortunate that i had two weeks summer camp national guard military base outside of chicago and we were there for the two weeks everybody goes into chicago. there was a small add for americans for co

i a conservative banner. think variable, think that's another variable, a kind of known unknown in this election yet see election that may yet see a number of mps say, i'm going to, you know, roll the dice here. i'm going to try something different because i'm leaving politics anyway, here's here's the suggests history suggest that jacob's arguments are right i >> -- >> sure. but is there a chance that this could be a real moment of historic change? the chance is one issue, which is immigration. >> uh, throughout the 20th century, the conservatives throughout the 19th century, the conservatives endured. but we are now in a world where identity and cultural issues matter, just as much to voters, in fact, more to voters than economic issues. if you ask bofis economic issues. if you ask boris johnson's voters today, what is your top priority? they say, stop the boats. they don't say, stop the boats. they don't say cost of living crisis. they say cost of living crisis. they say stopping the boats. so immigration c

and vote conservative again.you know, 1 in 20 of those voters who got that record majority are staying at home or supporting reform. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> would it be credible , henry? >> would it be credible, henry? would it be credible to have yet another leader or is it or is clark right in saying, i mean, he spoke to the bbc today. he said, look, the chap that shouts iceberg is never very popular. but it doesn't mean that it's the wrong thing to do. and i kind of got the logic of what he was saying there. but i mean, would the public put up with yet another change of prime minister incidentally, a prime minister they haven't voted for? they haven't actually voted for? >> i mean, there would be >> well, i mean, there would be enormous pressure on that new prime they enormous pressure on that new primeto they enormous pressure on that new primeto have they enormous pressure on that new primeto have an they enormous pressure on that new primeto have an early they enormous pressure on that new primeto have an earl

ok, so you are accusing the conservatives . conservatives.rvatives. ok, so you are - accusing the conservatives of being divided, there are none in the labour party at the moment? we are united, labour party at the moment? we are united. united _ labour party at the moment? we are united, united party _ labour party at the moment? we are united, united party wanting - labour party at the moment? we are united, united party wanting to - united, united party wanting to change this country, wanting to grow the economy wanting to great good and well paid jobs, to raise living standards and rebuild the national health service. we are united in that endeavour and we want to take our message of hope to the country. but instead, rishi sunak, there he is, what has he got to hide? running scared, continuing to squat in downing street and he hasn't got a plan for the next five months, never mind the next five years.— mind the next five years. talking of lans, mind the next five years. talking of plans. labour's— mind the next five years. talking of plan

enough progressive, it is none _ conservative enough progressive, it is none of _ conservative enoughhe far right— is none of the above in the far right is— is none of the above in the far right is done a much betterjob of fitting _ right is done a much betterjob of fitting that — right is done a much betterjob of filling that void sink every right to he _ filling that void sink every right to be angry and the entire establishment needs to be thrown out. , , ., �* _ establishment needs to be thrown out. , �* out. everything you're saying gay --eole out. everything you're saying gay people feel _ out. everything you're saying gay people feel it _ out. everything you're saying gay people feel it in _ out. everything you're saying gay people feel it in their _ out. everything you're saying gay| people feel it in their pocketbooks and that translates into yes because people, the eight attitude and that gave permission, what is it that they're angry about when it comes to politicians and you think you're beautiful your finger on it? when --eole beautiful your finger on it? when people see

conservatives, isn't it? yes, potentially. _ conservatives, isn't it? the _ conservatives, isn't it? yes, potentially, or the richard i conservatives, isn't it? yes, i potentially, or the richard tice were saying then, still, i wrote for reform is not necessarily a vote for the labour government. we kept using this phrase starmergeddon, referring to what is going to happen, richard tice, the leader of the reform party and the liberal democrats want an election sooner rather than later, a fact sir ed davey was also saying, he was going to take on legislation in the house of commons later on that would bring back the fixed terms parliament act, from when the lib dems were in coalition with the conservatives, then repealed by borisjohnson, but that legislation boris johnson, but that legislation would have meant that the election would have meant that the election would have meant that the election would have taken place on the 2nd of may, which is the same day as local elections are due to take place in england. ed davey made the point that rishi sunak is

