it is real coutoure. only the fact that most of those clothes are manufactured after -- even some not manufactured right. maybe a piece that is a piece of art. i do not like that expression. so forget it. bessemer truly like making beautiful things. i went there. one * my partner, boyfriend, arrived -- one time my partner, borden, said mickey should do a direct election. i said, why? the designer from the 1980's. he said, yes, but maybe it is could for perfume, things like that. to have an international passport. ok. but deep inside, i know that i should have loved to make one coutoure collection like that. a dream of the elegance of paris. and i remember that i propose -- it was the last new bid of coutoure that arrived. i thought to propose -- [unintelligible] why don't you take one designer like vivian westwood or others to make one season, one coutoure collection? >> you should call some up immediately and suggest the deal. >> [laughs] that is true. each one to make their own collection should not be

was doing coutoure for use something that you wanted to make coutoure different are doing it -- did it make you different as a designer? >> it is difficult to answer >> it is difficult to answer that question.

when i started to do coutoure, after a lot of stories that may be issued do another job, i said, ok, i will do my own collection. i started and never stopped after. on boat one, one woman, done all in lace in the exhibition. it starts like, ok, i did not think to make another one. so i did one after and one after and one after peter i am still doing it now. this is 1997. more than 10 years. >> i ask the question because it is very interesting when you talk about these people who marked the 1980's and earlier. but so few are around now or they are around in a relatively small way. you're in a situation where your company, the majority shareholding is with pooch to do the fragrances and work with other fashion houses. is this some sort of a new beginning? was it important for you to have this? >> definitely. it was a change. when i went to my company, it was a moment where there were more shops and boutiques. so we went with ermez, and it became something that was very funny. we -- one moment i did not even have a collection, which was not scheduled at all. it was not about a contract.