, a nonprofit conservancy. and i'd like to point out that it is telling that that prior to 2011, and i think most of the work on the parks and open space plan was done prior to 2011 when, when all of it was adopted at that point in time. since then, i don't believe that we've had a comprehensive study about the alternate lives that are before us and this is what we're trying to do at this point in time. am i correct that there hasn't been, uh, an analysis of how how the long terme plan thing, um, and the organizational structure should be we've been wanting to discuss it. we need a roadmap to discuss it, but they haven't been any study of on that, on those alternatives that i know of. and board presidents and you may very well be correct that there's not been a study that is satisfied to this board. there have been the two studies that were mentioned, the cmg study about staffing and the city fellows study in 2022 that were in your packets. but, um, those are the same options as and have not really advanced the

of those who voted conservative 2019 conservative at the 2019 election, 74.r phaseout opposed the gas boiler phaseout and of them. and 71% i'm one of them. two were petrol car were against the petrol car ban. these reiterate what we these results reiterate what we already one to be already know. no one votes to be poor and cold, rush poor and cold, and the rush towards be towards net zero needs to be rethought. well, nunziata, um, this goes to the point that this goes back to the point that matt making. matt goodwin was making. if you want the best want to win elections, the best thing is to keep your thing to do is to keep your coalition together coalition of voters together and more than that, it's not just three quarters of conservative voters who oppose these ridiculous measures. >> and i'm number two. um, it's 55% of voters that if you want to win elections, don't go against the vast majority . against the vast majority. >> isn't this obviously true? and he said he wouldn't do it in a grand speech, much fanfare, probably state trumpeters borrowed from th

and that brings recruits into the conservative movement, the conservative movement of the 1970s versus the conservative movement of 1950s. it's much more populist in its rhetoric. the great society presented as this elitist project, and now you have this kind of populist insurgency against it. and that really gives shape both the social movements on the right. in the 1970s, opposition bussing, opposition to the equal rights amendment. but it also begins to gather the troops who are going to reagan into office in 1980. and i would also say that in another way, that lbj contributes to it, although he's not necessarily behind it, you know, the vote against barry goldwater is a vote against barry goldwater. it's not always a vote for lyndon. and so this front that that johnson's people are helping to manufacture or to kind of spread message that that barry goldwater is a kook suggests that in the end when people did vote for lbj in those extruded and airy numbers the 61% popular vote and the amazing majorities 295 in the house. and it's just it's not necessarily in support of what johnson

that was the conservatives kind of promised, the conservatives kind of promised, the end _ the conservativesgoing, look, under me there is — in a way. he is going, look, under me there is not going to be parties, continual— me there is not going to be parties, continual arguments about politics, crisis _ continual arguments about politics, crisis after — continual arguments about politics, crisis after crisis. of course some of those — crisis after crisis. of course some of those prices are not the conservative party's faut, covid and division _ conservative party's faut, covid and division of _ conservative party's faut, covid and division of ukraine are not their fault. _ division of ukraine are not their fault. but — division of ukraine are not their fault, but of course what keir starmer _ fault, but of course what keir starmer is able to do is exploit the prices _ starmer is able to do is exploit the prices which very much where they're full, partygate and the liz truss experiment, what he is saying, under me politics _ experiment, what he is saying, under me politics will be orderly ag

that 53 number is crucial because it 53 conservative mps, 15% of conservative mps, 15% of conservativerishi sunak�*s leadership, they would be a ballot of all conservative mps about whether rishi sunak should continue as conservative party leader and crucially those 53 letters can be private. we will never know unless the mps choose to publicly disclose that they have submit those letters, how many have submitted the letters until 53 has hit if it ever is and we will never know who submitted them, so both theresa may and boris johnson ended up having that threshold hit, confidence votes in their leadership, but we never knew who had submitted the letters. so that can happen in private even if publicly it looks like simon clarke is relatively out on a limb going for a change of leadership. i know ou will for a change of leadership. i know you will keep _ for a change of leadership. i know you will keep your _ for a change of leadership. i know you will keep your ear _ for a change of leadership. i know you will keep your ear to - for a change of leadership. i know you will keep your ear

in lead over the conservatives and wait until it comes.— until it comes.rms of the progress _ until it comes. in terms of the progress in — until it comes. in terms of the progress in the _ until it comes. in terms of the progress in the pledges - until it comes. in terms of the progress in the pledges at - until it comes. in terms of the l progress in the pledges at rishi sunak is made to the electorate, i was getting on? you sunak is made to the electorate, i was getting on?— sunak is made to the electorate, i was caettin on? ., , ., , was getting on? you remember at this narrative last — was getting on? you remember at this narrative last year, _ was getting on? you remember at this narrative last year, rishi _ was getting on? you remember at this narrative last year, rishi sunak- was getting on? you remember at this narrative last year, rishi sunak set - narrative last year, rishi sunak set out his five pledges and said that the electorate should judge him are going to thrive pledges that he set out. and they were, really he has only made significant p

back for the conservative party _ if there is a way back for the conservative party it - if there ise conservative party it will be | if there is a way back for the - conservative party it will be those questions — conservative party it will be those questions about _ conservative party it will be those questions about trust _ conservative party it will be those questions about trust in _ conservative party it will be those questions about trust in keir- questions about trust in keir starmer _ questions about trust in keir starmer l— questions about trust in keir starmer. i, starmer. i disagree with that because i — starmer. i disagree with that because i think, _ starmer. i disagree with that because i think, you - starmer. i disagree with that because i think, you know, l starmer. i disagree with that - because i think, you know, everyone thinks politicians change their minds and change their argument, and in fact there is a positive argument to be said which is politicians, if they do change their mind, that's a good thing, they are learning from evidence. i think the better line

. what, conservatives.uh what you think? i what impact do you think? i guessi what impact do you think? i guess i know, but george galloway has announced he's entering the race for london mayor. i just wonder about this . mayor. i just wonder about this. whether it's jeremy corbyn, whether it's george galloway , whether it's george galloway, whether it's george galloway, whether they merge together , if whether they merge together, if they were to fight a significant number of seats at the next general election and indeed against sadiq khan, could they be hurt from the left? labour. >> well, i think if we were sat here a year ago, i'd be saying, oh, not really sure, not oh, i'm not really sure, not really. but big thing has really. but a big thing has changed and that is the october 7th in israel. and the, 7th attacks in israel. and the, you conflict and you know, ongoing conflict and that quite frankly, that has quite frankly, radicalised a lot of people on the are very angry with the left who are very ang

the conservative party last niiht it? the conservative party last night demonstrated _ it?rvative party last night demonstrated that theyl it? the conservative party last i night demonstrated that they are completely united in wanting to stop the boats on this bill passed with an overwhelming majority in parliament but more broadly the last year was difficult, difficult for the country and we are recovering from the impact of the pandemic, the legacy of backlogs in public services and the impact of the war in ukraine on people's bills but at the start of this year we are pointing in the right direction, we have made progress. that is why we have made progress. that is why we have to stick to the plan because thatis have to stick to the plan because that is how we deliver long—term change that the country needs and we will build a brighter future for our children and renewed pride in our country and the plan is working. you can look at what has happened on inflation for example. we set out a clear panel, we have delivered on that and because inflation has been halved from 11

conservative mps wanted to support — of conservative mps wanted to support the _ of conservative mpsanted to| support the prime minister and of conservative mps wanted to i support the prime minister and go for simon — support the prime minister and go for simon clark— support the prime minister and go for simon clark i _ support the prime minister and go for simon clari— for simon clark i don't think that is representative _ for simon clark i don't think that is representative of— for simon clark i don't think that is representative of our - for simon clark i don't think that is representative of our party i is representative of our party feels. i is representative of our party feels. ., �* ~' ., is representative of our party feels. ., �* ~ ., ., , is representative of our party feels. ~ ., ., , , ., feels. i don't know what he is up to but it is not — feels. i don't know what he is up to but it is not the _ feels. i don't know what he is up to but it is not the feel of _ feels. i don't know what he is up to but it is not the feel of the - feels. i don't know what he is up to but i

what we is a we actually now have is a conservative government, a conservative government, a conservativeay conservative. so if in any way conservative. so if you to the of you hark back to the days of thatcher, for instance, which, you can obviously extol you know, we can obviously extol the thatcher's the virtues of thatcher's multiple election victories and so on, and most of the electorate, in opinion, has electorate, in my opinion, has not they still electorate, in my opinion, has not for they still electorate, in my opinion, has not for dyedzy still electorate, in my opinion, has not for dyed in still electorate, in my opinion, has not for dyed in the still electorate, in my opinion, has not for dyed in the wool looking for dyed in the wool traditional conservative values on like business, on things like business, taxation, immigration, crime and so on. and so actually what reform to me represent is conservatism and the fact that keir starmer and rishi sunak over the last 48 hours have both seen fit to reference or without much of a veil, frankly, um, the, the fact that, you know, r

the conservatives?ssible . the brexit party not impossible. the brexit party almost did it in 2019. if that happens, all bets are off. then you're looking at what i would call a full blown realignment of the right in british politics. it's happened on two two occasions before canada in the 1990s. the labour party replacing the liberals in the early 20th century. it could happen again. >> matt goodwin, thank you very, very much. as ever, always a great way to start that show with that exclusive polling data. it did also appear, data. and it did also appear, didn't it, in that polling data that it it reiterated another gb news exclusive that we brought to is that there to you, which is that there appears to plot to appears to be some plot to replace rishi sunak with penny mordaunt, the leader of the house of commons. now she's reportedly at the centre of this plot . well, remarkably, she was plot. well, remarkably, she was full of praise for the prime minister today. >> he has shown global leadership on m

the last conservative both last part and the conservative. you know, there's a couple of different reasons i did, and i'm very aware that friedman did not call himself a conservative and would probably not like the title of it but he didn't go so far as f.a. hayek did to write an essay why i'm not a conservative. maybe if he had written that essay, i wouldn't say i can't you know, i can't move for its title, but i kind of mean it in two ways. one is when you look at his the people he interacted with, the people he gave his ideas to within american politics, those who found him most compelling, most of those people called themselves and conservatives in the united states is different than conservatism in other countries, in large part because it incorporates what in other countries is called liberalism or neo liberalism. it celebrates end of the market and celebrating capitalism. it's the dynamic economic system is in some in tension with being conservative because it drives a lot of social change nonetheless in the united states you have this

as governor of arkansas, i had the consistent conservative wrecker. -- conservative record. lowered taxes from 7% to 4.9 percent. $700 million a year going back to the taxpayer. i had a fundamental principle that i believe is important in political philoso want the privr economy to grow faster than the government sector. a simple principle. as a result, we created 100,000 jobs in the private sector, we are going to be leading the nation in steel production very soon. i brought in the steel industry to arkansas. u.s. steel from pennsylvania came in while i was governor. we reduced state government employment by 3000 workers. who does that anymore? from the time i started to the time i left, we had 3000 fewer government workers. we didn't fire anybody, no mess layoffs, we simply organized it, manage it and said we can do things more efficiently. we saved taxpayer dollars. a consistent conservative record. i am pro-life, we passed pro-life legislation. when you look at women's sports. i am a conservative from arkansas and i believe we ought to have women that have their sports

having ducks on having conserved 16 million acres across north america with over 6000 acres conserved in new hampshire alone and over 83,000 in iowa ducks unlimited's conservation work is a driver of small business and communities across america. given the importance and the impact of conservation congress should therefore work to eliminate regulatory green tape that hinders the delivery of scientifically beneficial conservation programs. enhance voluntary and incentive based conservation programs for working lands to support farmers and ranchers expand programs to meet the local needs of conservation on tribal lands and in areas that are accessible to historically underserved communities. these efforts will result in more water fowl and more wildlife and stimulate greater economic activity in our tourism industry. and they will also make our air and water cleaner, recharge precious groundwater systems and fortify our communities against the threats of extreme weather. these are all things that all americans need and support. once again, thank you for the opportunity to be part of thi

a man of the right you mentioned the conservatives and a longtime commentator in the conservative spacethe book has gotten a lot of criticism from the right so i just want to start on that note. there's a point in your book where you kind of retail the narrative you mentioned in your remark about the sort of political economic history of the country. especially in the post-depression era. there is one you said to me. part of what drove the prosperity that we saw in the middle of the past century was the commitment to limit and that's been a theme of a lot of things i've written about from the conservative perspective so i want to give you this. opportunity to answer how are you not a full socialist quite yet? >> great question. so, the smartest reviews of this book has come from marxists and they've argued that what it puts forward is a fundamentally conservative project whereas often when i'm dealing with center-right or centerleft broadcasters or reviewers they say it seems like your brain is right-wing when it comes to abortion but you have more of a leftist stream mentality when it

conservatives for five ears. years. , . , ., , with the conservatives for five ears. years. , . , .,nservatives for five ears. years. the liberal democrats are in second place _ years. the liberal democrats are in second place to _ years. the liberal democrats are in second place to the _ years. the liberal democrats are in second place to the conservatives i years. the liberal democrats are in | second place to the conservatives in around 80 seats around the country, places we call the blue wall, if people want to get rid of the government than in those places the liberal democrats are the best party to vote for. ., ., , , to vote for. you ignored my first question. _ to vote for. you ignored my first question. the — to vote for. you ignored my first question, the audience - to vote for. you ignored my first question, the audience will- to vote for. you ignored my first question, the audience will see | question, the audience will see that. i want to go back to when your party was in government, when he refused to meet alan bates, the postmaster who expose the horizon it scandal, to

moving still think the conservative party to get us outy moving still think the conservative party tooffoving still think the conservative party to get us out of this|g forward to get us out of this mess. it's very kind of. mess. so it's very kind of. richard, we've had a few, um, you know, few dingoes over the you know, a few dingoes over the past few weeks, a few, you know, a arguments. but he's a good a few arguments. but he's a good man. great man. like man. he's a great man. i like him, i him as a friend. him, i class him as a friend. but i think, know the best but i think, you know the best way forward solve this way forward to solve this problem strong conservative problem is a strong conservative party with strong mps like myself. >> and you will in the >> and you will stand in the next as a tory mp. of next election as a tory mp. of course i but overall, i course i will. but overall, i mean, you have a problem here for because will you for rishi sunak because will you vote the bill? a third reading? >> there's a lot happen >> there's a lot can happen between tomorrow between

that's what the conservative _ together? absolutely.he conservative rebels _ together? absolutely. that's what the conservative rebels on - together? absolutely. that's what the conservative rebels on the - together? absolutely. that's what l the conservative rebels on the right of the party want, they want downing street to back down. they are trying to exert pressure in media studios as well as in the house of commons today so that actually downing street makes theirjob easier for them by saying we're going to tweak this legislation this way or that way. one thing downing st the government has done today is they have said they are looking at ways to write into new rules for civil servants as well as for ministers a presumption that if the european court of human rights in strasbourg issues what has become known as a pyjama injunction, basically an emergency halt to any deportation flights to rwanda, that's what stopped the first flight that was meant to take off in 2022. if the issue any new emergency injunction issue any new emergenc